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Posted: 10/30/2002 7:54:30 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 7:59:10 AM EDT
Tattered volleyball nets? Damn... - those poor, poor bastards. How can they live like that?
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 8:12:31 AM EDT
This reflects badly on all Air Force members. I spent 20 years with the USAF and only deployed once. No, living in a tent is not the same as living in base houseing, but get a clue folks! This is a war, you're in a foreward location, grow up. I'd like to know how many are complaining, and what is the general feeling of the majority? No AC, bad vollyball nets, bad chow, dust, the horror!
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 8:18:13 AM EDT
These whiners should go hang out with a Marine Expeditionary Unit for a while
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 4:05:27 PM EDT
Must not be any PJ's on that base. Jay [img]http://members.cox.net/azcop/images/iroc-cop.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 4:10:38 PM EDT
I emailed that article to a friend of mine who was in Viet Nam, this was his response: Howdy USN, Well my take on it is this, when I served in the US Army, we had air-conditioned tents, B40 rockets and motors sure do put holes in tents, lets the air circulate real well. We also had to stand in a chow line, we stood in line to see who would open the case of C rations and then throw them out to those of us hungry enough to eat them. During the rainy season we lived in mud, during the dry season we never had a racial problems because we were all red, the color of the dirt and dust in the part of the country were I served. So I don't see why these guys should be called whiners after all they just want to live the way we did when I was doing my time. Just one question, what caliber is "volleyball" and what type of weapon do you load it into? "Mr. Cob" As always Ride Hard, Ride Free, Ride SAFE!
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 4:17:44 PM EDT
Apparently they didn't send the REAL AF folks out there. When I was in, I worked out in temperatures from 100 above to 100 below. Pouring rain, freezing sleet, trudging through waist high snow drifts. But DAMMIT....I did my JOB!!! Of course, there were some commanders who coddled their SP's. At a 3 week Air Base Ground Defense course in '88, some SP's from a few bases were exempted from doing certain obstacles on the obstacle courses because they MIGHT get hurt!!! Imagine that! Needless to say, our group looked down upon most of them. We were SAC, and we went to kick ass. In the end, we were one of a very few ABGD groups that the instructors were not able to penetrate. No wonder it takes us so damn long to deploy nowadays. All the excess baggage for a few creature comforts.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 4:27:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By eljay45: These whiners should go hang out with a Marine Expeditionary Unit for a while
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Amen Brother! It's always the REMF's that whine and complain. That's because the real warriors on the front lines are more concerned about getting killed than whether or not they have intact volley ball nets....... What do you expect from a branch of the service where their Physical Readiness Test entails riding a stationary bike...
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 4:37:26 PM EDT
Missilecop, you arent referring to Volant Scorpion in 88 are you? If so I was one of those ATC guys exempted from some of the obstacles. We werent just exempted we were prohibited. I've spent alot of time on deployments and the like during my 4 years as an SP in the USAF and although they were all just exercise deployments we didnt have shit for amenities. These guys are whiners, and that's the real AF. Keep in mind though there are "real men" in the USAF. The SP's, now SF's I guess and others do endure without whining just the average pencil pusher drags the rest down.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 4:56:43 PM EDT
Only one bottle per meal and OMG, they have to eat MRE's for lunch. We need to send these poor poor people money so they can go back to their filet mineon and merlot. Send donations to...screw the AF. These people are pussys, I go through more crap in a drill weekend than they ever do.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 5:09:22 PM EDT
That article is like some urban legend that the Marines or Army would make up to shit on the Air Force. I mean, without their big screens, recliners, and gourmet meals they are living in "cruel and unusual" conditions. This is outrageous, it must end (note sarcasm). Someone call Emeril for a food shipment, Pottery Barn for more comfy furniture, and Hilton to set up digs that meet Air Force standards. What the hell would those wusses do if a shot was ever fired in their direction. I guess the Clinton legacy lives on.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 5:10:05 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 5:20:13 PM EDT
We used to have Air Force PJ's accompany my team (SF) on some operations. They sure had all the neat, high-speed stuff, but man they whined and complained constantly. We just though they were a bunch of cry babies. Just shows things haven't changed much.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 5:43:49 PM EDT
You should have seen the list of some of the things they did fly in also, there was a bit on it in the MC/Navy times recently. Like a 35000 dollar cappuccino machines, big screen TV, etc.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 5:49:22 PM EDT
The only legit thing in that article they should complain about is the dust.. as it can't be healthy. The rest is just a bunch of whining. But really.. what can be done about the dust? I'd imagine most of it is just native to that enviorment.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 5:54:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/30/2002 5:56:50 PM EDT by CoyoteA1]
I see nothing has changed in the Air Force since I left in '92. My AF Weather Unit was assigned to the 101st in Desert Shield/Storm. We ate, slept, and sh*t with the 101st. One day we snuck over to the adjoining AF encampment and took a look around. First thing I noticed was "Air Conditioned Tents," WTF. They had a Mini BX and warm food to boot. All I had since arriving in country was warm MRE's(a gift from the Weather Gods) via the hood of a Humvee or left outside for five minutes. Anyways, some SP's finally caught up to us and cut our expedition short. We were told to hand over our M16A2's or leave. Needless to say we left. They would have freak out to learn we also had two AT-4's in our truck also :) F*nkin REMF's.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 6:02:22 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ChrisLe: Amen Brother! It's always the REMF's that whine and complain. That's because the real warriors on the front lines are more concerned about getting killed than whether or not they have intact volley ball nets.......
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OK there RAMBO....lemmie clue you in!!! We are all on the same team so dont be bad mouthin any of them. Without the guys in the rear "YOU"(assuming "YOU" even served) would not have ANY chow,water,medicine,beds or any other supplies. SO KISS MY ASS!! BTW ever been to a combat zone?
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 6:19:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By CoyoteA1: I see nothing has changed in the Air Force since I left in '92. My AF Weather Unit was assigned to the 101st in Desert Shield/Storm. We ate, slept, and sh*t with the 101st. One day we snuck over to the adjoining AF encampment and took a look around. First thing I noticed was "Air Conditioned Tents," WTF. They had a Mini BX and warm food to boot. All I had since arriving in country was warm MRE's(a gift from the Weather Gods) via the hood of a Humvee or left outside for five minutes. Anyways, some SP's finally caught up to us and cut our expedition short. We were told to hand over our M16A2's or leave. Needless to say we left. They would have freak out to learn we also had two AT-4's in our truck also :) F*nkin REMF's.
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Uh...so whats your point? The AF guys should not have "Air Conditioned Tents," a Mini BX and warm food? Sounds like your jelous!! I guranfuckintee you would have loved to have that stuff. So quit your BITCHIN!
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 6:22:20 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/30/2002 6:22:59 PM EDT by prk]
Shee*******t!!!! We considered ourselves real lucky to have our own racks to sleep in, and at least a little real milk at the beginning of the fresh > sterilized > powdered progression. And just about always fresh water to shower in. Such are the luxuries of carrier life. Hey Paul, can you paint a picture of life on a tin can? I only had 2 weeks on one out of Quonset Point and can't do it justice.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 6:41:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/30/2002 7:03:20 PM EDT by CoyoteA1]
Originally Posted By RipMeyer:
Originally Posted By CoyoteA1: I see nothing has changed in the Air Force since I left in '92. My AF Weather Unit was assigned to the 101st in Desert Shield/Storm. We ate, slept, and sh*t with the 101st. One day we snuck over to the adjoining AF encampment and took a look around. First thing I noticed was "Air Conditioned Tents," WTF. They had a Mini BX and warm food to boot. All I had since arriving in country was warm MRE's(a gift from the Weather Gods) via the hood of a Humvee or left outside for five minutes. Anyways, some SP's finally caught up to us and cut our expedition short. We were told to hand over our M16A2's or leave. Needless to say we left. They would have freak out to learn we also had two AT-4's in our truck also :) F*nkin REMF's.
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Uh...so whats your point? The AF guys should not have "Air Conditioned Tents," a Mini BX and warm food? Sounds like your jelous!! I guranfuckintee you would have loved to have that stuff. So quit your BITCHIN!
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I don't think so RIP, My commander was correct when he made the decision to, "exist with the units we support." If we were pampered like our AF brothers and sisters we would have had a distinctive disadvantage during the adjustment period when conducting operations in the field with supported army units. Besides the trade off wasn't worth it, give up my A2 for luxuries and trust SP's for my defense and security, LOL. Like I said, I don't think so.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 6:44:28 PM EDT
On 01 Nov. I'll have been retired 11yrs. this isn't the AF I remember. 10 yrs MAC (C5-A)going all over the world, and 11yrs SAC (52's G&H), A good NCO would have them little SOB's sweeping all that dirt up so it wouldn't FOD an engine! They wouldn't have time to complain. Suck it up you bunch of Sh*Lt for Brain A@@holes, Your not turning enough ACFT if you have time to take pictures, and be glad you have what you do!
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 6:58:41 PM EDT
Man o Man... We had to make our own nets... we had to drag our own softball fields and use sandbags for the bases. that lasted 1 month out of 9 that I was in that "Big catbox" back in '91 Livin like that sux butt. I would have been jealous, but I never saw any AF guys till I got to Kobar towers.. I always made a point to eat their mess every chance I got.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 7:05:33 PM EDT
Originally Posted By CoyoteA1: My commander was correct when he made the decision to, "exist with the units we support." If we were pampered like our AF brothers and sisters we would have to had a distinctive disadvantage during the adjustment period when conducting operations in the field with supported army units. Besides the trade off wasn't worth it, give up my A2 for luxuries and trust SP's for my defense and security, LOL. Like I said, I don't think so.
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Fine by me but dont BITCH cause some guys have it better. You should be glad they have that. Nothing like a slice of home when you are 9,000 miles away from home.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 7:09:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By RipMeyer: Nothing like a slice of home when you are 9,000 miles away from home.
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True and fair enough.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 7:13:52 PM EDT
. What's the use of complaining about tacky volleyball nets when most of Afghanistan lives in poverty, asks one officer. "The Army and Navy would laugh at us," he said.
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[b]WRONG![/b] Via the internet, the entire world is laughing at you, LOL! What a bunch of pansies......
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 7:14:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MissileCop: No wonder it takes us so damn long to deploy nowadays. All the excess baggage for a few creature comforts.
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This is a great point. We constantly hear that to attack Iraq would require months of build-up. Would it really [b]require[/b] that long? Hmmm.... -kill-9
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 9:17:52 PM EDT
As an enlisted aircrewman in the AF I admit I had it better than most. But you need to stop and think about how things are stateside too. Out of all the airfields/bases I've stopped at while TDY, the AF almost always had nicer things, from the buildings to the chow. That's just the way it is. So doesn't it make some sense that your average airman (not someone from a combat arms type career field) would have some trouble adjusting to such a situation. A perfect example is in '99 we were dropping members of the 82nd at the DoD airshow at Andrews AFB. On our return trip to Pope that afternoon we were diverted to Charleston due to weather and had to spend the night. IIRC we had 8 aircraft, that comes out to about 48 aircrew and around 400 jumpers that suddenly had to find a place to sleep(it was also a big drill weekend there so hotel rooms were already scarce). Well the aircrews were pretty much every crew for themselves to find lodging. We had crews in everything from Super 8 to some brand new $150 a night suites. We found out the next morning that the Army had spent the night on the floor of a hanger. I remember thinking that that must have really sucked, but none of them seemed too terribly put off by this(keep in mind they were jumping hollywood and had nothing with them) it was pretty much SOP for them. Just different folks used to different lifestyles. It's not just the AF either. I used to hate working with 18th Airborne Corps (Combat Admin-as we affectionately refered to them) because all they would do is whine, bitch, and moan. They were just there to make there quarterly jump so they could still strut around like they were someone important. I even had a soldier offer to pay me $100 cash if I could somehow arrange for the plane to be broken so he wouldn't have to jump, because "I just jumped last week", yeah that just oozes hardcore doesn't it. My point is that not everyone is the same and used to the same living conditions. IMHO Dirk
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 9:22:35 PM EDT
Life on the boat? Compared to anyone living in the dirt Navy people have it good on a Bird Farm.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 9:45:16 PM EDT
Worst than the fact that they brought summo suites and cappuccino makers, was although the could make room for useless crap, they could make room for tube artillery that was a combat asset. Too bad the Pogues and REMF are allowed to run the show for logistics. In the end who do you think their going to short, themselves or the trigger pullers? As history has shown those who pull triggers get screwed every time in order to allow the people in the rear to be comfortable.
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 10:45:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By STLRN: Worst than the fact that they brought summo suites and cappuccino makers, was although the could make room for useless crap, they could make room for tube artillery that was a combat asset. Too bad the Pogues and REMF are allowed to run the show for logistics. In the end who do you think their going to short, themselves or the trigger pullers? As history has shown those who pull triggers get screwed every time in order to allow the people in the rear to be comfortable.
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Hah - yeah they carried that article in the Army Times as well! I couldn't believe that shit - especially when I know there are ground units being told they can't bring certain equipment for lack of room! Adam
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 10:57:27 PM EDT
Everybody complains, but they SHOULD have kept it TDY. Doesn't make us Air Force guys look good!
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 11:15:06 PM EDT
Its just a difference in culture you do get complainers and whiners in every service. But the closer to the FEBA you get the more we take pride in being able to take it, although my Marines may not like getting rained on, living in a hole in the ground and getting poor food, they wouldn't think of complaining because we would tell them to shut up, suck it up and drive. You got to wonder, if they complain about a lack of comfort what will they do when they have to face death?
Link Posted: 10/30/2002 11:55:38 PM EDT
Originally Posted By RipMeyer:
Originally Posted By CoyoteA1: I see nothing has changed in the Air Force since I left in '92. My AF Weather Unit was assigned to the 101st in Desert Shield/Storm. We ate, slept, and sh*t with the 101st. One day we snuck over to the adjoining AF encampment and took a look around. First thing I noticed was "Air Conditioned Tents," WTF. They had a Mini BX and warm food to boot. All I had since arriving in country was warm MRE's(a gift from the Weather Gods) via the hood of a Humvee or left outside for five minutes. Anyways, some SP's finally caught up to us and cut our expedition short. We were told to hand over our M16A2's or leave. Needless to say we left. They would have freak out to learn we also had two AT-4's in our truck also :) F*nkin REMF's.
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Uh...so whats your point? The AF guys should not have "Air Conditioned Tents," a Mini BX and warm food? Sounds like your jelous!! I guranfuckintee you would have loved to have that stuff. So quit your BITCHIN!
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Ok, Wilbur Kookmeyer, you're making our point for us: Those AF wenies have more acoutrements on the battlefield than any other US service in history, yet they still have the audacity to complain. Wah, my cappucino isn't hot enough! Wah, my latest issue of Rosie is a month late! WAH! [B]THAT IS THE F*CKING POINT.[/B] Most of us here think that the majority of AF personnel are just as dedicated and willing to live in piss-poor combat conditions as any other branch... but whiners like those in this article are bringing to the forefront a disparity in quality of living that usually is shrugged off by the Army, Navy and Marines. It seems to me that a lot of that funding that the AF is blowing on foo foo niceties could be better utilized in other places. The other services have made due without vollyball in Afghanistan, and just maybe the Airforce can too. Frickin' whiners. And to qualify my opinion, I did my time in the service, and I can't complain; I enjoyed my time in the Navy. USS Aubrey Fitch (FFG-34)'94-'98, got out as an OS2.
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 2:44:12 AM EDT
I don't understand this shit, slamming members of the armed services. The generals get all the perks of the service and don't do shit,but take orders and pass them on down the line. I never served in the service and never will(ever). FLAME SUIT ON HIGH BTW never understood sending someone else to do my fighting for me. i don't dislike the services just don't appeal to me.
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 2:58:02 AM EDT
Originally Posted By batf-approved: The generals get all the perks of the service and don't do shit,but take orders and pass them on down the line. [snip] I never served in the service and never will(ever).
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The last sentence I quoted clearly explains your first sentence. Where do you get your information? Do you make this stuff up?
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 3:40:14 AM EDT
Originally Posted By RipMeyer:
Originally Posted By ChrisLe: Amen Brother! It's always the REMF's that whine and complain. That's because the real warriors on the front lines are more concerned about getting killed than whether or not they have intact volley ball nets.......
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OK there RAMBO....lemmie clue you in!!! We are all on the same team so dont be bad mouthin any of them. Without the guys in the rear "YOU"(assuming "YOU" even served) would not have ANY chow,water,medicine,beds or any other supplies. SO KISS MY ASS!! BTW ever been to a combat zone?
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RipMeyer, First and foremost you need to step back and calm down. The 'Kiiss my ass' reference was uncalled for. Obviously, I hit a little too close to home. I can only assume you're a REMF with a thin skin. If you can't make as coherent argument without insults, DON'T! As far as my original statement, I stand by it. It's every soldier's right to bitch and we all do it very well. We all know how easy the REMF's got it and I have no problem with that. After all somebody has to be in the rear with the gear. Get the goods anyway you can I always say. What I do have a problem with is that those REMF's not only complained about their living conditions, but had the audacity to take pictures of their 'less than perfect' living conditions and send them to the Pentagon knowing all well that their counterparts on the front line have it much worse....Nothing pisses me off more than thse REMF's that know they have it ten times better than the guys at the front yet they still cry and whine like preschoolers. If the shoe fits......... P.S. Been in the service since 88 and continue to serve, and Yes I have been in Combat Zone, been shot at, etc......Nuff said
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 4:16:14 AM EDT
Picture this I am working on a Airforce base on the side of the tarmac. Its is summer 80 deg. and sunny. This is a high traffic base LOTS of planes. I hear a different type of engine than normal so I look up to see a Lear jet taxing over to the building I am walking to. The jet pulls within 60ft of the building. That is pretty dam close. The Lear jet stopped with the door in front of a RED Carpet yes a red carpet of the indoor outdoor type. I am watching now. A airman runs out and opens the door a set of sets fold out and all I can see is BLACK HIGH HEELS AND A SET OF LEGS MMMMMMMM. Down steps a babe in the airforce uniform. Blue blouse and skirt she is playboy hot. Then another one comes out she is just as HOT. I don't know the rank of the old guy who got off next, but he look happy. They walked in to the building and sat down in the lounge. Nobody else got of that plane. That guy has a private lear jet and TWO BABES what a friggen life ! The USAF has it the best of ALL the services.
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 4:19:37 AM EDT
I spent 20 years in the AF and am now happily retired. I don't condone the whineing these people are doing. My only experience with something like this was a 106 day deployment to PSAB in 1997. Tent city was no big deal there and after the first few days I was used to it. The food was not great, but I survived, and I really got tired of biriyami rice by the time I left. That said, with the exception of Combat Controllers, Combat Comm and PJs you have to remember that the USAF is basically all REMFs and is an all REMF service. Because of our mission, we are tied to physical locations like airbases which are usually behind the lines and well established facility wise. The few exceptions I can think of are during deployments when we go into a austere/bare base and set up from scratch with nothing but a runway there. You can't fault the AF leadership for looking out for its troops by ensuring niceties such as air conditioned tents, better food, etc. The AF perspective I learned was that the Army didn't take as good care of it's soldiers as the AF did because the Army spent lots of time in the field and didn't want their soldiers to get accustomed to a cushy lifestyle on post. Sort of makes it harder to go to the field if you have to leave the recliner and decent chow behind. Also, since the Army does leave their bases to fight wars, why spend huge amounts of money to improve those bases if they would just empty during a conflict? Why not spend that money on better equipment or training instead? Anyway, comparing the Army, Navy, Air Force and Marines is like comparing apples, oranges, qumquats, and grapes. All are FRUITS, but all are also different; be it texture, flavor or use.
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 4:49:23 AM EDT
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 9:26:10 AM EDT
Man to hear you Army and Navy retards talk, the Air Force is a bunch of slackers. But when your rust bucket starts sliding beneath the waves because you have painted over the rust until all it was all rust or you need a ride to the war, who do you call? I have lived with every other branch of the service for long periods of time,,the AF has it best by far. We never have to write "PLEASE FLUSH" on the toliet or order our guys to bathe or wipe their asses. UNLIKE the Army or Navy. I happen to think the average AF enlisted guy would be a Captain in the Army. We have E-9's that do the jobs of generals and our job is more technical that combat oriented. As they say, the smarter the person the better he/she expects to be treated. The only thing I ever learned from the Army is that some people will steal anything.
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 9:50:11 AM EDT
CoyoteA1........ So, you were in the Weather Service too. Nice to know somebody on the board that was a weatherman also. I retired in "94" and now work for the National Weather Service in Cheyenne.
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 11:20:20 AM EDT
Originally Posted By lonegunman: Man to hear you Army and Navy retards talk, the Air Force is a bunch of slackers. But when your rust bucket starts sliding beneath the waves because you have painted over the rust until all it was all rust or you need a ride to the war, who do you call?
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You're kidding, right? WTF is your malfunction? Nobody called them slackers, but I believe that the words 'whiney bitches' was tossed around. And we're not generalizing the whole AirForce, just those pampered losers who were not happy with Afghanistan's ambient air temperature and felt the need to not go through their chain of command but to instead send pics directly to the Pentagon brass about the 'squalid' living conditions. Every service has these types of assholes who are never satisfied. The problem the rest of us have is that AF has the best of everything in relation to the other services in the same A/O... their personnel should be the last ones bitching about their quarters.
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 11:32:46 AM EDT
Originally Posted By lonegunman: I happen to think the average AF enlisted guy would be a Captain in the Army. We have E-9's that do the jobs of generals and our job is more technical that combat oriented. As they say, the smarter the person the better he/she expects to be treated.
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There is your problem you are thinking and you don't know. Since the average AF guy doesn't do leadership things and your PT is a joke they may not be able to lead and command, what Capts do (you know leading from the front and taking responsibility for all their men's actions) But than against since they cannot stomach their current conditions how can they lead men who live in the mud? The E9s doing what a general does is simply delusional. You might be surprised at the GT scores you find in the other services also. I know allot of guys with extremely high GTs in all the service, but amazingly even though they are smart they don't wine about only 2 hot meals a day and 1 bottle of water per meal.
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 1:32:11 PM EDT
Lonegunman, you should tone it down a bit. I am in the Navy, I have done over 20 years and I am NOT a "retard". So how about you? How about I take you on over to Bremerton or Everett and show you one of the Carriers so you can see for yourself the material condition of them before you speak. The Army, Navy and Marines use the Air Force as a means of rapid transportation since the Air Force is the "bus driving" service. The Navy does have a small fleet of C-130's, C-9's and 737's. About the technical end of things, working on or flying in an F-16 or an F18 is the same. No difference between operating the weapons systems of a fixed land based ICBM site than the weapon systems of an SSBN. And who flies the Airborne Command Post Missions? The Navy. If anyone had written and complained about the lack of latte/mocha machines or basketball nets on board an aircraft carrier I would have been the first one here to post. My brother is Major (C-130 pilot) in the Air Force and he thinks that what those two guys did was assinine. I have pictures of him and his crew living in some really crappy tents out in the middle of some desert while he was TDY delivering some "special" guys not too long ago. My friend who was in Viet Nam in "the shit" who wrote me the email understands that if there is a way to better living and working conditions for the Troops out in the field then every effort should be made to do so (withing reason). So cut the crap, if you quit posting like a troll then no one will treat you like a troll. Admit that those two guys went beyond what they should have in describing the living conditions. You going to the WAC show this weekend?
Originally Posted By lonegunman: Man to hear you Army and Navy retards talk, the Air Force is a bunch of slackers. But when your rust bucket starts sliding beneath the waves because you have painted over the rust until all it was all rust or you need a ride to the war, who do you call? I have lived with every other branch of the service for long periods of time,,the AF has it best by far. We never have to write "PLEASE FLUSH" on the toliet or order our guys to bathe or wipe their asses. UNLIKE the Army or Navy. I happen to think the average AF enlisted guy would be a Captain in the Army. We have E-9's that do the jobs of generals and our job is more technical that combat oriented. As they say, the smarter the person the better he/she expects to be treated. The only thing I ever learned from the Army is that some people will steal anything.
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Link Posted: 10/31/2002 2:40:23 PM EDT
Don't worry some of us aren't crying. I was at Bagram AB a few weeks ago. I lived in a tent like everyone else. I appreciate the fact that I was able to access ar15.com while I was there. Worst thing about being AF is the fact that when I go to a "combat zone", and I use that term lightly, I had to leave my ar, glocks, sigs, and toys locked away in an armoury back in Tucson. I had to redeploy to Kuwait in order to let the rest of the crews rotate up. Everyone is jumping at the chance to go there. Its nice to go to a place where your job as a bomb loader is hanging bombs to support the guys in the field doing the down and dirty work. Too bad our planes come home with their bombs a lot of the time. Might get a chance to send the real Bagram photos of people who are happy as all get out to be doing their job. In my 10 years in this has been my first chance to load out live bombs for real targets. Don't let the few out there ruin it for what most of us are doing. having been there its sort of a draw, army has better rec centers and things but heck I stayed busy enough at work so free time consisted of a the basic 3 S's and maybe some reading time.
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 2:45:00 PM EDT
Here are the pics, just in case no one has seen them. [url]http://www.hackworth.com/article10222002z.html[/url] Virtually every USAF enlisted and officer in our command was embarrassed and/or pissed over this, from E-5 to O-6. Just reporting results, so don't shoot me![(:)] Omar USMC, ret My daughter and son in law are USAF, btw
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 3:18:22 PM EDT
Originally Posted By omar: Here are the pics, just in case no one has seen them. [url]http://www.hackworth.com/article10222002z.html[/url]
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Lemmie Guess, That looks like paradise to non AF guys, Right? Get a clue if that looks good to you then your standards are VERY LOW. I don't care how bad you had it in the past eating raw snakes with rambo himself. Why do some of you want to make everyone else have the shitty end of the stick. [b]We all deserve better so don't knock it if someone want improvements to their environment.[/b] Maybe you should join the afghan army I hear they shit in there pants and live with it in there for days. They would call you guys wussies. Does that mean you should live with shit in your pants until you can bitch? Didn't think so!
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 3:34:05 PM EDT
Don't shoot the messenger. That was input from my USAF co-workers. It has nothing to do with standards and everything about playing the hand you're dealt, accomplishing the mission and NOT WHINING. Oh, and FUCK OFF.
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 3:42:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By omar: Don't shoot the messenger. That was input from my USAF co-workers. It has nothing to do with standards and everything about playing the hand you're dealt, accomplishing the mission and NOT WHINING. Oh, and FUCK OFF.
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It was not aimed at you. Fuck Yourself!
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 3:54:09 PM EDT
Err, OK. At least it'll be sex with someone I love![@:D]
Link Posted: 10/31/2002 4:06:14 PM EDT
Bitching is every serviceman's right. Bitching keeps you warm. Bitching lets off steam. Bitching is sometimes warranted, and usually expected. But for God's sake, bitch to your comrades, bitch to your supervisor or sergeant, even bitch to the base or post commander if the situation deserves it. Just make sure your problem doesn't go any further unless it SEVERELY impacts your ability to do the mission. After all, you are there for one purpose: Put Steel On Target. Everything else comes last. 8 years in the AF, and I've always been amazed at how good our TDY or remote locations were equipped. Even when I was sharing foxholes with Korean spiders, they were well-behaved spiders, and they knew to only bitch enough so they might get tossed a cricket or two. They never bitched too much, because they might've gotten a close encounter with the butt-end of an M16A2. After looking at the pics and reading the bitching, it seems the hidden story is that the base is getting built up, albeit slowly. Some troops forget that Rome wasn't built in a day, nor will Bagram be up to the same level of comfort that they left back at Barksdale, Wright-Pat, Fairchild or Moody by next week. Should they bitch? Sure. Why not? They're used to a certain level of comfort and they no longer have it. Do they have it better than most in other services? Most assuredly. That's life as an airman, and one reason the AF has higher retention rates than most. It's a source of pride to be able to see or bring an Army grunt or Marine on to your base, and see him act as if he just walked into Disneyland. Should this have been brought to the attention of the news media or even Pentagon personnel? No, not in the least. Someone had their priorities warped on this. The AF takes care of it's forward deployed people, and the issues raised would have been addressed in time, and fixes made, or they would have been told to suck it up. I'll admit, I liked the creature comforts being in the AF provided. It's a service of REMF's, and REMF's know how to work the system and how to get the best stuff. It's nice to have nice stuff, and to know you'll be getting nice stuff. Unfortunately, they also know HOW to bitch, but not necessarily WHEN to bitch. Someone needed to head this one off before it got too far, and they didn't. Now it may have the effect of reducing the nice stuff they would've gotten, and making it harder to increase their comfort. That might not be a bad thing after all, would it? P.S.: This might've been an Army effort of disinformation to discredit the AF...one never knows...
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