Sorry for not answering sooner.  Been insanely busy (which is great for a startup company but lousy for everything else in life.) and have not even been on email much.  Hitting the forum to see any issues, but not spending any real reading time.  Didn't realize you'd asked the question.

So....This product I'm interested in - for you- is a liquid aeration.   As to the timing of the results..I will give you an example of the results I've seen.

I have a lawn/landscape client who signed up with me this past late winter.  Their back yard would not grow grass. It just WOULD NOT grow grass.  It was wet all the time.  

Important data:  The house is 9 years old. It's a high-end development. (Houses at half a million dollars and up.  Not the highest price subdivision, but is a "better" development here.)  It's on the top of a ridge, overlooking a river bottom.  The backyard has an iron fence and on the other side of the fence is a steep slope/nearly cliff.  We're talking 60-70 degree slope or greater all the way down, forested (thank God).  The trees from the cliff hang over their back yard.  So yes, there's shade, but....it's LIGHT shade.  Grass should grow under it.

But it wasn't growing.    The back yard was soggy, even after three days without rain.  It wasn't draining, which is weird, right?  It's on the top of a freaking CLIFF.  Why isn't it draining and why won't the grass grow?

Their former lawn company had tried three cycles of mechanical aeration (pro machine that pulls plugs out of the lawn, which used to be the best possible approach)and reseeding, and gave everything they had to this back yard.  Front yard looked GREAT, so it's not that the company didn't have a good program.  They just could not grow grass in the back.  Which  is why they were looking for somebody else.

I looked at it and said, "Let's find out what's under there."

I pulled some cores.  I could not get the tool into the ground more than 4" anywhere in the back yard.  In a lot of places it went in only 2.5-3".  In a few places, less.

Basically, the contractor did not set the house high enough to bring in enough soil to grow a decent lawn on the top of this ridge.  

So....(thinks I) Well, well...what we have is rock.  Is it solid rock?  If so, the only answer is bring in more soil or let me build a garden that is on berms and does not involve lawn.  But if it's not solid rock....

Hmmmm.

I offered them a less expensive solution before we went for a really expensive solution (bringing in more soil, digging the whole thing up, (ripping out the fence and replacing, etc).

I would apply liquid aeration and see if we could drain that swamp on the top of a hill.  

I did two applications of liquid aeration, two weeks apart.

It was still raining (we had a very wet spring) but suddenly, their yard was not muddy.  Once the rains stopped, the next morning, you could walk on the lawn.

Within two weeks, the grass took off.

Their back yard looks like this now.



Edited..didn't mean to submit.  There's a thunderstorm here affecting our internet.

Anyway, with all that background...

I think there might be something between the increased drainage in heavy soil, and the EXTREME alkalinity of the liquid aeration, that might bring about benefit within a juglone-rich environment.

I don't know that it will help.  I am just interested in whether it might.

So....I think you need an area where you have plants that are treated, and plants that are untreated, and maybe...two applications a week apart before planting, and see if there is a difference?

I dunno.  Experimental design has certain parameters, and none of this meets those parameters.  

But it would be interesting to see if you notice a difference in same cultivars planted in same soil  BUT...some are treated and some are not.

So you know...all liquid aeration products are not created equal, nor are all humic acid products.  Some of them are throwing money into a sink hole, but some are not.  Greene Co Fert is not the ONLY viable liquid aeration product, but it's the one I use, so the one I can speak for honestly.

Cherries are cool trees, so I'm sorry you lost that one, but I would take down any Ailanthus altissima that I could find.  And pour stump killer on the stump.  Nuc it from orbit, in other words.

Every one of us who owns an old house is still looking for the secret hidden box of money.

Bourbon would be darn near as good, though.  I doubt money from 1850 would be worth much now.

Which means the box of money would be full of paper money and it would be stock in something that disappeared in 1920.

People with old houses always need more money.

Just sayin.

Here's what I think.

The soil where the root ball was is the LEAST juglone heavy soil in that area.

I might be wrong, but that's my theory.  Beyond that, it was also the BEST AERATED, which means the juglone that was present, affected the plants the least.  (Maybe.)

You dug that root ball out.  You shoved something else in there.  That soil you shoved in there has less juglone present than does the soil that was undisturbed in the dripline.

What do you think of this theory?

I wasn't there, so I did not see it.  You are the better judge.

Either way, I would not only take pictures, but I would measure the distance from where the main rootball was removed, to the outer perimeter of where tomatoes are grown. I would record good notes.  

5' out...tomates did X (include pics)

7' out, tomatoes did Y (include pics)

9' out, tomatoes did Z (include pics)

Include ALL observations, and pay attention to the details.  How do the leaves look? How does the fruit differ?  How much fruit did the plant bear?

And then I would collect the fruit from 5' out, 7' out, and 9' out (or whatever measurements make sense) and I would save the seeds from all of those separately.

The I would set up test plots next season.

I can help with those test plots if you need a correct "experimental design"

Aside from all of this..

I think it's FREAKING AWESOME that you are growing tomatoes in juglone-heavy soil!!!!!

This is REALLY interesting.

It appears to me like a relatively small input as far as aeration and bulky oranic matter, makes a huge difference in whether the plants can survive.

I am now more interested than ever in whether the liquid aeration will help.

I have no idea. Might be a bust.

But it might not.

Would you be able to take that photo and place markers on it for each numbered plant, so there is a visual of where the plants were in relation to the stump?

Then the information about how the plants did would be easier to understand.

@Squire what happened with the sprouting experiment?

Did any of the seedlings survive in the juglone-heavy growing media?

It's interesting.  The deformity looks almost like herbicide damage.

Which makes perfect sense, really, but I just never thought of it.

I think if you can get them to keep growing....meaning transplant them into a mix of...maybe LESS juglone-heavy soil (but still have plenty in there or the experiment will end at that point) and you can get some size out of them, take some cuttings and ROOT those cuttings, even if you have to grow them inside over the winter to preserve the DNA.  

then in the spring, take more cuttings and try it again.....in the GROUND under your walnuts and see how they do, and once again in your juglone-heavy potting media.  If you can get a tomato that grows in that..AND PRODUCES A FRUIT you will have something.

That is a good place to then start with further experiments.

Even if I had to root the cuttings in liquid media like water that was juglone free, I say the experiment has value, because you have DNA that survived the heavy juglone you put it into. Probably heavier than any real-life situation.  Most trees grow in actual soil.  Not just matter ground up from walnut trees.
So when you plant something under a walnut tree, you will be planting in actual soil, even if it is saturated with juglone. So your experiment will be one that says, "this can grow in ground up walnut matter.  Can it grow in soil with high concentrations of juglone, and if so, can it survive to adulthood and fruiting.  And can it fruit successfully throughout a season?"  

Those are questions you are heading toward answering with your "cultivar" that is juglone tolerant.

I have no idea how many people need to grow tomatoes in juglone-rich soils, but there are some, cuz I am one.  You may never get rich with this, but you will have benefited the gardening world substantially.

I'm confused.  Did he kill it?  

Or are you feeding him with troublesome squirrels?

He is beautiful, btw.  

Nice dag.