Not that I want to but I just heard that the deptartment of commerce - anti boycott commitee Will FINE you if you refuse service to a country you disagree with????

Bringing this up cause I remember a thread where someone here refused to sell something to a Suadi man cause of 9-11.

dont have a link cause IM listing on the net.. here goes
[url]mediaframe.yahoo.com/launch?lid=rna-14-p.933654,wma-28-p.920573&p=radio&c=affiliate&f=278035539&.abg=FFFFFF&.small=1&.ch_cursel=&.rst=a&.adw=http%3a//broadcast.com/radio/talk/klif/klif_dw.htm&.image=http%3a//us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/radio/st/KLIF.jpg&a=0,30[/url]

I propose we start by simply boycotting Israel threads.  [}:D]

I'm already boycotting Israel.

I've discontinued bulk purchases of Uzis, refuse to buy matzos, and will not watch Julia Loius Dreyfus on TV.

Come and get me State Dept.!!!!!!

[}:D]

The following FUND Israel:

AOL Time Warner
AOL internet  
Time magazine
Life magazine
Time-Life books, etc.
CNN  
ICQ (internet chat program)

AOL allocates 30% of its investment portfolio in Israel. [1][4]

The buy up of Israeli company Mirabilis, creators of ICQ (internet chat program), for $287m in 1998 forms part of AOLs investment in Israel.[5]

In 1998, Mr. Ted Leonsis, CEO of AOL studios (a business unit of AOL) received the Jubilee Award by the Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu. This is the highest tribute ever awarded by the "State of Israel" in recognition of those individuals and organizations, that through their investments and trade relationships, have done the most to strengthen the Israeli economy. [3]

Coca-Cola

From 1966 onward Coca-Cola has been a stauch supporter of Israel. Recently the Government of Israel Economic Mission honored Coca-Cola at the Israel Trade Award Dinner for its continued support of Israel for the last 30 years and for refusing ro abide by the Arab League boycott of Israel.

In contrast Pepsi abided by the Arab League boycott of Israel which ended in May 1991, after 1992 Pepsi is also trading in Israel.

Delta Galil Industries Ltd

Retailers supplied by Delta:
 
Marks & Spencers
- biggest customer , supply everything from underwear, socks, babywear, leisurewear to rugs.
 
Hema
- [Dutch] supply ladies intimate apparel, men’s underwear and socks
 
Carrefour
- [French] supply ladies intimate apparel and socks
 
Auchan
- [French] supply ladies intimate apparel, men’s underwear and socks
 
Tchibo
- [German] supply socks
 
Victoria's Secret
- supply ladies intimate apparel
 
GAP
- supply ladies intimate apparel and men’s underwear
 
Banana Republic
- supply men’s underwear
 
Structure
- supply men’s underwear
 
J-Crew
- supply leisurewear
 
J.C. Penny
- supply ladies intimate apparel
 
Pryca - supply ladies intimate apparel, men’s underwear, socks and babywear  
Lindex
- [Swedish] supply ladies intimate apparel


 
Brands selling Delta products :
 
DIM
- supply ladies intimate apparel, socks & fabric
 
Donna Karan / DKNY
- supply ladies intimate apparel & mens underwear
 
Ralph Lauren
- supply ladies intimate apparel & mens underwear
 
Playtex
- supply ladies intimate apparel
 
Calvin Klein (cK)
- supply mens underwear
 
Hugo Boss
- supply mens underwear

Delta Galil is one of Israels largest textile companies.

Its founder, chairman and major stock holder Mr. Dov Lautman is a close associate of Israeli President Ehud Barak.

Estee Lauder

PRODUCTS & AFFILIATED COMPANIES:


Aramis  
Clinique
 
DKNY
 
Prescriptives  
Origins Natural Resources  
MAC Cosmetics  
La Mer
 
Bobbi Brown Essentials
 
Tommy Hilfiger Toiletries
 
Jane
 
Donna Karan Cosmetics
 
Aveda
 
Stila Cosmetics
 
Jo Malone
 
Bumble and Bumble
 
Kate Spade

Estée Lauder's chairman, Ronald Lauder, also one time chairman of the Conference of Presidents of Major American Jewish Organizations[2], is the current president of the Jewish National Fund (JNF) - a quasi-governmental agency whose main function is to legitimize Israeli occupation of Palestinian land. Ronald Lauder is an ardent zionist, his activities have been catalogued by American Muslims for Jerusalem [3] who called for a boycott in Febuary 2001. In fact his views are often more extreme then some israeli governments![4]

Johnson & Johnson

Johnson & Johnson purchased Israeli company Biosense for $400 million


In 1998, Mr. Roger S. Fineon behalf of Johnson & Johnson, received the Jubilee Award by the Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu. This is the highest tribute ever awarded by the "State of Israel" in recognition of those individuals and organizations, that through their investments and trade relationships, have done the most to strengthen the Israeli economy.

News Corporation

PRODUCTS & AFFILIATED COMPANIES:


Fox TV Network (85% share)
20th Century Fox Films, Fox Kids, etc  
Sky TV Network  
Star TV Network:
hindi channels, chinese channels (Phoenix), Granada (uk), CNBC
 
National Geographical  
Weekly Standard Newspaper, TV Guide  
News of the World (UK)  
The Sun (UK)  
The Times (UK), Sunday Times, Times Educational Suppliment (TES), etc  
The Telegraph (Australia), Gold Coast Bulletin, Herald Sun, Independent Newspapers Ltd, Newsphotos, Sunday Herald, Sunday Mail ..etc... lots more Australian papers!  
The New York Post (US)newspaper  
Harper Collins Book Publishers, Ragan Books, Zondervan  
Nursery World, Rawkus, NDS, Mushroom Records, ChinaByte.com, Festival Records.

The News Corporation Limite is one of the world's largest media companies with total assets as of September 30, 2001 of approximately US $43 billion and total annual revenues of approximately US$14 billion. News Corporation's diversified global operations include the production and distribution of motion pictures and television programming; television, satellite and cable broadcasting; the publication of newspapers, magazines and books; the production and distribution of promotional and advertising products and services; the development of digital broadcasting.

News Corporation is the world's leading publisher of English-language newspapers, with operations in the UK, Australia, New Zealand, Fiji, Papua New Guinea and the US. The Company publishes more than 175 different newspapers, employing approximately 15,000 people worldwide and printing more than 40 million papers a week.

Murdoch's New Corp. invests heavily in Israel.

Murdoch News Corporation was one of three US companies that wase lauded for their support of Israel at the America-Israel Friendship League Partners for Democracy Awards dinner (25th June 2001). Murdoch himself co-chaired the dinner.

News Corp.'s digital technology company based in Jerusalem, called NDS, has grown from 20 to 600 employees in the past decade.

REVLON

PRODUCTS & AFFILIATED COMPANIES:

Revlon cosmetic products  
New World Entertainment  
Forbes

Financier and cosmetics billionaire Ronald Perelman , who controls cosmetics maker Revlon, is a zionist. Also ownes New World Entertainment & Forbes. He supports zionist causes - for example he is a trustee of The Simon Wiesenthal Center which uses the holocaust to promote Zionism and Israel.

HOME DEPOT

PRODUCTS & AFFILIATED COMPANIES:

Home Depot retails stores  
EXPO Design Centers  
Villager’s Hardware stores  
Apex Supply Company  
Georgia Lighting  
Maintenance Warehouse  
National Blinds and Wallpaper

The Home Depot is the world’s largest home improvement retailer and the second largest retailer in the United States, with sales of $45.7 billion. The Home Depot operates 1,134 retail locations, including 1,029 Home Depot stores in the United States, 67 Home Depot stores in Canada and 7 Home Depot stores in South America. The Company also operated 26 EXPO Design Centers, 4 Villager’s Hardware stores and 1 Home Depot Floor Store. In addition, the Company operated wholly-owned sub-sidiaries Apex Supply Company, Georgia Lighting , Maintenance Warehouse and National Blinds and Wallpaper. The Company employed approximately 227,000 people.

Its founder, and Co-Chairman of the Board Bernard Marcus is an active zionist. He is on the board of directors of Emet, the Pro-Israel Media "War Room" whos function is to ensure that all media in the US stays biased in favour of Israel.

Starbucks

PRODUCTS & AFFILIATED COMPANIES:


Starbucks Coffee Stores (4,709 locations world-wide) see[8][9][10] for details.

Starbuck coffee, chocolates, biscuits & ice-cream products

Seattle Coffee Company in the United Kingdom with more than 60 retail locations (aquired 1998).

Pasqua Inc., a San Francisco based coffee retailer in (aquired 1998).

Hear Music, a San Francisco based music company (aquired 1999).

Tazo®, a Portland, Oregon based tea company (aquired 1999).

Howard Shultz, the chairman of Starbucks is an active zionist.

In 1998 he was honoured by Israel with "The Israel 50th Anniversary Tribute Award" for his services to the zionist state.

His work as a propagandist for Israel has been praised by the Israeli Foreign Ministry as being key to Israels long-term PR success.

Howard Shultz,
Chairman of Starbucks

Recently whilst the Israeli army was slaughtering Palestinians in Jenin, Nabulus and Bethlehem he made a provocative speech blaming the Palestinians of terrorism and asking people to unite behind Israel.

Starbucks has investments in Israel - a joint venture with Israeli conglomerate Delek Group for Starbucks outlets in Israel ( Shalom Coffee Co).


[b]It is interesting to note how many of the above can be found supporting anti gun causes here in the US.[/b]

DANONE

PRODUCTS & AFFILIATED COMPANIES:


Strauss dairy  
Danone yogart  
Jacob biscuits  
HP foods  
Evian, Volvic  
Galbani    
LEA & PERRINS    
LU Biscuits  

In 1998, Mr. Franck Riboud, on behalf of Danone received the Jubilee Award by the Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu. This is the highest tribute ever awarded by the "State of Israel" in recognition of those individuals and organizations, that through their investments and trade relationships, have done the most to strengthen the Israeli economy.


The Danone Institute, an R & D facility, was established in Israel in July 1998.

Walt Disney  

PRODUCTS & AFFILIATED COMPANIES:


Disneyland  
EuroDisney
 
Disney Products

Walt Disneys Millennium exhibition at the Epcot Centre in Florida depects Jerusalem as the capital of Israel. Jerusalem is an illegally occupied city according to international law (UN resolution 242, 237 & 405)and can never be the capital of Israel. Of the 8 million dollars cost to set up the exibition, Israel contributed 1.8 million and worked with Disney to develop its content. This is part of Israels campaign to physically Judaise Jerusalem and mentally condition the world into accepting its claims over Jerusalem.

IBM

IBM invest heavily in Israel. IBM senior vice-president and general counsel, Lawrence Ricciardi, who noted that his company employs 1,700 people in Israel, said in an interview with the Jerusalem Post, "This wedge of land and the huge ideals it represents are very important to IBM."


IBM was one of three US companies that wase lauded at the America-Israel Friendship League Partners for Democracy Awards dinner (25th June 2001) hosted by Sharon.

KIMBERLY-CLARK

KLEENEX facial tissues  
KOTEX products  
HUGGIES disposable baby products  
ANDREX products

Kimberly-Clark is one of the largest consumer companies in the world with a turnover of $14 billion.

In 1998 Mr. Robert P. Van der Merwe, chairman of Kimberly-Clark Europe received the Jubilee Award by the Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu. This is the highest tribute ever awarded by the "State of Israel" in recognition of those individuals and organizations, that through their investments and trade relationships, have done the most to strengthen the Israeli economy.

L'OREAL

PRODUCTS & AFFILIATED COMPANIES:


Giorgio Armani Perfumes  
Redken 5th Avenue NYC  
Lancome Paris  
Vichy
 
Cacharel  
La Roche-Posay  
Garnier  
Biotherm  
Helena Rubinstein  
Maybelline  
Ralph Lauren Perfumes  
Carson

After being fined $1.4 million by the US in 1995 for writing a letter to the Arab League claiming that they had stopped production in Israel, they have been engaged in actively courting Israel with investments and large-scale commerce.

American Jewish Congress has expressed "keen satisfaction that L'Oreal has become a warm friend of Israel"

L'Oreal has established Israel as its commercial center in the Middle East and has increased investment and manufacturing activities ranging from a new production line established in Migdal Haemek, to joint research and development projects with Israeli affiliates, as well as education and public service campaigns.

In 1998 Mr. Pascal Castres St Martin of L' Oreal, received the Jubilee Award by the Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu. This is the highest tribute ever awarded by the "State of Israel" in recognition of those individuals and organizations, that through their investments and trade relationships, have done the most to strengthen the Israeli economy.

NESTLE

PRODUCTS & AFFILIATED COMPANIES:


Nescafé  
Perrier  
Vittel  
Pure Life  
Carnation  
Libby's  
Milkmaid  
Nesquik  
Maggi  
Buitoni  
Crosse & Blackwell  
Milkybar, KitKat, Quality Street, Smarties, After Eight, Lion, Aero, Polo  
Shreddies cereal  
KitKat, Quality Street, Smarties, Baci, After Eight, Baby Ruth, Butterfinger, Lion, Aero, Polo, Frutips,    
Felix - cat food  
L'Oréal (important interest)  

The swiss company owns 50.1% of israeli food maker Osem Investments. In dec 2000, it announced , it will invest millions of dollars to operate the new R&D centre
in israel.


In 1998, Mr. Peter Brabeck-Letmathe on behalf of Nestle, received the Jubilee Award by the Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu. This is the highest tribute ever awarded by the "State of Israel" in recognition of those individuals and organizations, that through their investments and trade relationships, have done the most to strengthen the Israeli economy.

NOKIA

Nokia have started to invest heavily in Israel.

Nokia general manager Lars Wolf said in an interview with The Jerusalem Post (4 March 2001): "We are really focusing on Israel from all perspectives, because we have an internal project called 'Project Israel' which means we are looking at Israel from a networks perspective, from the perspective of Nokia Ventures Organization, and also from the perspective of Nokia Research Center ".

Nokia Venture Partners, a branch of Nokia Ventures Organization, launched a new $500 million fund in December 2000 and allowed that a "disproportionate" amount of it would go into Israeli companies. Nokia Research Center is on the lookout for Israeli start-ups with which it can cooperate.

SARA LEE

PRODUCTS & AFFILIATED COMPANIES:


Hanes - Intimate apparel, hosiery, socks, knitwear, workwear, casualwear
 
Hillshire Farm - meat  
Playtex - Intimate apparel
 
Champion - Men's and women's athletic apparel and men's underwear
 
Leggs - Hosiery
 
Jimmy Dean - meat  
Douwe Egberts - Coffee and coffee systems
 
Sara Lee Bakery
 
Bryan - meat
 
Dim - Intimate apparel, hosiery
 
Ambi Pur - Air fresheners
 
Ball Park - meat
 
Bali - Intimate apparel
 
Superior Coffee - Coffee and coffee systems
 
Just My Size - Intimate apparel
 
Kiwi - Shoe care
 
Maison Cafe - Coffee and coffee systems
 
Aoste - meat
 
Nur die - Hosiery
 
Pilao - Coffee and coffee systems
 
Lovable - Intimate apparel, men's underwear, socks
 
Outer Banks - T-shirts, sportshirts
 
Wonderbra - Intimate apparel
 
Sanex - Body care
 
Pickwick - Tea
 
Gossard - Intimate apparel  
Body Mist - bodycare  
Brylcreem - bodycare  
Aqua Velva - bodycare  
Radox - bodycare

Sara Lee owns 25% of Israels leading textile company Delta Galil.

In 1998, Mr. Lucien Nessim of Sara Lee Personal Products received the Jubilee Award by the Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu. This is the highest tribute ever awarded by the "State of Israel" in recognition of those individuals and organizations, that through their investments and trade relationships, have done the most to strengthen the Israeli economy.

The Limited Inc.

PRODUCTS & AFFILIATED COMPANIES:



Express (667 stores)
 
The Limited (389 stores)  
Lerner New York (560 stores)  
Structure (469 stores)  
New York and Company (79 stores)  
Mast Industries (apparel manufacturer)  
Intimate Brands, Inc .
which includes:
 
Victoria's Secret  
Bath & Body Works  
White Barn Candle Company
 
Henri Bendel (Fifth avenue - single store)

The Limited, Inc. was founded by Leslie H. Wexner in 1963 in Columbus, Ohio. The Company has since grown to over 2,800 stores and five major specialty retail brands. Included under the LTD stock symbol are Limited Stores, Express, Lerner New York, Lane Bryant and Structure. The Limited also own approximately 84% of Intimate Brands, Inc. , the leading specialty retailer of intimate apparel, beauty and personal care products through the Victoria's Secret, Bath & Body Works, and White Barn Candle Company brands. The Company employs over 115,000 associates.

Its founder, president and CEO Les Wexner is a zionist. He is on the board of directors of Emet, the Pro-Israel Media "War Room" whos function is to ensure that all media in the US stays biased in favour of Israel.

Intel

PRODUCTS & AFFILIATED COMPANIES:

Processors - Celeron, Pentium, Itanium, etc
Motherboards, Chipsets, Adapters, Controllers, Network Products, Wireless components, Embeded Products, Software Development Tools.

Intel are one of the biggest supporters of Israel. Their very first development centre outside the US was opened in Haifa in 1974. Since then they have continued pouring investment in to Israel. By year 2000 they employ over 4000 israelis. Exports from their Lachish-Qiryat Gat plant in israel (opened feb 99) total $ 3 million a day at peak capacity - approximately $ 1 billion a year.

Timberland

PRODUCTS & AFFILIATED COMPANIES:


Footwear: Hiking, Multi-Sport, Sandals, Casual, Office, Boots, PRO

Outwear: Leather Jackets, Waterproof Parka, Lightweight jackets

Clothing: Shirts, Polos, Sweaters, Sweat Shirts, T-Shirts, Pants, Shorts

Gear: Belts, Hats, Backpacks, Luggage, Socks, Sunglasses, Wallets, Watches

Timberlands is a $1.1 billion footwear, apparel & accessories company. Its President and CEO Jeffrey Swartz is an active zionist.

In a recent "solidarity visit" to Israel he advised how best to get Israel's propaganda lies acceptable to the US public. In an interview where he made it clear he was speaking as the CEO of Timberland, he suggested sending 100 IDF thugs to the US for a week as ambassadors for Israel.

Although Timberland is a publicly traded company, his family holds approximately 47% of the stock and has approximately 81% of the voting power.


[b]As you can see, boycotting Israel is virtually impossible unless you plan on having no home, no job, no possessions and no food.

Homeless people can effectively boycott Israel. [/b]

"No way man ats not true!"
"Ye huh isreal!"

thats not the piont of the thread at all..
the point is that if your a own a company, you are legally reguired to do busniess with a counrty < any counrty on thier list , not just Isreal. this was just an example. > Even if you dont want to.

And THAT is why the list is so long.

If their primary loyalties are to foreign nations or support gun control, that is reason enough to boycott.

OK Guys, I'm stumped. Now I perfectly agree that
the government has no right to force companies
and individuals to buy from another county (I
do believe they have the right to tell us which
countries not to buy from - fund terrorist? No.)
I am curious, though, as to exactly why we want
to boycott Isreal. Help me out here, I wanna know.

Thanks,

Coffee

YEP !!

Also switch from the drug "Ecstasy" (this drug is run by an Israeli gang) to maybe "crank" which is a nice home made biker drug.

Because...

1. They already get 3 Billion a year in US aid. That is OUR tax dollars by the way.

2. Israel is a religious race based state. Israel is a great place to live if you are Jewish, all others including American non Jews are sceond class.

3. Israel is just another crazy middle eastern country involved in a holy war.

And a myriad other reasons. I don't mind helping any country that actually helps us. Israel does very little for us.

I 'believe' the gift from U.S. taxpayers is closer to $5 BILLON although the exact number is hard to find.
Some of the money is disguised as loans designed to never be repaid.

Join up with Johnny Jihad
Arafat, Bin Laden, Ghadaffi, Sadam Hussein, Syria, Hizbollah, Hamas
The Russians, The Chinese, The Euro Union, The New World Order and The Communist Party....Boycott the only friend America has in the Middle East
Surrender our forward LP....Betray our Friends....
Boycott Israel...
The Promise God made to Abraham.. I will bless those who bless you and I will curse those who curse you...
So by all means..especially in the gravity of these days...Boycott Israel.
Join the G-mans Jihad imo of course

I'm sure "Israel" could give a shit whether you "boycott" it or not.

Trust me I wouldn't give those aholes a nickle either. I was pissed off by the fund raising for terrorist sponsored organizations at US campuses and that wasn't even tax dollars.

Disliking Israel doesn't equal liking terrorists.

I think our relationship with Israel is parasitic. We give them tons of cash for nothing in return. If Israel was doing things for the US I would support them. They aren't.

Can anyone name one country that supports the Israeli position in the middle east besides the United States ??

That's mighty swell of them.

Now I'm not supporting the US governments habit
of spending money every where in the world but
in the US. I thing the billions of dollars in
aid we send out is way out of line. I just don't
see what this has to do with a boycott. I buy
from lots of stores that have lots of money
already. I just tend to see Isreal's "war" as
one of survival, not a holy war. Historically
they tend to conduct pre-emptive and retaliatory
strikes but not just land grabs. I'm not jewish,
but I just haven't seen a reason to boycott. I
think U.S. support is warranted (if we insist in
keeping a presence in that area) just because
they seem to be the only country in that region
thats not against us. I'm not lecturing, I just
dont understand a reason for a boycott...

Coffee

[size=6]]ARGH!!!  BOYCOTTING ISREAL WAS NOT THE POINT !!!!!!!!!![/size=6]

the point was....
here is another example..

IF you own store XYZ and someone in [u]"make up a country here"[/u]. Calls in and says I want to order a widget...make that a preban widget,,  You as the owner as onwer of store XYZ cant refuse sell to this guy if [u]"make up a country here"[/u] is on the state dept list.


That is the part I dont think is right..  the govt telling you, you  [b][u]HAVE[/b][/u] to..

[b]damn thread has nothing to do about boycotting Isreal..[/b]

no wait yes it does. The way I heard it was that a US palestinan Business owner refused to fill an order for someone that had a parent company in Isreal (from what I see that quite a few) and Basicly he was told he had to or some license of his would be taken away... ( guess I should of added this during the inital post ) see post #1 for radio link...

Regardless, I will continue to drink Coke because Pepsi sucks and shop at Victorias Secret because it looks good on the wife.

But I will still continue to bitch about US tax dollars to Israel and US businesses not being allowed to make their OWN policies - which was cluster's original point.

After all there is a huge difference between a company owner "deciding" to send money to Israel and US tax dollars automatically going there as a reason of policy.

But I also noticed the above companies who now support Israel after being officially punished for NOT supporting Israel such as L'oreal.

"After being fined $1.4 million by the US in 1995 for writing a letter to the Arab League claiming that they had stopped production in Israel, they have been engaged in actively courting Israel with investments and large-scale commerce."

Post from 5subslr5 -

Sooooo, what?

When did we ever decide to make a decision in the interest of our long range policies based upon whether our visions was, or was not, shared by any single other nation?

I'd say 'going it alone' has been a uniquely American tradition.

So, when would you like to see Kofi Annan get his office next to President Bush's?

Nothing like the sight of blue berets in the Rose Garden, eh, [b]subsailor[/b]?

Eric The(WillTheSwissGuardBeThereAsWell?)Hun[>]:)]

SteyrAUG, did you copy that list from some Arab website or was it just written by an American with very poor spelling (e.g., "Danone yogart")?

Providing a link to your sources is good netiquette. [;)]

(Howdy Hun !)

Can anyone name one country that supports the Israeli position in the middle east besides the United States ?

Mighty good question!

Micronesia?[:D]

But once again, why would it matter?

Do you base your decisions of right and wrong based upon the crowd?

Especially, the non-American crowd?

BTW, I hear they don't like us in France.[:D]

Does that keep you up late at nights?

Eric The(NorDoesItMe,Either)Hun[>]:)]

While "yogurt" may have been a typo it was not a referrence to Dannon Yogurt. Danone is correct.

[url]http://www.stonyfield.com/AboutUs/PartnershipSummary.shtml[/url]

And the information is from a super secret list I carry at all times and keep taped to the side of my leg because all I do is bitch about Israel.

Actually I copied the list some time ago, pre 9-11 and don't remember where I got it. I'm sure a basic internet search for "Companies that support Israel" would give you more or less the same list.

Eric,
I base my opinions on what I believe to be the best interest of my country - the United States of America.
Plainly our present policy of Israel before the United States is just plain WRONG.
Every other country besides the United States, and that especially includes Israel, is acting in their own self interest.

Yah why base your views on those that a country not involved in the conflict would? Thats being too biased! After all, people in other countries don't get their news from Israel funding organizations, how could you hope to hear the REAL truth!

ScareThe(EvilMotherFucker)Crow

Scarecrow, have you ever heard a full speech by Arafat?

I think he lost it about the time he left Beirut in such a hurry (June, 1982).

But just imagine this - with all the hideous rambling, and calls for a 'million martyrs to Jerusalem', with all the eividence that has been amassed showing that Arafat basically ran the suicide bombing racket in the West Bank and Gaza...

Arafat is still supported by most of the world!

Imagine that!

You must understand this - that the world probably despises US more than it does Israel, it's just that Israel's a much more obvious and convenient target than the US.

Oh, they hate us all right, but it wouldn't pay them to declare so openly, especially right at the first of the month when the check's due.

It's always a good time to bash Israel![:D]

Eric The(NoRelativismHereFolks!)Hun[>]:)]

France, Saudi Arabia, and the UN agree with YOU.

Is it not amazing that formerly persecuted take on the part of the persecutor???!!!  NAZI "victim" turns into NAZI??!!!

DaMan

Post from 5subslr5 -

Strange, I base [u]my[/u] opinions on what I believe to be in the best interests of [u]my[/u] country - the United States of America.

We just disagree over this minor point![:D]

But as LarryG points out, you have company with France, Saudi Arabia, and just about every member-nation of the United Nations.

I'm comforted by the last 50 years of United States support for the State of Israel.

The folks who think like me have pretty much been convinced that it is in the best strategic and tactical advantage for the US to have Israel as its chief ally in the region.

The folks who think like you....well, you know who they are.

Plainly wrong? Not so! [b]Plainly, it's working![/b] The Arab nations have not successfully combined militarily against Israel and destroyed it, and yet they are still happy to sell us their oil!

Of course they do, but then so do we!

If you don't think that our leaders, and especially [u]this[/u] President, is [u]not[/u] acting in our own self interest, then we should fire him immediately!

You wouldn't want him to do otherwise, nor should you expect Israel, or any other country to do likewise, right?

So why mention Israel from among all the rest?

Can you name me one country that doesn't act in its own interest?

Eric The(Incredulous)Hun[>]:)]

I can't believe anyone who lives a normal life, with a job and a family, could find the time or energy to rout out a list like Steyr AUG came up with.  I'm not questioning its' accuracy.  Hell, I don't have the time or energy to check it out. I only wonder why anyone who wasn't getting paid by some interest group or other would go to the trouble of amassing all this data.  Must just be a rightous concern that we all know everything the sneaky Israelis are up to.  Funny--- these guys never seem to find the time to inform us about what those super wonderful Arabs are doing in and to our country.  Hmmmm.  [soapbox]

Thanks for the info, SteyrAUG.

I wonder, though: If you copied the list "some time ago"...

Then how did this reference to recent events enter it?

Doubtful, very doubtful.

I put the interests of my country, that is the United States of America, first.

I don't care how many Palestinians the Israelis kill nor do I care how many Israelis the Palestinians kill I just do not want the U.S. taxpayer to continue to pay for the killing.

Put the money into our own military.

Yes I can.
Regarding Israel the United States does not act in its own best interest but acts in the best interest of Israel.

Tell you what.  Let's remove the $5 BILLION taxpayer dollars given to Israel for about three years and see if we have an ally or a parasite ?

The folks who run the United States think that they are acting in the best interests of the United States when they support Israel!

I happen to agree with them![:D]

You don't![>Q]

Maybe if the liberal Democrats succeed in taking over the House, keep the Senate, and elect some goofball to replace George W. Bush in 2004, the folks who run this country will decide to drop Israel.

But do you really want to test out that theory?

Eric The(JustGrinAndBearIt,M'boy!)Hun[>]:)

Could have sworn I coped it into my junk folder a long time ago. Gotta start dating crap. Sorry for the error.

In purusing the net when I come accross pointless statistics on certain subjects, ie. guns, Israel, etc. I save them to a junk folder in word. This way when someone asks for certain data I don't have to run all over the net looking for it.

I used to just bookmark it but my folders got huge and the link was inevitably dead when I needed the info.

5sub-

Obviously Congress and GW believe that support for Israel is a good thing.  So do many Americans, otherwise our elected representatives wouldn't be able to sign those big checks.

Some do, some don't.  If more did, those checks would be even bigger.  If less did, those checks would be smaller.  Despite what you keep saying, military funding is *not* a zero-sum game:  if the money did not go to Isreal, it wouldn't automatically go to "rebuild the military".  Who knows, maybe it's go to fund more tax laws or something.

What it does do is show that an appropriate and well-supported military is vital to a country's national security.  Isreal's ability to defend herself serves as an example to Americans who are just beginning to wake up to the realities of the world everybody else lives in.

N'est c'pas?

5subslr5, you, me and a few other people have been saying EXACTLY that over and over and over. But it doesn't matter. To certain people we will ALWAYS be anti semetic, nazi, arab loving, suicide bomber supporting, UN agreeing lovers of the French.

Makes no difference whenther or not you actually hate jews or just the policies of the State of Israel. Makes no difference whether you object to Israels actions or just US support of them. Even if you ONLY care about US money being diverted ANYWHERE, if you include Israel you are un-American.

The bottom line is if we had a similar relationship with ANY other country they would be complaining too. If we sent 3 Billion a year to Canada these guys would lose their minds. Remember NAFTA? They were right there with us. Israel is the single exception.

Try and remember this is usually from the SAME people who insist that if you don't believe in God you are automatically in league with the devil. Despite facts, figures and politics this one really comes down to ancient voodoo. When you realize that, you understand it will never "make sense" and then it will all make sense.

Obviously I want to stop funding Israel period.

Are you willing to test my theory ?

DS,
I know my opinion of the United States before Israel is not the popular opinion.
I know my opinion that Israel is of no strategic value to the United States is not the popular opinion.
I know my opinion that Israel is a parasite and not an ally is not the popular opinion.
I know that my opinion that Sharon is just a murdering piece of human garbage - just as Arafat is - is not the popular opinion.

None of this much matters to me.  My country and my caring is still for the United States of America and some few real allies such as Britain and Canada.

So long as we continue to pay $5 BILLION to Israel to kill Palestinians there will be no peace in the middle east.
Israel is in a peculiar position.  Israel cannot afford peace.

Why is it that you guys only bitch about foreign aid to Israel?  What is it about that country that draws your ire?

Remember, the federal budget for 2001 is about 1.8 trillion dollars.  Why not go here and peruse just *how* our tax dollars are spent...  

[url]http://www.usaid.gov/[/url]

So long as the United States continues to pay Israel to kill Palestinians there will be no peace in the middle east.

Israel cannot afford peace.  With peace the U.S. gifts either stop or are drastically reduced.  Without the billions in gifts per year Israel cannot survive financially.

Sooner or later our policies of Israel before the United States will bring about reduced oil from the Muslim states and this action will adversely affect the economies of the industrialized countries.  Sooner or later Americans will be killed because of our Israel first policies.

Israel is of no strategic value to the U.S. in the middle east.  Arabia and Turkey are strategic to that region.

For me these are reasons enough.

Simply because Israel gets MORE than anyone else. They get 40% of all foreign aid. Despite being one of the richest coountries in the world. Even jews in Israel question our foreign aid.

If you gave Israels foreign aid package to any other country I would have the same objection.

Also if Israel got much less, no country deserves 3 billion a year, and actually did more for us, I would have ZERO objections.

Sure they do.

They sit there and get the worthless Arab countries all steamed up over their existence.  This provides a buffer for us because they are already steamed over OUR existence.

All we have to do is tell Israel to go knock some heads over there, and 1/2 of the worlds terrorism problem will be solved.
They've kicked ass before, and they are willing to do it again.

But we can't do that, because Arafat "isn't a terrorist", and the European Union and the UN is staunchly anti-Israel, and we have to be "multi-lateral" about the war on terrorisim.

So now people wag their tounges about how Israel is at the root of the worlds problems, forgetting that they are simply the first focus of extinction for evil arab regimes.