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Posted: 9/11/2002 3:22:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/11/2002 4:07:48 PM EDT by JoeMike98]
I hear allot of talk on this board about folks(including myself) trying to justify or truly understand what is illegal under the Assault Weapons Ban. You and I both know that none of these features have ever constituted a reason for a weapon to be used in violent manner. People commit crimes, not guns. Anyway, having said this, my question is: Has anyone ever been out with their rifle and been questioned about its legality. If so, who asked you and what was the outcome? I ask this question because I hang around with several law enforcement officers on a regular basis and none of them would even think to ask someone if there weapon meets the current feature limits on the Assault Weapons Ban. I always play it safe rather than sorry, but, really has anyone ever been approached about this on the range or out in public with your weapons?
Link Posted: 9/11/2002 3:38:38 PM EDT
Actually Police Officers have to comply with the same laws as civilians regarding personally owned firearms. However many do not turn back in their LEO magazines as they are required to do, when they leave law enforcement under most state laws this sort of depends on your local department. Pre-ban goodies require Departmental purchase or letter head purchase in most jurisdictions.
Link Posted: 9/11/2002 4:13:47 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/11/2002 4:15:22 PM EDT by JoeMike98]
F&L37, I know what you mean. I have friends who have left the force that have LEO weapons they should have turned in, but did not(none of them are class III). I don't know how they got around that one, but that validates my point. Who really cares about the so called evil features or the Assault Weapons Ban? As far as what they want to do with there toys after they have left the force, that is up to them. I really want to know has anyone made a stink about your AR in public or at a range and questioned weather or not it was a legal pre/post ban weapon?
Link Posted: 9/11/2002 8:50:45 PM EDT
I went to a local range awhile back, took my SP1. After I was setup, an older fella comes over & notices the triangle handguards. He then asks what kind of lower is it on & gives me a "are you guilty" kind of look. I told him it was a SP1 lower, the rifle was just as it was went it left the factory. I wanted to tell this range nazi wannabe to take a flying fuck at a rolling donut but his teenage grand daughter was with him so I held my tongue. Why can't people mind their own freakin business & worry about their own damn problems!! [:(!][:(!] I damn sure don't go around looking at other people's weapons checking to see if they are PC or not. ColtShorty GOA KABA COA JPFO SAF NRA "I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people and I require the same from them."
Link Posted: 9/11/2002 8:59:03 PM EDT
JoeMike98, I have asked this very same question on this board maybe 5-6 times without an answer. I really doubt most LE even know what the laws are themselves or even what to look for. I do almost all of my AR shooting in the Commie State of MD (The MD State police LOVE to take guns away) and I have never been asked if I had a pre or post lower. I have even shot right next to two police officers and talked with them for maybe two hours while shooting, hell I even put my AK and AR on their table and told them when they want to try them go ahead and here is some ammo. They never even blinked an eye at my SN#'s or born on date. Even if they did give me the run around it all would have checked out to be legal, but I guess they didn't care. but as they say on this board: YMMV!
Link Posted: 9/11/2002 9:00:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/11/2002 9:08:12 PM EDT by FreeFireZone]
RSO weighing in... I've been working at a range for the last three years. I will admit to looking at what people bring to shoot. Why? I'm curious. Frankly, I don't give a tinker's damn whether it's registered or not - that's between them and the State, and I think it's a useless law (besides, compliance figures for the 2K register/whatever are near nil.) Only once did I ever approach someone about their firearm - it was an 8" (or thereabouts) bbl upper on an M4gery lower. All I had to say was to break that down and make it disappear - then I explained NFA '34 to him. Yeah, I suppose I could have turned him in, but I wouldn't have been anywhere near as satisfied helping F Troop as I have been helping the USSS bust counterfeiters while I was working in. Besides, I'd like to see NFA '34, FFA '38, and most of GCA '68 rescinded (and doing so would presuppose the rescinsion of the various "Crime Bills" and the like...) - even tho I have about a dozen Form 4's for the family collection that it is my turn to inherit. I'm not interested in the monetary value of my machine guns - I want to be able to buy more! I suppose it depends on the individual, but most people who come up to you on the range when you are shooting something different or unusual are merely curious - it's the "never seen one of THOSE" factor coming into play. Granted, some people are pricks and were the inspiration for the TIPS programme - but I'm not one of them. Neither are any of my colleagues. FFZ Almost forgot - the reason we discuss it so much is because it is a rather Byzantine piece of legislation, and we try to sort out not only everything which is CURRENTLY illegal under this onerous ban, but what can BECOME illegal due to the interpretation of it by those who enforce it. F Troop regs are almost as bad as 26USC... FFZ
Link Posted: 9/11/2002 9:12:54 PM EDT
I tok a M870 20GA to the skeet range, made the mitake of loading five and not waiting before firing 2nd and 3rd shots. And older man, a volunteer at the range, kindly informed me that a capacit of over 2 was illegal in WA state, and basically tried to chew me out. I made noncomittal grunts and left. He was obviously wrong, but I held my tongue.
Link Posted: 9/11/2002 9:22:05 PM EDT
The only time I get a little bent out of shape is at gun shows where someone is trying to sell you something which is obviously contraband. I have told more than one person (some of whom I recognized as ATF without the suit...) that there firearm is in a verboten config, and that (and I point.) he is a sheriffs deputy. I advise him, if you hurry you can reach the door before I reach his table. I don't care who you are, or who you work for, you will be spending a minimum of 24 hrs in jail until your identity is verified.
Link Posted: 9/11/2002 9:31:36 PM EDT
I would think the ATF would be more likely to try and sniff out some illegal post bans at gun shows, just much more easier pickings than to wait at the range.
Link Posted: 9/11/2002 9:42:14 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/11/2002 9:47:47 PM EDT
Well, more proof that "cops are people too"... There are "gun folk" LEO's, and "anti-gun" LEO's. Unfortunately, with the decrease in available public hunting lands, the kids that never got to go out hunting are shooting their first rounds in the armed forces or police academies, and are ripe targets for a political hack anti to tell them "private citizens have no right to guns". Sometimes recruits surrender brain to obtain badge...especially if it's not the first time they've heard something like this (NEA anti gun position). The libs have worked hard to institute this mindset in our youth. Fight it. Take a kid shootin'! Tango7
Link Posted: 9/11/2002 9:50:07 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Tango7: The libs have worked hard to institute this mindset in our youth. Fight it. Take a kid shootin'! Tango7
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Well said! [beer]
Link Posted: 9/12/2002 7:02:07 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/12/2002 7:05:30 AM EDT by JoeMike98]
Guys, this is great discussion and like I said a very valid topic. I have everything I own in compliance, however, I have seen many people both at the range and on private land with weapons that where questionable. I did not ask them if their guns met current regs, nor did either of the LEO friends that were with me at the time. I have found that many, many people find the AR15 to be a fascinating and alluring weapon. Many, if not most of them, do not have access to the kind of information we have on this site. They simply bought the gun because it appealed to them. They in turn see available parts at gun shows or in catalogues and bought them to accessorize, or because of the cool factor. In either situation they do not know of the so called Evil features and if they did many of their mindsets are,"If this company is selling it, it must be legal to own." With that being said, I know that we who attend this board on a regular basis are up to speed as to what is allowed, however, I would venture to say that there are thousands, maybe even hundreds of thousands of people who don't truly know the specifics of the Assault weapons ban and have taboo guns in their possession. Also, from my experience the only legal institution that would care is the BATF. They are very ANAL about those laws because that is what gives them their livelihood. But with the thousands upon thousands of possible illegally configured weapons that are out there why dont we here of any cases of prosecution or examples of what could happen. I believe it is because it is a very unenforceable law. If someone where arrested while at a range or on private land for being in possession of a weapon that is out of specs it just goes away. They get a very deserved tap on the wrist and explained they have broken the law. Now if a weapon like this is used in a Crime, then it is 25 to life for the perp, and the media has an Assault Weapon frenzy. I am going to quite rambling on, but man, I hope the point is clear. This is a bogus law because I'm sure many, many people have weapons of all kinds that don't meet current regs and it's of no genuine concern to our government. Maybe the Gov't priorities aren't that out of whack...just maybe?
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