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Posted: 4/16/2002 8:54:52 PM EDT
OK I've mest with the Jews and Christians, now time to offend some Romans. Just kidding. But I do have a theory that I believe explains the current "priest problem." And I mean currently "in the news" not "didn't always happen." I think many Homosexuals are drawn to the priesthood for the following reasons: 1. To get salvation. Those who are believers know that they are sinning. What better road to redemption than the priesthood? Perhaps some even believe they can be cured by immerssion into the Church. 2. To conceal their lifestyle. Nobody asks a Priest why he hasn't found a nice girl yet? If you think about it, Priest is the perfect cover. It also "used" to insulate you from suspicion. 3. Opportunity. Predatory homosexuals know that Priests are men of power and influence. Their deeds can be done and kept concealed as they have been for so long. What kid wants to risk hell for telling on a Priest. Especially if that Priest can convince the kid it was "his" fault. So while the Church is certainly guilty when they cover these things up and just shifting these guys around, I also have to wonder if most of the problem Priests began as homosexuals and used the Church as cover. So am I way out in left field with this one?
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 8:59:28 PM EDT
Wasn't this covered in another similar thread just a few days ago? [url]http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?id=106839[/url]
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 9:00:31 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 9:02:28 PM EDT
Missed that one. Atencio does seem to have raised similar points. But my main point is Homosexuals seeking out the Priesthood as cover.
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 9:06:32 PM EDT
You dont have much of a life do you?
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 9:11:14 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Confederate: You dont have much of a life do you?
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Actually I'm very busy solving all of life problems and determining the cause and effect of many things. I post my finding and or hypothesese here for your benefit.
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 9:37:54 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Confederate: You dont have much of a life do you?
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ROTFLMAO~!!!!! And it only took him a little more than 1000 post to figure it out. Heck, steyr probably posted a 1000 this week alone. Sgtar15
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 10:09:36 PM EDT
And here I thought this post was damn insightful and I was onto something....
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 9:05:31 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 9:12:39 AM EDT
This is why I am happy to have been brought up a Byzantine Catholic. The Eastern Rite has not been plagued with perverts and other riff-raff infesting the priesthood. In fact, up until the 1930's priests from the Eastern Rite were able to marry. Jealous Latin Rite clergy put an end to that. The Latin Rite has a good many problems stemming from the quality of men that make up their clergy, especially in the US.
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 9:23:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/17/2002 9:38:11 AM EDT by Boomholzer]
The root problem is that the Catholic Church needs to let priests have a private life with other consensual adults. Get married; go to gay bars, whatever. This should circumvent the urge to victimize innocent children. I don’t see Lutheran priests in the news so often. A priest in a small northern community where I snowmobile just got charged. Do you think that these Catholic priests are homosexual and therefore target little boys OR that the priests are mostly “strait” and target the boys because they are more accessible and the act may be considered less evil (in the Priest’s point of view) than say with little girls? Edited to add: Were they pedophiles before they entered the priesthood? Edited to add that I think it is a combination but that the committing priests ARE homosexual. My point is: Was the priesthood committing these acts always pedophiles or did celebacy drive them into the act after they became priests?
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 9:32:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/17/2002 9:48:26 AM EDT by Belloc]
Originally Posted By SteyrAUG: OK I've mest with the Jews and Christians, now time to offend some Romans. Just kidding. But I do have a theory that I believe explains the current "priest problem." And I mean currently "in the news" not "didn't always happen." I think many Homosexuals are drawn to the priesthood for the following reasons: 1. To get salvation. Those who are believers know that they are sinning. What better road to redemption than the priesthood? Perhaps some even believe they can be cured by immerssion into the Church. 2. To conceal their lifestyle. Nobody asks a Priest why he hasn't found a nice girl yet? If you think about it, Priest is the perfect cover. It also "used" to insulate you from suspicion. 3. Opportunity. Predatory homosexuals know that Priests are men of power and influence. Their deeds can be done and kept concealed as they have been for so long. What kid wants to risk hell for telling on a Priest. Especially if that Priest can convince the kid it was "his" fault. So while the Church is certainly guilty when they cover these things up and just shifting these guys around, I also have to wonder if most of the problem Priests began as homosexuals and used the Church as cover. So am I way out in left field with this one?
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I have this book on order and it should shed some light on your questions. [url]www.goodbyegoodmen.com[/url] It would seem that the American Bishops and Cardinals have for awhile been in open or secret revolt against Rome and the traditional doctrines of the Church. It is not that the Priesthood attracts diviants but that it would seem to because regular people who were orthodox and traditionalists were excluded. Add this to the fact that then these same Cardinals and Bishops had to cover their a$$ when all these homosexuals started abusing boys and it compounded the evil and their guilt.
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 9:35:54 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Boomholzer: The root problem is that the Catholic Church needs to let priests have a private life with other consensual adults. Get married; go to gay bars, whatever. This should circumvent the urge to victimize innocent children. I don’t see Lutheran priests in the news so often. A priest in a small northern community where I snowmobile just got charged. .
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Pure liberal libel. There is not one shred of evidence supporting the claim celibacy causes any sexual deviancy. Sinc the preisthood is in itself a very special part of the community, it very well could have attraction to pedarests. It could also be our highly socialized lifestyle is incompatable with celibacy. What the leadership did by treatment/shuffling was horrible and the Pope will be addressing the Cardinals to this effect. To label each priest as a potential pedarest is itself, irresponsible. Just this week a middle school teacher (male) was convicted on counts of male child porn. Are we now to question every male middle school teacher? How about LeTourno (sp?)? What she did (multiple times) with that boy was itself disgusting. I guess we need eunuchs teaching. But even then, we STILL will have a problem. Why? its not the instinct of procreation these bastards are fulfilling. Its an uncurable disease. Normalizing homosexual behavior does the problem no favors and could in fact, further the problem. Everybody's moral compass is jeopardized when we relax the normal behavior decorum. We must maintain standards by understanding the root meaning of the word morality. We also need to understand our actions do have reprocussions. Oh yes folks, please use your turn signals. And stop changing lanes within an intersection.
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 9:44:16 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Boomholzer: [b]The root problem is that the Catholic Church needs to let priests have a private life with other consensual adults. Get married; go to gay bars, whatever. This should circumvent the urge to victimize innocent children.[/b] The role of the Church is to draw men to holiness and to God, not to fornication and homosexual sodomy. It has, on and off, been doing a relatively good jog up until they started letting in masses of homosexuals. [b]I don’t see Lutheran priests in the news so often.[/b] Lutheran's are a denomination of Protestantism so are a much smaller group than Catholics. But it happens, and it happens in other denominations also but the media really hates the Catholics because of their support of unborn children. In any event the story is not that abuse only takes place among Priests, (in just the last month I have read a story of 2 protestant ministers, a rabbi, a professor at Harvard and 3, that's right, 3 DEA agents) the story is the cover up that lead to hundreds and perhaps thousands of more children being abused that would never should have happened if the Cardinals and Bishops were not "full of dead men's bones." [b]Do you think that these Catholic priests are homosexual and therefore target little boys[/b] So far about 92% of the cases of abuse have been commited by homosexuals abusing teenage boys. When all is said and done that number may get closer to 95 or even 98%.
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 9:48:30 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Keith_J:
Originally Posted By Boomholzer: The root problem is that the Catholic Church needs to let priests have a private life with other consensual adults. Get married; go to gay bars, whatever. This should circumvent the urge to victimize innocent children. I don’t see Lutheran priests in the news so often. A priest in a small northern community where I snowmobile just got charged. .
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Pure liberal libel. There is not one shred of evidence supporting the claim celibacy causes any sexual deviancy. Sinc the preisthood is in itself a very special part of the community, it very well could have attraction to pedarests. It could also be our highly socialized lifestyle is incompatable with celibacy. What the leadership did by treatment/shuffling was horrible and the Pope will be addressing the Cardinals to this effect. To label each priest as a potential pedarest is itself, irresponsible. Just this week a middle school teacher (male) was convicted on counts of male child porn. Are we now to question every male middle school teacher? How about LeTourno (sp?)? What she did (multiple times) with that boy was itself disgusting. I guess we need eunuchs teaching. But even then, we STILL will have a problem. Why? its not the instinct of procreation these bastards are fulfilling. Its an uncurable disease. Normalizing homosexual behavior does the problem no favors and could in fact, further the problem. Everybody's moral compass is jeopardized when we relax the normal behavior decorum. We must maintain standards by understanding the root meaning of the word morality. We also need to understand our actions do have reprocussions. Oh yes folks, please use your turn signals. And stop changing lanes within an intersection.
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Givin the frequency of these events, that means that the Roman Catholic Church is dream employment for pederasts. That is crimal intent and malice from the start. Don't you think that pederasts would favor targeting day-care, etc and take up a less demanding cover than priesthood?
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 9:51:08 AM EDT
I would argue that most who enter the Priesthood decide to do so at an early age. I believe their sexual growth stopped from that point on and never had a normal sexual lifestyle. So sexually these Priests are children with a adult sex drive. Thats not something they can talk about so it is kept inside and comes out in perverted ways. Another reason is some of these Priests were themselves molested when they were children. Without counseling and treatment they are headed down a path of self destruction and it may manifest inself in bad/pervert behavior like Pedophelia, Alcoholism, over-eating or other weird behavior. Priests should be required to have some sort of life before entering the Priesthood and this would eliminate all of these problems.
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 10:03:10 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Boomholzer: Givin the frequency of these events, that means that the Roman Catholic Church is dream employment for pederasts. That is crimal intent and malice from the start. Don't you think that pederasts would favor targeting day-care, etc and take up a less demanding cover than priesthood?
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Bull! The incidence of homosexuality in the preisthood is LOWER than that of the general population. Further to that, there are far more pedarests in the general population who have easier accessibility to young boys. Is a vow of poverty a "choice" employment? How about 6 years of seminary studies? It will still happen even with the best psych screenings possible. What needs to be done in removal of such actors from the positions, something the Church did not do until recently. Until society demands all child molesters be locked up indefinitely, this will continue especially outside the Church. Its a listed psychological disease and should be treated as such. As a society, we went down the slipperly slope pel mel when the APA removed homosexuality as a disease in 1973. Now we are reaping the associated fallout. Believe it, there are those pushing for pedophillia to be removed. The Supreme Court is actually helping these diseased humans.
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 10:05:08 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Boomholzer: Givin the frequency of these events, that means that the Roman Catholic Church is dream employment for pederasts. That is crimal intent and malice from the start.
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Almost all of the cases do not involve pedophilia though many do. Most of the cases are of homosexuals abusing teenagers.
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 10:11:34 AM EDT
March 22, 2002 Should gay priest adopt? Despite the growing media consensus that Catholicism causes sodomy, an alternative view – adopted by the Boy Scouts – is that sodomites cause sodomy. (Assume all the usual disclaimers here about most gay men not molesting boys, most Muslims being peaceful, and so on.) It is a fact that the vast majority of the abuser priests – more than 90 percent – are accused of molesting teen-age boys. Indeed, the overwhelmingly homosexual nature of the abuse prompted The New York Times to engage in its classic "Where's Waldo" reporting style, in which the sex of the victims is studiedly hidden amid a torrent of genderless words, such as the "teen-ager," the "former student," the "victim" and the "accuser." Meanwhile, no spate of sex scandals is engulfing the Boy Scouts of America. Inasmuch as the Boy Scouts were not taking risk-assessment advice from Norman Mineta, they decided to eliminate a whole category of potential problems by refusing to allow gay men to be scout leaders. Perhaps gay scout leaders just really liked camping. But it was also possible that gay men who wanted to lead troops of adolescent boys into the woods were up to no good... (more) [url]http://www.townhall.com/columnists/anncoulter/ac20020322.shtml[/url]
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 10:22:50 AM EDT
Its my understanding that Priests my be homosexual when they come into the ministry but are requiered ,like all other Priests,to take a vow of cellabancy.
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 10:49:29 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Keith_J:
Originally Posted By Boomholzer: Givin the frequency of these events, that means that the Roman Catholic Church is dream employment for pederasts. That is crimal intent and malice from the start. Don't you think that pederasts would favor targeting day-care, etc and take up a less demanding cover than priesthood?
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Bull! The incidence of homosexuality in the preisthood is LOWER than that of the general population. Further to that, there are far more pedarests in the general population who have easier accessibility to young boys. Is a vow of poverty a "choice" employment? How about 6 years of seminary studies? It will still happen even with the best psych screenings possible. What needs to be done in removal of such actors from the positions, something the Church did not do until recently. Until society demands all child molesters be locked up indefinitely, this will continue especially outside the Church. Its a listed psychological disease and should be treated as such. As a society, we went down the slipperly slope pel mel when the APA removed homosexuality as a disease in 1973. Now we are reaping the associated fallout. Believe it, there are those pushing for pedophillia to be removed. The Supreme Court is actually helping these diseased humans.
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I agree. I was playing devil's advocate in my comment about sex offenders joining the church to be sex offenders.
Pure liberal libel. There is not one shred of evidence supporting the claim celibacy causes any sexual deviancy. Sinc the preisthood is in itself a very special part of the community, it very well could have attraction to pedarests.
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I interpreted that quoted response in that you believed that sex offenders joined the church to be sex offenders. I do not agree with that point of view. I can not totally agree to state that they are not a product of their environment. I am sure that these priests were not normal before they entered the priesthood.
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 11:51:47 AM EDT
Celebacy causes pedophilia........ ...... just as having guns causes crime. Oh wait, we don't believe that one do we? [rolleyes] That is the same stupid baseless cause-effect "logic" that the liberals use to slam us. You guys are more like your enemy than you realize.
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 12:41:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/17/2002 1:00:43 PM EDT by Jarhead_22]
If, instead of hiding their hideous, disgusting acts and shuffling them from parish to parish, bishops bought wood chippers and large stocks of quicklime, and explained to the priests in their diocese what they were for, this problem would be a non-starter. ***Edited to add a quote from Dennis Miller: "If you ever feel so f*cked up and miserable that you think the only way to feel better is to hurt a child, then you need to kill yourself. You need to lean into the strike zone and take one for the team."
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 1:02:01 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Belloc: The role of the Church is to draw men to holiness and to God, not to fornication and homosexual sodomy.
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Some Bishops seem to be a little confused on this issue.
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 1:03:13 PM EDT
The Catholic priesthood is a refuge for homo/pedophiles! Kinda like the US Navy!!!! [:P] DaMan
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 1:05:35 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Jarhead_22: ***Edited to add a quote from Dennis Miller: "If you ever feel so f*cked up and miserable that you think the only way to feel better is to hurt a child, then you need to kill yourself. You need to lean into the strike zone and take one for the team."
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Was that quoted during MNF? [;D]
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 1:10:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Boomholzer: Was that quoted during MNF? [;D]
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Boom: No, that's from "Dennis Miller: The Rants."
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 1:19:19 PM EDT
So the most senior Priest who is an expert in ancient religious documents and language is allowed access to the Vatican archives. After being secluded for more than 18 hours without food they decide to check on him. They find him at a table sobbing over several original scrolls. He looks up and stammers.... ...."Celebrate"....The word was "Celebrate"..
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