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Posted: 5/8/2002 3:12:43 AM EDT
A little info on creatine I get in a monthly news letter. I am personally a believer in the supplement.... [:)] Realist Is creatine and protein a bad combination? The basic strategy of creatine supplementation is quite straightforward.  Simply, it is to increase muscle creatine content through increased creatine intake.  Although generally producing an effect this approach is somewhat naive.  Creatine transport into skeletal muscle is a complicated process requiring that muscle be in a receptive state. Creatine gets into skeletal muscle by the action of creatine transporters on the muscle surface.  Among other factors, insulin increases the activity of these creatine transporters.  This is similar to the stimulatory effect that insulin has on amino acid transport into cells and isn’t too surprising since creatine is closely related to amino acids. By deduction, anything that increases insulin release should also enhance creatine absorption by skeletal muscle.  This hypothesis turned out to be mostly true.  In 1996 is was shown by Dr. Paul Greenhaff’s group in the UK that taking creatine with glucose (releases insulin) enhanced creatine absorption by almost 60%!  At the time this caused a lot of excitement in the sports nutrition field.  Unfortunately, the amount of glucose needed to get this effect (~100 grams of sugar for each 5 grams of creatine) approached the level of sweetness tolerated by most individuals. Lately it has been shown that the combination of protein and simple carbohydrates has a greater effect than that of carbohydrates alone in releasing insulin.  This finding, in conjunction with the possible ill side effects of ingestion large amounts of sugars (carbohydrates), prompted Dr. Greenhaff and colleagues to examine the combined effects of protein and sugar on creatine uptake.
Link Posted: 5/8/2002 3:19:55 AM EDT
The Study Twelve healthy male volunteers (mean age 27 years) participated in the study. They were asked to refrain from strenuous exercise, protein and alcohol intake for 24 hours before commencing the study. They also had to be clean of creatine use for at least three months prior to commencing the study. These precautions were necessary since all of these factors influence the effectiveness of creatine and could influence the outcome of the study. Subjects were given creatine in combination with carbohydrates with or without protein. In all, four conditions were tested: Condition 1. Creatine (5 grams) and very low carbohydrates (5 grams glucose). Placebo Condition. Condition 2. Creatine (5 grams) and low carbohydrates (50 grams glucose). Condition 3. Creatine (5 grams) and high carbohydrates (96 grams of glucose). Condition 4. Creatine (5 grams) and carbohydrates (47 grams of glucose) and protein (50 grams of milk protein). Afterwards their blood insulin levels and the amount of creatine retained by the body were measured. Results This study found that the combination of protein and carbohydrates (Condition 4) increased insulin release and consequently muscle creatine absorption to the same extent as high carbohydrates alone (Condition 3). Furthermore, this augmentation in creatine absorption was much greater than that observed with either placebo (Condition 1) or low carbohydrates (Condition 2). Importantly, the increase in creatine retention with carbohydrates and protein (Condition 4) was 25% greater than that observed with placebo (Condition 1). Take your creatine with protein and carbohydrates! There are several advantages to doing this: First, the combination of protein and carbohydrates increases creatine absorption via the actions of insulin. Secondly, you only need to take half as much sugars to get the same boost in creatine absorption. Lastly, adding protein to your creatine mixture promotes the production of new muscle proteins.
Link Posted: 5/8/2002 5:19:38 AM EDT
Link Posted: 5/8/2002 8:44:46 PM EDT
hey ed sr. i'm having a problem with creatine giving me the urge to go poop about 30 min after in ingest it,liquid excrement. i usually mix 10 gms of creatine with 2 tblespoons of honey,diluted in water,16 oz. post work out. i would hate to ingest this combo then go do some full squats. rescue92
Link Posted: 5/8/2002 8:47:44 PM EDT
Ed, I had later heard that the product I was taking was Bogus.. but I felt I was seeing incredible strentgh and lack of Muscle fatigue using it. I never used a transport system... Just fresh water afterwards. I Kept the liquid form in mouth and under my tongue for a few minutes before swallowing. Twenty minutes before workout. I was always against taking any Protein directly after a workout as to keep the Blood in Muscle and not being drawn to your stomach for digesting. I guess I was wrong about that [rolleyes] The Product was ATP Advantage Creatine Serum by Muscle Marketing USA.
Link Posted: 5/9/2002 5:40:18 AM EDT
Link Posted: 5/9/2002 9:00:56 AM EDT
No ideas on the pooping issue, but I just wanted to add my input to the thread. I have been drinking a protein shake every morning for the last 45 days. I have a fairly rigorous workout routine, mixing cardiovascular and strength training. The shake is Protoplex by Precision Engineering. I also take Ripped Fuel by Twin Labs. I was using straight chromium picolinate, but found I was getting little effect from the pure stuff. I am still getting back to "cut" shape following a pretty serious knee injury which prevented my training for about five months. I have noticed a HUGE difference in my stamina and muscle recovery since beginning the shake/Ripped Fuel combo, and my size and definition are definitely taking a turn for the better. I was just curious if you guys are having similar results and with what supplements. BigGun
Link Posted: 5/9/2002 11:22:23 AM EDT
Link Posted: 5/9/2002 8:47:12 PM EDT
i think i figured out what i am doing wrong with my post work out creatine. i have ultimate nutrition creatine that i have beens using. well i mix and slam it down,today i took my time to finish off my cocktail,about 30 min. no problems today. are you guys cycling your creatine??? i have been going 20 days on 20 off. rescue92
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 4:15:11 AM EDT
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 9:16:21 AM EDT
Originally Posted By realist By deduction, anything that increases insulin release should also enhance creatine absorption by skeletal muscle.  This hypothesis turned out to be mostly true.  In 1996 is was shown by Dr. Paul Greenhaff’s group in the UK that taking creatine with glucose (releases insulin) enhanced creatine absorption by almost 60%!  At the time this caused a lot of excitement in the sports nutrition field.  Unfortunately, the amount of glucose needed to get this effect (~100 grams of sugar for each 5 grams of creatine) approached the level of sweetness tolerated by most individuals.
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A healthy dose of Grape Juice will mimic an insulin response to absorb creatine. Creatine and Caffeine don't mix. Caffeine dehydrates. FWIW-Excessive water amounts in a cell can lead to cancers starting and growing at an abnormal rate.(something I read)
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 10:32:40 AM EDT
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 11:48:02 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/10/2002 12:07:21 PM EDT by Nekkid80]
Originally Posted By EdAvilaSr: Nekkid, The juice with all the sugar in it would produce an insulin response(it would not mimic it)thus facilitating the absorption of creatine.
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I was thinking along the lines of making, telling, tricking, poor word choice.
I don't know about the "too much water in the cells causing cancer". For now,as far as I know,that does not happen.[:)]
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There is proof cancer grows faster in hydrated cells. Causing it???? I don't know. When did the FDA approve Creatine?[:D]
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