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Posted: 4/15/2002 12:50:21 PM EDT
Thinking about grabbing a Mauser or a Mosin Nagant at the next gun show as a "fun gun". Both are approximately the same price at local shows ($170 for matching s/n Nagants, roughly the same for unissued Yugoslav Mausers in VG condition), parts are available for each, sporter stocks are out there if I choose to go that route. Basically, I'm just tired of getting my shoulder beat to a pulp by my 12 gauge coach gun - local range only allows slugs. Every time I shoot, I can only shoot about 30 slugs or so before my shoulder, chest, and upper arm are black and blue (I'm guessing that the bruising simply spreads because bruises ON bruises wouldn't make much sense). The light weight of the coach gun makes the kick worse. And I'm sure that the 3" magnum slugs don't help much, either. [:D] [BD] I understand that both the 8mm Mauser round and the 7.62x54R round are in .30-06 territory. I'm not concerned with that - if I was, I wouldn't shoot slugs out of a SxS coach gun! What pros and cons are there for each, and any remarkable recomendations or suggestions, any others I should consider? TIA, the_reject
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 1:01:46 PM EDT
both are fine guns. consider the lee-enfields too. all are historic military longarms.
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 1:04:00 PM EDT
Originally Posted By lurker: both are fine guns. consider the lee-enfields too. all are historic military longarms.
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That was another possibility I was considering, but I haven't done a lot of research on the SMLE just yet. the_reject
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 1:20:31 PM EDT
Actually I like both of them. If you just want one for plinking duties however, I would lean more in the direction of the Mosin-Nagant. They are rugged, pretty accurate and satisfy your hunger to fire a powerful round. Also, the ones with the longer barrels will reach way out there! Probably the most convincing reason to purchase these rifles is the low cost and availability of surplus ex-Soviet block 7.62x54R ammo. SOG, J&G Sales, probably AIM Surplus and maybe even Ammoman keeps this stuff for anywhere from $45-$50 per 440 rd. sealed tin. And of course Wolf is available if you want brand new ammo, but I would stick with the mil-spec 148 gr. stuff (may actually be 147 gr). The Mauser is a very nice gun and generally has a much smoother action that the Mosin's, but ammo is hard to find for them. There are many rounds of 8mm out there, but much of it is very old WWII era surplus designed with 154 gr. bullets which weren't designed for the K98 types and their copies. These rifles do best on the 196 gr stuff. If you are using an older gun like the 1938 Turkish Mausers and the like, then the 154 gr. stuff will suffice if it fires. The only new ammo I have found loaded with a 196 gr. FMJ projectile is S&B. But due to the complaints I have heard of kabooms with this brand of ammo, I would be a bit reluctant to buy any until they improve their product line. If it were my choice and I was looking more at a shooter than a collection piece, I would get the Mosin. I have one of the M91/30 Finnish copies. I measured the barrel on the sucker at a whopping 31"! It is in good condition and has an unbelievable reach. Add a scope mount, free float the barrel, get a new sythetic stock and do a bit of trigger work and one could have a long range precision rifle! And at a fraction of the cost of many fancy Remington's and Winchester's. Oh, and get yourself some strippers for your new toy....they make reloading a breeze. Good luck.
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 1:25:00 PM EDT
Mauser
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 1:33:10 PM EDT
Originally Posted By the_reject: Thinking about grabbing a Mauser or a Mosin Nagant at the next gun show as a "fun gun".
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Geez, that's like deciding between a Yugo and a BMW...the Mauser of course.
Basically, I'm just tired of getting my shoulder beat to a pulp
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Hnngghh, that might be a problem ;) If recoil bothers you, the Mauser is not the way you dant to go. Get something smaller, way smaller.
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 1:35:33 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 1:44:21 PM EDT
Get both... then you'll never say you made the wrong choice.
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 1:51:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/15/2002 1:54:42 PM EDT by Stormbringer]
I have 3 mausers ( 2 model 96s and a Model 38 swede) I have 3 enfields ( NoIII mk 1, No 4 MkII and No5 I have 1 Mossin Nagant.( model 1891) Get the idea?? Mind you I would not turn a new Mossin down as I am always looking to expand my collection ( actually a nice Fin would do nicely. If I could only have one?? Well Hands down the enfields....No 4 MkI ( I perfer the rear site to that on my Savage MkII) If ammo cost is a factor....Mauser...I would try and find a Yugo or Syrian. www.marstar.ca has real nice deals on Mausers, yes they ship to the USA.
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 1:56:06 PM EDT
get both The Nagant is a light gun and the 7.62x54 is the equivalent of a 30.06 It's my favorite gun, and the recoil is tame.
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 1:57:07 PM EDT
Got both, they both kick like MOFO's Get a Past recoil reducing pad. Straps on. Both nice rifles. Either would be good. Moisens aren't that expensive around here.
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 2:04:47 PM EDT
easy get both there cheap enough that u can :)
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 3:49:59 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Kar98: Geez, that's like deciding between a Yugo and a BMW...the Mauser of course.
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Alright, and I can understand that analogy. The Mauser certainly has proved itself by living on in more modern weapons.
Hnngghh, that might be a problem ;) If recoil bothers you, the Mauser is not the way you dant to go. Get something smaller, way smaller.
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Nah, you didn't read above. I'm USED to getting beat to hell. I KNOW my SxS is more harsh. But, the added weight of a Mauser or a Nagant will help to take up some of that "oomph". the_reject
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 3:53:02 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Troy: Mausers have been used to build custom guns for decades. That would be my first choice.
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Yeah, and that's kinda why the appeal for me is more towards the Nagant - not quite as common. But, the popularity of the Mauser is definitely demonstrated by the responses I've received thusfar. I think I need to take a fresh look at it.
Mosin-Nagants are pretty accurate considering the age of the design, but there isn't much you can do with one (not an issue if you're going to leave it in stock configuration).
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I will not be leaving either in stock configuration.
#4 Enfields are the best *military* bolt guns, assuming your looking to keep them in stock condition. Aperture sights, smooth, fast action, good accuracy, and (relatively) high-capacity, detachable mags.
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Based on the responses, I think I'll need to give serious consideration to the Enfield. Time for more research... the_reject
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 3:53:52 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MC_Man: Get both... then you'll never say you made the wrong choice.
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Getting more than one is not an option. Money will need to be spent on "upgrades" and ammo. the_reject
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 4:15:09 PM EDT
For me it's a esthetic thing. I have a No. 4 Enfield, a '96 Swedish Mauser and a 48 Yugoslavian Mauser. I like the looks of all of them. I won't ever have a No. 1 Enfield or a Moisin-Nagant because I find them esthetically unpleasing. Different strokes. The Enfield in .303 British is really quite pleasant to shoot in volume. It's between the .30-30 and the .308 in power, and a fairly hefty rifle. However, I've had several, and none of them have been particularly accurate. The 8mm Mauser has a pretty good kick (especially with the steel buttplate on the 48) and is acceptably accurate. The 6.5x55 is a very pleasant round, and quite accurate. I'd go for a good '96 Mauser. They're drying up, but prices are still pretty good.
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 4:23:26 PM EDT
I fired my M48a (yugo mauser) and MN 91/30 for the first time a week ago. The M48a was one of the 'unissued' ones aim surplus was selling for like $100 a year ago with the bayonet, scabbard, and all the extra stuff. The MN I also got from aim a couple months later for $39. Its seen a lot of use. The M48 was louder and gave higher recoil. The sights are set too low for me - I had to hold my upper cheek against the stock in such a way that it felt like a punch in the face after the 7th shot. The accuracy sucked too. It must have been the crappy 8mm surplus ammo to blame, because the barrel is new and the trigger breaks clean. The MN was quieter (thats not saying much) and had less recoil. The ergonomics were good and the accuracy was actually pretty suprising. Groups were around 2" at 100yds with the occasional flyer, again used crappy mil surp ammo. Trigger felt like a sponge and took way too much effort to fire. My hand was tired after 15 rounds. I'm stoning the sear/cocking piece and so far the results are better. These 2 types can be found for really cheap, so why not get both?
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 4:29:24 PM EDT
I would much rather have the Mauser, with the MK4 Enfield a close second. I just never cared much for the Mosin Nagant - but that is just my preference. Tyler
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 4:32:26 PM EDT
Have you considered a K31 (straight-pull bolt action) in 7.5x55swiss? AIM has them for $89.95, shipped, and the one I bought last week is a fine rifle. All SNs match, the wood is a little beat up (hey, these were service rifles, not something that was built for ww2, never used, and stuck in cosmoline until no one wanted em anymore) but the bluing is nice, and the bores are AWESOME. Ammo is a little steep (about $0.40 a round) but it's not too bad.
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 4:32:49 PM EDT
MOUSER......Here kitty kitty
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 4:38:53 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/15/2002 4:59:45 PM EDT by HKgnnr]
If you havent already, nows the time to start thinking about a C&R license - definitely worth its $35 fee - you pay it off in no time with the money saved buying without the markup. I'd direct you to Cruffler's webpage, but its going through some upgrades apparently and currently unavailable. I have a Yugoslavian M48 Mauser and a Finnish M39 Mosin. I havent had the opportunity to try out the Mosin yet but from what I gather on other C&R boards I can expect exceptional accuracy, much better than the standard beat up Mosin 91/30s for $39 bucks. I spent $139 + shipping for an excellent condition Sako barreled Finnish rifle from [url]www.gunsnammo.com[/url] As for the Yugo, I went right into handloading for it, and have yet to try surplus stuff. I went with 180gr Nosler ballistic tips and the best group I tagged was just over 3" at 100 yards with open sights. Wouldnt hesitate to use that 50 year old + rifle for deer hunting at all. I think you'd be happy with either - inexpensive, accuracte and excellent pieces of history. Just want to come back and add that I believe the sights, overall balance, and length of pull are better on the M39 - these things are rock solid. However as Matt pointed out below, the action on the Mauser is a lot smoother. For the 39 I purchased a 'Darrells Scout Mount' [url]http://home.earthlink.net/~paralax1/darrellsintropage.htm[/url] setup and hopefully will pick up a extended eye relief scope soon.
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 4:47:29 PM EDT
I like the Mauser action way more than the Nagant. However, ammo is an issue with better, cheaper ammo available for the Nagant. You can get good 8mm from Winchester (underloaded) and Norma, but it's not cheap. But if you're looking for something to build on, you can't beat the Mauser action.
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 5:17:30 PM EDT
Originally Posted By HKgnnr: If you havent already, nows the time to start thinking about a C&R license - definitely worth its $35 fee - you pay it off in no time with the money saved buying without the markup.
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This is probably the best thing I can do right now. I think that pretty much settles it. To-do list will involve grabbing a C&R. From there, I'll move on to following everyone else's suggestion - buying one of each! I'll probably go with the Nagant first - cheaper to feed the new kid. Also came across a site with some nice Yugo M-98s. Damn. Bitten by the "bug". [:D] the_reject
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 5:34:14 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/15/2002 5:36:04 PM EDT by HKgnnr]
"Bitten by the bug" - Dont you know it. Once you start, theres no going back. [;)] Defnitely addicting, especially when you really start reading up on the history of each rifle. In my time so far, I've aquired the Mosin, M48 and a Romanian SKS. You cant go wrong when you pick up these 'fun guns' for plinking, hunting or just safe sitters/wall hangers. And dont worry if theres a 'ding' in that $130 stock/excellent condition rifle - it adds character and probably could tell some stories if it could. Have fun, and good luck in your search! Heres a link (due to Cruffler being down) that will help you aquire that C&R, and has a slew of C&R info: [url]http://www.armscenter.com/parallax/crhomepage.htm[/url]
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 5:39:43 PM EDT
Alrighty darlin, let Auntie Hannah share some pearls of wisdom with you..... Get the Mauser. This is the gun you want. The 3 lug bolt action of the Mauser is quite simply, the best bolt action rifle ever designed. Strongest, safest, BEST. Even our 1903 Springfield engineers paid $50,000 royalties to Mauser to copy this design. I find nice cheap ammo for them at all the shows...yes, corrosive milspec, but just clean the damned gun, and it is not a problem. Best damned bolt action rifles in the world. The Mosins were typical russkie craftsmanship, that is to say, they make great fenceposts. At the factory, when they were new, when test fired, if they could hit paper at ALL, they were designated a "sniper gun." LOL. There is a reason they are so cheap. Crrrrrap. Big heavy awkward crap, at that. If you are tired of being beaten by your bolt actions, try a Swiss Schmidt Rubin K-31. Price varies from $100-175 or so. A totally underrated, utterly sweet shooting tack driver. Straight pull bolt action, and NICE trigger pulls. Caliber is 7.5 Swiss, and may be a bit pricey to feed, but with the number of them coming into the country, ammo supplies are getting more plentiful, and the prices are coming down. Good luck, I hope you find a new toy. Love, Auntie Hannah
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 5:51:21 PM EDT
Hannah is right about the quality and accuracy of the Nagant. The ammo is out there for either bullet, but you are way better off getting the gun that will shoot it straight! Looks are a personal choice, but damn that Nagant is UUUUUUGLY! The Mauser has many parts to upgrade it with also, if that matters to you.
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 6:12:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By HKgnnr: Heres a link (due to Cruffler being down) that will help you aquire that C&R, and has a slew of C&R info: [url]http://www.armscenter.com/parallax/crhomepage.htm[/url]
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Thanks. I can recall visiting Cruffler before. I found the form off the ATF website - will look into filling it out and getting it sent in. the_reject
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 6:22:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/15/2002 6:27:52 PM EDT by the_reject]
Originally Posted By Hannah_Reitsch: The 3 lug bolt action of the Mauser is quite simply, the best bolt action rifle ever designed.
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This I know. Which is the appeal for the Mauser.
I find nice cheap ammo for them at all the shows...yes, corrosive milspec, but just clean the damned gun, and it is not a problem. Best damned bolt action rifles in the world.
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I'm not concerned that much with corrosive v/s non-corrosive ammo - if anything, I'm liable to clean the damn thing too much rather than not enough.
The Mosins were typical russkie craftsmanship, that is to say, they make great fenceposts. At the factory, when they were new, when test fired, if they could hit paper at ALL, they were designated a "sniper gun." LOL. There is a reason they are so cheap. Crrrrrap. Big heavy awkward crap, at that.
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I'm also assuming that under the description of "typical russkie craftsmanship", I'm hoping that the words "reliable" and functional" pop in there next to it's use as a fencepost. I'll defer due to lack of information. However, i'm finding lots of info (outside of a few posts in this thread) that are stating otherwise as far as the accuracy of the Nagant, so I'm still in the air on that issue. As far as big and awkward is concerned, I'm 6'6" and not exactly what one would call "small and agile". [:D] One more reason I'm possibly leaning towards the Nagant 91/30 rifle.
If you are tired of being beaten by your bolt actions, try a Swiss Schmidt Rubin K-31. Price varies from $100-175 or so. A totally underrated, utterly sweet shooting tack driver. Straight pull bolt action, and NICE trigger pulls. Caliber is 7.5 Swiss, and may be a bit pricey to feed, but with the number of them coming into the country, ammo supplies are getting more plentiful, and the prices are coming down.
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If the thing wasn't so expensive to feed, it'd be at the top of the list with the Mauser, Nagant, and Enfield. I'll get around to it, I'm certain, and look forward to picking it up based off of your recommendation.
Originally Posted By Minman72: Looks are a personal choice, but damn that Nagant is UUUUUUGLY! The Mauser has many parts to upgrade it with also, if that matters to you.
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Personally, I find the looks of the Nagant as appealing as the Mauser - particularly the 91/30 rifles. To each his own. [:)] the_reject
Link Posted: 4/15/2002 6:56:27 PM EDT
Since I own several of each of the above rifles, gotta make a few comments: (1) In military form, the Enfield No.4 is the best bet. If you want to keep the iron sights and add a sporter stock, it would still be a good bet due to the excellent peep sight. (2) Mosin-Nagants are not beautiful in the Swedish Mauser sense. However, they are far from "crap". Most of the ones coming from Russia have been legitimately used in war and are in fact pretty beat up. The Finn conversions of Russian MN receivers, particularly the Model 1939's are accurate, ergonomic, and have the best of tangent sights. They are neat weapons, but not a good base if you want a sporter. (3) All arguments about the classic design aside, Mausers will have the broadest assortment of parts available if you want to modify it. (4) If you plan to do a lot of upgrades, you may be able to save a bit of money by shopping around a bit and by buying one without the "accessories." (5) Surplus ammo is readily available for MN, Mauser, and Enfield. Just be sure to clean for corrosive primers and you'll be fine. Any way you go will provide lots of good cheap shooting.
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 2:38:46 AM EDT
#1 Ishapore Enfield Made of better steel, chambered for 7.62 NATO #2 03A3 Springfield #3 Krag-Jorgenson Smoothest bolt-action ever made (off the wall choices) Arisaka Type 99 w/ dust cover, if possible Mannlicher-Carcano Lebel 1886/93 If you do go for the Mosin-Nagant; get the full size one, not the M44 Carbine.
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 3:43:08 AM EDT
Originally Posted By QBit: #1 Ishapore Enfield Made of better steel, chambered for 7.62 NATO #2 03A3 Springfield #3 Krag-Jorgenson Smoothest bolt-action ever made (off the wall choices) Arisaka Type 99 w/ dust cover, if possible Mannlicher-Carcano Lebel 1886/93 If you do go for the Mosin-Nagant; get the full size one, not the M44 Carbine.
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If I did go the Enfield route, the Ishapore is at the top of the list, just from the little research I've done so far. As far as Mosin Nagant, it'd definitely be the rifle, not the carbine. Thanks for the other options, however. Now I have more toys I need to get. Might as well grab a safe while I'm at it... the_reject
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 4:37:29 AM EDT
Not Ishapore!! Long branch Broad Arrow!! Afterall THEY ARE CANADIAN!!!
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 5:07:31 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Stormbringer: Not Ishapore!! Long branch Broad Arrow!! Afterall THEY ARE CANADIAN!!!
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What are you talking aboot? [:D] Besides, I'd have to buy about 10 of those just to equal out to 1 Ishapore... You know, exchange rates and all... [;D] [BD] the_reject
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 10:16:02 AM EDT
The Yugo Mauser is a 'short' action & rebarreling requires additional machine work if you're planning on sporterizing it. Either one would be a good choice. The Yugo Mauser will be a little nicer looking but Mosin Nagants are so stone axe simple/reliable they make AK's look like range queen primma donnas. 7.62x54R is much cheaper to buy as 'surplus'. 8x57 is getting kinda thin & always seems to cost more. 8x57 does pass the Wal-Mart availability test though & brass is easier to come by for reloading.
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 12:40:27 PM EDT
Mauser- That is, a Swedish one. 6.5x55mm is one of the most accurate cartridges ever invented. Light recoil and superior penetration, to boot. Yugo Mausers are nice, also.
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 1:32:15 PM EDT
You gotta get a short barreled mossin. Nothing like going to a crowded range a firing it. The short barrels kick out a 1' flame with a very loud bang. It is a definite attention getter. Besides they are only $50.
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 1:42:13 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 2:55:13 PM EDT
The_Beer_Slayer said FOr a plinker get a mosin m44. the can't be beat for cheap fun. 50.00 in good shape, cheap ammo. Not to mention the bayotte is useful for cooking hotdogs in the muzzle flash. I feel ripped off. My M38 carbine (unfortunately bubba-ized) doesn't have a bayonet. How am I supposed to cook hotdogs (& marshmellows) with muzzleflash? The muzzleblast from the short Mosins does act as a secondary weapon much like a flash-bang or flamethrower. From what I remember (it's been too long since the last range session) the Mosin carbine didn't really kick that bad, not much more than my M43 Spanish 98 with surplus ball.
Link Posted: 4/16/2002 11:30:29 PM EDT
Stormbringer, or any other Canadian sources, Where can I get a Ross?!?!? Preferably the 1910 model. Straight-pull, and all told it will explode if you put it together wrong...
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 2:55:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/17/2002 2:57:41 AM EDT by Sixgun357]
If you can get your hands on a spanish FR8 it is a really cool gun. Built on the Muaser action, it has a Bayonet lug, a big evil Flash surpressor, rear peep and front post sights and are chambered in .308 with 19inch barrel. Here is a pick of mine. It looked as if it just came from the factory for $169. [img]www.ar15.com/members/albums/Sixgun357%2F2FR8L%2EJPG[/img]
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 3:25:01 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 4:47:47 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/17/2002 4:49:23 AM EDT by Stormbringer]
Originally Posted By QBit: Stormbringer, or any other Canadian sources, Where can I get a Ross?!?!? Preferably the 1910 model. Straight-pull, and all told it will explode if you put it together wrong...
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There are quite a few around up here. They run about $400 Canadian or so. Here is one. [url]http://www.milarm.com/[/url]
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 6:41:19 AM EDT
Thank for the information guys. I've been looking for a cheap bolt gun, preferably in .308 or .30-06 for a while, and I finally found one: [url]http://www.survival.com.mx/gunrack/gunlist2.html[/url] The one I want is the Indian Ishapore Enfield in .308, for $250! That IS a good deal right?
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 6:55:11 AM EDT
Originally Posted By 89hawk: You gotta get a short barreled mossin. Nothing like going to a crowded range a firing it. The short barrels kick out a 1' flame with a very loud bang. It is a definite attention getter. Besides they are only $50.
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Nah. I already scare them enough. My little coach gun launches 2-foot fireballs, deafens people who might just be happening to adjust their hearing protection, startles people into pulling their triggers accidently, and sends large chunks of cardboard and paper flying after only 5 rounds. It's so impressive it makes the baby jesus cry. the_reject
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 7:01:52 AM EDT
Originally Posted By RiffRandall: I feel ripped off. My M38 carbine (unfortunately bubba-ized) doesn't have a bayonet. How am I supposed to cook hotdogs (& marshmellows) with muzzleflash?
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I'm sure you already know it, but for the sake of posterity in this thread (since it appears others are getting some decent info from it), M38 Mosin Nagant carbines were not originally to have bayonets at all - more as a crew-serve weapon. They are also a bit more desireable as collectors items than the more common, fixed bayonet-stylin', essentially identical M44 carbine. the_reject
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 7:25:46 AM EDT
In on this late and haven't read all the posts, but --- a Swedish Mauser 96 would be good. Just wanted to get that in. Now, I'll go back and read that I've made a redundant statement. [rolleyes]
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 7:46:58 AM EDT
Originally Posted By BusMaster007: In on this late and haven't read all the posts, but --- a Swedish Mauser 96 would be good. Just wanted to get that in. Now, I'll go back and read that I've made a redundant statement. [rolleyes]
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That's okay, every opinion counts... I think it has now migrated from which rifle should I choose to personal experiences with the old battle rifles. the_reject
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 7:50:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/17/2002 7:50:56 AM EDT by Stormbringer]
Yes indeed!! So now your mission if you choose to accept it..... [b] IS TO GO FORTH AND GET SOME OLD MILITARY RIFLES!![/b] Then you can tell everyone about YOUR personal experiences!!! I just love to take my old war horses to the range....side by side with my newer ones......it often sparks some interesting conversations...." Hey mister just what sort of rifle is that?"
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 8:18:29 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Stormbringer: it often sparks some interesting conversations...." Hey mister just what sort of rifle is that?"
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aint it the truth! them: "say, what's that funny-lookin rifle you got there?" me: "model 1898 krag-jorgensen" them: "uh... krag-whut?" me: "krag-jorgenson. US service rifle 1894 thru 1903. spanish american war, phillipine insurrection..." them: "we had a war with spain?" me: "sure, 1899, cuba, phillipines, teddy roosevelt." them: "uh... ok. shoot good?" me:"yup! want to try it?" them: "uh, ok, sure!"
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 12:10:21 PM EDT
the_reject said Re Mosin earsplitters: 'I'm sure you already know it, but for the sake of posterity in this thread (since it appears others are getting some decent info from it), M38 Mosin Nagant carbines were not originally to have bayonets at all - more as a crew-serve weapon. They are also a bit more desireable as collectors items than the more common, fixed bayonet-stylin', essentially identical M44 carbine.' When I first bought the thing at an auction all I knew about them was that Mosin Nagants were the Russian/Soviet equal to the Mauser/Enfield/Springfield. When I started looking into the history of them I nearly became ill. The poor thing had been butchered by some 'Bubba' sometime during her stay in the USA. No handguard, wood cut down to where the rear barrel band should be, nasty runny varnish finish etc. The really sad thing is I think she was either a pre-68 import or a bring back from Korea/Vietnam/Grenada. No import markings that I can find anywhere. People who would butcher such a sweet innocent carbine........ seriously though, since she'd been hacked I tried to minimize the damage by rasping smooth the cut off forearm (Jethro left it square with saw tooth marks showing! UGGH!)& refinishing the wood in a soft satin oil finish. One of these days I'm going to get one that hasn't been molested (preferably a 91-30) but for now she compliments my M95 Nagant revolver ("My name is Riff & I'm addicted to commie guns...") The real kicker is I passed up a straight pull Swiss rifle at the same auction (same $$$$) because while I knew I could get 7.62x54R ammo I had no idea where to find 7.5x55Swiss.....
Link Posted: 4/17/2002 2:16:51 PM EDT
Originally Posted By RiffRandall: ...The poor thing had been butchered by some 'Bubba' sometime during her stay in the USA. No handguard, wood cut down to where the rear barrel band should be, nasty runny varnish finish etc. ...(Jethro left it square with saw tooth marks showing! UGGH The real kicker is I passed up a straight pull Swiss rifle at the same auction (same $$$$) because while I knew I could get 7.62x54R ammo I had no idea where to find 7.5x55Swiss.....
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Ouch... People who do that to decent guns shouldn't be allowd to buy 'em. I can understand the point in sporterizing one that has some REALLY beat up wood on it, but geez! The ammo for the Swiss is the reason why it's not at the top of my list. [:D] It's quite a bit more expensive then el-cheapo new-manufactured 7.62x54R Wolf ammo. the_reject
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