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Posted: 6/26/2002 5:39:14 AM EDT
You know who I'm talking about we have all met one. The Highpower shooter that is still pissed because he had to give up his M1A to be competitive. The guy that thinks that anything without a stainless Kreiger barrel and a Jewell trigger(they are excellent) is a peice of crap. The guy that brags about his Master or High master card. I hate them!!!! They lose sight of the real reason to shoot and the purpose for the Second ammendment. They think that if they don't have their jacket and glove they aren't shooting. I really despise those A holes. Their bullshit condescending attitude towards most of us normal AR shooters. They can kiss my butt. Too any "normal" non snobish Highpower shooters you have my sincerest apologies. I just had to rant a little.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 5:39:52 AM EDT
hehehehe
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 5:45:31 AM EDT
Don't you think you could be a little more "Tolerant" here?? "Celebrate diversity"! Your "un-feeling" statement may just have an adverse impact on somebody's "self-esteem", MAKING them have a bad day....
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 5:49:55 AM EDT
. Too any "normal" non snobish Highpower shooters you have my sincerest apologies.
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Apology accepted. My, my...what brought this on, anyway? Shoot your first match and get your ass kicked? Celt (HM)
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 5:50:51 AM EDT
why don't you tell us how you really feel Confedrate Texan?
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 6:00:39 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Celt:
. Too any "normal" non snobish Highpower shooters you have my sincerest apologies.
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Apology accepted. My, my...what brought this on, anyway? Shoot your first match and get your ass kicked? Celt (HM)
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I think we've got a case of "M1A envy." Or just mad cuz his AK is ....shall we say...LESS of a gun. [}:D]
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 6:07:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/26/2002 6:08:13 AM EDT by ConfederateTexan]
[/quote] I think we've got a case of "M1A envy." Or just mad cuz his AK is ....shall we say...LESS of a gun. [}:D] [/quote] Why, I have one of Each!!! I still like the AR better though. Die Highpower snob DIE DIE.......[uzi]
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 6:08:44 AM EDT
You forgot to mention guys who show off their Distinguished pins. [:D]
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 6:11:58 AM EDT
Originally Posted By ConfederateTexan: Why, I have one of Each!!! I still like the AR better though. Die Highpower snob DIE DIE.......[uzi]
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Actually, I haven't competed highpower this year at all. I'm more of a general gun snob. [:D]
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 6:34:29 AM EDT
Originally Posted By liberty86: Don't you think you could be a little more "Tolerant" here?? "Celebrate diversity"! Your "un-feeling" statement may just have an adverse impact on somebody's "self-esteem", MAKING them have a bad day....
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More importantly, it's not nice to piss of a guy who can reliably tag you 90%+ at 600 yards with a 12 mph 3/4 value crosswind with iron sights. Fortunately most such individuals wouldn't waste a good Berger bullet on you. ;^) BTW, I've met plenty of highpower snobs. One in particular, while an absolute font of knowledge and expertise, is particularly touchy.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 9:20:01 AM EDT
You forgot to mention guys who show off their Distinguished pins.
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One of which I'm sure you have, but humbly keep hidden? Commendable.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 9:47:50 AM EDT
I dont' think a Distinguished pin is somehting to cover up at all. I never think ill about a DM showing off his pin. I wish I had one to show. Besides, I've never seen one "shown off" just worn on a hat...pretty inconspicuous. Going Distinguished takes a tremendous amount of work and there's not a thing wrong with showing off the small symbol of that dedication. confederate Texan, I accept your apology. I don't know what got into you, but I guess there was some HP shooter that really waxed your a$$ or you just didn't like his point of view. "They think that if they don't have their jacket and glove they aren't shooting. " Here's something to consider: When I'm practicing or at a match, there is a mental mindset that goes beyond having fun. Shooting is no longer a pastime, it is a serious disciplene. The mindeset is reinforced with the glove and coat...you are there for business. Sorry you can't see that. Now, I don't know both sdes of the story, maybe he came over to your AR and spat on it and told you how crappy he thought it was...or maybe not.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 9:57:10 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Celt:
You forgot to mention guys who show off their Distinguished pins.
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One of which I'm sure you have, but humbly keep hidden? Commendable.
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No, I confess, I wear my Distinguished pin on my cap. I'd wear my President's 100 pin, too, if it weren't so big. [:)] My feeling is that anyone who's earned an award (or for a Master or High Master classification) has the right to be proud of it. That doesn't mean looking down on anyone, and in fact none of the top competitive shooters I've met have displayed any sort of snobbery or other attitude problem. Perhaps the lack of interest the match shooters show in plinking appears as disdain to some of the plinkers.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 10:10:52 AM EDT
Renamed...BINGO.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 11:41:31 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Frontsight-: Here's something to consider: When I'm practicing or at a match, there is a mental mindset that goes beyond having fun. Shooting is no longer a pastime, it is a serious disciplene. The mindeset is reinforced with the glove and coat...you are there for business. Sorry you can't see that. .
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People who have never competed don;t understand what an intensely mental contest it is. I leave a match mentlly drained. And if some yocal came up to me and lsapped me on the back in the middle of a match, or interrupted that concentration, yeah, I'd prolly respond a WHOLE lot differently than if I was just at the range plinking.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:07:25 PM EDT
Highpower bastards anyway...........who needs 'em?
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:08:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/26/2002 12:16:35 PM EDT by guns762]
I think grandman hit on something here. I have never competed with a rifle, but I did compete with my golf clubs through my high school career. It's kind of funny how similar I can describe competing on the golf course to what Grandman says about competing on the rifle course. Golf is also an extremely mental game. I wasn't playing golf unless I had my glove on, and the right shoes. I probably, no, I know I wasn't very sociable when I was on the course. I was trying to get into my zone. Each and every swing, every step, every putt, every drive. Everything was about the score. Am I under, by how many? If someone came along in a cart, laughing it up, wearing their basketball shoes, beer in their hand, and beat up clubs, I wasn't very civil. Hell, I wasn't very civil to my girl friend when she came with me. I think the guys are trying to tell you that most competitors really get into their discipline, and my not be the friendliest bunch of people at the range. I'm not condoning the treatment you received(if any?)haven't heard yet. I'm just saying some people like to get serious. If I had to do it over again, I would have not taken it so seriously; no, I would not have been as competitive, but I would have had a lot more fun. At least I would have asked the guy in the cart if I could have a beer as I played through! By the end of my "career", I was so burned out and mentally drained, I didn't even want to touch a club. I have golfed very little sense then. Occasionally, someone will recruit me for a best ball tourney, but even that isn't fun for me anymore. When I do play, I don't keep score anymore. Don't ever take yourself too seriously...it just isn't fun!
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:17:18 PM EDT
FRONTSIGHT: sounds to me like you are one of those snobby highpower shooters he is talking about as I see you were bothered by what he said. our friend most likely could not shoot at the range that day because of all those dang highpower shooters. I will have to try that sport out someday, hell how hard could it be anyway?
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:21:03 PM EDT
Lets not forget....... Benchrest snob Sporting clays snob The "I bring all my toys to the range, but don't dare ask or talk to me about them" snob The plinker snob The range snob, don't dare take the bench next to him, better yet, he will tell you to move down several spots so you don't bother him. And of course, the colt snob
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:22:18 PM EDT
I believe the point being made was the tendency for some to be very condescending toward people who don't share their level of passion (in this case, for accuracy). This is a human trait, and takes some awareness and self control to avoid. Some people should learn to just let people enjoy their hobby the way they they want to persue it! When shooting one of my AKs, I frequently get comments about how much they suck due to accuracy concerns. Sometimes this is stated outright, and other times it's implied by phrases like "I wouldn't get one because they aren't accurate." I can't imagine the level of arrogance it takes to walk up to someone who you don't know and criticize their equiptment, but some do! People that behave like this are all over this hobby, probably because gun guys have strong opinions (and often don't think before speaking). It in no way is restricted to competitive shooters. From my observations, they are one of the least offensive firearms sub-groups.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:23:04 PM EDT
I shot in a Highpower match recently, and though some people get SERIOUSLY into the sport, I never noticed anyone being snobby. I didn't know anyone there when I went, but everyone I talked to was very sociable. Of course, out of the 50 or so people there, I didn't get to talk to everyone, of course! It is a mental game. It requires a lot of concentration and focus, and I can see how some people get into a zone, and are thinking too much about what they have done wrong, and what they need to correct in the next string. It's fine with me if they are not too sociable when they are in this zone. However, there is a difference between that, and being a total snob. At the range just plinking or checking out some loads, I'd be a little put out if some jerk put his nose up at whatever I was shooting, and acted snobby. I'm looking forward to competing in more highpower matches in the future. (with my M1... she's off to get a new BBL installed!) [:)]
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:27:28 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:29:06 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SPECTRE: And of course, the colt snob
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[:D]
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:37:56 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:44:31 PM EDT
Anyone got good links for someone thinking about getting into highpower (but not thinking about getting snobby?)
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:44:53 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:48:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By PrudentGT: Anyone got good links for someone thinking about getting into highpower (but not thinking about getting snobby?)
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Try to find a local club that has matches. My local club has a match every month, first Sunday, 9am.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:50:31 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Naked80: Highpower bastards anyway...........who needs 'em?
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Well, when the SHTF I will need them for sniper duty.[sniper] Sgtar15 PS Those guys are good!!
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 12:56:29 PM EDT
How well do you think most of those guys could shoot out in the field, under stress, without their special glove and jacket, no rest, and when the targets are real people? I think there's probably a pretty big difference between your typical high power competitor and a good sniper.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 1:04:36 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Boomer: How well do you think most of those guys could shoot out in the field, under stress, without their special glove and jacket, no rest, and when the targets are real people? I think there's probably a pretty big difference between your typical high power competitor and a good sniper.
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Go ask the AMU or US Marine team that. [;)]
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 1:17:22 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/26/2002 1:20:53 PM EDT by garandman]
Originally Posted By Boomer: How well do you think most of those guys could shoot out in the field, under stress, without their special glove and jacket, no rest, and when the targets are real people? .
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If you wanna test your theory, head down range at the next highpower match, and then report back to us. [}:D] Concentration won't be a problem. Most are ex-military, and have alredy done the moral gyrations of shoot / don't shoot. And the coat and glove at 100 yards will be the difference between the iris, or the pupil as far as point of impact. Let's just say I'd want EVERY ONE of them on my side in a skirmish. Why do you think American GI's were SO INFINITELY better marksmen in WW2, over their Axis counterparts???
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 1:21:37 PM EDT
Originally Posted By garandman: If you wanna test your theory, head down range at the next highpower match, and then report back to us.
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I wasn't aware that highpower matches mimicked combat sniping. [;)] Were either Carlos Hathcock or Chuck Mawhinney high power competitors?
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 1:24:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By raf:
Originally Posted By SPECTRE: Lets not forget....... the colt snob
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Damn. I was gonna tell stories about buying pre-ban Colt A2's for only a little more than current Bushy uppers. But I won't. Might upset someone.
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Why would anyone get upset that someone is selling preban Colts for too much[?]
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 1:25:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/26/2002 1:27:01 PM EDT by Halfcocked]
Originally Posted By Boomer:
Originally Posted By garandman: If you wanna test your theory, head down range at the next highpower match, and then report back to us.
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I wasn't aware that highpower matches mimicked combat sniping. [;)] Were either Carlos Hathcock or Chuck Mawhinney high power competitors?
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Hathcock was one of the best competitive shooters of the time when he was sent over seas. Unfortunately he never got to compete when he returned.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 2:23:57 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 2:39:59 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SPECTRE: Lets not forget....... The range snob, don't dare take the bench next to him, better yet, he will tell you to move down several spots so you don't bother him.
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Those guys really crack me up. I especially like to take the bench to the left of them. Here comes the brass rain!
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 2:41:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By garandman: I [s]arrive[/s] leave a match mentlly drained.
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Not unusual for you...[:p]
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 3:05:25 PM EDT
I worked fairly hard for the Distinguished Rifleman Badge - so I don't feel one bit snobbish or self-concious about the miniature pin I wear on my shooting cap. On the other hand, I used to have a lot of fun plinking with my flattop, alone, or with friends - and I don't do much of it anymore. I probably need to take a break from the serious side/mental aspect of competition and go shoot some prairie dogs. I'll tell you this though - I love talking about guns & shooting - why the hell else would I spend so much time on this site - so if you ever see me at a highpower match and try to strike up a conversation, be prepared to have your ear talked off. If answering questions about shooting ARs in HP matches qualifies me as a 'HP snob', so be it.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 3:06:35 PM EDT
Originally Posted By garandman: Why do you think American GI's were SO INFINITELY better marksmen in WW2, over their Axis counterparts???
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Probably because back then most youngsters in the United States grew up hunting and shooting, not participating in formal target practice. Look at both Hathcock and Mawhinney. They grew up in rural areas, learning how to hunt and shoot from a very young age. Now we have to invest millions to teach adults what children used to learn naturally.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 3:36:12 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Boomer:
Originally Posted By garandman: Why do you think American GI's were SO INFINITELY better marksmen in WW2, over their Axis counterparts???
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Probably because back then most youngsters in the United States grew up hunting and shooting, not participating in formal target practice. Look at both Hathcock and Mawhinney. They grew up in rural areas, learning how to hunt and shoot from a very young age. Now we have to invest millions to teach adults what children used to learn naturally.
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Nailed it with that response!!! give this man a colt !! [;)]
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 3:46:20 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Boomer:
Originally Posted By garandman: If you wanna test your theory, head down range at the next highpower match, and then report back to us.
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I wasn't aware that highpower matches mimicked combat sniping. [;)] Were either Carlos Hathcock or Chuck Mawhinney high power competitors?
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Yeah, Hathcock was. What has your awareness got to do with it? Is this remark an attempt to discredit Highpower shooters?
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 3:47:14 PM EDT
Originally Posted By LE6920:
Originally Posted By SPECTRE: Lets not forget....... The range snob, don't dare take the bench next to him, better yet, he will tell you to move down several spots so you don't bother him.
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Those guys really crack me up. I especially like to take the bench to the left of them. Here comes the brass rain!
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What an irritating pest!
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 3:49:56 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 3:50:13 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SPECTRE: Lets not forget....... Benchrest snob Sporting clays snob The "I bring all my toys to the range, but don't dare ask or talk to me about them" snob The plinker snob The range snob, don't dare take the bench next to him, better yet, he will tell you to move down several spots so you don't bother him. And of course, the colt snob
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Are these individuals that you've encountered, or a categoy of people to whom you refer? Dismissing their unwillingness to associate with you as arrogance?
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 3:55:19 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Boomer: Were either Carlos Hathcock or Chuck Mawhinney high power competitors?
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Carlos's kid is with the Marine Corp Rifle Team. I saw him once fixin' rifles on the line during the Nationals at Perry. You can probably get his email addy by posting in the Competition Forum, and ask him yourself.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 4:05:23 PM EDT
Originally Posted By IMHO:
Originally Posted By SPECTRE: Lets not forget....... Benchrest snob Sporting clays snob The "I bring all my toys to the range, but don't dare ask or talk to me about them" snob The plinker snob The range snob, don't dare take the bench next to him, better yet, he will tell you to move down several spots so you don't bother him. And of course, the colt snob
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Are these individuals that you've encountered, or a categoy of people to whom you refer? Dismissing their unwillingness to associate with you as arrogance?
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I have had direct contact with a couple of these types. I have had the displeasure of meeting fisthand, benchrest snob, sporting clays snob and range snob all of whom were arrogant beyond belief. I added plinker snob just cuz someone mentioned plinkers and colt snob just to see if boomer was around. [;)] I like kidding him on occasion. As far as highpower snob, I have NEVER been at the range or a match where a master or high master or any shooter there was anything but happy to offer advice or just shoot the breeze,(as long as he was'nt in between strings.)[;)] and most all of them volunteer their time to coach our junior shooters as well. I hope to join their ranks as soon as time will alow for more practice.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 4:21:56 PM EDT
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 4:55:49 PM EDT
I respect the extreme amount of skill it takes to become a "Master" shooter, yet, I don't wish to compete, nor do I expect to be able to shoot as well as someone who 'disciplines' himself to that level. I would, however, have even more respect for someone who showed respect for me as a fellow shooter and maybe passed on a "little secret" to help me shoot better. That's good PR and gets a LOT of respect for what that individual knows and can do. My first trip to a rifle range was awesome. I'd never experienced anything like it. One obviously experienced shooter with some nice rifles and equipment complimented me on my new rifle. I was very proud of it and obviously as new to the range as the gun was! I felt pretty damn good after that. Next trip to the same range, a guy showed up with all the high zoot stuff and proceeded to move someone elses things around for them...put on his coat and glove and sneer at everyone around him, never saying a word. It was the most obnoxious behaviour from a shooter I've ever seen, to this day, and the world would've been a better place if his rifle shot backwards! That's the kind of guy that ruins the whole feeling on the range. OK, so you're good. So what? Save the theatrics for a match. If you show up on Sunday when the, ahem, 'rest of the world' is shooting, you, too, are a 'plinker'. Reading the last paragraph ought to be a good example of how NOT to be at a range. The paragraph before is an excellent example of WHY people like to shoot, and may go on to bigger and better things, including the 'discipline'. Hey, have fun, will ya?
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 6:46:33 PM EDT
Originally Posted By raf: bigyeti, tell me you wouldn't be all over a NIB pre-ban Colt A2 for $600. That's about what they sold for, once.
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Yup, I've got a $600 Colt Sporter Match HBAR. But you've got to remember, $600 back then is like about $6000 today. Okay, so maybe that was a bit of an exaggeration... [;)]
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 6:49:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By IMHO: What has your awareness got to do with it? Is this remark an attempt to discredit Highpower shooters?
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Nope, not to discredit highpower shooters at all. Just pointing out that accuracy and skills developed in the comparatively controlled environment of a range may not necessarilly translate into success as a sniper in the field.
Link Posted: 6/26/2002 7:07:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Halfcocked:
Originally Posted By Boomer:
Originally Posted By garandman: If you wanna test your theory, head down range at the next highpower match, and then report back to us.
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I wasn't aware that highpower matches mimicked combat sniping. [;)] Were either Carlos Hathcock or Chuck Mawhinney high power competitors?
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Hathcock was one of the best competitive shooters of the time when he was sent over seas. Unfortunately he never got to compete when he returned.
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Ya, sorta. You're never never going to have have a snow balls chance of doing it in the field if you can't do it on the range though (600 yard head shots).
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