The planet is cleaner now than it has been in the last 300 years.  People are living longer than they have in the past few thousand years.  

Climate "research" is so politically biased that it's impossible to know what's true and what's bullshit.

Now meaning during the pandemic?  Some of the photos from around the world that show wildlife returning to places where they haven't been seen for a hundred years are pretty amazing.  If you meant prior to the pandemic, then your first sentence is laughably false.  Regardless of what you meant with your first sentence, I agree with your other two.  I just don't understand the militant resistance to "green" initiatives that cost taxpayers nothing and will make our country a better place.

To bring this back on topic, look at all the satellite imagery of China after they did an actual lockdown.  Their incredibly polluted atmosphere cleared up in a matter of weeks.  Our nation isn't that polluted anywhere, and we didn't lock down, but I think that air pollution is measurably less here now, too (which makes sense since fewer people are on the road in many of the urban locations where this type of pollution is tracked).

Mostly because anything "green" has become politically militant...and potentially dangerous.  We use to have green advocates pushing for reusable grocery bags; now they're banned because they are unsanitary and were known to spread bacteria and viruses.  I could go on, but that's not the point.  The point is you don't have to jump on the politically green bandwagon to simply be a good steward of your own local community and home.  The biggest, loudest mouths for environmental causes and pushing draconian policies or regulations are often the biggest violators and threat to the environment.  I doubt there is a single person here that doesn't care about the environment, but most understand the balance of being a good steward and still having economic success and a sustainable quality of life.  Again, anytime a green-initiative is questioned, the virtue signalers (not you Dave, but the actual militant ones) scream sexist, bigot, homophobe, science-denier, xenophobe...etc., etc., etc.  Unfortunately our government (doesn't matter which party...it's the swamp in general) often uses facts out of context and misuses science to support some pork-filled or back-room money making scheme regulation or policy.  I just don't trust or have much faith in any big-government initiatives that require bloated, mismanaged bureaucracies to enforce compliance...anything "green" is often more about the elitist protecting their own wealth and influence, and little to do with the environment.

ROCK6  

I hear you, and I don't disagree.  But look at the positive aspects:  (Pre-pandemic) Compare US air pollution to China air pollution where there are few regulations.  Ever wonder why acid rain is no longer something that makes headlines?  Do you enjoy vehicles that can drive 5 times further on a gallon of gasoline?  

There's definitely a balance to be found.  I'm very libertarian, but I'm not an anarchist.  Some laws and regulations are good.  Capitalism often means that unscrupulous companies will do anything legal to make money.  Some say it's a corporation's responsibility to seek profit wherever it can be found.  Without environmental regulations, we'd still have factories spewing filth into rivers and belching toxic smoke into the air.  Reasonable regulations have prevented that.  And this pandemic has demonstrated the impact in many, many places all over the world.

I guess I just hope we continue to find a decent balance, but with the political middle ground (for everything) becoming thinner and thinner, I'm worried that the balance will be lost and we'll tilt to one side or the other.

I think this is just the reality and human nature.  Right now, I have more faith in corporations looking after the environment and communities than government; but yes, government has their roles with common-sense regulations and laws.  The political winds will tilt it to both extremes and voters will have to hold both government and businesses responsible and accountable.  It's so easy to be cynical towards either; power and profits will always drive big business and government...it just sucks that sciences gets hijacked and prostituted for political purposes or corporate greed.  The only threat to that balance is an apathetic voter base.

We both want the same thing, we just look at solutions from different perspectives and experiences...nothing wrong with that!

ROCK6

I can't bear to see my fellow countrymen act like fearful sheep.   My fear is not of some b.s. virus but rather my fellow man will not rise to the occasion when the communist hammer hits even harder than it's hitting now.

Well we're up to ~100k coronavirus deaths, and nobody seems to have a reliable estimate of what percentage of the population has already been infected, or how well immunity works if you have.

There was a good article in New Yorker by Atul Gawande, about how successful the medical workers have been in controlling infection. It seems like just a few common-sense behaviors will easily cut transmission by 95%  or more.

The good news from the article was the its not crazy contagious like Measles which has R0 of like 18; for covid-19 the average number a person  infects is about 2-3, so it's not hard to get transmission down below 1, just by wearing masks, washing hands, and ideally getting rapid tests for people who think they are infected or exposed, so they know whether to go to work or not.  

Wearing a surgical mask (not N95) is like 95% effective in blocking aerosolized saliva from being emitted. So wear a mask to protect others. It also help cut down exposure. Transmission from surfaces (in a hospital!) accounted for something like 6% of cases, so that's not a big worry if you wash hands aftr being in a group setting.

My guess is below 10% of the US population has had covid-19, so if that gets up to 50%, we would eventually see ~300-400k deaths , but if we slow the transmission  rate with reasonable use of masks in indoor group settings, and stay away from crowds in poorly ventilated spaces, that  spread could take years, and a vaccine  or drug therapy will probably be available before then.

I don't like crowds anyway. I did enjoy eating in restaurants though, I hope they survive.

Personally I still wear a mask as I am in a city that has a decent number of cases. I only wear it when I'm in a store. I don't wear it when I'm outside. Im not one of these idiots who berate people if they don't wear a mask. That's not my place. That's on the establishment if they want people to wear masks in the building. I'm not getting in anyone's business as I'm not going to change hearts and minds by doing that shit. Not to mention, if you're not covering your eyes, ears, nose... What are really are you doing?  Should we do this for the flu? When the Covid finally disappears, and there are 1 million other things that kill people… Will they still yell at people because we don't have masks on LOL??

The one thing that saddens me is seeing how divided we are politically with this Covid mess.  I remember when 911 happened, and for the most part, we didn't have a political divide. We came together in fought the terrosrists. It seems that people are picking sides now when it comes to what to wear, how to sanitize, what rules to follow, who's fault is what etc.  Talk about exhausting the country, this is going to kill people if the virus doesn't. I personally see most of the conservatives being "live and let live" when it comes to this situation, and the left berating people in public for their personal views and actions.  And, you're not going to get everybody to follow the rules. There are a lot of experts that say do not wear a mask. Hell, many of the big experts said that in the very beginning. Now I guess the "science" that we are supposed to worship was allowed to change when it comes to the liberal point of you and their experts.

I'm also sick of hearing people say things that they know aren't true. Things like, the conservatives want to old people to die. They don't care about lives. It's that immature attitude that the young people in this country are exposed to everyday. These young kids seeing adults act like children towards each other during a pandemic. All the race baiting that's going on right now. All the name calling.  All of the calls for people to lose their jobs because they didn't wear a mask in a store or they said something to someone that made them sad LOL. It's just insane. Then you put the pandemic on top of all of that, it just makes you sick.

@DaTrueDave

Maybe...just...maaybee... the whole "we are cleaner now" thing is because, wait for it:

- The level of damage humans can actually do to the earth is minuscule in the Geological timeframe

Sooooo, what's all the bullshit fuss about coal power, nuclear power, cars, Greta Dunderhead and all the other "we can't do industry cause it kills the earth".  Basically what the EcoIdiots are saying is that the earth fixed itself from all the pollution we dealt upon it within a matter of months, if not weeks.

Just sayin'

To me, the moral in this thread is pretty simple......

If everyone is saying the sky is falling, regardless of what others may say about it, or even what you may want to believe, you should at least look up and check for yourself, or.....risk the sky falling.

Action, even if it's overreaction, is more prudent than ignorance.