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Posted: 3/25/2002 10:05:17 PM EDT
Maybe some of you who have those huge "arsenals" of 5 or 6 guns could spare an SKS or 2... http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=145481&contrassID=2&subContrassID=1&sbSubContrassID=0
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 10:12:18 PM EDT
Don't they know they can buy a full-auto Uzi without any form of ID at American gunshows? All they need to do is get on the plane and come on over.
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 10:16:02 PM EDT
Why do I get the feeling that Eric is already organizing a flotilla of shrimp boats out of Port Arthur, loaded to the hilt w/ everything from capguns to anal probes?
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 10:29:32 PM EDT
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 10:46:46 PM EDT
Originally Posted By jobux: Why do I get the feeling that Eric is already organizing a flotilla of shrimp boats out of Port Arthur, loaded to the hilt w/ everything from capguns to anal probes?
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I hate it when I get beat to the punch!
Link Posted: 3/25/2002 10:59:24 PM EDT
What in the hell are they doing with the billions of dollars in foreign aid they get from the U.S. every year???? Why don't they learn from the Palestinians how to wage a war on a shoestring budget.
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 12:10:32 AM EDT
Good point Imbroglio. My thoughts are that the latest M-16 shipment didn't get there, or the Israelis gave some to the Palestinians so they could justify more settlements due to "terror attacks". Bloody hell. I hope these people nuke each other. I'm sick of this crap. themao [chainsawkill]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 1:41:51 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 1:53:19 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2002 2:47:54 AM EDT by platform389]
Originally Posted By Imbroglio: What in the hell are they doing with the billions of dollars in foreign aid they get from the U.S. every year????
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Trying to sell AEW technology to the Chinese(Phalcon EL/M-2075). Assisting the Chinese in the development of the new Chengdu J-10 fighter by providing assistance with composite materials, flight control technology, and avionics derived from the US F-16. (From AIR FORCES magazine, March 2002 issue). Providing assistance to the Chinese in development of APFSDS ammo for the newest version of the Type 98 MBT (ARMOR magazine, May-June 2001 link provided,Adobe reader required) [url]http://www.knox.army.mil/armormag/mj01/3chineseMBT01.pdf[/url] While I am a supporter of Israel, this activity is most troubling and is certainly not what one would expect from a "friend". We need to ask and demand answers from them concerning these actions! [img]http://www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/smilie/sadness.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 4:10:15 AM EDT
Israelis Running Out of Firearms!
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I don't believe this.....As long as the U.S still support them, they will not run out of anything.
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 4:12:15 AM EDT
Originally Posted By platform389:
Originally Posted By Imbroglio: What in the hell are they doing with the billions of dollars in foreign aid they get from the U.S. every year????
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Trying to sell AEW technology to the Chinese(Phalcon EL/M-2075). Assisting the Chinese in the development of the new Chengdu J-10 fighter by providing assistance with composite materials, flight control technology, and avionics derived from the US F-16. (From AIR FORCES magazine, March 2002 issue). Providing assistance to the Chinese in development of APFSDS ammo for the newest version of the Type 98 MBT (ARMOR magazine, May-June 2001 link provided,Adobe reader required) [url]http://www.knox.army.mil/armormag/mj01/3chineseMBT01.pdf[/url] While I am a supporter of Israel, this activity is most troubling and is certainly not what one would expect from a "friend". We need to ask and demand answers from them concerning these actions! [img]http://www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/smilie/sadness.gif[/img]
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I guess the Israelis haven't the read the part of the Bible that says the Chinese are going to attack them at Armageddon. [:E]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 4:20:24 AM EDT
Sorry, guys, I was busy loading ARs on a shrimp boat flotilla, when I suddenly recalled that shellfish is not [b][i]kosher[/i][/b], and that the weapons would be considered unfit for use by the IDF. See: Leviticus 11:9; Deuteronomy 14:9. Well, back to the drawing board![:D] Eric The(Hurry!)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 4:23:22 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 4:33:34 AM EDT
Originally Posted By platform389: While I am a supporter of Israel, this activity is most troubling and is certainly not what one would expect from a "friend". We need to ask and demand answers from them concerning these actions!
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Naawwww. Don't you know? Israelcan do no wrong. It's because of the Holocaust. [:K]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 5:09:21 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 5:15:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2002 5:18:13 AM EDT by Cincinnatus]
Originally Posted By raf: Wonder which is worse: Someone who thinks Israel can do no wrong, or someone who is convinced Israel can do no good.[?]
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Well, I'd say that the one who is on the same side of this issue as those who root for the death and destruction of Americans. Yeah, if you're on that side, you're worse. Heck, call me crazy, but I'm knee-jerk opposition to the those who root for the death and destruction of America.
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 5:18:42 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 5:31:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2002 5:32:55 AM EDT by Cincinnatus]
Sure. You asked who was "worse": "Someone who thinks Israel can do no wrong, or someone who is convinced Israel can do no good." Well, if you are on the side that believes that "Israel can do no good", then you are also on the same side of [b]THIS ISSUE[/b] as the Islamic extremists who root for OUR (America's) death. ...SO, I'd say that's worse. Simplistic, but true. "Enemy of my enemy", and all that...
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 5:37:07 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 5:39:41 AM EDT
Absolutely.
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 5:40:35 AM EDT
I happen to think that Israel can do, and has done, plenty of wrong in the past. But just as Sept 11th stayed me from any public display of the bad feelings that I have about Rudy Guiliani and his anti-gun rhetoric, at this point in time I will also shut my mouth about Israel's past sins. When the nation has fully recovered from Sept 11, then I will resume my anti-Guiliani public stance, etc. To do otherwise would put the RKBA on the wrong side of history in a lot of people's minds. You know, the minds of [b]voters[/b]. Let the general American public believe that the folks who support the RKBA, do not support the 'hero' former mayor of NYC, and the public's perception of the RKBA will suffer. When this second Intifadah is over and peace reigns in the Holy Land, then I will feel safe to criticize Israel, again. But not before. That what friends and allies are for! Eric The(Wise)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 5:49:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2002 5:53:05 AM EDT by platform389]
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: That what friends and allies are for! Eric The(Wise)Hun[>]:)]
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But, but Mr. Hun, it is very possible AMERICANS will face these Chinese weapons at some point in the future. I find it VERY troubling they are transferring technology provided by us "for their survival" to a potential adversary. Prophecy aside, I suspect we will have to deal with this before anything takes place "on the plains of Megiddo". [IMG]http://www.contrabandent.com/cwm/s/contrib/corky/smilies23.gif[/IMG]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 5:51:13 AM EDT
When the "Israel can do no right" crowd holds a convention, Osama, Al Qaeda, Hezbollah, and most of Iran shows up. Not a fun party.
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 5:57:56 AM EDT
Well, [b]platform389[/b], I suppose that the folks who know the entire story behind the Phalcon deal, air-to-air missiles, etc., have also looked at the Israel-Palestinian struggle and have decided to continue to support Israel. I don't think for a minute that this decision is based upon anything other than what is in the best interests of the United States. When the United States sells its most sophisticated planes to Saudi Arabia, do we let the Israelis have a veto over it simply because, in all likelihood, if those planes were ever to be used in combat, it would be against Israel? No? Well, Israel let's the United States have such a veto power over its sales of military hardware. Eric The(Fair)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 5:59:01 AM EDT
From the article:
And though some guns are manufactured in Israel, they require European-made ammunition, which is also affected by the embargo.
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Don't the Israelis have their own ammo plants? If they can't meet the demand, there are plenty of ammo makers outside of Europe.
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 6:02:48 AM EDT
Boy, I have a sh|tload of IMI (Israeli Military Industries) manufactured 7.62 NATO and 5.56 NATO on hand, as well. Should I be loading that stuff 'back' on the Hun Rescue Flotilla? So why the shortage of ammo? Eric The(Stevedore)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 6:08:25 AM EDT
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: Boy, I have a sh|tload of IMI (Israeli Military Industries) manufactured 7.62 NATO and 5.56 NATO on hand, as well.
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^^^^^^^^^Answer VVVVVVV Question ;)
So why the shortage of ammo?
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Eric The(Stevedore)Hun[>]:)]
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....who has all the Israeli ammo at home :)
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 6:12:22 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2002 6:13:55 AM EDT by platform389]
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: Well, [b]platform389[/b], I suppose that the folks who know the entire story behind the Phalcon deal, air-to-air missiles, etc., have also looked at the Israel-Palestinian struggle and have decided to continue to support Israel. I don't think for a minute that this decision is based upon anything other than what is in the best interests of the United States. When the United States sells its most sophisticated planes to Saudi Arabia, do we let the Israelis have a veto over it simply because, in all likelihood, if those planes were ever to be used in combat, it would be against Israel? No? Well, Israel let's the United States have such a veto power over its sales of military hardware. Eric The(Fair)Hun[>]:)]
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I understand exactly what you are saying in this regard. Weapons sales can be problematic. As to the Chinese problem, we finally had enough with the Airborne Early Warning deal. We told Israel no go. For the exact reasons I detailed in the last post. Of course, the Chinese hit the ceiling and are demanding $1.25 billion from Israel. See page 12 in the March issue of AIR FORCES magazine for more details. What bothers me about this is either Israel needs this stuff for "it's survival" or they are interested in profiting from technology otherwise unattainable. It can't be both ways. China WILL NOT come riding to Israel's rescue during the next war. [IMG]http://216.40.198.77/mysmilies/s/ups/kiss_my_ass/mad.gif[/IMG]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 6:21:52 AM EDT
Post from platform389 -
What bothers me about this is either Israel needs this stuff for "it's survival" or they are interested in profiting from technology otherwise unattainable. It can't be both ways. China WILL NOT come riding to Israel's rescue during the next war.
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Understood. But China will [b]not[/b] be coming to the rescue of a whole lotta nations, besides Israel. Do we have this same agreement with every nation to whom we sell or supply weaponry? The only reason the Phalcon deal fell through was because Israel permits the US to have such a veto power over its sales of military items. Eric The(FairEnough!)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 6:23:40 AM EDT
Don't know how this topic did a 180 degree turn, and became a chinese-related issue? I thought this is something related to Isral. And why should Isral consider anything the American say? Shouldn't Isral consider its national interests first? If an Israli starts to think of American interests first before their own interests, wouldn't he be a traitor? They are our allies, not our puppies. They have the rights to do whatever they feel. And we have the rights to do whatever we feel. That's why we are 2 seperate nations.
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 6:24:37 AM EDT
Post from Kar98 -
....who has all the Israeli ammo at home :)
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Yes, I admit it! I am an ammo-Pig! But a very 'kosher' ammo-Pig! I'll send it back, where it'll do some good. Eric The(GluttonyIsOnlyTheLeastOfMySins)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 6:37:40 AM EDT
Originally Posted By jd123: Don't know how this topic did a 180 degree turn, and became a chinese-related issue? I thought this is something related to Isral. And why should Isral consider anything the American say? Shouldn't Isral consider its national interests first?
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Uhh.. Check back on page 1, I raised the question back there. Provided references and a link to back my statements up. As much money as we provide in support of Israel, we have bought a right to have a say in what happens with this technology to a considerable degree. If not, why continue to provide funding? What "national interest" is served by providing the Chinese with advanced weapons technology?
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 6:47:28 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2002 6:55:17 AM EDT by jd123]
sorry, platform, maybe I jumped the gun a little. didn't read the link. I disagree with you totally. It's like giving your daughter away to her husband. Do you have any more rights to force her to do things you like? If you feel your daughter isn't doing what you like, you can stop giving her help. Besides, when we supply Isral with $$$ and technology, we never had any conditions. We just simply give it away. what national interests? $$$$$. That's the top reason for most countries to sell military weapons and related technology. I wonder why we sold Saudi's the F15s, the Apaches, the M1A2s, etc.... if not because of $$$. Don't tell me they will defend Iraq with those, them saudis will run and ask for our army when that time comes.
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 7:00:56 AM EDT
Post from platform389 -
As much money as we provide in support of Israel, we have bought a right to have a say in what happens with this technology to a considerable degree. If not, why continue to provide funding?
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As I mentioned before, someone on the Bush Team has, I would imagine, already figured the pluses and minuses of continuing US relations with Israel, and, for better or worse, has made the decision to stick by Israel. And I hardly think it likely that this was because of Jewish Americans' financial support of George W. Bush's candidacy for Prez. They, by and large, supported Gore. To their everlasting shame. Maybe they will learn some day. Before it's too late. Eric The(WhoKnows?)Hun[>]:)]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 7:12:40 AM EDT
Originally Posted By EricTheHun: As I mentioned before, someone on the Bush Team has, I would imagine, already figured the pluses and minuses of continuing US relations with Israel, and, for better or worse, has made the decision to stick by Israel. Eric The(WhoKnows?)Hun[>]:)]
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No disagreement there. I still feel the "cozy" relationship Israel is developing with the Chinese is very curious. Perhaps when the plains of Megiddo are filled with "men from the east", they will understand the folly of this interaction. Well, this has been an interesting discussion. [img]http://www.stopstart.fsnet.co.uk/smilie/biggrin2.gif[/img]
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 7:13:31 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 8:35:06 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Cincinnatus: You asked who was "worse": "Someone who thinks Israel can do no wrong, or someone who is convinced Israel can do no good." Well, if you are on the side that believes that "Israel can do no good", then you are also on the same side of [b]THIS ISSUE[/b] as the Islamic extremists who root for OUR (America's) death. ...SO, I'd say that's worse. Simplistic, but true. "Enemy of my enemy", and all that...
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Oh, yeah! You're sooooo right, baby! And while you're at it, you'd better pick which one is our friend: China or Russia? Remember, you have to side absolutely with one or the other. Here's a hint: there are a lot of Russian Jews. Therefore, Russia must be our butt-buddy.
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 8:41:35 AM EDT
So, if I understand you correctly, you're telling us that you're an idiot?
Link Posted: 3/26/2002 3:00:16 PM EDT
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