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Posted: 3/28/2002 5:12:45 AM EDT
So who's rights will be lost on some JBT doing his "job"?? Or is the mayor not happy that he is in charge of murder captial usa? Maybe now you all might see why Chicago folks dont trust the police. From the 13 getting off death row, to rolando cruz getting off. To hearing about police using live electrical wires to get confessions from people. To cops pistol whipping people on the streets! More torture, more beatings. Even the mob connections to the mayor's office. Cops ordered to boost arrests Memo to police in Cabrini area stirs quota issue By Maurice Possley Tribune staff reporter Published March 24, 2002 The head of the Chicago Police Department unit that patrols public housing in the Cabrini-Green neighborhood has ordered squad members to increase the number of arrests or face poor performance ratings. In a memo dated Jan. 20 and obtained by the Tribune last week, Lt. Michael Fitzgerald, commander of the Public Housing North unit, outlined "minimum" quotas for officers--including at least four arrests per month--after determining that some members of the unit were engaging in "very little activity." One day later, according to department officials, a "corrected version" of the memo was issued that eliminated specific numbers but still demanded increased arrests. Civil rights lawyers as well as the president of the police union criticized the practice of instituting arrest quotas, saying such a practice would lead to improper arrests. "Quotas? That's contrary to everything we've been taught," said Bill Nolan, head of the Fraternal Order of Police. Department spokesman Pat Camden said he found nothing improper about setting such standards for police work. The Jan. 20 memo said that those officers who did not meet minimum standards faced the prospect of receiving an unfavorable performance rating, which is used to determine whether officers qualify for merit pay increases or for preferential assignments. That memo required officers to make at least four arrests during each 28-day police period or to engage in a required number of other activities, such as making one traffic stop per day or writing up two curfew or truancy violations per day. "It's outrageous," said Tom Peters, a veteran civil rights lawyer. "It just encourages police to violate the rights of citizens to meet some arbitrarily imposed quota which doesn't necessarily translate to good police work." http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chi-0203240426mar24.story
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 5:14:05 AM EDT
This is old-line policing that predictably generates illegal stops of pedestrians and motorists," said Harvey Grossman, legal director of the Chicago office of the American Civil Liberties Union. "The best policies in law enforcement today frown upon quotas and it's also the antithesis of community policing. You are supposed to be problem-solving and working with people." "It's surprising that it's been put in writing," Grossman said. "Quotas are always bad. They put pressure on police to make stops whether these are good or bad stops." Nolan, whose union represents the rank-and-file members of the department, said: "We do not agree with any quota system. Our members do not make arrests based on a quota." Efforts to reach Fitzgerald were unsuccessful Friday. His officers patrol the Cabrini-Green and Lathrop Homes housing developments in an area that for years has been largely populated by minorities, but recently has seen gentrification and an influx of young urban professionals. Grossman was particularly critical of a requirement in the first memo that officers each day fill out three contact cards, which contain information about someone officers stopped but did not arrest. "This is when police officers just stop cars and stop people to stop them," he said. Camden defended the Jan. 20 memo, though he, too, conceded, "It's unusual to see it in writing." "There has to be a way to evaluate people," Camden said. "This isn't unreasonable. There has to be a way to account for an officer's time." Camden said police officers make out contact cards when "they see someone who appears to be suspicious." He said an officer might well stop someone who looks out of place in a particular neighborhood. "They stop them and question them and make out a card," he said. Not excessive Camden said the quotas listed in the Jan. 20 memo were not excessive. "You're not going to have 28 quiet days," he said. "Your activity is looked at every day. It's what you are paid to do. You can't tell me that an officer can be out all day and not see [illegal] traffic activity." Asked if he believed a quota system might result in improper arrests or police stops, Camden said, "I really don't think so. ... If you're not making arrests, what are you doing with your time?" Fitzgerald's Jan. 20 memo noted that if officers were unable to meet the quota of four arrests, they would be required to meet "some combination" of the other activities. The memo was sent anonymously to the Tribune attached to a letter addressed to Police Supt. Terry Hillard, as well as several other high-ranking police officers. The letter, typed on official department stationery and purportedly authored by a member of Fitzgerald's unit, stated that Fitzgerald "threatened to get rid of any officer who does not comply with his mandate and any officer whom he feels is not a `team player.'" "I have personally been the subject of retaliatory action...by Lt. Fitzgerald for not complying with his mandate," the letter said.
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 5:14:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/28/2002 5:15:04 AM EDT by c-rock]
Attorney Peters, who has successfully sued Chicago police for violating the civil rights of arrestees in the past, said arrest quotas "encourage police officers to make the requisite number of arrests whether or not there is sufficient evidence to make the arrests. I'm sure all the police officers want the best rating and there is an incredibly strong incentive to make arrests to meet the quota and get a high performance rating." But, he added, "This just doesn't make any sense. If an officer spent half his day helping some family in some important way instead of making arrests, why should he be penalized?" He added, "And the contact cards? That's just telling police to go stop young male blacks and prove you're making contact with them, which is basically harassing them." [img]http://www.concealcarry.org/billbrd2.jpg[/img]
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 5:43:44 AM EDT
Daley has way,way too much power!!! He has more clout than Gov. Ryan. Did you see the newest traffic violation?? If you don't clear ALL of the ice off of EVERY window on your vehicle. it's a $75.00 fine!! No matter how much revenue they bring in, it's never enough. [:(!][:(!][:(!] ColtShorty GOA KABA COA JPFO SAF NRA "I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people and I require the same from them."
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 6:25:03 AM EDT
Originally Posted By c-rock: Or is the mayor not happy that he is in charge of murder captial usa?
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"an area that for years has been largely populated by minorities, but recently has seen gentrification and an influx of young urban professionals." You reckon that last quote is just coincidence, or is there something there that caused this? I mean, we wouldn't want to accuse anyone of not giving a damn about the poor living in public housing, but responding to pressure from yuppies, would we? Naaaaahhh! Just concidence.
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 6:51:58 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 7:00:18 AM EDT
There are two types of patrol activity. Assigned calls and Observed calls. Assigned calls are car; crashes, 911 calls, citizen assist, anything where the officer is dispatched or sent to the call. Observed calls are self initiated activity like Car stops, warrant arrest, drug arrests, DUI's, ect. Also known as "catching bad guys" or "hunting". It's the reason most cops became cops in the first place. Unfortunately, there are alot of lazy cops in this world who do nothing but answer Assigned calls. They never have any Observed activity at all. Some angencies have resorted to quotas to encourage Observed activity. Personally I would rather see them assign the lazy cops who only want to answer calls to a desk job somewhere and replace them with younger aggressive guys who want to work and make arrests.
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 7:03:38 AM EDT
Originally Posted By AR15fan: There are two types of patrol activity. Assigned calls and Observed calls. Assigned calls are car; crashes, 911 calls, citizen assist, anything where the officer is dispatched or sent to the call. Observed calls are self initiated activity like Car stops, warrant arrest, drug arrests, DUI's, ect. Also known as "catching bad guys" or "hunting". It's the reason most cops became cops in the first place. Unfortunately, there are alot of lazy cops in this world who do nothing but answer Assigned calls. They never have any Observed activity at all. Some angencies have resorted to quotas to encourage Observed activity. Personally I would rather see them assign the lazy cops who only want to answer calls to a desk job somewhere and replace them with younger aggressive guys who want to work and make arrests.
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Why do quotas then? If crime is down, why do they have to become JBT's on common folk? Why not just give them a box, fire them, and let them look for a private job? I could use a tax break this year. [:)] c-rock
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 7:14:19 AM EDT
Originally Posted By c-rock: Why do quotas then? If crime is down
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Crime isnt down. But criminals do try to hide themselves and their crimes, so you have to go out and look for them. Quotas is a bad way of getting lazy cops to get off their ass and hunt for the criminals.
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 7:21:38 AM EDT
Originally Posted By AR15fan:
Originally Posted By c-rock: Why do quotas then? If crime is down
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Crime isnt down. But criminals do try to hide themselves and their crimes, so you have to go out and look for them. Quotas is a bad way of getting lazy cops to get off their ass and hunt for the criminals.
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Why not just can them, throw them onto the street, and hire new?
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 7:28:33 AM EDT
Originally Posted By c-rock: Why not just can them, throw them onto the street, and hire new?
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That is a solution I would support. However the labor unions would oppose it. As would the people who prefer the lazy Andy Griffith type cops to the younger hard working cops.
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 7:35:32 AM EDT
SO then why support the police, if they are unwilling to clean up? If they are so willing to protect those that are lazy, are JBT's, and such, why should I then trust the police? After living around here near chicago, you learn not to trust police. ' Fear is a better word. c-rock
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 7:55:35 AM EDT
Originally Posted By AR15fan: That is a solution I would support. However the labor unions would oppose it. As would the people who prefer the lazy Andy Griffith type cops to the younger hard working cops.
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Now hold on just a damn minute, AR15fan. Andy Griffith was a damn fine police officer. I never saw him resort to quotas, beat suspects, or violate them with a toilet plunger. Always polite, and professional to a T. I would much rather be arrested by Officer Griffith than anyone in the LAPD, NYPD, NOPD, or pretty much any big city's PD for that matter.
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 3:34:18 PM EDT
That is a solution I would support. However the labor unions would oppose it. As would the people who prefer the lazy Andy Griffith type cops to the younger hard working cops.
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Aha! Now we see the real problem and where it lies--the labor unions wield too much power and like all leftist organizations, their existence has a detrimental effect on the rest of society. Unions "tell" the cities and towns how many cops and firefighters they should have on staff. It always favors the union to bloat the numbers and squeeze a little more money out of the system. I would much rather have cops do nothing but assigned calls and serving warrants. No more fishing expeditions, checkpoints or other such techniques.
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 3:45:04 PM EDT
Originally Posted By urodoji:
Originally Posted By AR15fan: That is a solution I would support. However the labor unions would oppose it. As would the people who prefer the lazy Andy Griffith type cops to the younger hard working cops.
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Now hold on just a damn minute, AR15fan. Andy Griffith was a damn fine police officer. I never saw him resort to quotas, beat suspects, or violate them with a toilet plunger. Always polite, and professional to a T. I would much rather be arrested by Officer Griffith than anyone in the LAPD, NYPD, NOPD, or pretty much any big city's PD for that matter.
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Yeah, but he let Barney Fife have only *one bullet*... not much on cool firepower was he?
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 3:58:27 PM EDT
C-Rock, You make some accurate observations. I probably feel the same way you do about JBT's and quotas. That being said, if you show me a patrol officer that can't make 4 legitimate arrests a month and I'll show you a lazy SOB that should be charged with theft for accepting a paycheck!
Link Posted: 3/28/2002 4:03:48 PM EDT
Originally Posted By ilikelegs:
c-rock Maybe now you all might see why Chicago folks dont trust the police.
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In Dallas they were busting people with cocaine charges and as it turned out they had framed 20 to 40 people with sheet rock powder. They perposely placed it there to frame these people to make it look like they were doing a good job in the war on drugs.
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Well...I quit listening about a month ago when the daily count was at 76 cases dismissed with no questions asked. I understand there will be SEVERAL HUNDRED or more cases dismissed before it's over. And to keep things tidy, the local police got the INS to deport their "confidential, paid informant" back to Mexico where his pesky testimony is safely removed from the issue. GYPSUM...GYPSUM...WALLBOARD...dammit!...people framed by police and jailed for months with no recourse...jobs, savings, homes, families gone...and all of Dallas' biggest busts were for GROUND-UP DRYWALL!!... [:(!]
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