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Posted: 9/8/2010 8:15:26 AM EDT
Ok Im 23 years old, I am on a high protein diet including 2 whey protein shakes a day including other protein sources. So I would say my diet is ok although I am planning on increasing overall calorie intake. My main question is can you guys give me some tips for the actual work out. I want to get bigger but not look like a beef cake. Im not looking to be in a commercial or body building just add some mass. Like reps, sets, and should I do more then 1 work out per day.

I use free weight mainly focusing on my pecks, shoulders, arms and abs. Not to much on the legs(thats what the running is for).I have seen some improvement and my max's have been going up. Was 4 weeks into it and had to take a 3 week break because I pulled something in my back at work. But now I've started again.

As always thanks for the help.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:16:25 AM EDT
Push-ups.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:16:45 AM EDT
lift till you see Illidan..
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:18:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/8/2010 8:19:29 AM EDT by hsracer201]
I'm in the same boat bud. I've been doing a lot of reading as well and it seems that you/we need:

-more calories, many more calories
-don't work out too much. twice or three times a week is plenty. Do small sets of heavy weights for about an hour tops. Too much cardio and/or too little weight with too many reps will counter-act trying to put on muscle. That tones down what you already have and makes it more defined.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:18:08 AM EDT
Work out your legs too. I have heard that it will help all over your body for some reason.

I would consider cutting it to 1 protein shake per day. I think it can help cause kidney stones.

Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:18:19 AM EDT
In before you are 60 and have saggy man titties.

Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:19:51 AM EDT
If you aren't doing squats and deadlifts, start doing them today.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:21:39 AM EDT
Go to the Self Defense and Fitness forum
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:21:51 AM EDT
3-5 sets of 5-8 reps. 3 or so workouts a week.

Running will not build very much strength or size in the lower body, add barbell squats and deadlifts.

Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:22:16 AM EDT
Running ain't gonna build leg muscle.

Squats and deadlifts. Do em.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:24:52 AM EDT
I increased my bench press max in high school doing a "pyramid" workout.

I did a sets of 8, 6, 4, 2 then back up (reduce the amount of weight on when going back up) or 12, 8, 4, 2 then back up. Just be sure that you have a spotter.

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/sclark45.htm

Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:26:17 AM EDT
You are EXACTLY what you eat. LOTS of protein, at least as much as your body can metabolize.....theres a rule of thumb that goes by body weight but I forget, google it.

There are also a lot of good Creatines on the market today that wont "beefcake" bloat you like they used to, excellent for strength gains.

If you want to get big/strong focus on low rep HEAVY weight, if you want ripped do heavy cardio with high rep medium weight.

Isopure Protein shakes worked wonders for me but a tad expensive.

It can get expensive but of course that's relative.

Putting on slabs of muscle is a long dedicated process unless you get into steroids which I dont recommend. Many unwanted side effects and your body goes into a catabolic state as soon as you quit meaning you will lose all gains if not more as your body has stopped producing its own testosterone......very bad.

Work hard and eat right, no substitute.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:27:22 AM EDT
You are EXACTLY what you eat. LOTS of protein, at least as much as your body can metabolize.....theres a rule of thumb that goes by body weight but I forget, google it.

There are also a lot of good Creatines on the market today that wont "beefcake" bloat you like they used to, excellent for strength gains.

If you want to get big/strong focus on low rep HEAVY weight, if you want ripped do heavy cardio with high rep medium weight.

Isopure Protein shakes worked wonders for me but a tad expensive.

It can get expensive but of course that's relative.

Putting on slabs of muscle is a long dedicated process unless you get into steroids which I dont recommend. Many unwanted side effects and your body goes into a catabolic state as soon as you quit meaning you will lose all gains if not more as your body has stopped producing its own testosterone......very bad.

Work hard and eat right, no substitute.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:28:22 AM EDT
Protein and lots of it. At least 1 gram per lean body weight. Lift heavy and lower reps.

If I had your height and weight I would know what you need to do...
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:28:43 AM EDT
Originally Posted By msprooch:
Ok Im 23 years old, I am on a high protein diet including 2 whey protein shakes a day including other protein sources. So I would say my diet is ok although I am planning on increasing overall calorie intake. My main question is can you guys give me some tips for the actual work out. I want to get bigger but not look like a beef cake. Im not looking to be in a commercial or body building just add some mass. Like reps, sets, and should I do more then 1 work out per day.

I use free weight mainly focusing on my pecks, shoulders, arms and abs. Not to much on the legs(thats what the running is for).I have seen some improvement and my max's have been going up. Was 4 weeks into it and had to take a 3 week break because I pulled something in my back at work. But now I've started again.

As always thanks for the help.


Honestly, sounds gay, but P90x is good if you want to build, just do their suggestion of more weight/less reps. That's if youre going for moderate size increase and want to cut fat at the same time. Other than that, gym is good. Stick to a weight where you get the good burn at around 8-10 reps if you want to increase size, 12-15 if you want strength, 15-20 if you want tone. Divide up your workout into muscle groups (tri's and chest, back, bi's, and shoulders), vary the exercises that you do each time. Example: Don't just do flat bench for chest for 6 months, or you aren't going to be using the full range of your muscles. Switch it up. Try flat bench with the bar for 3 weeks, then try it with dumbells for 3 weeks, then maybe a machine the next time.

Try exercises that combine muscle groups and are based on natural movments of your body. Pullups kick ass, and work a ton of muscles. Pushups, dumbell bench, same thing. You can beefcake it up and isolate if you want, but you will get that beefcake look too, and your support muscles won't be as strong as they could be either.

For abs, no shit, P90x has the best ab workout ive ever seen or done. It will kick your ass if you do it right. Borrow the DVD from someone if you don't believe me.

Space your protein out too. Try three shakes at .75 of the recommended dose. Your body can only absorb a certain amount of protein at a time.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:36:25 AM EDT
That's right. Running does not make for big legs.

However, years and years of skateboarding on mostly flat land DOES. Been there, done that...had the tree trunk legs to prove it.


Get into a well-equipped gym, if only to learn more about the range of exercises and equipment that are available to you. See what
the more well muscled guys do in their routines. It'll give you some clues.

You're young enough that you don't need to worry about a few things that are factors that us older guys have to contend with.
I take a lot of supplements as well as DHEA, creatine, and L-Arginine daily. You'd certainly have no need for DHEA at 23.
(For maintenance of testosterone levels...allegedly.)

Work your ass out until you're so tired you have to drag yourself out of the gym. Do this at least twice a week but don't overdo it. Three times
is fine, four may be pushing it. Five certainly is. It's OK to alternate, though. In fact, it's a good idea. Weights on Monday, Wednesday, and Friday, cardio on Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday. Sunday do nothing.

If you want to put on muscle, you've got to work for it. Your nutrition helps. Complex carbs for fuel, protein for building muscle. You need
enough of each. But no high protein diet alone is going to do it for you if you're not busting your ass under heavy weights on a frequent basis.

Weight ranges...if you're going for mass, hit the heaviest weights that you can manage. If you can't do six reps, it's too much for you. If you can do more than 10 reps, add more weight. This applies to all repetition sets. If you're going for max weight lifts, you will of course
not be expected to crank out six reps at your new personal best lift.

The excerises you hate the most are the ones you need the most. As you get stronger, they get easier and you don't hate them as much.
It's the ones you hate that probably identify your greatest weaknesses.


Balance your workouts. If you work your chest, work your back, too. Biceps work has to be balanced with triceps. Quads have to be balanced with hamstrings.

Don't neglect the machines circuit. If you do them ALL, you'll be exercising everything. You may prefer free weights but let the machines
help teach you what good form is and what exercises help you in a given spot.

And, always...form and quality over simply moving the weight. Curls at 50 pounds, slowly and in perfect form, are better for you than simply
tossing around 80 pounds in a vaguely curl-like attempt at exercise.


CJ


CJ
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 8:44:07 AM EDT
work them legs too

squats and deadlifts are a must IMO

if your skinny eat big and drink milk
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 11:39:51 AM EDT
I'm shocked no one has mentioned the book "Starting Strength" by Mark Rippetoe.

Buy it, read it, follow the progression until you are through with it.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 12:14:08 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Chizzle:
I'm shocked no one has mentioned the book "Starting Strength" by Mark Rippetoe.

Buy it, read it, follow the progression until you are through with it.


this. someone posted here once, "lift big, eat big, sleep big, get big." sounds stupid, but it's solid advice (i'm not huge, but i did manage to put on a lean 20lbs). look into crossfit also. not to knock p90x, but i've never seen a "big" person on it, although it will burn some fat off you and increase strength (so i'm told). YMMV.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 12:19:25 PM EDT
Look up "Heavy Duty" and Mike Menzter. You want mass, that'll do.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 12:20:24 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Chizzle:
I'm shocked no one has mentioned the book "Starting Strength" by Mark Rippetoe.

Buy it, read it, follow the progression until you are through with it.

Well, technically if he would follow the link above to the fitness forum he would have seen it stickied. Here is the direct link though:

http://media.ar15.com/media/viewFile.html?i=2311
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 4:06:10 PM EDT
how much cardio would you all consider to much cardio for someone in his situation? cause I am in a similar one, and must run every morning at least 3 miles for ROTC (i live in Louisiana so you can't step outside without sweating your balls off.) I bought some protein cause i lift weights at least 3x's a week, but had a guy at the gym tell me if i want to gain weight to cut the cardio out all together or else your wasting your money on protein?

What do yall think?

-not trying to hijack this guys thread, just figured no need to start a new one
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 9:22:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/8/2010 9:26:46 PM EDT by JasonC]
Originally Posted By bushyM4A1:
how much cardio would you all consider to much cardio for someone in his situation? cause I am in a similar one, and must run every morning at least 3 miles for ROTC (i live in Louisiana so you can't step outside without sweating your balls off.) I bought some protein cause i lift weights at least 3x's a week, but had a guy at the gym tell me if i want to gain weight to cut the cardio out all together or else your wasting your money on protein?

What do yall think?

-not trying to hijack this guys thread, just figured no need to start a new one


IMO, you need the cardio. Sure bulking up looks impressive -but most of those guys couldn't even run a mile. I believe in a total performance body. Besides, cardio+weights give you lean muscle mass (you'll looked ripped).

I currently work out 5 days per week. Take Protein, Creatine, and multi-vitamins. I lift upper body 3 days per week combined with a 3.5 mile run. Lower body and abs is 2 days per week and combined with a 30 min elliptical workout (about 3.5mi). I also do about 15min. of good stretching exercises. IMO, runners do benefit from protein -especially when combining your running with weights.
Link Posted: 9/9/2010 6:14:19 AM EDT

Originally Posted By bushyM4A1:
how much cardio would you all consider to much cardio for someone in his situation? cause I am in a similar one, and must run every morning at least 3 miles for ROTC (i live in Louisiana so you can't step outside without sweating your balls off.) I bought some protein cause i lift weights at least 3x's a week, but had a guy at the gym tell me if i want to gain weight to cut the cardio out all together or else your wasting your money on protein?

What do yall think?

-not trying to hijack this guys thread, just figured no need to start a new one

I don't think it is a waste with the protein, but I agree with him that if you goal is do bulk up you should cut the cardio.
Link Posted: 9/9/2010 9:20:35 AM EDT
Originally Posted By bradinator:
Work out your legs too. I have heard that it will help all over your body for some reason.

I would consider cutting it to 1 protein shake per day. I think it can help cause kidney stones.



Working legs increases testosterone and will help with overall body mass. Dead lifts and squats are great.

Eat well, including fruits and vegetables. You need plenty of fiber.

Work out hard, and work out consistently.
Link Posted: 9/9/2010 11:04:30 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/9/2010 11:05:06 AM EDT by Saur]
+1 to squats and deadlifts

and if your working pecs 'n shoulders definitely use the bench and overhead press (and plenty of dips :D)
Link Posted: 9/9/2010 5:15:25 PM EDT
Start your week with Legs. Your legs are 50% of your body and release massive amounts of HGH...making you grow. If your workouts take more than 40 minutes, you are doing some wrong.

Heavy weight, low reps 6-10, massive amounts of protein (whey ~50g) after your workout with fast metabolizing carbs (fruits and simple carbs, you may also try dextrose as a supplement). pile on complex carbs for a morning meal (oats, oats, oats, oats!). Don't forget your fruits and veggies. You want to plan your meals so your lean proteins are consumed during the day, with the carbs centered around your workouts. don't forget the cottage cheese and PB before bed. drink coffee or tea throughout the day to keep your metabolism up.

building muscle is 80% diet, 20% busting your butt in the gym.

Lift with intensity, don't make excuses, and EAT! at least 6 times a day. You should feel exhausted leaving the gym, if not, you didn't do your job.

PS, I went from 153lbs to 165 in 10 weeks doing this with only about 1-2% increase in BF. My before/after: bench (165/245) squat (180/325) Deadlift (135/225) Curls (80/135).

check out bodybuilding.com and muscleandfitness.com great articles on both.
Link Posted: 9/9/2010 10:33:06 PM EDT
My routine: 2 sets of 10 reps each of Squats, Deadlifts, Bent-Over Rows, Overhead Presses, Pull Ups, Bench Presses. I do the same three days a week, 30-40 minutes a day.
Link Posted: 9/10/2010 5:51:33 AM EDT
Originally Posted By rehab:
Start your week with Legs. Your legs are 50% of your body and release massive amounts of HGH...making you grow. If your workouts take more than 40 minutes, you are doing some wrong.

Heavy weight, low reps 6-10, massive amounts of protein (whey ~50g) after your workout with fast metabolizing carbs (fruits and simple carbs, you may also try dextrose as a supplement). pile on complex carbs for a morning meal (oats, oats, oats, oats!). Don't forget your fruits and veggies. You want to plan your meals so your lean proteins are consumed during the day, with the carbs centered around your workouts. don't forget the cottage cheese and PB before bed. drink coffee or tea throughout the day to keep your metabolism up.

building muscle is 80% diet, 20% busting your butt in the gym.

Lift with intensity, don't make excuses, and EAT! at least 6 times a day. You should feel exhausted leaving the gym, if not, you didn't do your job.

PS, I went from 153lbs to 165 in 10 weeks doing this with only about 1-2% increase in BF. My before/after: bench (165/245) squat (180/325) Deadlift (135/225) Curls (80/135).

check out bodybuilding.com and muscleandfitness.com great articles on both.


do you really bench and squat more than you dead lift or was that a typo?

just seems kinda odd unless your using a smith machine insted of free weights

great job reguardless!
Link Posted: 9/10/2010 1:01:40 PM EDT
Originally Posted By GUNGUY148:
Originally Posted By rehab:
Start your week with Legs. Your legs are 50% of your body and release massive amounts of HGH...making you grow. If your workouts take more than 40 minutes, you are doing some wrong.

Heavy weight, low reps 6-10, massive amounts of protein (whey ~50g) after your workout with fast metabolizing carbs (fruits and simple carbs, you may also try dextrose as a supplement). pile on complex carbs for a morning meal (oats, oats, oats, oats!). Don't forget your fruits and veggies. You want to plan your meals so your lean proteins are consumed during the day, with the carbs centered around your workouts. don't forget the cottage cheese and PB before bed. drink coffee or tea throughout the day to keep your metabolism up.

building muscle is 80% diet, 20% busting your butt in the gym.

Lift with intensity, don't make excuses, and EAT! at least 6 times a day. You should feel exhausted leaving the gym, if not, you didn't do your job.

PS, I went from 153lbs to 165 in 10 weeks doing this with only about 1-2% increase in BF. My before/after: bench (165/245) squat (180/325) Deadlift (135/225) Curls (80/135).

check out bodybuilding.com and muscleandfitness.com great articles on both.


do you really bench and squat more than you dead lift or was that a typo?

just seems kinda odd unless your using a smith machine insted of free weights

great job reguardless!


Squats are on a smith. I have always done bench and squats, just recently took up dead lifts. Still trying to iron out my form and prevent injury, not to mention my grip flat out blows.

thank you for the compliment!

Link Posted: 9/10/2010 1:17:42 PM EDT
Originally Posted By rehab:
Originally Posted By GUNGUY148:
Originally Posted By rehab:
Start your week with Legs. Your legs are 50% of your body and release massive amounts of HGH...making you grow. If your workouts take more than 40 minutes, you are doing some wrong.

Heavy weight, low reps 6-10, massive amounts of protein (whey ~50g) after your workout with fast metabolizing carbs (fruits and simple carbs, you may also try dextrose as a supplement). pile on complex carbs for a morning meal (oats, oats, oats, oats!). Don't forget your fruits and veggies. You want to plan your meals so your lean proteins are consumed during the day, with the carbs centered around your workouts. don't forget the cottage cheese and PB before bed. drink coffee or tea throughout the day to keep your metabolism up.

building muscle is 80% diet, 20% busting your butt in the gym.

Lift with intensity, don't make excuses, and EAT! at least 6 times a day. You should feel exhausted leaving the gym, if not, you didn't do your job.

PS, I went from 153lbs to 165 in 10 weeks doing this with only about 1-2% increase in BF. My before/after: bench (165/245) squat (180/325) Deadlift (135/225) Curls (80/135).

check out bodybuilding.com and muscleandfitness.com great articles on both.


do you really bench and squat more than you dead lift or was that a typo?

just seems kinda odd unless your using a smith machine insted of free weights

great job reguardless!


Squats are on a smith. I have always done bench and squats, just recently took up dead lifts. Still trying to iron out my form and prevent injury, not to mention my grip flat out blows.

thank you for the compliment!



by looking at your other lifts I bet you will be pulling well over 300 in no time

Link Posted: 9/10/2010 2:27:06 PM EDT
Originally Posted By rehab:
Originally Posted By GUNGUY148:
Originally Posted By rehab:
Start your week with Legs. Your legs are 50% of your body and release massive amounts of HGH...making you grow. If your workouts take more than 40 minutes, you are doing some wrong.

Heavy weight, low reps 6-10, massive amounts of protein (whey ~50g) after your workout with fast metabolizing carbs (fruits and simple carbs, you may also try dextrose as a supplement). pile on complex carbs for a morning meal (oats, oats, oats, oats!). Don't forget your fruits and veggies. You want to plan your meals so your lean proteins are consumed during the day, with the carbs centered around your workouts. don't forget the cottage cheese and PB before bed. drink coffee or tea throughout the day to keep your metabolism up.

building muscle is 80% diet, 20% busting your butt in the gym.

Lift with intensity, don't make excuses, and EAT! at least 6 times a day. You should feel exhausted leaving the gym, if not, you didn't do your job.

PS, I went from 153lbs to 165 in 10 weeks doing this with only about 1-2% increase in BF. My before/after: bench (165/245) squat (180/325) Deadlift (135/225) Curls (80/135).

check out bodybuilding.com and muscleandfitness.com great articles on both.


do you really bench and squat more than you dead lift or was that a typo?

just seems kinda odd unless your using a smith machine insted of free weights

great job reguardless!


Squats are on a smith. I have always done bench and squats, just recently took up dead lifts. Still trying to iron out my form and prevent injury, not to mention my grip flat out blows.

thank you for the compliment!



Drop the smith squats, it's probably why your deadlift is so low. Someone who could max out at 180 on squats should not be maxing at 135 on deadlift. I don't know what to tell you about form, it's really straight forward.
Link Posted: 9/10/2010 7:16:33 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Chizzle:
I'm shocked no one has mentioned the book "Starting Strength" by Mark Rippetoe.

Buy it, read it, follow the progression until you are through with it.


This is what you want to do.
Link Posted: 9/10/2010 10:53:48 PM EDT
Originally Posted By keroppl:
Originally Posted By rehab:
Originally Posted By GUNGUY148:
Originally Posted By rehab:
Start your week with Legs. Your legs are 50% of your body and release massive amounts of HGH...making you grow. If your workouts take more than 40 minutes, you are doing some wrong.

Heavy weight, low reps 6-10, massive amounts of protein (whey ~50g) after your workout with fast metabolizing carbs (fruits and simple carbs, you may also try dextrose as a supplement). pile on complex carbs for a morning meal (oats, oats, oats, oats!). Don't forget your fruits and veggies. You want to plan your meals so your lean proteins are consumed during the day, with the carbs centered around your workouts. don't forget the cottage cheese and PB before bed. drink coffee or tea throughout the day to keep your metabolism up.

building muscle is 80% diet, 20% busting your butt in the gym.

Lift with intensity, don't make excuses, and EAT! at least 6 times a day. You should feel exhausted leaving the gym, if not, you didn't do your job.

PS, I went from 153lbs to 165 in 10 weeks doing this with only about 1-2% increase in BF. My before/after: bench (165/245) squat (180/325) Deadlift (135/225) Curls (80/135).

check out bodybuilding.com and muscleandfitness.com great articles on both.


do you really bench and squat more than you dead lift or was that a typo?

just seems kinda odd unless your using a smith machine insted of free weights

great job reguardless!


Squats are on a smith. I have always done bench and squats, just recently took up dead lifts. Still trying to iron out my form and prevent injury, not to mention my grip flat out blows.

thank you for the compliment!



Drop the smith squats, it's probably why your deadlift is so low. Someone who could max out at 180 on squats should not be maxing at 135 on deadlift. I don't know what to tell you about form, it's really straight forward.


probably should have mentioned that those numbers were my rep numbers, not max. I haven't really taken the time to do a 1RM assessment. maybe next week. I do my DL's on my back days, thinking about potentially moving them to my leg days or shoulder days as they are typically last in my workouts.
Link Posted: 9/11/2010 3:45:22 PM EDT
I've put on muscle when doing a cardio-heavy ROTC regimen in addition to weightlifting. You just have to eat more. A LOT more.
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