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Posted: 11/7/2002 9:21:58 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/7/2002 9:27:07 AM EDT by shooter69]
[size=2][b]Editorial: Utterly reprehensible[/size=2][/b] ArabNews.com (Saudi based) 7 November 2002 THE BUSH WHITE House is currently in a buoyant mood. As a result of the midterm elections, the Republican Party now added control of the Senate to that of the House of Representatives. The president will see this success as an endorsement, at least domestically, of his hawkish attitude toward Iraq as well as his campaign against international terrorism. No doubt, many US voters will have been influenced by the [u]news of the slaying of a leading Al-Qaeda suspect in Yemen, apparently by a missile fired from an unmanned drone operated by the CIA[/u]. Their government is acting tough, no US lives were lost [u]in the operation against a man widely believed to have been behind the attack on the USS Cole in October 2000, in which 17 sailors were slain[/u]. They no doubt took the view that international terrorists were getting some of their own back, and good riddance to them. [u]Unfortunately in a civilized society, extra-judicial murders are not acceptable. Ali Qaed Senyan Al-Harthi may indeed have been a terrorist with blood on his hands, but it was not for the American CIA to act as judge, jury and executioner. Though it would undoubtedly have been far more difficult and might have caused the loss of further lives, the right thing to have done would have been to have apprehended Al-Harthi and brought him to trial. Butchering him and his body guards with a remotely fired missile was wrong.[/u] Hitler’s propaganda supremo, Josef Goebbels used to boast that the bigger the lie, the greater its chances of being believed. Twenty four hours after the attack, the US administration came up with what many in the Middle East will see as a lie worthy of the biggest Goebbels ever told. The United States declared that it continued to oppose the policy of assassination used by the Israelis against what they took to be Palestinian extremists. How, when Washington’s secret army, the CIA has just done the self-same thing, can anyone believe this American claim? In fact, what the Al-Harthi assassination lays bare is the fact that the United States believes that, while it cannot be seen to be endorsing Zionist extra judicial murders, privately it finds this uncivilized savagery by the Israelis perfectly acceptable. [u]It is one more double standard that can only add to the despair of those in the Arab world[/u], who still hope that the Americans can push through a just and honorable settlement to the 50- year plight of the Palestinians. [u]But how can Washington act as an honest broker when it is guilty of exactly the same deadly crimes as Zionists?[/u] If Americans feel that the system of freedom and justice, which they appear to hold so highly as the centerpiece of their constitution, is insufficient to deal with the threat of Al-Qaeda, they are on dangerous grounds. If illegal violence is seen as a solution in Washington’s war against terror, how can the US possibly condemn Palestinians for fighting back against the terror imposed upon them by Zionists? The Land of the Brave and Free sent an unmanned drone to do its murderous dirty work. At least Palestinian fighters, however misguided, are prepared to die along with their unfortunate victims. Is it Washington’s case that it is all right to assassinate innocent civilians including children and women provided the murderer or murderers don’t get killed or hurt? In behaving criminally, the United States is putting itself on a level with the terrorists who are its enemies. Indeed, because so much better should be expected of a civilized state built upon justice, it is actually placing itself below the criminals it now seems prepared to assassinate. There can be no exceptions to murder. They are all crimes, in the Yemen, in the West Bank and Gaza, on the streets of Israel or in the center of New York or at the Pentagon in Washington. The United States must not persist with this dangerous dishonoring of the rules of justice upon which all civilized societies are built. If it does, it will be making itself no better than the international terrorists it hunts. ---------------------------------------- I was going to underline certain parts but I stopped because THE WHOLE THING is just so fucking crazy! There are heavily armed Al Qaeda operating in Yemen, which have REPULSED and DEFEATED every attempt of the Yemeni government to eliminate/capture them, inflicting something like seventeen casualties on their military, and here we have the Yemenis permission to attack..... un-ba-friggin-lievable!! Extra-judical "murders?" "Butchering him?" Deadly crimes? Illegal violence? Murderous dirty work? What drugs are these freaks on!? Most of their people support OBL and the Jihad boyz, so WTF is with the "must not persist with this dangerous dishonoring of the rules of justice." They must instead be "brought to justice" in a court of law. These Gulf Arabs are supporting Jihad in every corner of the globe! Through so-called charities even. They wouldn't know justice if it hit them on the head. For them it's all a muslim thing. They even have the unmitigated gall to bring the United States Constitution into into it! proving that a little knowledge is a dangerous thing. Last I heard we could still wage war under the constitution. Only in a Noam Chomsky wet-dream could the founders ever even imagine such a thing! And [s]people[/s] whiney liberals say we need to educate more of these arab characters in the West for better mutual understanding, blah-blah-blah... all I can see is more of them learning how to use every western arguement back on us to suit their cause, whether it fits or not. I've never seen a people more fanatical. Obviously this 'understanding' of how we must deal with foreign combatants who have declared war upon us has come from western leftists. They are just parroting it back. It certainly did not pre-exist in their own region or society: when crazy muslims occupied Mecca a couple decades back the Saudis just went in and KILLED EVERYBODY.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 10:05:53 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/7/2002 10:08:19 AM EDT by BustinCaps]
I guess it is pretty worthless to huff and puff over Arab ideas. Although the article did make me laugh. These nuts are going to do all the whining they can while hitting below the belt every time. When I hear "Arab Intellectuals" speak it strikes a perfect parallel with a Democratic party convention. edited because I write here when it should be hear all the time.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 10:11:34 AM EDT
Get used to it rag heads, this is just the beginning. [frag] [50] [heavy] [rocket]
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 10:12:49 AM EDT
SO[rolleyes]
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 10:18:14 AM EDT
Executed without a trial and it doesn't even raise an eyebrow anymore. The US is becoming more like a banana republic with each passing day.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 10:20:10 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/7/2002 10:20:58 AM EDT by Hawkeye]
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 10:22:57 AM EDT
Originally Posted By trickshot: Executed without a trial and it doesn't even raise an eyebrow anymore. The US is becoming more like a banana republic with each passing day.
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What comes around goes around.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 10:23:06 AM EDT
They're right------and at the same time they're totally wrong. Right in that it would have been nice if we could have captured these guys alive and tried them for their criminal acts. They're totally wrong however in saying that, because we couldn't capture them alive for trial, we had no right to hit them in whatever way we could. I know it's preaching to the choir to post it here, but the simple fact is that when you're dealing with these terrorists, you've got to get them any way you can. This is what the Israelis figured out some years back, and I'm happy to see that we've come to the same conclusion. Whether with live troops, drones or manned aircraft, get 'em all!!!
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 10:35:00 AM EDT
Ah, FUCK those bedsheet bandits! Sometimes I think maybe the best thing to do would be to totally withdraw from the Middle East, and I mean TOTALLY, and let them fight it out until there's just one winner left...and then we do business with them! Maybe I'm out of line for saying it. Hit me with a stick if you want to, but I said what I meant and I meant what I said. CJ
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 10:38:22 AM EDT
Lets crack open that rubiks cube in mecca.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 10:39:18 AM EDT
quit bitching you towel-headed terrorist bastards! we could have used [size=5][red]2[/red][/size=5] missiles.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 10:44:51 AM EDT
They should be happy they are not in a vapor state floating over a sea of glass by now.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 10:52:18 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 10:59:15 AM EDT
seriously, did we?
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 11:03:17 AM EDT
Originally Posted By trickshot: Executed without a trial and it doesn't even raise an eyebrow anymore. The US is becoming more like a banana republic with each passing day.
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And the alternative is what ???? Would you prefer we put our soldiers in harms way just to capture these terrorists. Then we could bring them back here and put them on trial and then dershowitz or cochran or some other shithead lawyer can try to get them off at OUR TAXPAYER EXPENSE. Then IF they get convicted they can hang out in our fine prison system (which is better than where they lived before) and play our justice system for as long as possible or untill the liberal snot noses start a "free the terrorists" campaign. No thank you, I like the outcome just fine. Now lets do it again.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 11:05:04 AM EDT
Nice shooting if you ask me. Next.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 11:07:12 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/7/2002 11:15:07 AM EDT by Hawkeye]
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 11:12:53 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/7/2002 11:13:42 AM EDT by redray]
ok everyone. that red " 2 " up there on my post, pretend its a [red][size=5]3[/red][/size=5]. i stand corrected. and im glad.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 11:36:00 AM EDT
Since when do we need to capture and put on trial a group of people that declared war on us, and in return we declared war on them?
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 11:42:56 AM EDT
I think the arabnews.com site is run with Khashoggi money by Saudis with a few radical american (or anti-american, as the case may be) left-wingers for "balance". *LOL* It's purpose is obviously to co-opt the "9-11 tragedy" and insert anti-american screeds and critiques, while claiming that we don't really understand THEM. Here are their (distastefully titled) 9 books by 11 authors to "understand" the 9-11 attacks fully. (All that's missing is that French "book" claiming we blew up the Pentagon ourselves.) [url]http://www.arabnews.com/Tragedy/911j.asp[/url]
9 books by 11 authors The Cell: Inside the 9/11 Plot, And Why the FBI and CIA Failed to Stop It by John Miller and Michael Stone This investigation into anti-American terrorist activities would have been even more shocking if information hadn’t already started to dribble out about the inadequacies of the FBI and CIA in tracking and preventing such activities. But every page of this information-packed report seems to present ineffectual actions, missed opportunities and frustrated agents on the ground blocked by the FBI hierarchy, turf battles and political lack of will. Why do People Hate America? by Ziauddin Sardar & Merryl Wyn Davies Many people do hate America, the authors conclude, in the Middle East and the developing countries as well as in Europe. They explore the global impact of America’s foreign policy and its corporate and cultural power, placing this unprecedented dominance in the context of America’s own confused because idealistic perception of itself. Blowback: The Cost and Consequences of American Empire by Chalmers Johnson "Blowback" is a term originally coined by the CIA to describe the unintended consequences of American policies. In this devastating critique, all the more relevant after Sept. 11, Johnson updates the old adage that you reap what you sow, except that in the case of US foreign policy the American people are unaware of what has been sown on their behalf. Perpetual War for Perpetual Peace: How We Got to be So Hated by Gore Vidal Includes a catalogue of the nearly 250 military incursions since 1945 in which the United States has been the aggressor. While disgusted by the slaughter in the Twin Towers, Vidal argues that the greatest victim of the Sept. 11 attacks will be American liberty. The fact that no American newspaper or magazine would publish the essays in this book tends to validate Vidal’s argument. The New Rulers of the World by John Pilger This is a book about power, its secrets and illusions, and how they relate to modern imperialism. Following the Sept. 11 attacks and the consequent bombing of Afghanistan, Pilger describes the new thrust of American power and its goal of "world order", as well as the propaganda that justifies and drives it. Rogue State: A Guide to the World’s Only Superpower by William Blum “Suggesting to Americans that their country has a compelling lust for political, economic and military hegemony over the rest of the world, divorced from any moral considerations, is akin to telling them of one’s UFO abduction – except that they’re more likely to believe the abduction story,” writes William Blum, who has compiled evidence in this book that will make believers of such skeptics. Terrorism and War by Howard Zinn Zinn has made a life-long study of the purpose and outcomes of war, and has played an enormous role in the ongoing democratic debate within the US. In "Terrorism and War", he explores the growth of the American empire, as well as the long tradition of resistance in the United States to US militarism. 9/11 by Noam Chomsky Noam Chomsky comments on the new “war on terrorism”, US foreign policy, Osama Bin Laden, US involvement with Afghanistan, and the long-term implications of America’s military attacks abroad. This is not vintage Chomsky, but “9/11” does provide a badly needed corrective to the deliberately slanted, or just plain incompetent, news coverage of the present-day "war on terrorism." Stupid White Men by Michael Moore This is humor with a subversive edge, the message of which in one chapter is that George W. Bush stole the last US election and should be ousted from the Oval Office by UN troops. "Stupid White Men" shot to No. 1 on the amazon.com bestsellers list days after publication, and is still a New York Times bestseller. Its popularity shows that, contrary to popular myth, democracy in the United States is far from dead and buried after Sept. 11. *** (John R. Bradley is News Editor at Arab News. His guides to Saudi Arabia and Iraq will appear in the forthcoming Lonely Planet Guide to the Middle East - January 2003).
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Now we can see the Saudi perspective: It's the CIA's fault, the warmongers in Washington, White guys, whatever - anything but islamic intolerance. [;)] I think that what they are really pissed about in this situation (specifically) is that THEY CAN'T effectively eliminate their enemies, let alone do damage without killing themselves in the process. [;)] LOSERS
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 11:48:03 AM EDT
Originally Posted By BustinCaps: I guess it is pretty worthless to huff and puff over Arab ideas.
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I can understand that, but it gives me something to do while I'm on the computer besides drink coke and put on weight I don't need. Besides, I'm interested in what our enemies are thinking, at home or abroad.
Although the article did make me laugh. These nuts are going to do all the whining they can while hitting below the belt every time. When I hear "Arab Intellectuals" speak it strikes a perfect parallel with a Democratic party convention.
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Yup. They seem to hook up with our "social justice" types quite easily. Of course if they got to know each other... I mean really got to know...
edited because I write here when it should be hear all the time.
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Not sure what that means, but that's okay. Carry on.
Originally Posted By trickshot: Executed without a trial and it doesn't even raise an eyebrow anymore. The US is becoming more like a banana republic with each passing day.
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Same old trickshot. [trickshot-think: Whenever foreign terrorist umbrella organizations with thousands of members (and once upon a time governmental co-authority in a (now) defeated regime), armed to the teeth, declare and wage war against the United States in an unprecedented manner in human history, the proper response is to have Barney Fife go and round them up on foreign soil, to bring them back to face long drawn-out trials. How about the Zacarias Moussaoui trial times a thousand... anyone? That trial is a circus everybody (the judge, his lawyers) except Moussaoui now wishes wasn't started. And who thinks like trickshot and the wealthy wahabis? Our old [s]communist[/s]socialist friend from Sweden...
In Mexico, Swedish Foreign Minister Anna Lindh criticized the operation, saying suspected terrorists should be treated according to due process of law. "If the U.S.A. is behind this with Yemen's consent, it is nevertheless a summary execution that violates human rights," Lindh told the Swedish news agency TT. "If the U.S.A. has conducted the attack without Yemen's permission it is even worse. Then it is a question of unauthorized use of force."
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Just as I thought, the socialists! Good company to be in. [;)] The western-educated Saudis have no ideas of their own, of course. [rolleyes] Allah knows, they don't even do any real work in their country... And who would be the sole legitimate power in their eyes to authorize the use of force? Why, the U.N. of course! Arabs, muslims and left-thinking westerners all agree. Now isn't that *SPECIAL*. (I like Swedes but find it amazing that they can lecture ANY country at ANY time about ANYthing. Lest we forget this is the country that declared nuetrality while the rest of the world was in a life and death struggle with fascism. They did however PROFIT from the Nazis by selling them raw materials to keep their war machine humming along nicely.)
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 12:01:26 PM EDT
Originally Posted By trickshot: Executed without a trial and it doesn't even raise an eyebrow anymore. The US is becoming more like a banana republic with each passing day.
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No, you're becoming more and more bananas every day. If one of our soldiers had Hitler in his sights should he have refrained because Hitler hadn't received a trial? We are at war. These people want to kill us. And while you personally make me sometimes hope we don't bother stopping them, on a larger scale I know we have to.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 12:02:11 PM EDT
The way I see it, assasination involves covertly killing a political target. This was the policing of a country that cannot or will not police itself. In its capacity of protecting America, the CIA met a deadly threat with deadly force. That terrorist, and his body guard thugs, had plenty of time to turn themselves in. There is nothing to be politically gained by this so it was not an assasination. In fact we are the political loser in this situation (but it sure feels good!!!). Reactionary
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 12:10:23 PM EDT
[u] Though it would undoubtedly have been far more difficult and might have caused the loss of further lives, the right thing to have done would have been to have apprehended Al-Harthi and brought him to trial.[/u]
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LOL. This coming from the same hypocrites who harbor, feed, and finance these filthy subhuman terrorist POS's.....LIke they would be willing to just turn them over for trial. No thanks.That 250g hellfire missile is cheaper than a trial anyway. Best money my tax dollars ever spent...
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 12:20:10 PM EDT
Originally Posted By trickshot: Executed without a trial and it doesn't even raise an eyebrow anymore. The US is becoming more like a banana republic with each passing day.
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No, we are getting back to the way it used to be, when wiping out a bad guy of any kind hardly raised an eyebrow, except from whiny, liberal, anarchist, anti-American punks. More whiny, liberal, anarchist, anti-American crap from dickshot.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 12:20:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/7/2002 12:22:40 PM EDT by Hawkeye]
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 12:54:20 PM EDT
[b]three of these.[/b] [img]http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/missile/longbowhellfire1.jpg[/img] [b]delivered by this.[/b] [img]http://www.ga.com/news/phell_445.jpg[/img] sounds fuckin good to me.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 1:42:25 PM EDT
My only question is when do we start missile strikes in France to kill the Al-Qaeda terrorists tied to September 11th that they refuse to turn over to us because they have not committed crimes in France? THISISME
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 1:58:52 PM EDT
If Allah didn't want them dead, he would've miracled them out of there. Seriously... Do they realize we are at war with terrorists? Assassinating people is against American law, but targeting a threat and destroying it is a very necessary part of war.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 1:59:04 PM EDT
Originally Posted By THISISME: My only question is when do we start missile strikes in France to kill the Al-Qaeda terrorists tied to September 11th that they refuse to turn over to us because they have not committed crimes in France? THISISME
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Hmmm, interesting point.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 2:04:19 PM EDT
You live by the camel with explosives, you die by the wrath of the the American people. Fuck them and their religion. FUCK ISLAM.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 2:19:46 PM EDT
The use of a "hellfire" against those assholes is almost poetic. I like it!
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 2:22:51 PM EDT
Didn't these assess declare war on us? If they feel that targeting civilians is fair why shouldn't we be able to target their fucking leaders? Did they give the folks on September 11th a trail? No,they just killed them. Reap what you sow.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 2:23:42 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 3:13:54 PM EDT
waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!! looks like the 'ol jihad just isn't as much fun when you're no longer the only one doing the killin'. death from above, with a whole new twist! i freakin' love it, lets see some more. a hellfire a day keeps the ragheads away, or something like that... -eric
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 3:22:40 PM EDT
no big loss.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 3:48:20 PM EDT
I WANT GUN CAMERA FOOTAGE !!!!!! I WANT TO SEE THE COCKROACHES JUST AS THEY GET SOME HELLFIRE !!!!
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 3:56:25 PM EDT
They need to rename that Predator drone "the Brimstone." That way we could take out the terrorist scum with Hellfire and Brimstone. [;)]
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 4:00:41 PM EDT
A good muslim eats hellfire for breakfast.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 4:02:34 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 4:03:17 PM EDT
Dead war combatant in a 'declared' war. He's with his 72 Virgins in Paradise now. He's happy, we're happy. What's with the bitching?
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 5:06:52 PM EDT
Amen Rik. (oops, careful now). By the way, the responsibility and protection of the US government stops with it's citizens. Non-citizens are supposed to be protected by their own governments. Planerench out.
Link Posted: 11/7/2002 5:38:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/7/2002 5:42:07 PM EDT by gus]
The dumb asses have no concept of crime vs war. This is not a criminal investigation. It's war! We'll put whatever enemy we deem appropriate on trial AFTER the war. BUT, if it will make them FEEL better: [img]www.ar15.com/members/albums/gus%2Fapology%2Ejpg[/img]
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