[b]What is your choice?[/b]

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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - [b]What is your choice?[/b]

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:19:03 AM EDT

Have a question to all members here:

A scenario: An unknown amount of intruders (let's just say two or three for the sake of simplicity) break in your house at night. You (live by yourself) hear the noise and get either your handgun or shotgun and plan to defense yourself.
The main question is:
a. Do you rack the slide/pump the shotgun to scare them off.
b. You already did ahead of time so the element of surprise is to your advantage.
c. Dial 911 (apply for liberals/anti-gunners only)

I, myself, would like to go with choice B.

Your choice? Thanks.

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:22:09 AM EDT

[#1]

Remotely set off the prepared flash-bangs
Release the Hounds (yes, capital H)

Wait

Rifle through remains, take money off the exBGs, add guns to collection, pat doggies, feed the hogs.

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:23:49 AM EDT

[#2]

I'd go with A. Odds are, that should convince them to go elsewhere. If it doesnt, go to plan B.

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:25:45 AM EDT

[#3]

Quoted:
Remotely set off the prepared flash-bangs
Release the Hounds (yes, capital H)

Wait

Rifle through remains, take money off the exBGs, add guns to collection, pat doggies, feed the hogs.

View Quote

i like

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:26:34 AM EDT

[#4]

You are outnumbered, the element of surprise and the fact that you know the layout are your only advantages. Use them to the best of your ability.

I pick [b]B[/b].

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:29:15 AM EDT

[#5]

B while Wife simultaneously does C/gets kids on the floor behind cover...and she ain't no lib/anti.
[:)]

Scott

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:29:25 AM EDT

[#6]

I would play the A-Team opening theme real loud. I love it when a plan comes together.

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:30:58 AM EDT

[#7]

Use the Poll Luke.

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:31:07 AM EDT

[#8]

Also go with B....I have a 3 story townhouse and my bedroom door is closed when in bed. The steps leading up land right in front of my door to my bedroom.

It opens? Bang, Bang.....move -- wait....they want more or will they run? My guess is run....

Ed

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:31:25 AM EDT

[#9]

Intruders?...What intruders?!!!

No bodies...No crime!

I would go with A!

There is no better crime deterrant than "Rackin' the slide of a pump shotgun"!!

Heck rack it as many times as neccesary!...Like they do in the movies![%|] Only applies to liberals and anti-gunners![BD]

BigDozer66

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:32:04 AM EDT

[#10]

Quoted:
Use the Poll Luke.

View Quote

Glad I re-read that....thought you were advocating homesexual activity.

Use the "pole" Luke. [;D]

Ed

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:32:40 AM EDT

[#11]

Security measures would have alerted me and my family members that intruders were present.
At such time, all gather in the "safe room", and take cover.
Of course, by that time, a cell phone call to the police has gone out, and a family member is in constant contact.
If the intruders should reach the door to the safe room (NOT easily kicked in), an announcement is made that whoever enters will be shot, and the police have been called and are expected momentarily (true).
At that point, their actions determine what response, if any, is made.
Assuming the intruders flee, next thing is to await the police, and for them to clear the house (They're the experts--YOUR job is to protect your family, which you cannot do effectively while clearing the house).
Since cell phone contact is ongoing, the responding police are apprised of your being armed, and "holed-up". Only after an official police ID is slid under the door and examined, are weapons set on-safe, and the door unlocked.

I don't know about anyone else, but there is nothing in my house, save a family member, worth getting killed for.

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:40:37 AM EDT

[#12]

What a coincidence, I keep an 870 by the bed and one in the kitchen (opposing ends of the house)

Gotta go with A. But I'd like to say, racking the gun to scare is not my intent. Racking the gun to blow their head off is. They came in, they won't have time to get scared off....

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:41:35 AM EDT

[#13]

"."

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:55:39 AM EDT

[#14]

....meanwhile, back at reality...

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:55:51 AM EDT

[#15]

Assuming that I don't live alone and am in bed:
1. Retrieve and load defensive firearm.
2. Retrieve wife/children.
3. Turn on lights in bedroom.
4. Take defensive position.
5. Dial 911 and stay in constant contact.
6. Defend the family.

Anyone who enters the room will have a momentary blindness moving from the dark house to the bright light. This gives the defender the advantage in both response time and target identification. Also, anyone entering the room would be considered the aggressor.

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:56:25 AM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:
I don't know about anyone else, but there is nothing in my house, save a family member, worth getting killed for.

View Quote

I was telling someone one time about when I was the target of a carjacking. BG's decided that my Sig P220 was an unfair advantage on my part and left the area quite quickly. The person I was telling this to said to me, "You mean you were willing to die for your truck? That you think your life is worth a vehicle?" I said NO, I dont think my life is worth my truck. But the guys trying to take it obviously thought my truck was worth theirs.

My point is, my home is my castle. Literally. I am quite anal retentive about my house. Anyone who enters uninvited, will not leave without outside assistance if I am home. I have no mercy at all for home invaders. I dont take kindly to mylife being endangered. My home and everything in it is part of my life. I will die to defend it the same way I would for my country. Again, Is my life worth my tv? Not really, but the guy trying to take it must think its worth his.

Edited to add- I train to be able to clear my house better than anyone else, period. I make it a point to learn how to clear my house better than the police. I know it better than anyone because I live there. I make it a point to learn the right way to do it. etc., etc. Would I tell just anyone to go looking through their house in the middle of the night if they thought someone else was in there? No. I can only speak for what [b]I[/b] would do based on what [b]I[/b] have made a point to learn and accomplish. It helps too that my wife is a legit and formidable backup. As a two person team, we can take care of our house pretty good, especially in the dark when we can move through the house effortlessly with NO light(s) on. [;)]

Posted: 12/3/2002 7:59:21 AM EDT

[#17]

Tell them I'm gonna kill them first! If they don't leave I'll kill them, but I hate to clean up all the brain and blood matter on my carpet and walls. It would kinda ruin the atmosphere of the house for the wife after I got thru with the intruders. As far as the secruity equipment is concerned the cameras and motion sensors just tell me who and where the victims are for the carnage to come.

Posted: 12/3/2002 8:07:04 AM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:
I don't know about anyone else, but there is nothing in my house, save a family member, worth getting killed for.

View Quote

That's a valid position. But if you believe that you are also responsible in some way to your society, stopping the perpetrators so that they cannot prey on others [i]may be[/i] worth the risk. It's a decision only you can make for yourself at the time. It's not just about your property being "worth your life," it's about doing the right thing even at the risk of it.

Posted: 12/3/2002 8:25:48 AM EDT

[#19]

I'm sorry, but [b]Kar98[/b], has already posted the correct response.

You do simply do not want to ever meet the dead BG's friends and relatives, either in a Court of Law or in a dark alley.

So avoid the pitfalls and let the hogs handle the trash.

Eric The(OfCourse,MyAdviceVoidWhereProhibitedByLaw)Hun[>]:)]

Posted: 12/3/2002 8:30:06 AM EDT

[#20]

B...why let them get away and do the same thing to someone else...It will be known that this gunowner is not to be messed with.

Posted: 12/3/2002 8:35:20 AM EDT

[#21]

I would simply push the magic button on the side of my AR

Posted: 12/3/2002 8:38:06 AM EDT

[#22]

B. Shotgun.

Not that it would matter - if they've already made it into the house they're severly wounded / maimed. Just too many booby-traps to encounter. I, myself, would have difficulty entering any other way but the lock-and-key route (and I know where and what everything is).

Posted: 12/3/2002 8:43:19 AM EDT

[#23]

"break into your house at night..."

Warning? Why a warning? Don't y'all think that the existence of the damn front door is ample "warning" enough for them to [b]not[/b] enter your house.

Straight to Plan B.

Anything eles is fooish.

CMOS

Posted: 12/3/2002 9:26:57 AM EDT

[#24]

No bodies, no crime.
Seriously, one of the Mennonite families here was invaded by two slimeballs from a homeless shelter. The Mennonites had two young daughters. No more need be said. Kar98 has the plan. Ops

Posted: 12/3/2002 9:55:18 AM EDT

[#25]

[b]Quoted:
I don't know about anyone else, but there is nothing in my house, save a family member, worth getting killed for.[/b]

You give up a little portion of you life for everything in your home, a little sweat and blood everyday you go to work to collect that pay check. So you are slowly dying for it anyway.

So the BG thinks his life is worth my things? Well I opt for B.

Posted: 12/3/2002 10:08:04 AM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:
Security measures would have alerted me and my family members that intruders were present.
At such time, all gather in the "safe room", and take cover.
Of course, by that time, a cell phone call to the police has gone out, and a family member is in constant contact.
If the intruders should reach the door to the safe room (NOT easily kicked in), an announcement is made that whoever enters will be shot, and the police have been called and are expected momentarily (true).
At that point, their actions determine what response, if any, is made.
Assuming the intruders flee, next thing is to await the police, and for them to clear the house (They're the experts--YOUR job is to protect your family, which you cannot do effectively while clearing the house).
Since cell phone contact is ongoing, the responding police are apprised of your being armed, and "holed-up". Only after an official police ID is slid under the door and examined, are weapons set on-safe, and the door unlocked.

I don't know about anyone else, but there is nothing in my house, save a family member, worth getting killed for.

View Quote

Very well said.

Posted: 12/3/2002 10:10:09 AM EDT

[#27]

There have been several home invasion robberies in AZ during this year where the home owner has resisted with deadly force. In all but one case the home owner died as a result taking one or more of the bad guys with them. They should have shot without warning and lived so I would pick the shotgun and B.

Though I would be more likely to pick up my .45 camp carbine for 15rds of 165gr at 1,500fps since I don’t own a shotgun other than my kids single shot.

THISISME

Posted: 12/3/2002 10:30:33 AM EDT

[#28]

What raf said!
Here is a good rule: [b]If it's serious enough to pick up your gun, you might consider calling the police FIRST.[/b]
In recent emergency drills I have been through, here is my experience. The dispatcher wants your name, your street address, and nearest cross-street FIRST. Don't even think about telling the dispatcher what is going on until they have your information.
Have in mind what you are going to tell the police. Tell them what you know (number of people, where you are, that you are armed and safe for the moment, etc) and what you think (intruders that may be armed, where they are entering, etc).
As far as racking the shotgun, give yourself both options. Have one in the chamber. Rack another if you wish. However, your best bet is to remain undetected unless you are going to present yourself for the purpose of turning a good day into a bad day for the intruders.
Give yourself a moment to verify target before shooting. Make sure it isn't Little Johnny or Little Suzie taking the 00 Buck.
None of this is legal advice.

Posted: 12/3/2002 10:35:41 AM EDT

[#29]

[b]B[/b]

Not all scenarios allow enough time to rack the shotgun, so always keep it loaded. If you want to warn them, go verbal as already mentioned.

Posted: 12/3/2002 10:52:09 AM EDT

[#30]

Well, I'm probably going to get flamed, but I just can't resist.
raf had the correct answer. All this talk about blowing the bad guys away is fine....if you are ready to spend your retirement fund on lawyers. Would I shoot a home intruder if my life was threatened? You bet. But first I would try everything else including calling the police, hollering a warning, etc.
I don't want to shoot anybody I don't absolutely have too. If they will leave, it solves my problem. And I don't have to hire an evil lawyer. If you don't think a shooting will involve lawyers, you are dreaming.
I used to be a policeman (in the good old days) and we wouldn't arrest someone for shooting a burglar. But my current LEO friends tell me that nowadays, if you shoot a bad guy, they will pat you on the back, say "Good job!", and then they will have to arrest you. They have no choice.
Don't be too anxious to open fire unless absolutely necessary. If you do, the nightmare is only just started.

Posted: 12/3/2002 11:01:56 AM EDT

[#31]

If there are armed guys in my house there to do my family harm:

If I really really really have the drop on them, they might get a "drop your weapon" out of me.

Otherwise, I'm shooting from cover. Being outnumbered puts things decidedly out of my favor and PA state law says I don't have to retreat or give warning in my own home.

Posted: 12/3/2002 11:05:35 AM EDT

[#32]

If someone enters my home with criminal intentions - they die.

Like I give a rat's tail about getting some handcuffs slapped on my wrists - big deal. Hiring a lawyer? No problem.

Is dealing with death an issue? Of course - but not nearly as much as dealing with the death of an innocent person.

Experience? Quite a lot. Yesterday I spent 4 hours each (8 hours total) trying to keep people alive who were in that condition due to criminal acts. They were unable to be saved.

I'd much rather hear about the bad guys getting killed and stick to taking care of sprained ankles, lacerations, and broken bones.

edited to add: By the way, those who died were children.

Posted: 12/3/2002 11:23:24 AM EDT

[#33]

Me: snoring

Wife: John wake up ! Do you hear that ?

Me: What what uh ?

Wife: I hear something or someone

Me in a loud yell: Hey motherfuckers I got 3 rottwiellers and shotgun, the cops are on the way ! Now get the hell out or your dead.[;D]

Wife: We dont have any more dogs remember ?

Me: They don't know that

2 minutes later wife makes sweep of house while I cover her from the bed because she [b]hasn't[/b] heard any more noise.

she is a delight and wouldn't trade her for the world [:D]

Posted: 12/3/2002 11:31:06 AM EDT

[#34]

Because the missus and I are raising little ones again (out grandkids), I can't keep the Mossberg M590A loaded and in arms reach as I would otherwise. Instead, I keep my P-99 and my Sig P-230 with hot hollow points in the pipe and at the ready, along with a little Scorpion light.

Intruders in the home are putting their lives at risk. While I would NOT shoot to simply protect property, (No engaging a teenager in the back while he is boosting the TV), a surprise nighttime hot burglary/home invasion break-in means all-out war to me. I answer the door at very odd hours with a pistol in my hand too.

Momma and I have actually discussed this. I would engage the perps as necessary and she would dial 9-1-1 and yell for help. Since the sheriff is probably several minutes away and they only really clean up the mess and try to capture the perps anyway...it is up to me to defend us. I will not hesitate to shoot if I think we or the babies are in danger.

Gee...I wonder if the insurance company would pay for the carpet replacement? That much blood is going to be a bitch to clean up.

Posted: 12/3/2002 11:33:30 AM EDT

[#35]

Man, there are a lot of good ideas from you gents.

[b]Raf[/b]'s plan looks very good also.
Of course, with plan [b]B[/b], I warn them ahead of time when they step into to room, before I shoot the perp(s).

Posted: 12/3/2002 11:48:30 AM EDT

[#36]

[b]D[/b] Intruder never makes it into house because E, F, and G greet him at point of entry.

[img]http://photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/IG_LoadImage.asp?iImageUnq=478[/img]

Wake up next morning toss shoes, flashlight, and shredded bits of clothing into trash.

Posted: 12/3/2002 12:31:14 PM EDT

[#37]

A and B

If someone is in my house, and I see them before they see me, they will die.

I think I would rack the slide right before I shot them, so there will be that...
"Oh Shi---BLAM!!"

But there would have been one in the chamber the whole time.

Posted: 12/3/2002 12:41:25 PM EDT

[#38]

If intruders are in my house and I fear for the lives of my family, the first noise the intruders would hear would be the sound of one of them dying by the .45, 9mm, or AR.

I would give NO WARNING WHATSOEVER except the sound of the safety clicking off, and I'd take that off as quietly as possible.

[b][red]TO WARN THEM IS TO GIVE THEM THE OPPORTUNITY TO PREPARE TO ATTACK ME. THIS MUST BE AVOIDED AT ALL COSTS.[/red][/b]

Their first indication of trouble would be to discover that three intruders are suddenly down to two...make that one...oops...all out of intruders!

If there were just ONE intruder, and I was sure of that, I might give warning. But multiples? I won't take the chance of them having a chance of working together to get me.

As there would be no surviving intruders, there would be no conflicting stories.

At least one of the intruders would certainly be armed when the police arrived, and tests of that weapon would not suggest that it was anything but the dead intruder's own weapon.

Oh yes, it'd be a "clean" shooting. Be very sure of that.

CJ

Posted: 12/3/2002 1:02:54 PM EDT

[#39]

Like most of you ...
I'd fumble around for my glasses and knock them off the bedside table. Then I'd notice the alarm clock was going off and it must be morning. So I'd stumble toward the can where a BG would knock me unconcious or dead.

Posted: 12/3/2002 1:40:24 PM EDT

[#40]

In any scenario where armed people who mean you harm are in your house the correct handling is to fire without warning with whatever you have, preferably a shotgun. Calling the police is fine, but you most likely won't have time. Just call 911 and lay the phone down. Never tell someone to "Drop a gun". Police do this because they have a duty to arrest. You don't. Police won't tell you to drop a gun unless you seem like you won't fire and they have cover. Catch a cop in the open and threaten him with a gun and you will see a cop shoot you as fast as he can. If you engage some armed intruder in conversation about dropping guns, you have just shown him you don't want to shoot. His response will be to shoot. If someone is in your home, you would be well advised to shoot him without warning and shoot him now. In Tn the law is mere presence is enough to justify use of deadly force. Not present and armed. Not present and threatening deadly force. The law assumes anyone who enters your home illegally means you harm. This came about in 1989 when an old man in Memphis was holding a burglar at gunpoint and on the phone with police. In the meantime, the burglar jumped the old man, took his gun, and killed him. Never mess around when it's showtime. A gun won't help you if you won't shoot it. Most likely you will not have this problem unless you sell dope, but anything can happen. Never hesitate to fire when you are justified. To ponder is to perish.

Posted: 12/3/2002 2:14:54 PM EDT

[#41]

In addition, depending on state law, giving a warning implies the threat was not immediate. Without the immediate threat, you may be held liable for unjustifiable homicide instead of self-defense.

1. Call 911 if the perp is not right on top of you and lay the phone down, still connected so thre is a record on the tape..

2. If in your bedroom, stay there. If the perp comes into the bedroom, drop him/them. And make sure they can't tell any clever tales.

Posted: 12/3/2002 2:20:45 PM EDT

[#42]

Old_Painless, In the last few years I have heard of at least a dozen cases where a home owner shot bad guys in their homes and when asked the officers have always said they don’t anticipate any charges against the home owner. These where burglaries gone wrong where the person killed had no gun and expected no one to be home.

Of course there was a case where a man walked two kids that threw rock at his mobile home down the street at gun point to the 7-11 to call the police and shot one while he ran away. He is in big trouble.

There was also a guy last year who shot and killed one bad guy in his house and wounded another then proceeded to chase him over seven or eight blocks and shot a few more times till he died. He was not charged for killing one bad wounding the other in his house. He did get charged for his actions though from the point he left his property.

If your state laws are written right your life won’t be ruined after you have protected it. That is so long as you don’t chase them across the city and kill them while they beg you for mercy. Such things are simply not tolerated.

THISISME

Posted: 12/3/2002 3:16:15 PM EDT

[#43]

Some of the statements that have been made are the EXACT reason I dont like to tell anyone how they should handle this kind of situation. All I can say is how I would handle it, based on MY personal training, experience, capabilities, and knowledge of local laws, procedures, and how things like this are usually handled. Fortunately in my area, someone comes in your house illegally, and they are pretty much SOL.
I would not give any warning whatsoever as I am not obligated morally or legally to do so. I do not want the intruder(s) to know that I am armed, what defensive measures I have taken, where I am at, what I intend to do, or to give him any information whatsoever.
Know YOUR area (laws, etc). YOUR area is the ONLY one that will matter. Not mine or anyone elses.

Posted: 12/3/2002 3:30:39 PM EDT

[#44]

Quoted:
c. Dial 911 (apply for liberals/anti-gunners only)

View Quote

Whoa! Many brave patriots here use the Imbroglio defense, I'm sure. [;)]

Posted: 12/3/2002 3:39:38 PM EDT

[#45]

The handgun is always loaded. I'd pump the shotgun though. Then dial 911 while I wait for them to work my way, (I don't want to have to clean up the bodies).

Posted: 12/3/2002 4:00:59 PM EDT

[#46]

B

Immediately kill all intruders without hesitation.

They have no business in your home.

Posted: 12/3/2002 6:36:56 PM EDT

[#47]

D) Non of the above

Because here in the PRK for:

A) If you rack the the slide you will be arrested for assault with a deadly weapon, the BG will sue you for duress and get awarded punitive damages by a ultra liberal jury that was convinced by an attorney for the BG that the sound of you racking a shotgun was really you racking the cocking handle on a Ma Deuce you bought illegally at a gun show.

B) Here in the PRK we can't shoot BG's. They have rights you know. You as a home owner have non because owning a home means you are of the "Priviledged Class" and have a societal obligation to give your hard earned money away to the "oppressed and down trodden".

C) The 911 system is so overloaded by soccer moms who have 911 programmed on a button of their cell phone and it keeps getting pushed when it's buried in their designer 20 gal shoulder bag that [b]IF[/b] anyone ever answers you will be put on hold so they can put the 500 people on hold who called for directions and then it will take 20 minutes of trying to convince the 911 operator that you really do have an emergency and then another 45 minutes before anyone shows up at your house to take a report by which time you are either dead, or late for work because by now it's 7 am.

[:D] Just in case anyone [i]really[/i] thinks I'm serious.

Posted: 12/3/2002 6:40:16 PM EDT

[#48]

[b]

Quoted:

[b][red]TO WARN THEM IS TO GIVE THEM THE OPPORTUNITY TO PREPARE TO ATTACK ME. THIS MUST BE AVOIDED AT ALL COSTS.[/red][/b]

If there were just ONE intruder, and I was sure of that, I might give warning. But multiples? I won't take the chance of them having a chance of working together to get me.

CJ

View Quote

[/b]

I agree these 2 points, CJ.

Posted: 12/3/2002 6:43:49 PM EDT

[#49]

set off the claymores

Posted: 12/3/2002 8:25:03 PM EDT

[#50]

1. Quietly don slippers and underpants (either order).
2. Sneak quietly over to gun lock box.
3. Discreetely turn on flashlight.
4. Solve combination lock on gun lock box.
5. Rifle through dresser drawer for trigger lock key.
6. Unlock and remove trigger lock.
7. Load two "safety" bullets in low-capacity magazine.
8. Bear crawl to bedroom door and down hallway.
9. Observe bad guy.
10. Announce stern request for BG to leave premises.
11. Rack the slide and repeat request, this time emphasizing "please".
12. Violently click off the safety and fire a single warning shot into air.
13. As BG sprints toward you, fire the remaining bullet, smartly dislodging the gun from his grasp.
14. BG quickly leaves in amazement.

[beer]

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - [b]What is your choice?[/b]

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