New body armor for $199. - Page 2

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - New body armor for $199. (Page 2 of 2)

Posted: 9/6/2010 7:18:01 PM EDT

[#1]

I got a level II new for about $ 100 a year ago.

I'd rather have a IIIA but the limited benefits of the next level, and the fact that I don't wear one regularly don't make it worth buying a better one.

Posted: 9/6/2010 7:27:43 PM EDT

[#2]

Depending on if its a NIJ 05 or NIJ 06. The 06 level II vest has better ballistics then the NIJ 05 level IIIA vest. Just had a shoot with Point Blank where they brought out their level II and I was amazed at the stopping power. But they are more than double that price lol

Posted: 9/6/2010 7:34:08 PM EDT

[#3]

I sure am glad I know where to buy dragon skin so I don't have to fool around with discount body armor.

Posted: 9/6/2010 7:37:51 PM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:

do they have it in XXXXL?

Ya but it's 500 bucks extra.

Posted: 9/6/2010 7:40:23 PM EDT

[#5]

I have a IIIA and IIA.

Posted: 9/6/2010 7:44:20 PM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
I sure am glad I know where to buy dragon skin so I don't have to fool around with discount body armor.

eBay?

Posted: 9/6/2010 7:46:29 PM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Level II?

I think I'd prefer IIIA.

I wore a level II for 10 years.

How much more uncomfortable is IIIA to wear?

It sucks.

Posted: 9/6/2010 7:49:01 PM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:

Quoted:
do they have it in XXXXL?

Ya but it's 500 bucks extra.

Point Blank makes a IIIA bomb/frag blanket for the fatties.

http://www.pointblankarmor.com/MILprod_blankets.html

Armored muumuu.

Posted: 9/6/2010 7:59:39 PM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:
If there is one thing to not go cheap on, it's body armor.

How many level II vests in actual shootings have been penetrated using handguns?

Posted: 9/6/2010 8:07:25 PM EDT

[#10]

Hey Kpel,

When did you leave the PI?

It is possible to export body armor for personal use. I think all it takes is a form you download from state. Try going to the their website and poking around a bit. The local embassy or consulate is always a last resort. I have only been to one US embassy, and if I am lucky never again.

Posted: 9/6/2010 9:03:14 PM EDT

[#11]

Has anyone bought anything from ombexpress before? I googled their name and it came up with something from ripoffreport.com

Posted: 9/6/2010 10:31:10 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Level II?

I think I'd prefer IIIA.

I wore a level II for 10 years.

I wore a T-Shirt for the last 10 years.. Since I didn't get shot in it, I can't speak for how well it stopped bullets.

Posted: 9/6/2010 11:18:13 PM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:

Has anyone bought anything from ombexpress before? I googled their name and it came up with something from ripoffreport.com

Bought tons of Glock stuff from them, good to go

Posted: 9/6/2010 11:42:49 PM EDT

[#14]

Is there any way to attach a plate carrier onto the back? I'm worried about taking hits from a .338 lapua...

Posted: 9/7/2010 12:21:37 AM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:

Quoted:

I think you're thinking WOVEN vs. LAMINATED.

IIRC,Twaron is a woven aramid and Gold-Flex is a laminated aramid.

You're probably right. I haven't paid much attention to body armor since the 2nd Chance debacle some years ago. I friggin' hate all the industry names, too...just clouds the issue.

What was the 2nd chance debacle?

Posted: 9/7/2010 12:27:12 AM EDT

[#16]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Level II?

I think I'd prefer IIIA.

I wore a level II for 10 years.

Do you wear armor every day?

Posted: 9/7/2010 2:41:37 AM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:

Quoted:
I think you're thinking WOVEN vs. LAMINATED.

IIRC,Twaron is a woven aramid and Gold-Flex is a laminated aramid.

You're probably right. I haven't paid much attention to body armor since the 2nd Chance debacle some years ago. I friggin' hate all the industry names, too...just clouds the issue.

What was the 2nd chance debacle?

People wanted their 'second chance', they didnt get it. Capiche?

Posted: 9/7/2010 2:58:58 AM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:

Quoted:

do you have to be leo to buy from this store

No but they fuck their pricing up quite a bit on specials, won't honor advertised pricing and cancel orders with no notification.

I know the guy that owns this company - I used to work in the cop shop biz from the late 1960's - late 1970's. The guy became a fellow employee at a place in 1975, or so. He worked his way up the food chain to company ownership by being totally arrogant and sociopathic. He even ran for Congress once and made his employees go door to door delivery his handbills in their spare time - or else.

Who cares about your fucking $200 order when there's $20 million more where that came from?

Posted: 9/7/2010 3:29:03 AM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:
What was the 2nd chance debacle?

Google "Second Chance" and "Zylon".

Short version:

Zylon was some new wunder-polymer that was lighter and more flexible than Kevlar...meaning it made for more comfortable vests. Unfortunately it was also nowhere near as durable. When exposed to heat...like body heat...the polymers rapidly broke down and the vest lost its protective ability. It would melt when involved in contact shots from firearms...and a significant percentage of gunshot wounds to police officers are delivered at contact distance.

Some people at SC knew all of this...but tried to hide it and continued selling the body armor.

Eventually test data came out showing that Zylon was crap and everybody stopped using it. The NIJ actually de-certified the second chance products made with Zylon. I think SC is still in litigation over the zylon thing.

Posted: 9/7/2010 3:38:14 AM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:

Quoted:
I think you're thinking WOVEN vs. LAMINATED.

IIRC,Twaron is a woven aramid and Gold-Flex is a laminated aramid.

You're probably right. I haven't paid much attention to body armor since the 2nd Chance debacle some years ago. I friggin' hate all the industry names, too...just clouds the issue.

What was the 2nd chance debacle?

Second Chance used a lightweight polymer replacement for Kevlar called Zylon in a popular series of police/civilian vests. Well, oops, it turns out that Zylon degrades rapidly when wet, like from body sweat. A couple of police officers were killed or wounded by penetrations of vests that shouldn't have happened. Supposedly Second Chance asked the Japanese manufacturer of Zylon WTF, the manufacturer swore that Zylon tested fine, so Second Chance didn't immediately recall the vests. The DOJ was unamused, got involved and ran a test, 100% of in-warranty test vests failed, most with penetrations. Second Chance issued a massive recall, got overrun with lawsuits, and was sold to new owners as soon as possible.

Posted: 9/7/2010 7:59:54 AM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Level II?

I think I'd prefer IIIA.

I wore a level II for 10 years.

I wore a T-Shirt for the last 10 years.. Since I didn't get shot in it, I can't speak for how well it stopped bullets.

Didn't it get a bit gamey wearing the same shirt for 10 years? maybe that's why the perps stayed away.

Posted: 9/7/2010 8:44:09 AM EDT

[#22]

Anyone ever deal with BULLETPROOFME.COM before?

Posted: 9/7/2010 9:21:17 AM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
Has anyone bought anything from ombexpress before? I googled their name and it came up with something from ripoffreport.com

Back when they sold ammo to non-LE I bought a case of Winchester Ranger 9mm +P from them. Everything came as specified and quickly.

They recently changed their policy so I don't think they will sell me ammo any more.

Posted: 9/7/2010 1:36:04 PM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:
Is there any way to attach a plate carrier onto the back? I'm worried about taking hits from a .338 lapua...

Posted: 9/7/2010 1:42:58 PM EDT

[#25]

it says 400 :(

Posted: 9/7/2010 1:50:25 PM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:
do they have it in XXXXL?

I wouldn't bother at that size. You'd be slow enough to get an easy headshot on

Posted: 9/7/2010 1:56:18 PM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:

Quoted:
do they have it in XXXXL?

Ya but it's 500 bucks extra.

kevlar blanket..

Posted: 9/7/2010 2:01:31 PM EDT

[#28]

i sold a ballistic blanket once that had no NSN number over seas.

Quoted:

Quoted:
I had to use Exploder, but it's there. NICE price. I'd rather have Level II than nothing.

Unfortunately, though I have need of it, I can't have it because of effing ITAR, one of the most repulsive pieces of crap to come down the pike.

Hell, I can't even get a DILLO here!

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

Sorry for the hijack, but why no dillo?

ITAR regulations. Even common, benevolent items are considered "armaments" such as t-shirts, belts, boots, shoelaces, etc., if they come from a firm that manufactures anything military-related.

Lithium batteries, flashlights, camouflage clothing, etc., are all forbidden for export by ITAR signatories.

China, believe it or not, is NOT a signatory, therefore all the shameless Chinese copies of anything and everything military-related throughout Asia.

It's nuts, and it's cutting us out of the world economy.

We follow the rules, and put people in jail for innocuous things, but others fill the void.

Body armor is purely defensive item, but is still considered an "armament".

Dillos are manufactured by a firm that makes firearms parts and weapons, therefore the regulatory and permit-filing requirements are rather onerous.

Why get arrested if you send someone a 1913 rail keychain? Better to not do business overseas at all.

I'm serious about not being able to get a t-shirt, hat, belt, boots, batteries, or what not over here, unless they're Chinese copies. And there are PLENTY of those.

Body armor would make State apoplectic.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

I just recently wrote an article in an industry newsletter regarding ITAR regulations and processes. I have been exporting military and non military aerospace products for more than a decade and I assure you this information is incorrect. Long story short, check the USML for the items you think are controlled and I guarantee you will not find the Larue dillo there. Have you called Larue and just ordered a dillo, or are you assuming things?

Posted: 9/7/2010 2:04:29 PM EDT

[#29]

Does armor "go bad"? That is, is 20 year old armor going to work as originally designed, or does it degrade some how?

ETA - Let's say it lives in a pizza box under the bed.

Posted: 9/7/2010 2:07:16 PM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:
Does armor "go bad"? That is, is 20 year old armor going to work as originally designed, or does it degrade some how?

depends on how heavy the use is, and how well you take care of it...

soft armor is fabric, so keeping it clean, dry, etc will definitely extend the life of the armor.. there will be some degradation though..

Posted: 9/7/2010 2:30:56 PM EDT

[#31]

Quoted:
Does armor "go bad"? That is, is 20 year old armor going to work as originally designed, or does it degrade some how?

ETA - Let's say it lives in a pizza box under the bed.

Temperature and moisture will kill it quicker than anything else. If it's kept relatively cool and dry, the good kevlar stuff generally works well past the warranty period on the vest.

20 years past the warranty date is pushing it. IIRC most of the good kevlar stuff is certified for 5 years...so you're talking 4 times the intended service life.

Posted: 9/7/2010 2:33:02 PM EDT

[#32]

level II?

meh.

The kind of situation that would warrant me pulling out the body armor, I'd want at least a IIIA.

Posted: 9/7/2010 3:05:26 PM EDT

[#33]

Quoted:

Quoted:

Level II?

I think I'd prefer IIIA.

I wore a level II for 10 years.

Do you wear armor every day?

Three to four days a week.

Posted: 9/7/2010 3:08:25 PM EDT

[#34]

Tough crowd.

I still haven't heard of a handgun round penetrating a level II.

Posted: 9/7/2010 3:43:19 PM EDT

[#35]

Quoted:

Quoted:

what level is standard issue for most leo

what level is required to stop a rifle bullet

You'll need to add plates to IIIA or get level III/ IV to stop most rifle.

http://i51.tinypic.com/33ufuxl.jpg

Wow, I want the 30-06 that I can load a 166 GRAM bullet into. I can't imagine the recoil from that sumbitch traveling at 2900fps!

Posted: 9/7/2010 4:15:11 PM EDT

[#36]

Quoted:
Tough crowd.

I still haven't heard of a handgun round penetrating a level II.

You forget the average Arfcommer is expecting to encounter undead armies wielding belt-fed .50 cals.

Posted: 9/7/2010 4:33:41 PM EDT

[#37]

Quoted:

Quoted:
what level is standard issue for most leo

what level is required to stop a rifle bullet

You'll need to add plates to IIIA or get level III/ IV to stop most rifle.

http://i51.tinypic.com/33ufuxl.jpg

Wow, I want the 30-06 that I can load a 166 GRAM bullet into. I can't imagine the recoil from that sumbitch traveling at 2900fps!

lol, whoever did that chart mistook "gr" for "g" it looks like.

Posted: 9/7/2010 5:42:32 PM EDT

[#38]

Quoted:

Quoted:
what level is standard issue for most leo

what level is required to stop a rifle bullet

You'll need to add plates to IIIA or get level III/ IV to stop most rifle.

http://i51.tinypic.com/33ufuxl.jpg

Wow, I want the 30-06 that I can load a 166 GRAM bullet into. I can't imagine the recoil from that sumbitch traveling at 2900fps!

That is a pretty funny typo - that would be a 2561 grain boolit.

Posted: 9/7/2010 9:13:50 PM EDT

[#39]

Quoted:
i sold a ballistic blanket once that had no NSN number over seas.

Quoted:

Quoted:
I had to use Exploder, but it's there. NICE price. I'd rather have Level II than nothing.

Unfortunately, though I have need of it, I can't have it because of effing ITAR, one of the most repulsive pieces of crap to come down the pike.

Hell, I can't even get a DILLO here!

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

Sorry for the hijack, but why no dillo?

ITAR regulations. Even common, benevolent items are considered "armaments" such as t-shirts, belts, boots, shoelaces, etc., if they come from a firm that manufactures anything military-related.

Lithium batteries, flashlights, camouflage clothing, etc., are all forbidden for export by ITAR signatories.

China, believe it or not, is NOT a signatory, therefore all the shameless Chinese copies of anything and everything military-related throughout Asia.

It's nuts, and it's cutting us out of the world economy.

We follow the rules, and put people in jail for innocuous things, but others fill the void.

Body armor is purely defensive item, but is still considered an "armament".

Dillos are manufactured by a firm that makes firearms parts and weapons, therefore the regulatory and permit-filing requirements are rather onerous.

Why get arrested if you send someone a 1913 rail keychain? Better to not do business overseas at all.

I'm serious about not being able to get a t-shirt, hat, belt, boots, batteries, or what not over here, unless they're Chinese copies. And there are PLENTY of those.

Body armor would make State apoplectic.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

I just recently wrote an article in an industry newsletter regarding ITAR regulations and processes. I have been exporting military and non military aerospace products for more than a decade and I assure you this information is incorrect. Long story short, check the USML for the items you think are controlled and I guarantee you will not find the Larue dillo there. Have you called Larue and just ordered a dillo, or are you assuming things?

I had written Mark PMs and emails over the past few years and did not receive a reply. I tried to join the mailing list, but there is no way to enter Cambodia, Thailand, or the Philippines as places of residence, etc.

I like the quality of his stuff that I have handled, his attitude, and the way he takes care of his customers, but can't be a customer myself for some reason.

I'm talking from personal experience, as I -am- overseas, and have had a lot of difficulty getting firms to ship gear due to the paperwork or being cautious about possible ITAR violations.

The way I should have phrased it is that ITAR compliance is such a pain in the ass that no one wants to deal with it.

My personal experience is what I'm going on, not having consulted industry experts or being one myself.

I just know I have tried to get belts, shoelaces, T-shirts, utilities, boots, knives, etc., and been told that they could not be shipped due to ITAR.

I'm over here, not back home, and it's a PITA no matter how you slice it. I =CAN= go and get Chinese counterfeit crap, but am now being advised by State that purchase of counterfeit goods while overseas can still be prosecuted in the same manner as child pornography.

From the State Department country information sheet for Cambodia:

There are also some things that might be legal in the country you visit, but illegal in the United States, and you can be prosecuted under U.S. law, for example, if you buy pirated goods or engage in child pornography.

Why deal with the crap? Just tell the poor schmuck 12 time zones away to STFU and deal with it, I guess.

My apologies if I was not proficient enough with the regulations to correct the vendors who chose not to deal with that BS.

Excuse my ignorance, but WTF is a USML?

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

Posted: 9/7/2010 9:14:08 PM EDT

[#40]

Double Double Tap Tap.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

Posted: 9/7/2010 10:04:52 PM EDT

[#41]

Quoted:
Tough crowd.

I still haven't heard of a handgun round penetrating a level II.

Doubt you will. The big reason IIIA has to be thicker than II is to pass the BS 44mm BFD test.

Posted: 9/8/2010 9:31:42 AM EDT

[#42]

Quoted:

Quoted:
i sold a ballistic blanket once that had no NSN number over seas.

Quoted:

Quoted:
I had to use Exploder, but it's there. NICE price. I'd rather have Level II than nothing.

Unfortunately, though I have need of it, I can't have it because of effing ITAR, one of the most repulsive pieces of crap to come down the pike.

Hell, I can't even get a DILLO here!

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

Sorry for the hijack, but why no dillo?

ITAR regulations. Even common, benevolent items are considered "armaments" such as t-shirts, belts, boots, shoelaces, etc., if they come from a firm that manufactures anything military-related.

Lithium batteries, flashlights, camouflage clothing, etc., are all forbidden for export by ITAR signatories.

China, believe it or not, is NOT a signatory, therefore all the shameless Chinese copies of anything and everything military-related throughout Asia.

It's nuts, and it's cutting us out of the world economy.

We follow the rules, and put people in jail for innocuous things, but others fill the void.

Body armor is purely defensive item, but is still considered an "armament".

Dillos are manufactured by a firm that makes firearms parts and weapons, therefore the regulatory and permit-filing requirements are rather onerous.

Why get arrested if you send someone a 1913 rail keychain? Better to not do business overseas at all.

I'm serious about not being able to get a t-shirt, hat, belt, boots, batteries, or what not over here, unless they're Chinese copies. And there are PLENTY of those.

Body armor would make State apoplectic.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

I just recently wrote an article in an industry newsletter regarding ITAR regulations and processes. I have been exporting military and non military aerospace products for more than a decade and I assure you this information is incorrect. Long story short, check the USML for the items you think are controlled and I guarantee you will not find the Larue dillo there. Have you called Larue and just ordered a dillo, or are you assuming things?

I had written Mark PMs and emails over the past few years and did not receive a reply. I tried to join the mailing list, but there is no way to enter Cambodia, Thailand, or the Philippines as places of residence, etc.

I like the quality of his stuff that I have handled, his attitude, and the way he takes care of his customers, but can't be a customer myself for some reason.

I'm talking from personal experience, as I -am- overseas, and have had a lot of difficulty getting firms to ship gear due to the paperwork or being cautious about possible ITAR violations.

The way I should have phrased it is that ITAR compliance is such a pain in the ass that no one wants to deal with it.

My personal experience is what I'm going on, not having consulted industry experts or being one myself.

I just know I have tried to get belts, shoelaces, T-shirts, utilities, boots, knives, etc., and been told that they could not be shipped due to ITAR.

I'm over here, not back home, and it's a PITA no matter how you slice it. I =CAN= go and get Chinese counterfeit crap, but am now being advised by State that purchase of counterfeit goods while overseas can still be prosecuted in the same manner as child pornography.

From the State Department country information sheet for Cambodia:

There are also some things that might be legal in the country you visit, but illegal in the United States, and you can be prosecuted under U.S. law, for example, if you buy pirated goods or engage in child pornography.

Why deal with the crap? Just tell the poor schmuck 12 time zones away to STFU and deal with it, I guess.

My apologies if I was not proficient enough with the regulations to correct the vendors who chose not to deal with that BS.

Excuse my ignorance, but WTF is a USML?

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

Not being able to import shoelaces, t-shirts and boots into your country is not ITAR related. A company may choose not to sell their products overseas, but it usually has nothing to do with State Dept export controls. Now, I am not surprised that Larue for instance would not sell ANY products outside of the US because they do manufacturer ITAR controlled items and the possibility of a mistake is higher than just simply setting a company policy of no foreign sales. This is a question better suited for them.

Generally, you would not even be able to easily find ANY export control items on the consumer level. Night-vision and Ebay, not-withstanding. The USML list is the top categories of ITAR controlled items/technology that may not be exported to certain foreign entities without the proper DSP-5 authorization. This process is expensive, tedious and a general pain in the ass.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Munitions_List

Posted: 9/8/2010 10:43:39 AM EDT

[#43]

Quoted:

Quoted:

what level is standard issue for most leo

what level is required to stop a rifle bullet

You'll need to add plates to IIIA or get level III/ IV to stop most rifle.

http://i51.tinypic.com/33ufuxl.jpg

Wow, I want the 30-06 that I can load a 166 GRAM bullet into. I can't imagine the recoil from that sumbitch traveling at 2900fps!

That is a pretty funny typo - that would be a 2561 grain boolit.

http://i51.tinypic.com/33ufuxl.jpg

47822 ft-lbs of energy.

You'd better have a damn good brake and a shoulder made of rubber.

Posted: 9/8/2010 2:28:43 PM EDT

[#44]

Quoted:

Quoted:
what level is standard issue for most leo

what level is required to stop a rifle bullet

You'll need to add plates to IIIA or get level III/ IV to stop most rifle.

http://i51.tinypic.com/33ufuxl.jpg

Wow, I want the 30-06 that I can load a 166 GRAM bullet into. I can't imagine the recoil from that sumbitch traveling at 2900fps!

That is a pretty funny typo - that would be a 2561 grain boolit.

http://i51.tinypic.com/33ufuxl.jpg

47822 ft-lbs of energy.

You'd better have a damn good brake and a shoulder made of rubber.

Level X armor. For when the enemy is firing battleship rounds at you!

Posted: 9/8/2010 2:31:42 PM EDT

[#45]

Quoted:
I'm not up on the latest body armor news, but IIRC Twaron and Gold-Flex are not aramid fiber Kevlar products, right?

I don't think so...that's a deal breaker for me.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - New body armor for $199. (Page 2 of 2)

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