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Posted: 7/18/2002 11:19:05 AM EDT
I was shooting an old stop sign I found in a gully with my Bushy and the PMC lead core 55grs made neat little holes in the 1/8 inch steel, but would leave the copper jacket behind. However, the Wolf 55grs made a bigger hole, even though they also left the jacket stuck in the hole. I assumed that this was because Wolf has a steel core. Am I right in this assumption? Feel free to share any funny stories.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 11:24:15 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 11:25:59 AM EDT
Originally Posted By eswanson:
Originally Posted By Valkyre: Feel free to share any funny stories.
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Yeah, I heard a funny story about a guy who got arrested for criminal damage to property for shooting stop signs. He got put on conditional discharge and can't own a firearm now.
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Hahaha...Now THAT'S a funny story!
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 11:31:20 AM EDT
yeah its my stop sign. I didn't steal it. It's not still on the pole on the side of the road.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 11:33:28 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/18/2002 11:36:17 AM EDT by BoWilliams]
Originally Posted By eswanson:
Originally Posted By Valkyre: Feel free to share any funny stories.
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Yeah, I heard a funny story about a guy who got arrested for criminal damage to property for shooting stop signs. He got put on conditional discharge and can't own a firearm now.
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eswanson, are you an old school marm? Give the guy a break. He said he was shooting an old sign he found in a gully! That's a lot different than going around shooting mounted signs.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 11:38:42 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 11:40:01 AM EDT
The level of hostility here is getting out of hand.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 11:40:07 AM EDT
Originally Posted By eswanson: Oh, for chrissake, people, lighten up. Is fatman the only one who recognizes humor? Geez.
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Yes. I am! [:D]
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 11:43:48 AM EDT
I've found that cars are the most fun to shoot, especailly when they have not been touched by firearm projectiles before. Most, if not all .223 I have fired into doors, quarter panels, and engine blocks tend to leave behind their copper jackets. I've never noticed if one particular type leaves a hole bigger than another, though.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 11:44:47 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Imbroglio: The level of hostility here is getting out of hand.
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Kinda of like everywhere else I've been lately. What do think is the cause Imbro.?
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 11:55:41 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/18/2002 11:56:26 AM EDT by Big_Bear]
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 11:56:39 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 11:57:48 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 12:51:26 PM EDT
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 1:23:13 PM EDT
all I shoot is wolf but that stuff is a incredible penetrator it has no problem ripping thru thick steel plates.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 1:27:27 PM EDT
It seems that I have an evil twin! Remember my moniker is spelled correctly. He must be from the planet Bizarro?
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 1:59:09 PM EDT
Yeah just dont shoot at the U-Turn signs!
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 2:23:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By eswanson:
Originally Posted By BoWilliams:
Originally Posted By Imbroglio: The level of hostility here is getting out of hand.
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Kinda of like everywhere else [b]I've[/b] been lately.
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Maybe it's you.[;D]
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Typical one-eyed response.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 2:25:14 PM EDT
What would happen if you fired a bullet at a yellow light? Would it speed up to make sure it got through before it turned red? How about if I shot a Reno for Governer billboard (I'm sure there's one somewhere in this state)?
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 2:36:19 PM EDT
Originally Posted By mace: What would happen if you fired a bullet at a yellow light? Would it speed up to make sure it got through before it turned red? How about if I shot a Reno for Governer billboard (I'm sure there's one somewhere in this state)?
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Aw, c'mon. That's [b]so[/b] juvenile. Some average joe worked hard putting up that billboard. Do something that won't negatively impact a human being: shoot her.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 2:38:04 PM EDT
Originally Posted By 1911greg: all I shoot is wolf but that stuff is a incredible penetrator it has no problem ripping thru thick steel plates.
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So Wolf might not be the best ammo for indoor home defense. It would probably go through a sheetrock wall.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 2:38:41 PM EDT
hey Valkyrie, did you get your user name from that video game Max Payne?
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 2:46:11 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MAHABALI: hey Valkyrie, did you get your user name from that video game Max Payne?
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you're the first person to ever notice. i thought i was the only person who played max payne. in max payne they spell it "valkyre" but in norse mythology it is "valkyrie" not sure if it is pronounced differently.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 2:50:17 PM EDT
Me and my buddy also shot up and old lawnmower and a busted washing machine using a Savage .30-'06. Remington Core-Lokt expanded to almost 3x. And tracers set the oil pan on fire.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 2:54:35 PM EDT
Originally Posted By DamageInc: I've found that cars are the most fun to shoot, especailly when they have not been touched by firearm projectiles before. Most, if not all .223 I have fired into doors, quarter panels, and engine blocks tend to leave behind their copper jackets. I've never noticed if one particular type leaves a hole bigger than another, though.
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I've done it. Many moons ago myself and 4 others unloaded about 400 rounds into a car that we (for whatever reason) decided was abondoned. It was actually parked in front of a farmhouse (house was about 1/4 mile of the road). That guy who owned the car came down the road with about 6 or 7 dogs (he was in his car). We reloaded, slowly got back in the car and drove away. Hmmm, karma ...... not looking forward to it.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 2:57:50 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SIX: I've done it. Many moons ago myself and 4 others unloaded about 400 rounds into a car that we (for whatever reason) decided was abondoned. It was actually parked in front of a farmhouse (house was about 1/4 mile of the road). That guy who owned the car came down the road with about 6 or 7 dogs (he was in his car). We reloaded, slowly got back in the car and drove away. Hmmm, karma ...... not looking forward to it.
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Was he in his car while you were installing those "Speed Holes"
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 2:58:22 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Valkyre:
Originally Posted By MAHABALI: hey Valkyrie, did you get your user name from that video game Max Payne?
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you're the first person to ever notice. i thought i was the only person who played max payne. in max payne they spell it "valkyre" but in norse mythology it is "valkyrie" not sure if it is pronounced differently.
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Its a good game, I just finished it the other day.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 3:00:21 PM EDT
I finished it about a year ago. I hated the dream levels. Twin Ingrams on rock-n-roll, sweet!
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 3:02:42 PM EDT
Ride of the Valkyries by Wagner. Think "Apocalypse Now".
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 3:09:16 PM EDT
Did anyone hear about the shooting in the Israeli airport in california by a islamic dude who was shooting Israelis.(the media never says that he is a "terrorist" That might hurt his feelings) The governer responded by tighting gun control laws so that terrorists cant get guns. Right.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 3:09:41 PM EDT
"I assumed that this was because Wolf has a steel core. Am I right in this assumption?" no. wolf 5.56x45 has no steel core. it is a lead bullet withe EITHER a steel jacket that is copper gilded (their bi-metal line) or just a copper gilded lead slug.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 3:11:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/18/2002 3:11:48 PM EDT by Valkyre]
Originally Posted By CAMPYBOB: no. wolf 5.56x45 has no steel core. it is a lead bullet withe EITHER a steel jacket that is copper gilded (their bi-metal line) or just a copper gilded lead slug.
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you sure about that? i believe that some Wolf ammo does have steel core.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 3:13:01 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Valkyrie: Ride of the Valkyries by Wagner. Think "Apocalypse Now".
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its a book?
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 3:21:19 PM EDT
that's what i said...BOTH bullets are made of lead...it's the jacket material that varies. NO steel core in 5.56x45...comprende? some resellers have completely dropped the steel/copper jacket 5.56 ammo, in favour of the superior bore wear characteristics of the cooper (only) bullet. now...as far as steel "penetrators"... wolf MILITARY production 5.45x39 has a steel plug...NOT there to enhance penetration. it's there by design to smear lead inside the jacket. as 5.45 hits a medium more dense than air and decellerates, the steel plug shifts forward inside the bullet. this causes an asymmetrical smearing of lead forward into the 5.45 "air tip" nose cavity. this has the effect of causing the round to flip by moving the center of gravity about the polar moment of inertia. the net result is a very rapid yawing of the round and an more erratic path thru the media. the ONLY 5.45 military ammunition that is currently in country is the bulgarian "wasp". this has not been released for sale, yet. you can buy nato ammo with a steel plug in 5.56...but not wolf.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 3:26:55 PM EDT
yeah just making sure. im jest an ig'nant texan.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 3:46:06 PM EDT
A stop sign made of .125 inch steel? They make them awfully heavy duty down there in Texas.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 4:10:59 PM EDT
Originally Posted By bigdb1: A stop sign made of .125 inch steel? They make them awfully heavy duty down there in Texas.
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they have to, a .22 LR doesn't even dent the paint. yes it is 1/8 inch. I measured it myself.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 4:18:27 PM EDT
Hey I've got half a bus in another gully I could shoot, and a toliet. and a bunch of old hot water heaters (is that an oxymoron?)
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 4:23:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Valkyre:
Originally Posted By CAMPYBOB: no. wolf 5.56x45 has no steel core. it is a lead bullet withe EITHER a steel jacket that is copper gilded (their bi-metal line) or just a copper gilded lead slug.
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you sure about that? i believe that some Wolf ammo does have steel core.
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I have disected many wolf bullets and have found alot of variation in them, sometimes a steel core, sometimes a steel plug in the base, usually just a steel jacket clad in copper. I don't know if they make their own or just buy up cheap stuff in bulk and start loading it.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 4:27:36 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Big_Bear: Apparently... copper jackets... can read. [;D]
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... Ah brahhhha! LOL
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 5:48:51 PM EDT
"sometimes a steel core, sometimes a steel plug in the base, usually just a steel jacket clad in copper." rangemaster, i have wire e.d.m.'s, and i've also sectioned many a bullet, including wolf bi-metal, copper jacket, hollow point, soft point and fmj in bot 55 and 62 grain. i have never seen any steel core in a wolf, barnaul or ulyanhevsk round. are you certain it was wolf production and not rws??? rws looks identical, other than the headstamp (same green laquered case...maybe a shade darker than wolf)? there are known samples of rws copies of the russian m-74-7n6 military round in the country. other than the bulgarian "wasp" rounds sitting in u.s. customs warehouses, i know of no com-bloc ammo with a steel core in a calibre other than 5.45x39 (diregarding unavailable a.p. ammunition). can you tell me the size and shape of the steel plug you saw? and when you said you found a "steel core", are you certain that was russian .223 and not chinese 7.62x39? btw, the thre major russian munitions complexes are fully capable of processing all steps of the manufacturing process, from formulating propellants to stamping jackets to forming cases to bi-cast component making. i'm not doubting you, but what you seem to be stating goes against all that i've seen. thanks.
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 6:06:21 PM EDT
dang cheap ruskie ammo
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 6:33:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/18/2002 6:34:32 PM EDT by Valkyre]
If you put a glass beer bottle in front of a washing machine and shoot it with a .30-'06, the hole in the washing machine is about this wide: (----------------) KA- boom!
Link Posted: 7/18/2002 7:16:11 PM EDT
Originally Posted By CAMPYBOB: "sometimes a steel core, sometimes a steel plug in the base, usually just a steel jacket clad in copper." rangemaster, i have wire e.d.m.'s, and i've also sectioned many a bullet, including wolf bi-metal, copper jacket, hollow point, soft point and fmj in bot 55 and 62 grain. i have never seen any steel core in a wolf, barnaul or ulyanhevsk round. are you certain it was wolf production and not rws??? rws looks identical, other than the headstamp (same green laquered case...maybe a shade darker than wolf)? there are known samples of rws copies of the russian m-74-7n6 military round in the country. other than the bulgarian "wasp" rounds sitting in u.s. customs warehouses, i know of no com-bloc ammo with a steel core in a calibre other than 5.45x39 (diregarding unavailable a.p. ammunition). can you tell me the size and shape of the steel plug you saw? and when you said you found a "steel core", are you certain that was russian .223 and not chinese 7.62x39? btw, the thre major russian munitions complexes are fully capable of processing all steps of the manufacturing process, from formulating propellants to stamping jackets to forming cases to bi-cast component making. i'm not doubting you, but what you seem to be stating goes against all that i've seen. thanks.
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Sorry I was using "Wolf" as a catch all for crappy steel cased soviet block ammo. Most of the stuff I've disected wasn't in a box so I can't say for sure that it is Wolf or just lookes like it. But the point is that the only steel cased ammo that don't have at least some steel in the bullet seems to be that Wolf ammo that specifically sais "copper fmj" on the box. I've got a bunch of pieces of this junk somewhere I'll have to dig it out and see if I can identify it better.
Link Posted: 7/24/2002 3:22:40 PM EDT
The wolf ad for 223 says that they are the only russian 223 that doesn't have steel in the jacket, they dont say anything about the core.
Link Posted: 7/24/2002 3:27:22 PM EDT
What does a stop sign taste like?
Link Posted: 7/24/2002 3:39:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By tulsacmpshooter: What does a stop sign taste like?
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Go bite the rims on you're truck and that's pretty close [;D]
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