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Posted: 10/16/2017 1:48:07 PM EDT
I've done a lot of camping over my years including numerous trips to the BWCA in the spring and summer but recently I've had a bug up my ass to do a winter camping trip somewhere like the Superior National Forest or the BWCA.
Anyone know of any good books on cold weather winter camping? The last time I went winter camping was many years ago when I was in scouts and that was in a state park, not exactly wilderness.
Link Posted: 10/16/2017 5:23:26 PM EDT
[#1]
What do you want to know?  Winter camping is my favorite camping.  As long as you're moving it's extremely comfortable.  You can take along foods that would expire quickly on a summer hike.  Hardest part sometimes is finding the trail if it's covered in snow.  Just bring an appropriately rated sleeping bag; I think that's the most important thing.  I have an enormous wool sweater from Finland or something that I wear as my mid-layer; at night I stuff it down into my sleeping bag and wrap my feet in it.  Comfy - cozy.  I'm a huge fan of wool - wool sweater, hat, socks, scarf - my wife knits me things for hiking.

ETA - Your canteen may freeze leaving you thirsty despite being surrounded by snow and it takes A LOT of snow to make a cup of water.  Sleep with a canteen on below-freezing nights!
Link Posted: 10/16/2017 10:54:52 PM EDT
[#2]
Mainly I'm looking for info on sleeping gear.
I have a slumberjack bag thats rated to -20 and thats about it at the moment.
I plan on testing that out with my current therma-rest pad and 1 man tent in my back yard this winter to see how that combo does. If it works out and I dont freeze I'll probably try a overnight in a state forest to further "beta test" that bag and tent combo.
What do you like for a ground pad? I could see my light weight thermarest being a little thin for the job, but having not used it for anything but spring/summer/fall I really dont know.
Also, do you use a sled/pulk at all? or just a backpack? I would assume that a sled would only come into play on longer outings when you would be hauling more gear.
Link Posted: 10/17/2017 12:25:12 AM EDT
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Mainly I'm looking for info on sleeping gear.
I have a slumberjack bag thats rated to -20 and thats about it at the moment.
I plan on testing that out with my current therma-rest pad and 1 man tent in my back yard this winter to see how that combo does. If it works out and I dont freeze I'll probably try a overnight in a state forest to further "beta test" that bag and tent combo.
What do you like for a ground pad? I could see my light weight thermarest being a little thin for the job, but having not used it for anything but spring/summer/fall I really dont know.
Also, do you use a sled/pulk at all? or just a backpack? I would assume that a sled would only come into play on longer outings when you would be hauling more gear.
View Quote
Is that a -20 bag, EN rated?  If so, that's a "useful" standard, but each person is unique, so definitely test.  And it's really more a survival rating, not a comfort rating.  I have a -20 mountainsmith bag down that I tested in my yard in single digits during the polar vortex a few years ago.  I slept on my two pads (a thermarest ridgerest roll and a inflatable Stoic).  The thermarest is 5/8 waffle, which compresses under weight to about 3/8 to 1/2 depending on weight point.  My stoic is a winter pad, almost 2 inches thick.  I had my bag liner in the bag, but it is just to keep dirt off the bag, not warm fleece one which can add 5 degrees.  I slept with in mid weight synthetic upper/lower and balaclava. I was fine and probably comfortable down to 0, maybe low negative singles.  But I'm pretty sure -20 would been cold (but survivable).

A small 1 man tent has less air to heat.  Is it a 4 season or a 3 season.  A 4 season is better sealed, so keeps cold air out since there are no vents or fully closable mesh vents.  a 3 season allows air flow.  a 4 season is also meant to deal with blowing snow and winter snow/ice better.  The fabric is stronger and the poles are stouter to deal with the weight of snow ice.  I have a 3 season tent for all seasons as I don't do true mountaineering conditions.  My warmth is from my sleep gear.  a 4 season will have a ice/water buildup from the breath condensation which a 3 season's airflow helps mitigate.

I pack everything, but my longest winter camp was 4 nights.  I split gear load, carrying tent and foot/cook stuff with my buddy.  Solo, I've got 3 days, but the pack is heavy.  I don't own a sled, but that would be easier.  Winter camp, I prefer real food, and since refrigeration isn't an issue, I like to pack in eggs, steaks, chops, chicken, rice, potatos, so it gets heavy. Flame spit cooked lunch and dinner.  Breakfast is generally cooked over stove in vestibule still in my bag.  Water is really heavy as well.  If I did dehydrated/freeze dried backpacker food, I could probably go 5 days if there was a water source nearby.

Just for reference, I have a 62l pack which during spring, summer, fall I can get carry my base gear and food for a week(longest non stop trip, I've done, purified water on the trip).  During winter, 3 days solo is max.  Everything is just bigger, fatter, heavier.  My -20 down bag is probably 5 pounds with stuff sack vice 3.25 for other seasons.  So that 62l doesn't go far.  I don't go longer to justify an 80+l pack and for winteri would probably buy a sled and use a lighter day pack.

Anyway, have fun, cool to cold camping is glorious.
Link Posted: 10/17/2017 8:36:15 AM EDT
[#4]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Is that a -20 bag, EN rated?  If so, that's a "useful" standard, but each person is unique, so definitely test.  And it's really more a survival rating, not a comfort rating.  I have a -20 mountainsmith bag down that I tested in my yard in single digits during the polar vortex a few years ago.  I slept on my two pads (a thermarest ridgerest roll and a inflatable Stoic).  The thermarest is 5/8 waffle, which compresses under weight to about 3/8 to 1/2 depending on weight point.  My stoic is a winter pad, almost 2 inches thick.  I had my bag liner in the bag, but it is just to keep dirt off the bag, not warm fleece one which can add 5 degrees.  I slept with in mid weight synthetic upper/lower and balaclava. I was fine and probably comfortable down to 0, maybe low negative singles.  But I'm pretty sure -20 would been cold (but survivable).

A small 1 man tent has less air to heat.  Is it a 4 season or a 3 season.  A 4 season is better sealed, so keeps cold air out since there are no vents or fully closable mesh vents.  a 3 season allows air flow.  a 4 season is also meant to deal with blowing snow and winter snow/ice better.  The fabric is stronger and the poles are stouter to deal with the weight of snow ice.  I have a 3 season tent for all seasons as I don't do true mountaineering conditions.  My warmth is from my sleep gear.  a 4 season will have a ice/water buildup from the breath condensation which a 3 season's airflow helps mitigate.

I pack everything, but my longest winter camp was 4 nights.  I split gear load, carrying tent and foot/cook stuff with my buddy.  Solo, I've got 3 days, but the pack is heavy.  I don't own a sled, but that would be easier.  Winter camp, I prefer real food, and since refrigeration isn't an issue, I like to pack in eggs, steaks, chops, chicken, rice, potatos, so it gets heavy. Flame spit cooked lunch and dinner.  Breakfast is generally cooked over stove in vestibule still in my bag.  Water is really heavy as well.  If I did dehydrated/freeze dried backpacker food, I could probably go 5 days if there was a water source nearby.

Just for reference, I have a 62l pack which during spring, summer, fall I can get carry my base gear and food for a week(longest non stop trip, I've done, purified water on the trip).  During winter, 3 days solo is max.  Everything is just bigger, fatter, heavier.  My -20 down bag is probably 5 pounds with stuff sack vice 3.25 for other seasons.  So that 62l doesn't go far.  I don't go longer to justify an 80+l pack and for winteri would probably buy a sled and use a lighter day pack.

Anyway, have fun, cool to cold camping is glorious.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Mainly I'm looking for info on sleeping gear.
I have a slumberjack bag thats rated to -20 and thats about it at the moment.
I plan on testing that out with my current therma-rest pad and 1 man tent in my back yard this winter to see how that combo does. If it works out and I dont freeze I'll probably try a overnight in a state forest to further "beta test" that bag and tent combo.
What do you like for a ground pad? I could see my light weight thermarest being a little thin for the job, but having not used it for anything but spring/summer/fall I really dont know.
Also, do you use a sled/pulk at all? or just a backpack? I would assume that a sled would only come into play on longer outings when you would be hauling more gear.
Is that a -20 bag, EN rated?  If so, that's a "useful" standard, but each person is unique, so definitely test.  And it's really more a survival rating, not a comfort rating.  I have a -20 mountainsmith bag down that I tested in my yard in single digits during the polar vortex a few years ago.  I slept on my two pads (a thermarest ridgerest roll and a inflatable Stoic).  The thermarest is 5/8 waffle, which compresses under weight to about 3/8 to 1/2 depending on weight point.  My stoic is a winter pad, almost 2 inches thick.  I had my bag liner in the bag, but it is just to keep dirt off the bag, not warm fleece one which can add 5 degrees.  I slept with in mid weight synthetic upper/lower and balaclava. I was fine and probably comfortable down to 0, maybe low negative singles.  But I'm pretty sure -20 would been cold (but survivable).

A small 1 man tent has less air to heat.  Is it a 4 season or a 3 season.  A 4 season is better sealed, so keeps cold air out since there are no vents or fully closable mesh vents.  a 3 season allows air flow.  a 4 season is also meant to deal with blowing snow and winter snow/ice better.  The fabric is stronger and the poles are stouter to deal with the weight of snow ice.  I have a 3 season tent for all seasons as I don't do true mountaineering conditions.  My warmth is from my sleep gear.  a 4 season will have a ice/water buildup from the breath condensation which a 3 season's airflow helps mitigate.

I pack everything, but my longest winter camp was 4 nights.  I split gear load, carrying tent and foot/cook stuff with my buddy.  Solo, I've got 3 days, but the pack is heavy.  I don't own a sled, but that would be easier.  Winter camp, I prefer real food, and since refrigeration isn't an issue, I like to pack in eggs, steaks, chops, chicken, rice, potatos, so it gets heavy. Flame spit cooked lunch and dinner.  Breakfast is generally cooked over stove in vestibule still in my bag.  Water is really heavy as well.  If I did dehydrated/freeze dried backpacker food, I could probably go 5 days if there was a water source nearby.

Just for reference, I have a 62l pack which during spring, summer, fall I can get carry my base gear and food for a week(longest non stop trip, I've done, purified water on the trip).  During winter, 3 days solo is max.  Everything is just bigger, fatter, heavier.  My -20 down bag is probably 5 pounds with stuff sack vice 3.25 for other seasons.  So that 62l doesn't go far.  I don't go longer to justify an 80+l pack and for winteri would probably buy a sled and use a lighter day pack.

Anyway, have fun, cool to cold camping is glorious.
I have no idea if Slumberjack bags are EN rated or not, Ill have to look into it. Its a pretty heavy bag, the couple times I've used it early spring in MN when the nights were still in the low 30's it was almost too warm. Definitely planning on testing it.
What should I be looking at for a sleeping pad? Just stack a ridgerest or two on my thermarest and call it good?
I'm good for packs for simple 1 or two nighters at this point. I kinda figured on needing a larger one for a ~week in the BWCA or SNF as my 40L is just enough for a week up there with a separate pack in the canoe for food.

My tent is a 3 season 2 man tent, Mountain Hardware Drifter2.
Fantastic tent in the summer. Its all screen with the fly off so on clear summer nights its like sleeping in the open without the bugs.
Definitely not 4 season, but ill test it out and see how it does. I'm kinda tempted to look at something like a seekoutside with a stove for a longer trip, but thats down the road a bit.
Link Posted: 10/17/2017 5:03:59 PM EDT
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

I have no idea if Slumberjack bags are EN rated or not, Ill have to look into it. Its a pretty heavy bag, the couple times I've used it early spring in MN when the nights were still in the low 30's it was almost too warm. Definitely planning on testing it.
What should I be looking at for a sleeping pad? Just stack a ridgerest or two on my thermarest and call it good?
I'm good for packs for simple 1 or two nighters at this point. I kinda figured on needing a larger one for a ~week in the BWCA or SNF as my 40L is just enough for a week up there with a separate pack in the canoe for food.

My tent is a 3 season 2 man tent, Mountain Hardware Drifter2.
Fantastic tent in the summer. Its all screen with the fly off so on clear summer nights its like sleeping in the open without the bugs.
Definitely not 4 season, but ill test it out and see how it does. I'm kinda tempted to look at something like a seekoutside with a stove for a longer trip, but thats down the road a bit.
View Quote
Since the bag will compress to nothing where you lay on it, you want at least 2 inches of insulation in the true winter conditions.  My two pads give me just a bit more than that under weight.

Dry snow is so light that if there is anything more than 5 mph, it will drift and blow up against and up under your fly.  My tent is similar and is 3 season.  I've slept cowboy style (out in open) before in the winter, marvelous clear skies and stars.   But here in VA, snow tends to be wet, so a 3 season works fine since the snow can't drift normally.

The only tents with stoves, I've seen are used for the long term stays and people often bring cots and suck for those.  True winter comfort comfort.
Link Posted: 10/26/2017 12:07:53 PM EDT
[#6]
While its not a how -to, pick up a copy of The Mad Trapper of Rat River for a good read by the fire with your feet up on a snow bank.
Link Posted: 10/26/2017 1:18:19 PM EDT
[#7]
Link Posted: 10/26/2017 11:25:49 PM EDT
[#8]
Search for Shugemery on YouTube. Corny, but good info on the gear he uses to hammock camp in MN winters.
Link Posted: 10/31/2017 1:05:48 PM EDT
[#9]
Not a book but check out "Winter Camping Symposium".  Their website wasn't working earlier today so I won't post a link.  Google will give you lots of hits if you search.  It was held last weekend in Sturgeon Lake, MN.    Lots of seminars and classes.  Great event.  Geared more to the old style heated tent camping but has something for everyone.  I may have room in my 12x12 tent for one or 2 more people next year.  This picture is not at WCS but a week earlier at a pre-1816 reenactment.
Attachment Attached File

The awning can be pulled down to the ground to make a 12x10 vestibule in front of the tent.  Plan to be camped in the primitive camp.
 There will be vendors there with their products to look at and purchase.

Edit:
The website is working again so here is the link   Winter Camping Symposium
Link Posted: 10/31/2017 1:09:09 PM EDT
[#10]
I hope to next year have several join me from around northern Indiana, southern Michigan or northwest Ohio so I don't have to make the 9+ hour drive alone.  If you are close to northern Indiana and interested in going along send me a pm.
This year was great with temps high 20s and low 30s with snow.  Not cold but perfect to learn winter camping.
Link Posted: 10/31/2017 1:13:40 PM EDT
[#11]
Buy a fleece sleeping bag as a liner for your main bag.  A good ground pad is essential and a blanket for over your head helps keep the heat in.  If its really cold a couple disposable hand warmers in the bag work really well.  Don't forget a bottle in the tent because you do not want to leave the tent in the middle of the night, unless it is really necessary.
Link Posted: 11/3/2017 2:58:01 PM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I read a book called "Paradise Below Zero: The Classic Guide to Winter Camping"  
It was about a Minnesota guy that traveled the Yukon? in the winter.

Written in the 60s I believe. It's what got me into winter camping in the 70s and then
dog driving in the early 80s. Over the course of over twenty years I have drove my dogs
in the BWCA quite a few times.

Link to book

I'm real slow at typing so I really can't help with tips in written form but if interested in picking my brain
I would IM you my number.

James
View Quote
Added the book to my amazon list.
As for chatting, i might take you up on that once I have some more specific questions than "wtf am i getting myself into"
Dog sledding has always fascinated me, are you still running dogs?
Link Posted: 11/3/2017 2:58:40 PM EDT
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Search for Shugemery on YouTube. Corny, but good info on the gear he uses to hammock camp in MN winters.
View Quote
I've watched some of his vids
Corny is an understatement, good info though
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