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Posted: 4/8/2002 1:35:02 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/8/2002 3:05:04 PM EDT by MurderSHO45]
I think that Gay women should not be allowed to get donated sperm. Its my belief that gay people should not be able to pass their name off to a new generation. Gay men, cannot have children, so their name and genes cannot be passed on. (except for those ones that are get married to a wife, have a few children, and then realize after their relationship isn't going well, O shit I must be gay, I'll go chase me some butt) Gay women on the other hand, cannot have children themselves, they need help of a man. (Gee funny how that works, you wouldn't supposed that it was intended that way? Naaa, I think I'll go munch some carpet) THESE WOMEN MUST BE STOPPED!! They should not be allowed to pass their name and genes on to another generation. I used to be real tolerate of gay people, but in the last year or so, I've really became against it and I don't know why, I guess getting married and having a child soon has made me realize more about life, and really what I think our purpose is for. ( Make babies, fight for what you believe, and live in peace as much as possible with your neighbors and take care and be there for family) You people feel the same way in any way?
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 1:43:11 PM EDT
I agree. It just isn't right. I don't fall into the b.s. "oh it's ok, let everyone do what they want" line because some things just aren't right. It isn't natural. If it were, there wouldn't be two sexes. If you want to accept that lifestyle, you have to accept that there are things you just can't do, like get pregnant.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 1:49:58 PM EDT
Yeah, but what's to stop them from plugging their noses and allowing some guy they picked up at the bar to bang away at them? It's not like these people have any morals. Hell, when you get right down to it, a good portion of the membership here at AR15.com would happy to do the deed. Moreso if both lesbos were involved.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 2:02:21 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Boomer: Hell, when you get right down to it, a good portion of the membership here at AR15.com would happy to do the deed. Moreso if both lesbos were involved.
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Now Boomer............you know perfectly well that would all depend on what the aforementioned lesbos actually looked like[;)] Personally, I find that I have less and less of an appetite for being tolerant these days. Seems to me that the more a "special interest group" is granted, the more they in turn "demand" from mainstream society. I agree that fags and dykes have every right to be what they wish to be w/o fear of being denied the basics of employment, healthcare, retirement, government/social services etc etc so on and so forth. It surely has to stop somehwere though. My .02 TIOLI
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 2:11:52 PM EDT
Sad thing is, their kids don't have a snowball's chance in Hell of being normal. Just more future liberals that will be running around doing the same thing when they grow up...
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 2:14:20 PM EDT
no, i don't. i think that kind of thinking is as antithetical to the premise of liberty as one can get. i cannot condone denying rights to someone simply because i do not agree with his lifestyle choice.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 2:18:26 PM EDT
Couldn't the Gay Men donate their sperm to the Gay Women? [:D] Vulcan94
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 2:19:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Boomer: Hell, when you get right down to it, a good portion of the membership here at AR15.com would happy to do the deed. Moreso if both lesbos were involved.
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(...said like Elmer Fudd...) "Only if theyuh [b]Wipstick Wesbians[/b]...huh-uh-uh-uh..."
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 2:24:58 PM EDT
i find myself lately to be "closed minded and intolerant" on issues such as this. there really is no way around it, IT VIOLATES THE LAWS OF GOD AND NATURE. end of story........
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 2:28:54 PM EDT
I'd make a gay male couple donate the sperm and then require them to live with and share the raising of the offspring in the same house with the lesbian couple. Sadly it's not up to me and this annoying abuse of a childs right to a normal upbringing is one the casualties of a free society. Its always amazing to me to see the same people who rail against a women's right to choose also then stand up for a lesbo's right to conceive a child knowing that there's no way that child can ever have a normal life. I call that pre-endorsed child abuse. My .02
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 2:31:57 PM EDT
Like this..... When is the line drown being "special". For example, in Minnesota or Michigan, one of the colleges is throwing a "Special" graduation after the "regular" one. This special one is for all the blacks that have finished. Some white students are appalled saying, "if we had a graduation for the whites, then it would start a riot". Good point cause it would!! So when do we draw the line!? When is getting special rights, overly special. Hell in 50 years, whites are going to be minority, and it will be too late by then! The wheels are already in motion! I'm am NOT a racist in anyway, but like my first post on this topic, I am getting fed up and wondering where this is going?!! Now that we gives rights to "special" ethnic groups, and we keep giving and giving, if we take them away because they become to much, we now look like bad guys and they wonder what are agenda is now. Really messed up situation. I hope these weren't the same thoughts that KKK and other racist groups have, cause I am in no way a racist, just thinking out loud.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 2:52:36 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ARlady: no, i don't. i think that kind of thinking is as antithetical to the premise of liberty as one can get. i cannot condone denying rights to someone simply because i do not agree with his lifestyle choice.
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I am always amazed at how many AR15ers want to limit OTHERS rights to choose, but not their own... I got your back on this one ArLady. The[green]Red[/green]Goat
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 2:56:28 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ARlady: no, i don't. i think that kind of thinking is as antithetical to the premise of liberty as one can get. i cannot condone denying rights to someone simply because i do not agree with his lifestyle choice.
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I value your reply and opinion. But let me get this straight, let people make there own choice, just keep it off my wave right? Madam, it will soon be your wave, and thats my point! At the rate we're going, in 20 years, over half of people will be gay!! We cannot be a strong nation if we're all having gay sex. If we just let people be gay and happy, in 200 years, the figgen america will die off cause they can't reproduce (not that we will last another 100 years). You might laugh at this idea, but if you look at numbers and years it took for us to get here, it will happen sooner then you think.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 3:00:54 PM EDT
I think that all people as human beings are entitled to the same basic rights. However, with those rights comes responsibilities: if you are going to create a child, you must ensure that it receives a proper environment to grow in, not just have the kid to make some idiot political statement. (case in point, the dykes in Kalifornia i believe who wanted to have a deaf child) When one "minority group" starts acting like they are entitled to more rights than the mainstream solely because they are an "oppressed minority" or some bull$h!t like that the line has been crossed. Example: the second graduation for all the black students that was previously mentioned. That is ridiculous. The actions that group of people is taking only serves to divide ethnic groups even farther. On a parallel note, i am absolutely against any sort of reparations for something that happened hundreds of years ago...the whole slavery thing and especially the CSX issue.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 3:02:33 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ARlady: no, i don't. i think that kind of thinking is as antithetical to the premise of liberty as one can get. i cannot condone denying rights to someone simply because i do not agree with his lifestyle choice.
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The reason profered for denying homosexuals custody of children is because the homosexual lifestyle is destructive to the child's well being, not because of the particular lifestyle choice (which, as you so aptly put it, is a choice; you don't have to choose that lifestyle). But, couldn't one say that any "choice" shouldn't be grounds for denying one children? "liberty." "freedom." "etc."
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 3:03:30 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/8/2002 3:06:06 PM EDT by MurderSHO45]
Originally Posted By TheRedGoat:
Originally Posted By ARlady: no, i don't. i think that kind of thinking is as antithetical to the premise of liberty as one can get. i cannot condone denying rights to someone simply because i do not agree with his lifestyle choice.
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I am always amazed at how many AR15ers want to limit OTHERS rights to choose, but not their own... I got your back on this one ArLady. The[green]Red[/green]Goat
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My whole point is that it comes down to more of a lifestyle choice dammit!!! Can't you people see that!!! Its about reproduction, children being raised, and us americans as whole nation of people, lots of people. I feel if we keep opening the gate towards homosexuality, we are opening more then just LIFESTYLES. You say "not giving up my rights", well its obvious you mean me owning a firearm. I don't see how you can compair our 2nd amendment right to the choice of being gay. That's pretty messed up man.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 7:56:09 PM EDT
Originally Posted By MurderSHO45: My whole point is that it comes down to more of a lifestyle choice dammit!!! Can't you people see that!!! Its about reproduction, children being raised, and us americans as whole nation of people, lots of people. I feel if we keep opening the gate towards homosexuality, we are opening more then just LIFESTYLES. You say "not giving up my rights", well its obvious you mean me owning a firearm. I don't see how you can compair our 2nd amendment right to the choice of being gay. That's pretty messed up man.
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it's simple. a right is a right is a right. every person, regardless of his/her sexual orientation, has a right to procreate. what you propose infringes on that right. how are you any better than the antis that wish to infringe on your 2nd amendment right? since you broached the subject, where do you draw the line at infringing on people's rights so you can have your ideal world? can't you see that you have no more right to limit these women in their sexuality/fertility/procreation than you do mine? i agree with you that they shouldn't be raising children in such an environment. i don't agree with homosexuality and i don't approve of it. and i abhor the idea of children being raised by homosexual parents. but infringing on the rights of other to remedy a situation is NOT, i repeat NOT, the proper way to go about fixing it. i see a huge parallel between what you're proposing and what the antis propose in regards to guns. scenario one: criminals often use guns and people want crime to stop. response: antis propose a spate of bullshit laws that infringe on the rights of gunowners all with the laudable goal of eliminating crime. reality: we all know that guns don't cause crime and the appropriate response is to go after the criminals who use guns and not the law-abiding gunowners. scenario two: homosexuality is a no-no and people shouldn't be raising kids in a homosexual relationship. response: zealots want to stop the moral decline in america and propose assinine laws that infringe the rights of others for no other reason that said zealots don't agree with lifestyle of others. reality: YOU CAN'T LEGISLATE MORALITY!!!!!!!!! don't fall into the trap of attacking the symptoms. attack the root of the problem: which in this case is a decided lack of morals and values and an extreme case of selfishness.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 8:29:18 PM EDT
I'M SICK OF HEARING THAT BEING GAY IS A LIFESTYLE CHOICE!! HOW MANY ANIMALS DO YOU SEE IN NATURE SCREWING THE SAME SEX?? NONE THE ANIMALS DIE BECAUSE NATURE DOESNT ALLOW GENETIC DEFECTS TO SURVIVE. THIS GAY RIGHTS SHIT MAKES ME SICK THE ONLY RIGHT THEY DESERVE IS TO BE LOCKED UP IN A MENTAL HOSPITAL. THE FACT IS GAY PEOPLE CAN'T REPRODUCE SO THEREFORE SOMETHING IS WRONG WITH THEM TO WANT TO BE WITH THE SAME SEX. THEY SHOULD'NT BE ALLOWED TO ADOPT CHILDREN AND SCREW UP THE INNOCENT KIDS. IF THEY WANT KIDS THEY SHOULD SCREW EACH OTHER UNTIL THEY PRODUCE ONE. GAY PEOPLE ARE SICK AND NEED HELP. REALLY TICKS ME OFF TO HEAR THEM BITCH ABOUT WANTING TO HAVE THE SAME RIGHTS AS MARRIED COUPLES. IF ANYTHING THE DOCTORS SHOULD TRY TO FIND OUT WHAT IS CAUSING THE DEFECT IN THESE PEOPLE. ANSWERS SIMPLE CAN 2 PEOPLE OF SAME SEX REPRODUCE NO THEREFORE NO ADOPTION OF CHILDREN SHOULD BE ALLOWED.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 8:40:35 PM EDT
Go for it Illinois! The caps are a bit much but your point is well taken. I refuse to accept their corruption of the language and the shorthand - they ARE NOT "Good As You"!! They are queer, homosexual, faggot or lesbian, NOT gay. They are diseased and have no SPECIAL rights.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 8:43:50 PM EDT
ARlady. Someone once said "whoever has the children has the future." Its sensible to go to the root of the problem of a lack of morals and attack there. But as long as these POS idiots are allowed to raise children and feed them thier POS lies then the longer were going to be fighting and correcting and educating. We have to stop the flow of homosexual education to children which is nearly impossible if a child grows up in a homosexual home. trying to end this terrible immorality the way you describe is liken to trying to stop a river by bailing with buckets!
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 9:07:38 PM EDT
Originally Posted By WolfAR15: ARlady. Someone once said "whoever has the children has the future." Its sensible to go to the root of the problem of a lack of morals and attack there. But as long as these POS idiots are allowed to raise children and feed them thier POS lies then the longer were going to be fighting and correcting and educating. We have to stop the flow of homosexual education to children which is nearly impossible if a child grows up in a homosexual home. trying to end this terrible immorality the way you describe is liken to trying to stop a river by bailing with buckets!
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the only problem with your point is that the homosexual education is rampant in our school systems, it isn't limited to homosexual households. remove it from public schools and you've removed it from the vast majority of children. in all actuality, homosexual households with children are not the source of or even the lifeline of the homosexual agenda. just getting rid of homosexual parents isn't going to do diddly squat. therefore, preventing homosexuals from procreating will do nothing to stop the situation. as for the rest of you, you need to take a serious look at what you're saying...and what i'm saying. i am in no way favoring "special" rights. but neither will i support taking away basic ones simply because i don't approve of something someone does. everyone is entitled to procreate. everyone. illinois, you actually help homosexuals make a point for "born this way" argument if you deny the lifestyle choice option. i believe it is a choice. it is precisely because it is not the norm in nature that makes it a choice and not a "born with it" thing. and one more point that needs to be made: homosexuals are not incapable of reproducing . a gay man is just as fertile as a hetero one. the likelihood that they will ever produce children is low, given their LIFESTYLE CHOICE, but they are capable of doing so.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 9:29:07 PM EDT
ArLady, Let's say these fags are making this choice to be a fag. A healthy person would not choose to be with a partner of the same sex. A sick and diseased person would. Step back and look at what you are saying. You can't tell me that a fag is a healthy normal person. They maybe be fertile but as I said 2 OF THE SAME SEX CAN NOT REPRODUCE ITS NOT POSSIBLE. A MALE HAVING WHAT FAGS CALL SEX WITH ANOTHER MALE WILL NOT PRODUCE A CHILD! A FEMALE HAVING WHAT LEZBIANS CALL SEX WITH ANOTHER FEMALE WILL NOT PRODUCE A CHILD! BEING FERTILE DOES NOT MATTER! ONLY 2 PEOPLE OF OPPOSITE SEX CAN PRODUCE A CHILD! THEREFORE THE DISEASED PEOPLE NEED HELP TREATING THEIR DISEASE THEY DO NOT NEED TO BE ADOPTING CHILDREN AND DESTROYING THE CHILDS LIFE. TELL ME HOW THAT CHILD HAS ANY CHANCE OF GROWING UP NORMAL. HOMOSEXUALS SHOULD HAVE NO RIGHT TO ADOPT ANY CHILDREN. AS I SAID BEFORE IF THEY WANT KIDS THEY SHOULD SCREW EACH OTHER UNTIL THEY PRODUCE ONE. WHICH WE KNOW WILL NEVER HAPPEN.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 9:29:27 PM EDT
Yup. I would agree with you on this one. It is werid that they wanted childern but they won't have a man around them. I have a possible solution for their diliema. I would ask the alternate life style women if I can impreganate them.[;)]
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 9:45:55 PM EDT
I don't think it's right, but I also don't agree with taking away liberties. No.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 10:01:38 PM EDT
I'm with ArLady, TheRedGoat, and Stealth on this; I don't like the implications on personal liberty it may have. Its a slippery slope folks. If you can deny someone their rights based upon their lifestyle choice, how long will it be before someone tries to restrict your rights because of [i]your[/i] lifestyle choice. If you deny gays the opportunity to adopt because of their lifestyle choice, I guarantee you it won't be long before someone proposes that gun owners should not be able to adopt because of our lifestyle choice of having guns in the house.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 10:19:09 PM EDT
Well said Shaggy , I read alot of the members here condem other citizens for something, they do in the privacy of there homes. Two way street fellas u cannot be like the so-called liberals, then flip flop when it suits your personal needs and whats. THAT'S WTF IS WRONG WITH THE WORLD TODAY, GROW-UP, LIVE YOUR OWN LIVES AND DEMAND ALL OTHERS DO TOO!!!!!!!! P.S. Is this a religious site or a information site of firearms, I've been here 2 or so months and seen alot of religious condamnation by at least 50 members and 1 moderator.
Link Posted: 4/8/2002 10:34:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/9/2002 8:26:49 PM EDT by rockinAR]
If every gay and lesbian went out and bought a firearm and then joined the NRA, GOA, etc... I would welcome them. I don't agree with the gay lifestyle so I am not gay. However, I also don't go out there and gay bash, nor do I tolerate the persecution of a person because he or she is gay (having been in education, I have had to defend gay students from bullies) I think legislating morality is NOT the government's job. I think that morals should be taught by the church, synogogue, mosque, community organizations, etc... AND MOST OF ALL PARENTS! As a Christian, I take seriously Jesus' charge to "do unto others as you would have them do unto you." I know the Bible says that homosexuality is a sin, but then so is lying, cheating on your wife, coveting (which I personally do a lot of, especially when looking at pictures of M4 uppers), etc...etc... So I don't waste my time hating homosexuals. I treat people with dignity and respect until they do something to me that warrants a change in status. I know this goes against what a lot of people think of as the "christian response" and I think that's sad. Someone should ask me about how its possible to be pro-choice AND anti-abortion... now I've done it! Go ahead and flame me! [flame]
Link Posted: 4/9/2002 4:29:31 PM EDT
Right is right, wrong is wrong. What is right does not change with the political winds, nor does it change because someone else thinks differently. It is possible for someone to live a lifestyle that is wrong, no matter what the moral relativists, left-wing academia, or socialists teach. Homosexuality is unnatural. It does not comport with either the gender "roles" created by nature or by God, whichever you prefer. Furthermore, homosexuals, in general, cannot create a stable/healthy family relationship because the homosexual "family" lacks either a mother of a father, both of which, in general, are required. The belief that one cannot, under any circumstances, claim that a person should not/cannot have children is ridiculous. Does a pedophile have the "right" to keep a child, even if there is significant danger the child will be abused? No. Why not? Are we persecuting the abuser? are we impermissibly abridging his "rights?" As soon as we can say "its ok to take that person's child away," then have shattered the notion that we cannot "judge" a person as a bad parent and deny their right to procreate.
As a Christian, I take seriously Jesus' charge to "do unto others as you would have them do unto you."
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I understand that I will judged by the same standards as other christians. I accept that. However, such a proposition does not counsel me into accepting the sinful homosexual lifestyle, or treating it as though its ok. Its not ok. No sin is ok, even if I do it. (I don't accept any sinful lifestyle, including my own; yes, i am a sinner and I do sin, and I will be judged accordingly). The fact that I will also be judged does not "force" me to allow or accept children being raised in destructive households; in fact, it "forces" me to do the opposite.
Link Posted: 4/9/2002 7:53:00 PM EDT
I agree but for different reasons. In spite of modern psychological statements to the contrary I believe homosexuality to be a form of mental illness. The mentally ill don't think their condition is indicative of an illness and we do no good for them as a society to placate their manifested condition. I have studied psychology for the last few years after leaving the military and have come to the conclusion that many in the psychological community merely look to not make waves and adopt the philosophy of making the patient feel comfortable with their illness as long as its manifestations don't cause physical harm to the patient or others. Real treatment doesn't exist nor is one striven for. There is reason enough to question the woeful lack of understanding the nature of this illness and its effects on the community at large have. And I believe history will look back on this time as a dark age. Its not merely a lifestyle that is being advocated (nudism is a lifestyle)its a complete rejection of what it is to be human and a overt denial of one's role in the nature of things. It is the ultimate statement of man's conquest and subjugation of nature. With the idea of God eliminated from the world man becomes the supreme being endowed with the ability to transmute his own existence. Man is not subject to nature instead man controls and manipulates nature. Homosexuality is a psychos of the individual that feels threatened by nature.
Link Posted: 4/9/2002 10:59:05 PM EDT
Originally Posted By TheRedGoat:
Originally Posted By ARlady: no, i don't. i think that kind of thinking is as antithetical to the premise of liberty as one can get. i cannot condone denying rights to someone simply because i do not agree with his lifestyle choice.
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I am always amazed at how many AR15ers want to limit OTHERS rights to choose, but not their own... I got your back on this one ArLady. The[green]Red[/green]Goat
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Much as I HATE the diesel dyke bitches that pull this kinda shit, I have to agree with the personal freedom issue. It is fucked up, but fucked up people think the same of us. Freedom is freedom.
Link Posted: 4/9/2002 11:10:19 PM EDT
I have nothing against those who live an alternative lifestyle. When the time comes, we will not be turning away patriots and allies solely because of their sexual preference.
Link Posted: 4/9/2002 11:21:43 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/10/2002 6:13:56 PM EDT by BusMaster007]
I posted a lame joke at first, but, the bottom line is this isn't right. Everyone knows it. It's twisted. It DOES bend the laws of nature, by using the law. Naturally, parents are male and female. Adoption and artificial insemination (or natural insemination by deception) by homosexual 'couples' is NOT normal. Period. Even writing about this makes it obvious to anyone that some kind of UNnatural defense of the whole idea must be conjured up to appease the people involved or those that defend their "RIGHT" to be a parent. The lifestyle of homosexuality is a choice; I don't believe people are born that way. If you choose to deny yourself the natural way of becoming a parent, you should be childless. Cruel? Tough. Things work a certain way in this world. Try building things with parts that don't fit. No product. Lots of opinions on this Topic. That's mine. edited to clarify a point: "If you choose to deny yourself the natural way of becoming a parent, you should be childless." Let's say a heterosexual couple wishes to have a child. Under normal circumstances, this is the only way it can be done. Fine. They can adopt or utilize the tool of artificial insemination. They win the prize. On the other hand, we have the homosexual couple that in no way can produce a child. They can NOT do this under normal circumstances; so they don't even get to play the game. The motives for a homosexual couple wanting to be a parent are selfish. They don't have a right, or RIGHT, to this, because they MUST use someone else to be 'parents'. It's fakery. The kid who is raised in a normal household will know who is parents are, and will know all the things a member of a normal family would know. The kid who is raised with 'parents' of the same sex will undoubtedly be asking some very ABnormal questions. This kid is going to be affected in ways the kid of a normal family would not. It's inevitable. It's undeniable. It's not normal. That's all. The truth.
Link Posted: 4/10/2002 4:37:02 AM EDT
I love the way you guys are so pro-freedom until one of your hot-button issues pops up, then it is time to unlimber the guns of the state and point them at your fellow citizens. Don't like gays? Well then, don't be one. Don't like lesbians? Don't be one. Start down the road of denying people reproduction rights because of lifestyles and you will be sorry. When the gummint determines that being strongly religious or owning guns is inimical to having/adopting children, remember that YOU were the ones cheering it on when it involved somebody else.
Link Posted: 4/10/2002 2:43:51 PM EDT
Have to agree. It's like buying a kid. Or at least the raw ingredients [:D]
Link Posted: 4/10/2002 8:15:54 PM EDT
Its obvious there's 2 different paths in this discussion. And in reality, they both have good points. I really appreaciate everyone's response to this post. G'night all.
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