Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Site Notices
Posted: 5/6/2002 1:54:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/6/2002 2:05:33 PM EDT by SteyrAUG]
I have cross trained with both asian style martial artists and american boxers. I can sum them up as such... 1. Martial artists - Most lethal techniques combined with substandard conditioning and lack of practical experience. 2. Boxers - Superb conditioning, real time experience but hindered by confines of sport. I love to cross train the two. I enjoy the expression on a black belts face when he gets knocked on his ass for the first time. I also enjoy the look of horror when a boxer reamins standing after 3 really good hits. I also enjoy a boxers frustration when a talented martial artist takes him outside his realm of experience. I love watching boxers have their legs attacked. I love to see them locked, chocked and pinned out. Because, ultimately the above helps both parties. Martial artists are incredibly skilled with a dangerous arsenal of technique. But rarely do they train in a practical way. Seldom are they as conditioned as a boxer. They usually cannot take real hits and stay in the fight. They often have never really hit anybody before. This is because most martial arts are studied in a non contact academic manner. Kinda like learning to swim but never getting in the water. Boxers are in shape. But they have a woefully innadequate arsenal. Their defense is based on the presumption of 10-14oz. gloves for additional coverage, they don't block. They have a mere handful of strikes that become predictable regardless of the combinations used. And they have no finishing techniques. If they cannot land a knockout, they cannot win. So if you are a martial artist, train like a boxer. If you are a boxer, fight like a martial artist. Another item of note. Boxers condition their entire bodies EXCEPT for their hands. Martial artists coincidentally often condition ONLY their hands. Funny huh... Result is boxers who get into real fights almost always break their hands. Without wraps and gloves to protect them boxers generate far more power and force than their hands can sustain. Martial artists on the other hand, generally genereate much less power but manage a greater capacity for destruction of the target. And here is the secret... [url]http://ctr.usf.edu/shotokan/makiwara.html[/url] It's called a "makiwara" and is designed to build hard hands for striking without sustaining injury. [img]http://ctr.usf.edu/shotokan/images/makiwara.gif[/img] They are simply made and incredibly effective. Most will skip the "straw makiwara" route for simpler designs. I use (2) 2x4s one 6ft. and one 3 ft. I screw them together to support each other but let the top unsuported 3 ft. section flex. I bury them 1 1/2 feet below ground ending up with a 4 1/2 ft. tall target. For the striking area I use a 1" rubber pad inside a large towel folded and wrapped around the top of the post. This gives me the rubber target on the striking face and several layers of thick towel. I then bind the towel in place by cords at the top and bottom of the padded area. You can protect it from rain by placing a bucket over it.
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 1:55:21 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/6/2002 2:01:53 PM EDT by SteyrAUG]
When struck correctly you flex the 2x4 with each strike as you attempt to penetrate the target with driving force. After several reps it feels as if you are striking bare wood. Use extreme caution at first as the wrist and knuckles will be vulnerable and prone to injury. This is a gradual process of hardening the hands. The idea is moderate continuos reps not a few full power strikes. I do 500 strikes a day and have done so almost uninterupted for the last 10 years. Though my reps used to be only 200 (100 each hand). Again be very careful. Soreness is normal, blood splatter is not. 50 moderate strikes is more beneficial thatn 10 massive hits. Editted to add: Beginners will proably want to use a single 2x4 for the striking post. This gives reasonable flex with good resistance. I have used 3x4 fence posts but found them unable to be flexed. The result is the energy is returned to the body causing frequent injury. I only use 3x4s for conditioning the feet as kicks are quickly withdrawn from the target surface. 3x4s also do not absord as much use and eventually snap at the base. 2x4s and double 2x4s will also eventually break but are easily replaced for a few dollars.
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 6:48:59 PM EDT
SteyrAUG, Good post. I agree, cross training is the key. I know some full contact fighters and they all study more than one system. I'd hate to get into a fight without knowing both striking and ground fighting techniques, because you never know how things will end up.
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 8:07:49 PM EDT
What most people don't know is "styles" is a post Meiji Restoration (1867) phenomena . With the unification of Japan fighting methods for practical combat were not as necessary and the Samurai classes were abolished. As a result fighting methods underwent a conversion from "Jutsu" (Technique or Method) to "Do"(Way or Path.) Jujutsu became Judo, Kenjutsu became Kendo and so on. So fighting methods went from pure "practical methods" to "ways of life with Zen influences." As the Do became more suited to individuals in peacetime, Karate-Do(as evolved from Karate-Jutsu)branched into various styles. Rather than master all prominent methods, as was done in the preMeiji times of conflict, the complete mastery of a single style was now prominent. This is akin to those who specialize in firearms. While there will always be those who are expert with ONLY the handgun or high power rifle, the person who must fight in combat usually finds it prudent to master all common arms that may be encountered or employed. And this is nothing new.
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 8:23:58 PM EDT
This is one thing I like about the system I'm involved in (budo tai[b]jutsu[/b]). Tons of variety. It's like the boy scouts with lots of butt-whipping thrown in. Everything from tying knots to tying people in knots. Hands, feet, teeth, knives, sticks, guns, everything. I've gotten punched in the face more than once when I wasn't on the ball because we always attack with the intention to make contact with our partner. In my particular group, we probably don't do as much free-style sparring as we should, but it's definitely the most practical system I've ever seen. A karate or tae kwon do kata doesn't do sh!t for you when some wannabe Gracie has you pinned.
Link Posted: 5/6/2002 9:42:40 PM EDT
On the topic of kata... It has been my experience that 99% of those who practice and teach them, haven't got a fricking clue as to what the hell they are doing. They may as well do the Tango. Kata is NOT and NEVER WAS a long technique with the assumption that attackers would wait their turn and attack you with the CORRECT predetermined strike. Long ago when Karate (Tode to be correct) was a secret, the most valuable techniques were cataloged in a sequenced form so that they would not be forgotten and could be more easily passed down to generations. It was also a useful way to practice the most common techniques. Kata contain many individual techniques that are merely strung together training purposes. If you are not aware of the individual techniqes and applications (Bunkai), but only know the form itself, they are completely useless except as a means of exercise. When attacked one does not start to do a KATA! Only a idiot would even think this. And unfortunately many of them are teaching. But you can use "techniques" from kata as they are applicable IF you know them. It has further been my experience that those who criticize kata have never learned one correctly. If they had, they would understand they already DO apply kata when they fight and spar without even knowing it. Sorry to rant, but this is very, very basic information that every martial artist SHOULD know. I sometimes get distressed by how much correct information is NOT taught or known.
Link Posted: 5/7/2002 4:51:49 AM EDT
Link Posted: 5/7/2002 4:58:37 AM EDT
improvise weapons. like take your belt and run it thru a locked pad lock and fold the belt over. it makes a nasty flail and you can take it onboard an airplane.
Link Posted: 5/7/2002 5:25:20 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/7/2002 5:26:49 AM EDT by fizassist]
SteyrAUG, I agree that there's nothing wrong with kata; they are indeed useful for cataloguing and practicing series of movements. It's just that most arts don't teach them correctly, as you say. That's why I singled out karate & tae kwon do; I very rarely see kata taught in a useful way in "belt factories". [flame retardant]I'm not implying that all karate & tkd schoools are belt factories, just that most belt factories are karate & tkd schools.[/flame retardant]. In the taijutsu class i attend, we mix up the kata (of course we have them) as much as possible, changing the order, the direction, the height, the attack, etc. That rids one of the conditioning to do movements in the "right" order and teaches how to flow between different attacks and defenses (albiet a somewhat arbitrary distinction). But I should note that the order cannot be entirely random, because a lot of the kata we practice involve systematic attacks on the nervous system. Attacking the proper kyusho in a certain order has a delightful effect. [smash] (edited because I haven't been practicing spelling no kata)
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 8:50:04 PM EDT
Hey, didn't Stevel Segal make a "makiwara" in "Hard To Kill"?
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 9:29:55 PM EDT
Originally Posted By SNorman: Hey, didn't Stevel Segal make a "makiwara" in "Hard To Kill"?
View Quote
Yes, a very hokey ineffectual one, but yes he did. And that is just Steve's way.
Link Posted: 5/10/2002 9:55:31 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/10/2002 9:57:30 PM EDT by Pthfndr]
"Practical Combat Conditioning".....hmmmm. I've taken martial arts of various styles over the years but one of my early instructors had the best advice. Be aware of what's going on around you, be in good physical shape, and NEVER fight fair. He said most all people are mentally conditioned to fight fair and as such are at a disadvantage to one who fights to win at all costs. He told me as part of the martial arts discipline (taught at that particular place), try to avoid the fight if possible. But if you must fight assume your life is at stake and do whatever it takes to stop your opponent even if it means ripping their eyes out or their balls off. None of this standing there trying to spar and duke it out toe to toe. It's kind of like using a firearm - if you are going to point your gun at someone you damned well better be mentally prepared to put a lot of bullets in them without thinking about the fact that you might "hurt" them. That reminds me. I have got to stop smoking and start running up the mountain again [:)]
Link Posted: 5/11/2002 6:27:30 AM EDT
Top Top