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Posted: 9/14/2010 6:53:39 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/14/2010 6:53:39 AM EDT by Zhukov]
Sorry if this in the wrong place admins please feel free to move it.

Ok so this is a debate I've had many times before and since I value the varied opinions on this board I thought I'd fire up a hypothetical situation and see how everyone would respond.

You find yourself in a situation facing one aggravated but unarmed assailant who is demanding your wallet and car keys. You as a well prepared citizen have your concealed carry firearm...
Do you:

A) Give up your wallet and keys in the hopes of avoiding conflict

B) Draw your weapon with the hopes that it will deter the person

C) Draw and use your weapon


I know this is a very broad scenario and this is never a black and white issue but I am interested to hear your choice and justification. If you would offer up a different response please explain your justification.

Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:28:10 PM EDT
They are armed, someone demanding you give them your belongings is making a physical threat by their body language alone, a threat that they will use that physical force to harm you. No one is ever unarmed, the human body is the first weapon mankind ever had, right before they found a large stick or rock to pick up.

So, tell them loudly to back off and that you are armed, at this point you should be reaching if not already have your hand on your firearm, if they persist or make a move for a better weapon, draw and yell to back off as a final warning.
Anyone who is stupid enough not to run, or thinks your firearm is a toy to scare them off needs a once in a lifetime lesson that its real
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:30:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 5:33:20 PM EDT by Keekleberrys]
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:36:13 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MikefromTX:
Originally Posted By tbraginton:
Sorry if this in the wrong place admins please feel free to move it.

Ok so this is a debate I've had many times before and since I value the varied opinions on this board I thought I'd fire up a hypothetical situation and see how everyone would respond.

You find yourself in a situation facing one aggravated but unarmed assailant who is demanding your wallet and car keys. You as a well prepared citizen have your concealed carry firearm...
Do you:

A) Give up your wallet and keys in the hopes of avoiding conflict

B) Draw your weapon with the hopes that it will deter the person

C) Draw and use your weapon


I know this is a very broad scenario and this is never a black and white issue but I am interested to hear your choice and justification. If you would offer up a different response please explain your justification.




First, I would NOT voluntarily give up my wallet and keys. NOT.

Second, even though he APPEARS to be unarmed, how do you KNOW he is? Did he tell you? Any chance a criminal might lie? In any assault or robbery situation, you must ASSUME the assailant is armed. In any case, your life or wellbeing is threatened or you wouldn't even consider giving up your stuff. (Avoid conflict??? What??? You're kidding, right?)

Third, you never draw your weapon without the intention of using it. You hope you won't have to, but you must be prepared to do so.

Fourth, you are entitled by law in most jurisdictions to use lethal force in the protection of life and property.

SO ... what you do is draw your weapon, aim it at the prick and yell for him to get on the ground right now or you're going to blow his sorry ass to hell. If he obeys, call the cops and hold him until they arrive.

On the other hand, if he makes any move toward you, shoot his sorry ass a number of times. When the police arrive, you tell them he lunged toward you, you thought he had a weapon, and you feared for your life so you shot him to protect yourself. Period.

Case closed.

.
.


Not true, you are not entitled to use deadly force solely for the protection of property in most jurisdictions, Texas is an exception.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:38:54 PM EDT
I would say if hes un armed hold him at gun point and call the police..if he tries to attack you or is reaching for something I believe you have the right to defend yourself if he ignores your orders to stop after all he could still be armed even though he doesnt visibly have a weapon.Thats why its always good to have a cell phone as well.If you draw down on him and he runs from you just let him go and call the police in anyway having to defend yourself or not.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:39:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 4:40:31 PM EDT by FMJ]
And I have a AR15

need to be in different forum
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:39:07 PM EDT
You say "no" and whip out the cell phone, call police. Until my life is actually threatened with a weapon, there is no reason to pull my weapon. Each state has different laws when it comes ti justifiable use of force, but I dont know of any that allow you to pull your weapon because of a verbal demand.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:40:07 PM EDT


He's new... be nice...

I have the feeling this one may get moved....

To the OP: if there was just one, I'd laugh in his face. If he touched me, I'd throw him to the ground and break whichever limb I had a good hold on; though my BJJ is a little rusty... haven't rolled in ~2 years since I got married...
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:40:13 PM EDT
needs more info. If he has a gun to my head and I'm in my car with seat belt on and family with me, would be different from walking down a dirt road alone and unobstructed.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:42:02 PM EDT
Originally Posted By slappomatt:
needs more info. If he has a gun to my head and I'm in my car with seat belt on and family with me, would be different from walking down a dirt road alone and unobstructed.


+1

not enough info

Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:43:26 PM EDT
if someone is demanding money from you, you absolutely can draw your weapon. if the subject attempts to attack you at that point, you can shoot. i'm assuming the person is threatening you for your money and not saying "sir may i hold a dollar?" all states more or less have the same law regarding using deadly force. to protect yourself or a third party from serious injury or death.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:47:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 4:48:31 PM EDT by Guitargod18241]
it Depends on your state laws, i understand it in texas, and beleive it is applicable to most CCW states,

however if I were in that situation,
I would continue to resist, and reach for my weapon "without exposing/brandishing it" and even more forcefully tell him to stop and leave, if he makes a verbal threat, I pull it out and for a final time warn him to stop and leave, at which pointi if he decided to react in a hostile way, shoot.

My CHL instructor told me about a situation very similar

"She was walking to her car late at night after a movie, a man was moving to intercept her at her car in a large hooded jacket with arms in pocket. She notices the mans intended idea to meet her at her car, and she says "You better leave now" to which he replies, "Im gonna get you b***h" she then draws her Colt 1911 and the man is quick to turn and run....... FYI, it was gang initiation night.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:47:11 PM EDT
I have been a lurker for several years hence the low post count... I don't expect to get respect here and I apologize in advance for this being in the wrong place.

As I said I know there are a lot of missing details but you don't want a novel and I don't want to type one. The information given is enough to get the juices flowing and hopefully get some serious discussion regarding the use of deadly force.

I respect the varied experiences held by the many contributors on this forum and I can't think of a better way to tap a more broad audience on such an important topic for all gun owners.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:47:32 PM EDT
Blow a whistle and scream rape
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:48:18 PM EDT
Originally Posted By tbraginton:
Sorry if this in the wrong place admins please feel free to move it.

Ok so this is a debate I've had many times before and since I value the varied opinions on this board I thought I'd fire up a hypothetical situation and see how everyone would respond.

You find yourself in a situation facing one aggravated but unarmed assailant who is demanding your wallet and car keys. You as a well prepared citizen have your concealed carry firearm...
Do you:

A) Give up your wallet and keys in the hopes of avoiding conflict

B) Draw your weapon with the hopes that it will deter the person

C) Draw and use your weapon


I know this is a very broad scenario and this is never a black and white issue but I am interested to hear your choice and justification. If you would offer up a different response please explain your justification.




First, I would NOT voluntarily give up my wallet and keys. NOT.

Second, even though he APPEARS to be unarmed, how do you KNOW he is? Did he tell you? Any chance a criminal might lie? In any assault or robbery situation, you must ASSUME the assailant is armed. In any case, your life or wellbeing is threatened or you wouldn't even consider giving up your stuff. (Avoid conflict??? What??? You're kidding, right?)

Third, you never draw your weapon without the intention of using it. You hope you won't have to, but you must be prepared to do so.

Fourth, you are entitled by law in most jurisdictions to use lethal force in the protection of life and property.

SO ... what you do is draw your weapon, aim it at the prick and yell for him to get on the ground right now or you're going to blow his sorry ass to hell. If he obeys, call the cops and hold him until they arrive.

On the other hand, if he makes any move toward you, shoot his sorry ass a number of times. When the police arrive, you tell them he lunged toward you, you thought he had a weapon, and you feared for your life so you shot him to protect yourself. Period.

Case closed.

.
.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:49:22 PM EDT
Originally Posted By murf214:
Blow a whistle and scream rape


yeah...or this.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:49:24 PM EDT
Exactly once a demand is made for something a car or money thats a crime and you have a right to defend yourself...if you go into a bank and demand money even though you dont have a gun and the teller hands you money or doesnt its still bank robbery.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:56:08 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MikefromTX:
Originally Posted By tbraginton:
Sorry if this in the wrong place admins please feel free to move it.

Ok so this is a debate I've had many times before and since I value the varied opinions on this board I thought I'd fire up a hypothetical situation and see how everyone would respond.

You find yourself in a situation facing one aggravated but unarmed assailant who is demanding your wallet and car keys. You as a well prepared citizen have your concealed carry firearm...
Do you:

A) Give up your wallet and keys in the hopes of avoiding conflict

B) Draw your weapon with the hopes that it will deter the person

C) Draw and use your weapon


I know this is a very broad scenario and this is never a black and white issue but I am interested to hear your choice and justification. If you would offer up a different response please explain your justification.




First, I would NOT voluntarily give up my wallet and keys. NOT.

Second, even though he APPEARS to be unarmed, how do you KNOW he is? Did he tell you? Any chance a criminal might lie? In any assault or robbery situation, you must ASSUME the assailant is armed. In any case, your life or wellbeing is threatened or you wouldn't even consider giving up your stuff. (Avoid conflict??? What??? You're kidding, right?)

Third, you never draw your weapon without the intention of using it. You hope you won't have to, but you must be prepared to do so.

Fourth, you are entitled by law in most jurisdictions to use lethal force in the protection of life and property.

SO ... what you do is draw your weapon, aim it at the prick and yell for him to get on the ground right now or you're going to blow his sorry ass to hell. If he obeys, call the cops and hold him until they arrive.

On the other hand, if he makes any move toward you, shoot his sorry ass a number of times. When the police arrive, you tell them he lunged toward you, you thought he had a weapon, and you feared for your life so you shot him to protect yourself. Period.

Case closed.

.
.


This ^
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 4:59:27 PM EDT
Are there witnesses?
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:04:41 PM EDT
If your assailant is unarmed what reason do you have to escalate the situation by drawing a handgun (I presume you're not walking around with an AR15 under a raincoat)? Given you have the advantage why not just remove yourself from the picture? If the assailant produces a weapon and continues to threaten you then you can react accordingly. Drawing a pistol in hopes of scaring off a bad guy is not a good idea. If you shoot him in the process and he's in fact unarmed you're facing jail time. A weapon should never be unholstered as a threat. Unless you're willing to shoot it can be taken from you and used on you, or others around you. Cautiously backing away from the situation is a far wiser option if it's available to you. Shooting an unarmed man is never a good move. JMHO
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:07:28 PM EDT
While I would choose option three, unless you train on a consistent basis, I would suggest option one. If you aren't proficient, it is unlikely that you be able to effectively draw, and put rounds in your attacker. I have seen many security videos, and worked crime scenes where this has happened. Someone tries to commit a crime against someone, the victim pulls a gun and hits nothing but air. In turn, the perpetrator produces his weapon, and a melee ensues. In several instances, the only person hit was an innocent bystander. Of course, if you are confident in your ability, then, by all means, shoot. Criminals these days are very brazen, and submitting to them doesn't ensure your safety. There have been several cases in my area, in recent years, where a submissive victim was still executed.

I don't think that I could recommend option two. Drawing your weapon in the hopes that it will scare someone seems like it will put you in a more precarious situation. Criminals arm themselves, and sometimes actually know how to use their weapons. I would hate to bluff, have it called, and end up on the losing end.

The key to option one is to be able to explain yourself. In most places, if you feel your life is threatened, that is justification enough. You just have to make sure you have your story straight. "He threatened to kill me and reached into his waistband" is often sufficient to avoid criminal prosecution in all but the strictest states. Obviously, you will be in a hairy situation if you just say that the guy demanded your wallet, while making not indications of violence.

Also, shoot to kill. People are very litigious. You are a lot less likely to be successfully sued if the other guy isn't around to tell his side. Obviously, this all goes out the window if he has sympathetic witnesses, or there is video with audio.

Like a previous post stated, there is no way to really know if someone is armed, or not. I would rather go to court than the morgue.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:11:40 PM EDT
Ok we are starting to get the multiple angles I was hoping for...

I have given this a lot of thought over the years and have thankfully never been put in a situation where I was forced to make this call.

I have always been told that your weapon should only ever be unholstered if you have the intention to use it but I can see how it would be a very effective for deterring your adversary. This is precisely the question at hand! I know there are more guys with an opinion on this so lets hear it.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:13:26 PM EDT
If I don't see a weapon....Kick him in the nuts and spit in his face.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 5:17:17 PM EDT
Start yelling as loud as you can Please dont hurt me , just take my money , Please dont hurt me you can have my money then draw your weapon and watch him run .
Works great if someone is trying to pick a fight with you also.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 6:12:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 6:15:49 PM EDT by rick458]
tbraginton
If you are carrying a CCW your DUTY is to remain in possesion of that weapon, at all cost
Pull and guard, if he advances Fire. DO NOT let your weapon be removed from you.
(and if he is taking your stuff he will certainly take your weapon).
But of course I live in Texas and you can prevent Theft with lethal force as well,
but that is secondary if you are being robbed and carrying.

(edited because I had the wrong OP name)
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 6:18:00 PM EDT
He's committing a forcible felony against me and I genuinely believe he will cause me great bodily harm (and probably has a weapon on him). If he doesn't go away when I tell him to, he's dead.

I love Florida.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 6:28:31 PM EDT
Second, even though he APPEARS to be unarmed, how do you KNOW he is? Did he tell you? Any chance a criminal might lie? In any assault or robbery situation, you must ASSUME the assailant is armed


This....better to be tried by 12 than carried out by 6......light 'em up!!!
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 6:53:48 PM EDT
This must be drilled into your head before you ever carry a weapon. If it comes out of the holster you MUST be prepared to use it!

"you never draw your weapon without the intention of using it. You hope you won't have to, but you must be prepared to do so."

Link Posted: 9/13/2010 8:20:01 PM EDT
If only one party has a gun in a fight it is still a gun fight.... the other side is just at a major disadvantage

Real life is not about playing fair. It's about hard work, integrety and looking out for you and yours.

Assuming you can beat someone in hand to hand combat when you have a wepon is just stupid. Are you going to call timeout when you find out the attacker is highly skilled so you can drawl you wepon before he chokes you to death or beats your brains out aginst the sidewalk? Real life just doesn't work that way.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 9:10:29 PM EDT
Tiger

I like what you say there so in this situation what would you suggest? I am in agreement that if you draw your weapon you should be prepared to use it so does this situation warrant a draw down?
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 9:36:10 PM EDT
Originally Posted By rcurrier44:
If only one party has a gun in a fight it is still a gun fight.... the other side is just at a major disadvantage

Real life is not about playing fair. It's about hard work, integrety and looking out for you and yours.
...


Whats that quote?

Something like, "If you ever find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck"


Link Posted: 9/13/2010 10:11:29 PM EDT
mustangduckk:

11th rule of a gunfight: "Always cheat, always win. The only unfair fight is the one you lose."
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 10:44:29 PM EDT
KAPOW! .....Dead bad guy...

Get into car and drive home........
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 11:16:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/13/2010 11:20:46 PM EDT by Forgetfull]
Ya this post belongs here, as a mod to move it if you'd like-
http://www.ar15.com/forums/forum.html?b=5&f=10

There are a lot of other forums on this site.

Basically if he just asks for my money I'm going to back up and say no and put my left hand in my pocket. If he comes closer without being overly threatening I'm going to spray him and prepare to backpedal fast. If he gets real aggressive or pulls a weapon I'm going to draw and shoot. If his attitude changes in the second it takes to get my gun out I'll not shoot.

Link Posted: 9/13/2010 11:51:23 PM EDT
Unarmed assailants don't have weapons in their hands or pockets. I don't shoot unarmed people.


My move depends on how far away he is.
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 11:51:28 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/13/2010 11:58:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Unicorn:
Originally Posted By tbraginton:
Sorry if this in the wrong place admins please feel free to move it.

Ok so this is a debate I've had many times before and since I value the varied opinions on this board I thought I'd fire up a hypothetical situation and see how everyone would respond.

You find yourself in a situation facing one aggravated but unarmed assailant who is demanding your wallet and car keys. You as a well prepared citizen have your concealed carry firearm...
Do you:

A) Give up your wallet and keys in the hopes of avoiding conflict

B) Draw your weapon with the hopes that it will deter the person

C) Draw and use your weapon


I know this is a very broad scenario and this is never a black and white issue but I am interested to hear your choice and justification. If you would offer up a different response please explain your justification.




D: Taser gets pulled and used. Or,
E: OC gets pulled and used.

Not every situation calls for either doing nothing or lethal force. But too many gun owners have just those two options available.


Except this is a discussion about whether or not to use deadly force if that is your only option besides giving up.
Link Posted: 9/14/2010 1:26:35 AM EDT
in oklahoma the only time you may use your cocealed weapon is if you are in imminent danger of losing your life, or a spouse,parents,son or daughter, employee, or employer. or if your home is invaded. and then only if you the use of a gun could stop the harm or injury.(this from the ccw test). doesn't say anything about losing your wallet. obviously each incident is a judgemnt call.
if you can avoid the confrontation (run) you must.
having said that, my ccw instructor told us in texas you may use your ccw to stop the commission of a felony.
malicious mischief, after dark, is a felony.
so...if you saw paco tagging the 7-11 at midnight, its lights out.
Link Posted: 9/14/2010 3:27:31 AM EDT
Wow alot of different views.....Captains 1911 statement about Texas was cool...they are a Progressive state.....
The situation described is vague yes but it is complete also....when things happen...that is all you will remember...
I say pull the gun......shoot him...then lay the "throw away" knife you have in your other pocket....in his hand...."there dead bad guy".......self defense.....Oh wait...that is only if they break into the house in my state......
But seriously....how can you really define this, give me your wallet and keys...."or what"....depending on who you are and how big or doped up they are...it really is hard to answer.....I would say....excuse me, and why would I want to do that....at which point my hand is on my gun....the next second or two would decide the out come....if he reaches....he is a dead man....if he lunges toward me...with my free hand....push him back or at least keep distance while I draw and put it to his head and ask...."do you believe in god.......because you are about to meet him".....then instruct him to the ground and call the cops....so on and so forth......but you would probably have to shoot him...
TO HELL WITH CRIMINALS HAVE RIGHTS.....Just shoot him......
My favorite quote...involving something like this......

"Fight back! Whenever you are offered violence, fight back! The aggressor does not fear the law, so he must be taught to fear you. Whatever the risk, and at whatever the cost, fight back!"
- Col. Jeff Cooper


SASS
Link Posted: 9/14/2010 4:38:02 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/14/2010 4:57:46 AM EDT by bmyk]
Originally Posted By rychencop:
Originally Posted By murf214:
Blow a whistle and scream rape


yeah...or this.


Or yell FIRE while heading for the SD forum!!!

Seriously....
I would say if you cannot retreat or get away and there is a disparity in force (he is bigger or better armed) then draw and fire. If he is striking or grabbing distance, too late to draw....I guess we will how is the better striker , go for the KO I do not want to roll around with some dirt bag and have to get a tetanus shot . I would prefer to make some room and not engage this person, if he continues to advance AND threaten despite my repeated warnings.....well he is gonna need a new shirt.

I WILL always opt for the least violent (trouble for me, costly) solution. If some thugabees are running from different angles, then yeah going right for the gun. Just some crack head demanding money? I am gonna move off and call the cops, let them help him sort out his life. I WILL save my own life, the lives of my family and other innocents, HOWEVER when it is all said and done it is probably (according to the local lawyer who helps teach NRA First Steps course here..) going to cost 10-40 thousand dollars for the ensuing civil suit....somebody is going to try and cash in. So is shooting this asshole worth my daughters college fund, or can I solve this some other way?

Bottom line, get some valid training and legal advice germane to YOUR AOR.

M2C, YMMV, LRR.....
Link Posted: 9/14/2010 5:11:44 AM EDT
Originally Posted By MikefromTX:
Originally Posted By tbraginton:
Sorry if this in the wrong place admins please feel free to move it.

Ok so this is a debate I've had many times before and since I value the varied opinions on this board I thought I'd fire up a hypothetical situation and see how everyone would respond.

You find yourself in a situation facing one aggravated but unarmed assailant who is demanding your wallet and car keys. You as a well prepared citizen have your concealed carry firearm...
Do you:

A) Give up your wallet and keys in the hopes of avoiding conflict

B) Draw your weapon with the hopes that it will deter the person

C) Draw and use your weapon




I know this is a very broad scenario and this is never a black and white issue but I am interested to hear your choice and justification. If you would offer up a different response please explain your justification.




First, I would NOT voluntarily give up my wallet and keys. NOT.

Second, even though he APPEARS to be unarmed, how do you KNOW he is? Did he tell you? Any chance a criminal might lie? In any assault or robbery situation, you must ASSUME the assailant is armed. In any case, your life or wellbeing is threatened or you wouldn't even consider giving up your stuff. (Avoid conflict??? What??? You're kidding, right?)

Third, you never draw your weapon without the intention of using it. You hope you won't have to, but you must be prepared to do so.

Fourth, you are entitled by law in most jurisdictions to use lethal force in the protection of life and property.

SO ... what you do is draw your weapon, aim it at the prick and yell for him to get on the ground right now or you're going to blow his sorry ass to hell. If he obeys, call the cops and hold him until they arrive.

On the other hand, if he makes any move toward you, shoot his sorry ass a number of times. When the police arrive, you tell them he lunged toward you, you thought he had a weapon, and you feared for your life so you shot him to protect yourself. Period.

Case closed.

.
.



Amen

Link Posted: 9/14/2010 5:36:09 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/14/2010 5:37:48 AM EDT by SuzookKING]
Originally Posted By hotdog250j:
in oklahoma the only time you may use your cocealed weapon is if you are in imminent danger of losing your life, or a spouse,parents,son or daughter, employee, or employer. or if your home is invaded. and then only if you the use of a gun could stop the harm or injury.(this from the ccw test). doesn't say anything about losing your wallet. obviously each incident is a judgemnt call.
if you can avoid the confrontation (run) you must.
having said that, my ccw instructor told us in texas you may use your ccw to stop the commission of a felony.
malicious mischief, after dark, is a felony.
so...if you saw paco tagging the 7-11 at midnight, its lights out.


Oklahoma State Statutes

§22 31. Who may resist.
Lawful resistance to the commission of a public offense may be made:
1. By the party about to be injured.
2. By other parties.
R.L.1910, § 5556.

§22 32. Resistance by party to be injured.
Resistance sufficient to prevent the offense may be made by the party about to be injured:
1. To prevent an offense against his person or his family, or some member thereof.
2. To prevent an illegal attempt, by force, to take or injure property in his lawful possession.
R.L.1910, § 5557.

Where does it limit what level of resistance can be used?
It doesn't.
Link Posted: 9/14/2010 5:59:13 AM EDT
Op, to answer you question what would I do? I need more information.
In my line of work(asset protection) I'm taught to try to remain calm but be firm in my stance. I let people know that they are not going to win. Body language has a lot to do with it. I have learned to read peoples eyes and body language. You can tell if someone is going to be aggressive. If that's the case then my voice gets firmer and then I make a decision on whether to be the aggressor and end the situation(which means we go to the ground and they submit to being put in handcuffs) or try to deesscolate the situation.
On the street is a different story. I am armed when not at work. If you attack me with what I take as a deadly threat, thanks to the good state of Texas there is a really good chance that you will be met with multiple 125 gr Gold dots.
Now if there is no deadly threat I will let the person know in a firm voice that this is not what they want to do. I'm not saying that I'm a bad ass by all means. I have had my ass handed to me a few times. I deal with people trying to fight me or get away from me everyday at work. You get really good at reading people. My daily experiences, many hours with instructors, and many hours training on a mat have kept me alive and safe from serious injury. I say a prayer every morning asking to be kept safe and that I don't have to hurt someone else.
Link Posted: 9/14/2010 6:04:02 AM EDT
I'd draw my weapon and tell him to get his face in the dirt. If he runs I let him go. If he complies I hold him for the police. If he attacks I fire. If he is threatening me, whether or not he is armed has no bearing on it. You don't need a weapon to be a threat and if he brings a knife or no weapon at all to a gun fight, well that is his fault.
Link Posted: 9/14/2010 7:00:55 AM EDT
The moment one of his hands isn't visible, he's no longer to be considered unarmed.

If he presents himself as a threat within 21 feet, I'm clearing leather. I don't want to have to be drawing when he surprises me with a weapon.

If one of my kids is with me in this scenario, the likelihood of needing a defense attorney goes up big time.
Link Posted: 9/14/2010 7:19:05 AM EDT
Originally Posted By tbraginton:


You find yourself in a situation facing one aggravated but unarmed assailant who is demanding your wallet and car keys.



It's going to depend on a lot of factors. If all he did was make demands I would tell him "no", maybe not-so-politely, but then again I might even laugh at the idea.

If he made a threatening move or even verbally indicated he intended to harm me I would do what's necessary to stop the threat, including shooting him if I believe that's what it takes. Whether he is armed with a weapon is irrelevant. Hell, he might be some kind of martial arts wizard capable of taking my head off using only his fingernail for all I know.

Link Posted: 9/14/2010 7:36:00 AM EDT
Mozambique Drill
Link Posted: 9/14/2010 7:43:17 AM EDT
I would do whatever was needed to stop the threat

Drawing my firearm might stop the threat.

2 in the chest and 1 in the head would stop the threat.
Link Posted: 9/14/2010 9:57:06 AM EDT
C) Draw and use your weapon
Link Posted: 9/14/2010 2:07:37 PM EDT
First say NO! and create distance. Make noise so others will pay attention.....

At least if you are moving away from the assailant and he or she comes at you, you will have more justification after you do a double tap on him or her.

Attempt to de-escalate the situation.

Deadly force should be your last resort.


Your first thought should always be how to avoid the situation to begin with. More so if you are CCW at the time.
Link Posted: 9/14/2010 2:22:26 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Captains1911:
Originally Posted By MikefromTX:
Originally Posted By tbraginton:
Sorry if this in the wrong place admins please feel free to move it.

Ok so this is a debate I've had many times before and since I value the varied opinions on this board I thought I'd fire up a hypothetical situation and see how everyone would respond.

You find yourself in a situation facing one aggravated but unarmed assailant who is demanding your wallet and car keys. You as a well prepared citizen have your concealed carry firearm...
Do you:

A) Give up your wallet and keys in the hopes of avoiding conflict

B) Draw your weapon with the hopes that it will deter the person

C) Draw and use your weapon


I know this is a very broad scenario and this is never a black and white issue but I am interested to hear your choice and justification. If you would offer up a different response please explain your justification.




First, I would NOT voluntarily give up my wallet and keys. NOT.

Second, even though he APPEARS to be unarmed, how do you KNOW he is? Did he tell you? Any chance a criminal might lie? In any assault or robbery situation, you must ASSUME the assailant is armed. In any case, your life or wellbeing is threatened or you wouldn't even consider giving up your stuff. (Avoid conflict??? What??? You're kidding, right?)

Third, you never draw your weapon without the intention of using it. You hope you won't have to, but you must be prepared to do so.

Fourth, you are entitled by law in most jurisdictions to use lethal force in the protection of life and property.

SO ... what you do is draw your weapon, aim it at the prick and yell for him to get on the ground right now or you're going to blow his sorry ass to hell. If he obeys, call the cops and hold him until they arrive.

On the other hand, if he makes any move toward you, shoot his sorry ass a number of times. When the police arrive, you tell them he lunged toward you, you thought he had a weapon, and you feared for your life so you shot him to protect yourself. Period.

Case closed.

.
.


Not true, you are not entitled to use deadly force solely for the protection of property in most jurisdictions, Texas is an exception.


KS would be an exception then too.
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