Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Posted: 5/29/2003 11:09:31 AM EDT
and do you include cardio?
Link Posted: 5/29/2003 11:29:45 AM EDT
I always do cardio, but that's just me. I usually do more when I am trying to loose fat though. [url=http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=113&t=183077&w=searchPop]Here[/url] are some good routines for adding mass. Also, keep in mind that your diet is just as important as your lifting routine. In order to grow, you need to eat...A LOT. At least 1.5-2 grams of protien per pound of body weight per day. And at least as many carbs.
Link Posted: 5/29/2003 11:59:37 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/29/2003 12:01:16 PM EDT by macho99957]
I never do cardio. Being an ectomorph every pound is hard fought. I usually aim for 3500 cals. Diet is the determining factor in a bulk or a cut, the training remains the same for me.
Link Posted: 5/29/2003 3:27:47 PM EDT
Originally Posted By sr15: I always do cardio, but that's just me. I usually do more when I am trying to loose fat though. [url=http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=113&t=183077&w=searchPop]Here[/url] are some good routines for adding mass. Also, keep in mind that your diet is just as important as your lifting routine. In order to grow, you need to eat...A LOT. At least 1.5-2 grams of protien per pound of body weight per day. And at least as many carbs.
View Quote
Thanks. I was looking for something a little more specific though. I mean, I could very easily say Mon/Thurs: chest/tri Tues/Fri: back/bi Wed/Sat: legs But that doesn't really tell you anything
Link Posted: 5/29/2003 6:59:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/29/2003 7:01:37 PM EDT by sr15]
Ok, how specific do you want to get? People write entire books on this subject. Here's one of the routines that has worked for me in the past. Keep in mind though that a lot of the working out game is about figuring out what works best for you. Monday: Chest flat bench presses, incline bench presses, flys or pullovers Tuesday: Back lat pulldown, dumbell or cable rows, shrugs, deadlifts Wednesday: Legs squats, leg press or leg extention, leg curls, stiff leg deadlifts, calf raises Thursday: Shoulders military presses, upright rows, side raises Friday: Arms preacher curls, barbell curls, tricep pushdowns, lying tricep extentions or dips When I do this routine, I like to do two warm up sets then three working sets of each exercise. I'll usually do 4-7 reps for two weeks and then 8-12 reps for 1 week. I'll also alternate between dumbells and barbells. I like to do cardio in the morning and then lift weights at night, but if I can't make it to the gym twice a day, I'll lift weights and then do cardio. All of the exercises I listed above are the ones that work best for me. I've tried many others, but those are the ones that my muscles respond well to. You can also use those exercises in some of the routines from the thread I posted above. Also, if you are looking for a cookbook approach to building muscle, check out [url]www.musclenow.com[/url]. The book is $100, but IMO it's worth it if you're looking step-by-step nutrition, cardio, and lifting program. Hope this helps, and good luck.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 3:03:12 AM EDT
Forgive my ignorance...warmup sets?
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 8:46:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/30/2003 1:39:07 PM EDT by Yojimbo]
Below is the workout I use. I like to stick to basics and alternate heavy and moderate weights every week. Depending on how I feel I will go to failure on the last couple sets of each execise. I like to keep things from going stale so some time I will change the excercises around and do something different. Hope this helps![:D] [b]Day 1-Chest, Triceps, Abs and Calves[/b] Chest Flat Bench Press 4x10 Incline Bench Press 3x10 Flat Bench Flyes 2x10-15 Dips 2xFailure Triceps Lying Barbell Extensions(SkullCrushers) 3x10 Cable tricep Pushdowns 3x10 Calves Standing Calve Raises 3x10-20 Seated Calve Raises 3x10-20 Abs Crunches 2x20 Seated Knee Tucks 2x20 Reverse Crunches 2x20 [b]Day 2-Lats, Rear Delt and Abs[/b] Lats Deadlifts 4x10 Bent Rowing 4x10 Pulldowns 4x10 Rear Delts Bent Lateral Raises 5x10 Abs Crunches 2x20 Seated Knee Tucks 2x20 Reverse Crunches 2x20 [b]Day 3-Front and Side Delts, Biceps, Calves and Abs[/b] Biceps Barbell Curls 4x10 Alternate Dumbbell curl 2x10 Delts Military Press 3x10 Side Laterals 3x10 Uprigt Rowing 3x10 Calves Standing Calve Raises 3x10-20 Seated Calve Raises 3x10-20 Abs Crunches 2x20 Bench Knee Tucks 2x20 Reverse Crunches 2x20 [b]Day 4-Legs and Abs[/b] Quads Squats 5x10, 3x5 Leg Extensions 2x20-50 Hams strings SLDL 4x10 Leg Curls 2x20-50 Abs Crunches 2x20 Seated Knee Tucks 2x20 Reverse Crunches 2x20 * Perform 15-40 Minutes of Aerobic activities on the off days. Running, Biking, Sprint/Jog, Rope work. ** If trying to cut weight do 30-40 of aerobics after each workout and also on off days.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 9:11:42 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/30/2003 9:14:59 AM EDT by EdAvilaSr]
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 10:06:19 AM EDT
Yojimbo, how long does that take you each day? How much time between sets changing to anohter excercise? Right now I just take 30 seconds between sets and a minute between excercises.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 1:29:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/30/2003 1:30:37 PM EDT by Yojimbo]
Originally Posted By norman74: Yojimbo, how long does that take you each day? How much time between sets changing to anohter excercise? Right now I just take 30 seconds between sets and a minute between excercises.
View Quote
As you see all the bodyparts are worked on a 4 day split. This split can be used however you want. You can workout for 4 days straight then take a break and repeat the cycle or you can do a session every other day with cardio/aerobic days in between. The weight traing part should take about 45 minutes to 1 hour, it may take 30 minutes longer on heavy days due increased rest time beween sets. If your hitting the weights much longer than that you are not training hard enough. As far as rest between sets goes, 30-45 seconds if you're training light and fast to lose weight and cut-up and 2-3 minutes if your doing heavy weights for power and mass building. When doing the heavy weights I generally rest just long enough so that my breathing returns to normal. Obviously when trying to lose weight you will want to speed up the rest sessions since you're using less weight. Hope this helps!
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 1:54:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/30/2003 1:57:31 PM EDT by skullworks]
This is my workout routine (with which I went from 168lb to 185lb in 6 weeks): Day 1: Chest and Tris Day 2: Shoulders and Biceps Day 3: Day off Day 4: Back, back, and more back Day 5: Legs and whatever other muscle group I want to focus on that week. Day 6&7: Days off I also alternate so that odd weeks I lift heavy on days 1 and 4, and on even weeks I lift heavy on day 2 and 5. I pretty much stick to basic excercise such as incline bench presses and flys, military presses and bent over raises, lat pulls and seated rows, etc etc. I also make sure that keep adding more weights to all my excercises by each week. I had a shoulder injury that kept messing with my progress, but once I limited the number of excercises I do (and cut out regular bench presses) I managed to go from a weak-ass 65lb in military presses to 170lb. My goal is to do 200 by the end of summer. This in combination with Cell-Tech right after workout (or in the morning on days off) and 20 grams of protein every three hours or so throughout the day (except for right after a workout where I down about 40 grams of protein.) I did stay away from cardio while I was using this routine. The routine worked well for me, thought it might be overly simplified for some people as their bodies require more (or less) work to gain mass. I tried a lot of different excercises before I realized that my body responds well to certain specific excercises in order for it to "bulk up." Once it's time for definition, that's when I expect to do a wider variety of excercises. I do have to say that getting a lot of protein and water is, in my eyes, really the key to bulking up. I also limit the amount of time I spend in the gym - I'm usually done in 45 minutes and a loooong workout for me would be 75 minutes (where I might have to work around a machine that is taken etc.) Also, I stay away from any and all illegal supplements, I've been blessed with bad genes as it is (heart problems on my dad's side and cancer on my mom's) and I don't want to further endanger myself by screwing around with steroids etc.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 2:25:04 PM EDT
Great post skull. If you wanna save a lot of money you can make your own cell tech though. Muscletech is way over priced.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 3:38:38 PM EDT
Originally Posted By macho99957: Great post skull.
View Quote
Thank you.
If you wanna save a lot of money you can make your own cell tech though. Muscletech is way over priced.
View Quote
That's what people keep telling me. I've had great success with Cell-Tech, so I've been sticking with it. I've also been told that Cell-Tech is safer than pure Creatine, as it's harder to get the dosage screwed up. We had a guy where I work who OD'd on Creatine, and ended up almost killing his kidneys. Sure, he wasn't exactly the brightest guy around (he's one of those "if 10 grams is good then 20 or 30 has to be great!") but still...
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 3:39:27 PM EDT
Alright, what is cell tech, what does it do, and how do you make your own? I'm steering clear of creatine and other borderline weenie-shrinkers, but I do supplement my natural protein in various ways. One of which is a 30 gram bar at 3pm everyday. I think what I'm going to plan on doing is switching up my current routine to hit one group a day like SR15 posted mon: chest tues: back wed: legs thurs: shoulders fri: arms I work out at home, and I don't have any kind of cable, but otherwise I've got a bench, barbells and dumbells. I'm thining of making some kind of pulley system so I can do various types of pulldowns (tris and lats come to mind). I already have an attachment for preacher curls. I just recently changed up my routine, I had deffinately hit the wall. After doing standard curls those concentration curls are murder, a much longer range of motion.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 4:13:57 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/30/2003 4:15:16 PM EDT by sr15]
Originally Posted By norman74: Alright, what is cell tech, what does it do, and how do you make your own?
View Quote
Don't waste your money on supplements. It's much more important to find a good routine that works for you and to follow a good nutrition plan. Supplements do nothing to promote long term gains. They only sell because of good marketing techniques. Don't buy it. If you use protein powder to supplement your diet, make sure that you are doing just that, supplementing - not substituting. There is no substitute for real food and no supplement will encourage long term gains better than a proper diet, intense training, and enough rest.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 7:55:22 PM EDT
Originally Posted By norman74: Alright, what is cell tech, what does it do, and how do you make your own?
View Quote
Cell-Tech contains creatine, plus some other stuff (not exactly sure what, which might be a bad thing.) What Cell-Tech, and creatine for that matter, does is that it increases the amount of water in your body. More importantly, it allows your muscles to retain more water, which enables protein to be absorbed faster. When first taking Cell-Tech or creatine you can count on gaining a good 5lb in water weight within the first two weeks. Of course, water weight should not be confused with actual muscle gain, but I don't have to tell you that now, do I? It might be interesting to note that an increasing amount of physicians will recommend MS-patients to take creatine as it allows the muscles that are constantly being worked by the uncontrolled muscle spasms to recoupiate faster. So in short; Cell-Tech/creatine enables your body to speed up and increase the amount of protein that your muscles can absorb to generate more musclefibers. A word of caution - when taking Cell-Tech/creatine (or any other supplement for that matter) make sure you get plenty of water or these products can play hell with your kidneys and/or liver.
Link Posted: 5/30/2003 11:07:29 PM EDT
Originally Posted By skullworks: Cell-Tech contains creatine, plus some other stuff (not exactly sure what, which might be a bad thing.)
View Quote
Dextrose (sugar), and ALA (Alpha Lipoic Acid). Both encourage an insulin response, which aids in the transport of creatine to muscle cells.
So in short; Cell-Tech/creatine enables your body to speed up and increase the amount of protein that your muscles can absorb to generate more musclefibers.
View Quote
Actually, creatine has nothing to do with protein, other than it's an amino acid. Creatine is a substance that is produced in the human body by the liver, pancreas, and kidneys. Once produced, creatine is combined with phosphorus to form phosphocreatine. Phosphocreatine is transported to muscle cells by the cardiovascular system. Once creatine reaches muscle cells, it is used to replenish ATP, the muscles energy source, during exercise. Creatine also aids in muscle cell water retention. This added water retention helps combat the adverse effects of lactic acid build up during prolonged strenuous exercise. So, supplementing existing creatine levels already in the body will provide muscle cells with additional ATP and water. This will increase strength, endurance, and water weight while one is supplementing with creatine, but as soon as supplementation is ceased, so are the added benefits. Basically, as I've said above, there are usually no long term benefits to using creatine. For some, creatine does help increase training intensity and that will aid in muscle growth, but IMO one should be capable of intense training without supplements. Take the money you'd spend on supplements and go buy a few ponds of chicken. Your body will get much more out of that.
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 6:09:56 AM EDT
I don't want to take creatine, so that's out.
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 1:40:46 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 3:33:10 PM EDT
Originally Posted By EdAvilaSr:
Originally Posted By sr15: Take the money you'd spend on supplements and go buy a few ponds of chicken.
View Quote
I don't mean to be a wise ass John,but chickens are not in ponds.Those would be fish,which are BTW very good for your diet too! [:D] I always agree with what you say,and creatine does not seem to do me any [red]goog[/red].But lately I have been taking Cell-Tech and I do feel a small diference in my workouts. No doubt it could be mental(placebo effect)
View Quote
I know what a pond is, but what's a goog?
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 3:37:34 PM EDT
Originally Posted By EdAvilaSr:
Originally Posted By sr15: Take the money you'd spend on supplements and go buy a few ponds of chicken.
View Quote
I don't mean to be a wise ass John,but chickens are not in ponds.Those would be fish,which are BTW very good for your diet too! [:D]
View Quote
[:D] Oops...pounds, not ponds.
I always agree with what you say,and creatine does not seem to do me any goog.But lately I have been taking Cell-Tech and I do feel a small diference in my workouts. No doubt it could be mental(placebo effect)
View Quote
No, I believe that the Cell-Tech probably is helping you with your workouts. I've had some good quality creatine that helped me with my workouts too. But I don't think I got any long term benifits from it. That's all I was trying to say. I got short term benifits, but no long term benifits. For me, the real long term gains came when I started eating right.
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 5:28:14 PM EDT
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 5:34:51 PM EDT
Originally Posted By sr15:
Originally Posted By skullworks: So in short; Cell-Tech/creatine enables your body to speed up and increase the amount of protein that your muscles can absorb to generate more musclefibers.
View Quote
Actually, creatine has nothing to do with protein...
View Quote
I think you missed my point when I said "in short..." I oversimplified what Cell-Tech does since few of us on this board are experts on organic chemistry. As both of us already have stated, Cell-Tech makes the muscles retain water, which allows amino acids (from protein) to be absorbed and [insert fancy technical term] into muscle fibers. But we've already covered that, so on to other things. Anyway, one thing that is important to note is that for some of us, I myself is a prime example, who slave away in the gym without seeing any progress it is hard to stick with the workouts in the long run. If there are no visible progress it is very hard to keep going. So, Cell-Tech creates a boost of progress that, to many, creates that mental jump that now allows us to keep going, even if that jump was created by artificial means. So in that sense I would disagree with you about long-term benefits. Maybe not long-term as in the product's direct benefit to your body, but long-term in that it creates a temporary situation that gives you long-term dedication. As EdAvilaSr pointed out, it could be a sort of placebo effect, but if it makes you more committed to sticking with your training regiment, then who cares? Also, if Cell-Tech enables you to gain more muscle-mass faster, how is that not a long term benefit? I'm kinda curious what you see as a long term benefit and what is not? I do agree that proper nutrition is key though.
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 6:59:07 PM EDT
Originally Posted By skullworks:
Originally Posted By sr15:
Originally Posted By skullworks: So in short; Cell-Tech/creatine enables your body to speed up and increase the amount of protein that your muscles can absorb to generate more musclefibers.
View Quote
Actually, creatine has nothing to do with protein...
View Quote
I think you missed my point when I said "in short..." I oversimplified what Cell-Tech does since few of us on this board are experts on organic chemistry. As both of us already have stated, Cell-Tech makes the muscles retain water, which allows amino acids (from protein) to be absorbed and [insert fancy technical term] into muscle fibers.
View Quote
Well, that's not exactly correct, but ok, enough technical discussion. [:)]
Anyway, one thing that is important to note is that for some of us, I myself is a prime example, who slave away in the gym without seeing any progress it is hard to stick with the workouts in the long run. If there are no visible progress it is very hard to keep going.
View Quote
Ahhh, here's the problem. If you are seeing no improvements in the gym, then you have a fundamental problem. That problem is either with your workout routine, your diet, or your rest. Your workout routine looks ok to me, so I'm betting the problem is with your diet. Proper diet is just as important as working out. But whatever the problem is, if you correct it you will see better gains than what Cell-Tech gives you.
So, Cell-Tech creates a boost of progress that, to many, creates that mental jump that now allows us to keep going, even if that jump was created by artificial means. So in that sense I would disagree with you about long-term benefits. Maybe not long-term as in the product's direct benefit to your body, but long-term in that it creates a temporary situation that gives you long-term dedication. As EdAvilaSr pointed out, it could be a sort of placebo effect, but if it makes you more committed to sticking with your training regiment, then who cares?
View Quote
I understand what you are saying. Believe me, I've been there. But that was before I realized how much diet and rest affected my workouts. All I am saying is that there are cheaper, more effective ways to build strength and muscle.
Also, if Cell-Tech enables you to gain more muscle-mass faster, how is that not a long term benefit?
View Quote
Usually once one stops taking creatine/Cell-Tech, the weight and strength gains disappear. So, IMO, you haven't really made any lasting changes.
I'm kinda curious what you see as a long term benefit and what is not?
View Quote
To me, long term gains are gains that don't disappear, as long diet and training remain the same. Simple as that. If one is improving week after week and month after month, then that person is making long term gains.
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 7:03:24 PM EDT
Originally Posted By EdAvilaSr: Two things: [b]sr15 :[/b] At my age,there is no need for long term plans [:D]
View Quote
I don't know about that. You're only a couple of years older than me and I'm making long term plans.[:)]
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 7:24:33 PM EDT
Originally Posted By sr15: Your workout routine looks ok to me, so I'm betting the problem is with your diet. Proper diet is just as important as working out. But whatever the problem is, if you correct it you will see better gains than what Cell-Tech gives you.
View Quote
Actually, I used to have problems making progress, but now I don't. Cell-Tech was one part of the solution.
So, Cell-Tech creates a boost of progress that, to many, creates that mental jump that now allows us to keep going, even if that jump was created by artificial means. So in that sense I would disagree with you about long-term benefits. Maybe not long-term as in the product's direct benefit to your body, but long-term in that it creates a temporary situation that gives you long-term dedication. As EdAvilaSr pointed out, it could be a sort of placebo effect, but if it makes you more committed to sticking with your training regiment, then who cares?
View Quote
I understand what you are saying. Believe me, I've been there. But that was before I realized how much diet and rest affected my workouts. All I am saying is that there are cheaper, more effective ways to build strength and muscle.
View Quote
Well, don't stop - tell us what they are.
Also, if Cell-Tech enables you to gain more muscle-mass faster, how is that not a long term benefit?
View Quote
Usually once one stops taking creatine/Cell-Tech, the weight and strength gains disappear. So, IMO, you haven't really made any lasting changes.
View Quote
If you lose your weight gains after quitting creatine/Cell-Tech you never gained any muscle to begin with, just water weight, which means that (as you implied previously) something else is wrong.
I'm kinda curious what you see as a long term benefit and what is not?
View Quote
To me, long term gains are gains that don't disappear, as long diet and training remain the same. Simple as that. If one is improving week after week and month after month, then that person is making long term gains.
View Quote
Okay but what I am saying is that as in my case I went from 168 to 185 in 6 weeks, and then I stopped taking Cell-Tech. I only lost 3 pounds of water after stopping. But yeah, my strength did weaken some, but that's not a major concern to me. So Cell-Tech allowed me to gain 14lb in 6 weeks, which is still some pretty good gains in my book. I'm not saying that you can't achieve the same long term results without cell-tech. But for some of us it adds to the motivation when the results come a little bit faster.
Link Posted: 5/31/2003 8:45:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/31/2003 9:03:18 PM EDT by sr15]
Originally Posted By skullworks: So Cell-Tech allowed me to gain 14lb in 6 weeks, which is still some pretty good gains in my book.
View Quote
Those are good gains, but I think you are giving too much credit to the Cell-Tech. Most of those gains were probably made because you changed up your workout and/or diet. I will agree that the dextrose in the Cell-Tech was beneficial post workout, but you can get dextrose from other sources.
Well, don't stop - tell us what they are
View Quote
First, look at the routine I posted in the link above. That routine, or something similar is a good way to vary your workouts week by week. Variation is important to prevent hitting a plateau. Also, it is very important to take all of your working sets to failure. Don't just rack the weight because you're tired, keep pushing until you physically can't push anymore. Second, nutrition is just as important as working out. Typically, the best way to make changes to your body is to either add mass, or loose fat, not both at the same time. This is done by adjusting your diet, not your workout (except for added cardio during the loose fat phase). If you are trying to add mass, it is important to eat ... A LOT. Most people don't realize how much they need to eat until they actually start measuring their food. You should be getting at least 1.5-2 grams of protein per pound of body weight per day. So that 20 grams every three hours that you were eating isn't even close to sufficient if you are looking to add mass and strength. Buy a scale and start measuring your food. You'll probably be surprised at how much food this really is. For meat, you can figure about 6g protein per oz. And the only protein sources that count are milk, eggs, yogurt, cheese, beef, chicken, pork, turkey, fish, and soy. The other foods that have protein listed on their nutrition label (peanut butter, bread) have incomplete amino acid profiles and don't promote muscle growth. Protein isn't the only thing that your body needs to build muscle. It also needs carbs. Try to get about twice the amount of carbs as you do protein. Check out [url=http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=113&t=176724&w=searchPop]this thread[/url] to see what IMO is the best way to consume carbs. Insulin is an extremely anabolic hormone, use it to your advantage. Also, don't eliminate fats from your diet either or your testosterone levels will suffer. I try to include unsaturated fat in all of my meals except for pre-post workout meals. Flax oil is an excellent source Omega 3,6,and 9 unsaturated fats. Peanuts and olive are sources of good fat too. Your pre and post workout meals should be the largest meals of the day and should include protein, simple carbs, and complex carbs. My pre/post workout meals while I'm trying to bulk contain about 200g carbs and 80g of protein. Eat at least every three hours. Don't let your body get hungry, ever. If you do, it immediately starts breaking down muscle. When you stop making weight gains, it's time to add more calories. Add about 500 cal/day once you feel you are not improving any longer. Finally, don't forget about sleep. It's very important to get enough sleep ever night, as this is when growth hormone is secreted. Well, those are the basic ideas I follow and they've worked well for me. Edited to add: And don't forget about drinking water. Consuming at least a gallon of water a day is a must.
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 1:43:43 PM EDT
SR15, WOW your workout routine is exactly like mine. that's cool. I recently broke up arms to Triceps on Friday and Bi's on Sat. IT's AWESOME. you sound like you know what you're talking about.
Link Posted: 6/3/2003 8:35:11 PM EDT
Sr15 is right on. You don't gain in the gym, you gain during the next three days when you're sore as hell. Sleep and diet are just as important as your workout.
Link Posted: 6/4/2003 6:45:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/4/2003 6:49:22 PM EDT by skullworks]
Originally Posted By MP906: Sr15 is right on. You don't gain in the gym, you gain during the next three days when you're sore as hell. Sleep and diet are just as important as your workout.
View Quote
I agree, but what I have been trying to say is that Cell-Tech speeds up the time it take for you to recoupiate (ie, when you can start moving without feeling to sore.) Using Cell-Tech and the already stated routine I have had good results (by my standards.) The information I have provided might be of some help to some of you guys, whereas others such as sr15 might prefer not to use any nutritional supplements. It's all a question of taste. I'm not going to say that sr15 is wrong by not using supplements, it's just two different ways of achieving more or less the same results. My results might have come faster than sr15's, but then again he is probably very proud (and rightfully so) over the results he has achieved using his methods. Whatever method anyone else chose to use is of no concern to me, you go use all the supplements you can afford, or absolutely none, whatever your heart might desire. What it comes down to in the end is how dedicated you are to achieveing the results you want. You can take all the supplements you want without any positive results, just as you can take no supplements and have great results. Learn to listen to your body before you start using products such as Cell-Tech. Make sure that you get proper nutrition and plenty of sleep (just as sr15 said) before you start complaining about poor results. If your after workout nutrition consists of having a Big Mac on the way to your favorite bar there's a good chance neither my advice nor sr15's will do you any good. However, there's always a risk that you will have to sacrifice something; for example, the hours I keep (due to my job) does not provide me with the consistent amount of sleep that I would like to receive. I do try to compensate by making sure that my nutrition is as ideal as possible (even though I don't eat poultry) and that I pay as close attention as possible to my body. I think that pretty much sums it all up.
Link Posted: 6/4/2003 8:43:07 PM EDT
Ok, one more time, then I'm through. [:)]
Originally Posted By skullworks: Using Cell-Tech and the already stated routine I have had good results (by my standards.) The information I have provided might be of some help to some of you guys, whereas others such as sr15 might prefer not to use any nutritional supplements.
View Quote
Just FYI, I've tried most of the popular supplements out there. I prefer not to use them now because I never really kept any of the gains I made and most of the serious BB's or powerlifters I know have the same experiences. For me, the real gains came when I finally figured this diet thing out.
It's all a question of taste. I'm not going to say that sr15 is wrong by not using supplements, it's just two different ways of achieving more or less the same results.
View Quote
Wait a second, how do you know what my results are? If your goal is 200 lbs on the military press by the end of the summer, I assure you, my results are much better. [;)]
My results might have come faster than sr15's, but then again he is probably very proud (and rightfully so) over the results he has achieved using his methods.
View Quote
The faster the results come, the faster they go.
Link Posted: 6/4/2003 8:51:01 PM EDT
Originally Posted By letsgetiton: SR15, WOW your workout routine is exactly like mine. that's cool. I recently broke up arms to Triceps on Friday and Bi's on Sat. IT's AWESOME.
View Quote
Actually, the routine I posted in this thread is not the one I'm currently using. But yes, it is a good one. I go back to it from time to time. The routine I'm using now is in [url=http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=1&f=113&t=183077&w=searchPop]this thread[/url].
you sound like you know what you're talking about.
View Quote
If only I looked like I did, I'd be all set.[:)] I've been doing lots of reading the past few years. There's a wealth of information out there and it's pretty fascinating to me.
Link Posted: 6/5/2003 9:44:08 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/5/2003 9:53:07 AM EDT by skullworks]
Originally Posted By sr15:
Originally Posted By skullworks: Using Cell-Tech and the already stated routine I have had good results (by my standards.) The information I have provided might be of some help to some of you guys, whereas others such as sr15 might prefer not to use any nutritional supplements.
View Quote
Just FYI, I've tried most of the popular supplements out there. I prefer not to use them now because I never really kept any of the gains I made and most of the serious BB's or powerlifters I know have the same experiences. For me, the real gains came when I finally figured this diet thing out.
View Quote
Like I've stated perviously it doesn't matter. [b]You[/b] didn't have the results you expected when using these products. [b]I[/b] had great success when using them. I can therefore make the point that my body responds different to these supplements than your's do. You can continue to state that you didn't get the results you wanted by using supplements until you're blue in the face, it won't change the fact that I had good results.
It's all a question of taste. I'm not going to say that sr15 is wrong by not using supplements, it's just two different ways of achieving more or less the same results.
View Quote
Wait a second, how do you know what my results are?
View Quote
Okay, so I assumed that you had had good results (not a set defined result, but good results,) I gave you the benefit of the doubt that you actually walk the walk and that you're not one of those anonymous couch potatoes who will claim to know everything about how to succeed in the gym when their only practical experience of lifting anything is to move a can of Rolling Rock from their computer desk or livingroom table.
If your goal is 200 lbs on the military press by the end of the summer, I assure you, my results are much better. [;)]
View Quote
Go back and read through my first couple of posts in this thread. I had a shoulder injury that precluded me from even lifting a third of that back in January. I hope to go past 200, but I like to set obtainable goals. Also, if you've been reading about this stuff for the past few years, how long have you been working out? If you've been working out for longer than that I would certainly expect you to do more than 200 in seated military presses. I started out slowly lifting last year, and it was back in January I made a serious commitment to what I was doing in the gym. Regardless, what I meant by results was not a set weight, but rather an individual goal. You might focus on how much weight you can lift, whereas I (regardless of the mentioning of a stated goal for military presses) am more concerned about my overall body composition.
My results might have come faster than sr15's, but then again he is probably very proud (and rightfully so) over the results he has achieved using his methods.
View Quote
The faster the results come, the faster they go.
View Quote
Like I said, that's [b]you're[/b] experience. However, provided that I was to quit working out and did absolutely no physical activities, yeah I'd probably lose my strength and body composition real quick, but then I know my body responds that way regardless of whether or not I use supplements.
Link Posted: 6/5/2003 11:48:48 AM EDT
Ok. Hey, most of working out is finding out what works for you. If you're happy with the results that you're seeing, then you probably shouldn't change anything. Although I do think you could see the same results by adjusting your diet. Proper nutrition is one thing that work for everyone. Anyway, I was just passing along some information that I've learned over the years. Take it or leave it, it doesn't matter to me. Also, just as a side note, if you've already had a shoulder injury, you might find rotator cuff exercises helpful. Good luck and I hope you get that 200 lbs soon.
Link Posted: 6/5/2003 12:15:34 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 6/5/2003 12:19:22 PM EDT by skullworks]
Originally Posted By sr15: Ok. Hey, most of working out is finding out what works for you. If you're happy with the results that you're seeing, then you probably shouldn't change anything. Although I do think you could see the same results by adjusting your diet. Proper nutrition is one thing that work for everyone.
View Quote
I will never disagree that proper nutrition is fundamental. The funny thing though is that what we have different opinions on are nutritional supplements, not the nutrition in itself. But like we've both said - we have provided others with information on what has worked for us, and it's up to them to figure out which way they want to go. You tried "my" way and didn't care for it, and there's a good chance that I end up cutting Cell-Tech out of the picture for me too. But not quite yet. Another thing that is important, and I can't remember if either of us have touched on this yet (I sure hope we have, cause it's important,) is that one continues to tweak one's regiment. I'm not saying that you should give something up completely, but at times you need to try something new if even just to chock your body and force it to adjust to something it hasn't done before. This could be that you change the order of how you work out; sets, reps, whatever. It could be nutrition (maybe change the protein to carb ratio for a week or two.) You can't expect any real progress if you're doing the exact same thing over and over without changing anything. (Isn't that the definition of insanity; continously doing the same thing over and over yet expecting a different result?) I see people who get in the gym and they use the exact same weights as they used when I first entered the gym, and sure, for maintenance purposes that works, but not for someone who wants to change (ie improve.)
Also, just as a side note, if you've already had a shoulder injury, you might find rotator cuff exercises helpful.
View Quote
Any specific exercise you're thinking of. It seemed as though when I started to focus on standing rows, seated shoulder presses (with back support,) and shrugs, my shoulder stopped giving me crap. Also, when doing lat pulldown, I never do them behind my head anymore. That was a big one as I noticed my shoulder would ache the day after my back workout.
Good luck and I hope you get that 200 lbs soon.
View Quote
Not knowing what your goals are, I hope you have the same.
Link Posted: 6/7/2003 10:59:34 AM EDT
Originally Posted By skullworks:
Also, just as a side note, if you've already had a shoulder injury, you might find rotator cuff exercises helpful.
View Quote
Any specific exercise you're thinking of.
View Quote
[url=http://familydoctor.org/handouts/265.html]These exercises[/url] are helpful for me. You can also do the same movement using one of those big rubber band things that attaches to a door or the cable cross over machine.
Link Posted: 6/7/2003 12:14:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By sr15:
Originally Posted By skullworks:
Also, just as a side note, if you've already had a shoulder injury, you might find rotator cuff exercises helpful.
View Quote
Any specific exercise you're thinking of.
View Quote
[url=http://familydoctor.org/handouts/265.html]These exercises[/url] are helpful for me. You can also do the same movement using one of those big rubber band things that attaches to a door or the cable cross over machine.
View Quote
Gotcha. Yeah, I've tried them before. The really weird thing is that I tried them (with rubber bands) but just ended in more pain. Now I'm pain-free though. I think my body has something against me. [>:/]
Link Posted: 6/7/2003 1:00:20 PM EDT
Originally Posted By skullworks: Gotcha. Yeah, I've tried them before. The really weird thing is that I tried them (with rubber bands) but just ended in more pain. Now I'm pain-free though. I think my body has something against me. [>:/]
View Quote
Yeah, they do hurt for the first couple of weeks, but then the pain subsides. Applying ice after the exercises helps. Muscles respond well to repetitive high resistance movements. Joints do not. Most people who have been working out for a long time have joint problems in at lest one joint.
Link Posted: 6/7/2003 1:14:58 PM EDT
Originally Posted By sr15:
Originally Posted By skullworks: Gotcha. Yeah, I've tried them before. The really weird thing is that I tried them (with rubber bands) but just ended in more pain. Now I'm pain-free though. I think my body has something against me. [>:/]
View Quote
Yeah, they do hurt for the first couple of weeks, but then the pain subsides. Applying ice after the exercises helps.
View Quote
The pain that I got was the same as when I had my injury, so I stopped doing the excercises.
Muscles respond well to repetitive high resistance movements. Joints do not. Most people who have been working out for a long time have joint problems in at lest one joint.
View Quote
Ain't that the sad truth.
Top Top