Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login

Posted: 7/10/2008 5:17:39 PM EST
I currently have a fireplace that goes through wood like papiermarks in the Weirmer republic. I'd very much like to replace it with a wood burning stove that is more efficient. Idealy, I'd like a stove that can heat about 1000 sq ft. with a stove top that I can cook on come shtf. The basic requirements are that it is efficient, utilizes the existing fireplace and has glass doors so that the princess can enjoy those romantic nights in front of the fire.

Do I need to get a fireplace "insert" or can I get a stand alone and feed the exhaust through the existing fireplace?
Link Posted: 7/10/2008 5:36:50 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/10/2008 5:38:15 PM EST
Dancing glass-door flames and efficient wood burning are like Sunni and Shia. You can arrange plenty of either, but not at the same time or place!
Link Posted: 7/10/2008 7:21:27 PM EST
Vermont Castings make some stoves that throw off serious heat for their size. I had a "Vigilant" model in my last home (1400 sq ft). I had no issues keeping the home above 80 degrees inside even when temps fell below zero outside. We have a late 1970's era Fisher wood stove in our current home. It too does a good job heating our home, but it is a lot of work considering I get all of our wood from our property. I spent $50 last winter to heat our 2,000+ sq ft home (gas/oil for saw and tractor, several chains sharpened).
Link Posted: 7/10/2008 9:13:57 PM EST


I had one of those models a few years back. The blooming thing easily heated half my house, but didn't come with any kind of stove-top. You may have some difficulty using the existing fireplace if you require a stove-top... I've never seen a flush or near-flush insert that came with a stove top... You'd probably be more likely to find that in a stand-alone model with a vent pipe.

The model I referenced above really worked well, and is my only real experience in the area.
Link Posted: 7/10/2008 11:44:19 PM EST
Vermont Castings was the best in the industry. They had to file bankruptcy.

Link Posted: 7/11/2008 2:22:01 AM EST
Jotul.. They make a great stove.

An insert you are going to have a much smaller ledge to cook on, but it is possible depending on how deep you put it in your fireplace.

With only a requirement to heat 1K sq feet, you won't need a big stove, so maybe you can find something shorter to fit on your hearth. Is it a masonry chimney or a manufactured fireplace? That will have more to do with what you can put in there than anything else.

My first Jotul was made in the 70s and is a Model #3. It is pretty easy to cook on, but most of my cooking was limited to soups/stews. I used a trivet so I wouldn't damage the enamel finish so I don't know about just putting a skillet on it? It easly would heat the space you were looking at.

My second Jotul is a Firelight. It is the biggest stove they make and easily heats my home. The hold time on it is marathon like so you are not feeding it every few hours. I have done soups, stews, and a skillet on it and it runs just fine.

I now run the #3 in my basement just to help warm it up down there if we are going to use the space.

I have looked at some of the older Vermont stoves and they look nice, but I am partial to Jotul. Good luck..


Link Posted: 7/11/2008 3:03:46 AM EST
If your looking at a free standing stove I recommend a Fischer model. It is the most copied style of airtight stove in the world. I have one at my BOL and love it. The only issue with the Fischer stoves is that they are not UL listed, IOW, your insurance company may take issue with it.
Link Posted: 7/11/2008 4:12:33 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/11/2008 4:13:59 AM EST by blackhawkhunter]

Originally Posted By Electronrider:
Vermont Castings was the best in the industry. They had to file bankruptcy.



I like Jotul better by far. I had problems with the thermostat controls on the Vt Castings. Otherwise they were well made.

Fischers are very good also.
Link Posted: 7/11/2008 6:40:53 AM EST
whatever you get, buy the blower that goes w/ it or plan on adding you own blower. also, the rated square footage IS NOT the actual heating you'll get. the ratings are based on the stove/insert being in a large room, not in a house that is divided up, in which the air may not flow easily throughout the house.
Link Posted: 7/11/2008 3:17:57 PM EST

Originally Posted By Cacinok:
whatever you get, buy the blower that goes w/ it or plan on adding you own blower. also, the rated square footage IS NOT the actual heating you'll get. the ratings are based on the stove/insert being in a large room, not in a house that is divided up, in which the air may not flow easily throughout the house.


Which was exactly my setup. The fireplace was in a large great room (that was roughly half my square footage). It kept that room toasty and warm all winter.
Link Posted: 7/11/2008 4:30:17 PM EST
As stated above, Vermont Castings' owner filed for Chap. 11 in April and restarted the work force in June, I believe. You might give them a try (www.vermontcastings.com). Their product continues to work well for me.

Link Posted: 7/11/2008 7:53:06 PM EST

Originally Posted By Cacinok:
whatever you get, buy the blower that goes w/ it or plan on adding you own blower. also, the rated square footage IS NOT the actual heating you'll get. the ratings are based on the stove/insert being in a large room, not in a house that is divided up, in which the air may not flow easily throughout the house.


Personally, I disagree with the blower theory. I think you strip too much heat off your stove. Let it warm up and do it's job as designed. I would put the extra blower money towards buying the biggest stove I could.

On the thought of a divided home. I moved back to zone heating. If you aren't using a room do you need to heat it? It might be 65F in there but if you aren't using it, does it matter? I started out trying hard to heat every last room in my home and was burning through oak fast.. When my cousin came in from Sweden and explained zone heating, it made sense.

I eventually upgraded to a much larger stove as listed above and can now easily heat everything, but if you don't have a stove with a massive fire box.. you need to heat to your abilites.

Link Posted: 7/12/2008 4:31:02 AM EST
Here is an E-Bay Auction for a Fisher. Looks like it might be from a fellow board member, the beekeeper! Not sure if it is him or not but looks like a smoking deal for a local!
Link Posted: 7/12/2008 5:08:53 AM EST

Originally Posted By Waldo:
Dunno. Once upon a time, I burned wood. Then I stepped in a hole with a big armload of wood, tore my ACL, lost 3 months wages plus med bills, pain, operation, therapy. Never did that again. YMMV



You blame your accident on the wood? Wow I thought I'de heard it all.
Link Posted: 7/12/2008 5:13:49 AM EST
A guy I work with heavily recommends Regency Fireplaces. He uses it to heat most of his house for MD winters (avg. temps in the 30's).

Looking through their sit, the Model I2400 is said to have a cooktop surface and looks to still tuck fairly well into the exiting brick fireplace. About what I am looking for, I was told about $3k with the stainless chimney insert, blower and everything from the ACE hardware down the road. Maybe another $800 to have it installed.

The guy at work also mentioned the glass front is good for view of the fire. That will make the woman happy, which means I can be happy
Link Posted: 7/12/2008 2:49:44 PM EST
There's more to than just sliding one of those inserts into your fireplace. Trust me on this one I use to do this for a living hence ny screen name.

Don't let anyone BS you on this either. That chimney was designed to be used with that large opening of your fireplace. When you slide that wood stove in there you're basically trying to take a big fire hose of a fire hydrant and connect it to your water faucet on the side of your house and put a fire out with it...it doesn't work very well. Trouble is you won't know the difference until your chimney sweep tells you that you have 3rd degree creosote build up or also called glazed on creosote and it's going to cost you mega $$$ to get it out.

Plan on spending just as much to have the proper liner installed through your existing chimney and connected to the stove as you spen on the stove itself...if not more.

I'd recommend a stainless steel line with a minimum of a 1/2" wrap of foil faced insulation.

Just read the owners manual of the stove for your "basic" needs to install.

You're asking for trouble if you just slide that thing into your fireplace.
Link Posted: 7/12/2008 4:03:47 PM EST

Originally Posted By dmsmith_Sig:
Looking through their sit, the Model I2400 is said to have a cooktop surface and looks to still tuck fairly well into the exiting brick fireplace.


That looks a lot like ours, except we have a Jamestown. I've never had to use the cooktop, but for giggles I put a large pot of water on top and let it sit. A few hours later I used a meat thermometer to get the water temp - 175 degrees. So, not quite hot enough on top to boil water, but hot enough to slow cook a stew or soup. I usually left a pan of water on top anyway to add moisture to the air - our house is very dry in the winter.

Oh, and what Sweep said is absolutely true. The prior owners of our house installed the insert exactly the wrong way, and the home inspector missed it. They must not have used it much. Having a proper chimney for it installed was about $1200. Get it done, since once it was installed right it used a lot less wood and burned more efficiently.

Link Posted: 7/12/2008 4:16:40 PM EST

Originally Posted By Waldo:
Dunno. Once upon a time, I burned wood. Then I stepped in a hole with a big armload of wood, tore my ACL, lost 3 months wages plus med bills, pain, operation, therapy. Never did that again. YMMV





wood don't kill people: stepping in dang holes does!!! fill in them holes - keep burning wood! better, stuff some wood down in the hole! Burn the hole! That'l teach it!
Link Posted: 7/12/2008 6:41:00 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/13/2008 3:31:25 AM EST

Originally Posted By dmsmith_Sig:
A guy I work with heavily recommends Regency Fireplaces. He uses it to heat most of his house for MD winters (avg. temps in the 30's).

Looking through their sit, the Model I2400 is said to have a cooktop surface and looks to still tuck fairly well into the exiting brick fireplace. About what I am looking for, I was told about $3k with the stainless chimney insert, blower and everything from the ACE hardware down the road. Maybe another $800 to have it installed.

The guy at work also mentioned the glass front is good for view of the fire. That will make the woman happy, which means I can be happy


We have a Regency and it heats our entire lower floor using the blower. We have the I3100, the large model. For some reason the large model extends 2" less than the I2400. I can tell you that with the I3100 the little 5" shelf on top doesn't get anywhere near not enough to cook on. Maybe the I2400 is different but I wouldn't think so.

The blower makes all the difference in the world. The previous poster who suggested using a fireplace insert without a blower is just plain wrong. The firebox gets plenty hot and through radiant heating will heat the general area without the blower. But remember the firebox is inside your fireplace so you only get heat radiating from the front of the stove. Once when our electricity was off we were forced to run the insert without the blower and while our family and living rooms were comfortable, the kitchen and dining room were noticeably cooler. And we have a very open first floor plan, much more open than most.

The blower circulates air around behind the firebox and then blows it out into the room. The blower allows our insert to heat our entire first floor. I'm trying to come up with a way to passively get some of that heat to the 2nd floor. For now our 2nd floor stays about 12-15 degrees cooler than the first.

In the Regency, the blower has two speeds. The high speed is just a little noisy but the low speed can barely be heard. A nice surprise for us was that the low speed was just about as good in circulating the heat as the high speed.

Oh, and the glass front is very nice and when you have a fire going you have all the ambiance of a regular fireplace. The swirling flames are hypnotic.

Back when I researched fireplace inserts I came up dry trying to find meaningful comparisons between brands. Everybody could tell you what brand they liked because that was the brand they bought. Almost nobody has real experience with multiple brands so take "recommendations" with a grain of salt. Also, as a previous poster mentioned, take BTU and square footage specs with two grains of salt as there is no independent testing of these specs and each manufacturer is free to say anything they like.

I only have experience with the Regency I3100 and can recommend it. The only thing I don't like about it is the "cook top" portion that extends into the room cannot be used for that purpose. But for heating the house, it does a damn good job. And even in a SHTF scenario, without electricity, it would allow us to live comfortably in two of our lower rooms. Our primary reason for buying was supplimental heat to keep natural gas bills down but our secondary reason for buying was as a utilities free source of heat should the need arise. The Regency serves both purposes well and looks good too boot.
Link Posted: 7/13/2008 5:33:42 AM EST

Originally Posted By Sweep:
There's more to than just sliding one of those inserts into your fireplace. Trust me on this one I use to do this for a living hence ny screen name.

Don't let anyone BS you on this either. That chimney was designed to be used with that large opening of your fireplace. When you slide that wood stove in there you're basically trying to take a big fire hose of a fire hydrant and connect it to your water faucet on the side of your house and put a fire out with it...it doesn't work very well. Trouble is you won't know the difference until your chimney sweep tells you that you have 3rd degree creosote build up or also called glazed on creosote and it's going to cost you mega $$$ to get it out.

Plan on spending just as much to have the proper liner installed through your existing chimney and connected to the stove as you spen on the stove itself...if not more.

I'd recommend a stainless steel line with a minimum of a 1/2" wrap of foil faced insulation.

Just read the owners manual of the stove for your "basic" needs to install.

You're asking for trouble if you just slide that thing into your fireplace.


Can you explain how putting a woodstove into a fireplace is different than a thimble. I realize fireplace flues are usually larger, but otherwise dont see a difference.

Thanks
Link Posted: 7/13/2008 5:37:13 AM EST
The Lopi Freedom series A+.
Link Posted: 7/20/2008 5:28:41 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/20/2008 5:33:30 AM EST by Baldmonk]
Look for an Older Kodiak on E-bay. ALL new stoves sold require catlytic converters, and are not airtight draft control making them very ineffecient. Gotta love the EPA. They are as efficient as an old Franklin stove which suck by the way. So unless you have a wood pile the size of you house dont bother with one of these.

You can still buy an old used Kodiak or Fisher on EBay. Ashley is another good brand, but they made very few inserts, mostly standups.

My Kodiak will run me out of my 2100 sqft house without turning on the blower and will run all night if I load it up and crank down the draft. Kodiaks were made in Alaska for the Alaska climate.


Edited. Cause I cant type.
Link Posted: 7/20/2008 7:45:13 AM EST

Originally Posted By Baldmonk:
Look for an Older Kodiak on E-bay. ALL new stoves sold require catlytic converters, and are not airtight draft control making them very ineffecient. Gotta love the EPA. They are as efficient as an old Franklin stove which suck by the way. So unless you have a wood pile the size of you house dont bother with one of these.

You can still buy an old used Kodiak or Fisher on EBay. Ashley is another good brand, but they made very few inserts, mostly standups.

My Kodiak will run me out of my 2100 sqft house without turning on the blower and will run all night if I load it up and crank down the draft. Kodiaks were made in Alaska for the Alaska climate.


Edited. Cause I cant type.


Not true.. the Jotul line does not require a catalytic. They are super efficient and are air tight.

Link Posted: 7/20/2008 7:49:22 AM EST

Originally Posted By blackhawkhunter:

Originally Posted By Sweep:
There's more to than just sliding one of those inserts into your fireplace. Trust me on this one I use to do this for a living hence ny screen name.

Don't let anyone BS you on this either. That chimney was designed to be used with that large opening of your fireplace. When you slide that wood stove in there you're basically trying to take a big fire hose of a fire hydrant and connect it to your water faucet on the side of your house and put a fire out with it...it doesn't work very well. Trouble is you won't know the difference until your chimney sweep tells you that you have 3rd degree creosote build up or also called glazed on creosote and it's going to cost you mega $$$ to get it out.

Plan on spending just as much to have the proper liner installed through your existing chimney and connected to the stove as you spen on the stove itself...if not more.

I'd recommend a stainless steel line with a minimum of a 1/2" wrap of foil faced insulation.

Just read the owners manual of the stove for your "basic" needs to install.

You're asking for trouble if you just slide that thing into your fireplace.


Can you explain how putting a woodstove into a fireplace is different than a thimble. I realize fireplace flues are usually larger, but otherwise dont see a difference.

Thanks


I think Sweep is just trying to say you can't shove a flue pipe up a chimney and expect it to draw.

Most stoves are specifically designed to draw at a specific size pipe. With most chimney's being a square tile, they are much larger than the original design spec.

You don't need to put a triple wall pipe in a masonry chimney though. There was a single wall stainless liner in mine when I bought my home. Works just fine and there is no issue on heat transfer as it was originally designed to be burned in without a liner anyways.
Link Posted: 7/20/2008 10:45:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By Longboat:

Originally Posted By Baldmonk:
Look for an Older Kodiak on E-bay. ALL new stoves sold require catlytic converters, and are not airtight draft control making them very ineffecient. Gotta love the EPA. They are as efficient as an old Franklin stove which suck by the way. So unless you have a wood pile the size of you house dont bother with one of these.

You can still buy an old used Kodiak or Fisher on EBay. Ashley is another good brand, but they made very few inserts, mostly standups.

My Kodiak will run me out of my 2100 sqft house without turning on the blower and will run all night if I load it up and crank down the draft. Kodiaks were made in Alaska for the Alaska climate.


Edited. Cause I cant type.


Not true.. the Jotul line does not require a catalytic. They are super efficient and are air tight.



I don't think he wants to spend the $2000 for a Jotul when he can get a used Kodiak or Fisher for $300 ~ $400. At least I wouldn't.
Link Posted: 7/20/2008 11:56:32 AM EST

Originally Posted By Baldmonk:

Originally Posted By Longboat:

Originally Posted By Baldmonk:
Look for an Older Kodiak on E-bay. ALL new stoves sold require catlytic converters, and are not airtight draft control making them very ineffecient. Gotta love the EPA. They are as efficient as an old Franklin stove which suck by the way. So unless you have a wood pile the size of you house dont bother with one of these.

You can still buy an old used Kodiak or Fisher on EBay. Ashley is another good brand, but they made very few inserts, mostly standups.

My Kodiak will run me out of my 2100 sqft house without turning on the blower and will run all night if I load it up and crank down the draft. Kodiaks were made in Alaska for the Alaska climate.


Edited. Cause I cant type.


Not true.. the Jotul line does not require a catalytic. They are super efficient and are air tight.



I don't think he wants to spend the $2000 for a Jotul when he can get a used Kodiak or Fisher for $300 ~ $400. At least I wouldn't.


and you can get a used Jotul in that same price range too..
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:56:36 AM EST

Originally Posted By Longboat:

Originally Posted By blackhawkhunter:

Originally Posted By Sweep:
There's more to than just sliding one of those inserts into your fireplace. Trust me on this one I use to do this for a living hence ny screen name.

Don't let anyone BS you on this either. That chimney was designed to be used with that large opening of your fireplace. When you slide that wood stove in there you're basically trying to take a big fire hose of a fire hydrant and connect it to your water faucet on the side of your house and put a fire out with it...it doesn't work very well. Trouble is you won't know the difference until your chimney sweep tells you that you have 3rd degree creosote build up or also called glazed on creosote and it's going to cost you mega $$$ to get it out.

Plan on spending just as much to have the proper liner installed through your existing chimney and connected to the stove as you spen on the stove itself...if not more.

I'd recommend a stainless steel line with a minimum of a 1/2" wrap of foil faced insulation.

Just read the owners manual of the stove for your "basic" needs to install.

You're asking for trouble if you just slide that thing into your fireplace.


Can you explain how putting a woodstove into a fireplace is different than a thimble. I realize fireplace flues are usually larger, but otherwise dont see a difference.

Thanks


I think Sweep is just trying to say you can't shove a flue pipe up a chimney and expect it to draw.

Most stoves are specifically designed to draw at a specific size pipe. With most chimney's being a square tile, they are much larger than the original design spec.

You don't need to put a triple wall pipe in a masonry chimney though. There was a single wall stainless liner in mine when I bought my home. Works just fine and there is no issue on heat transfer as it was originally designed to be burned in without a liner anyways.


I could see a potential problem with running something like a mini sheet metal stove with a 4 inch pipe into a big chimney, but I dont see where running a decent size woodstove would cause any problems assuming the chimney draws reasonably to begin with.
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 9:57:16 AM EST

Originally Posted By Baldmonk:

Originally Posted By Longboat:

Originally Posted By Baldmonk:
Look for an Older Kodiak on E-bay. ALL new stoves sold require catlytic converters, and are not airtight draft control making them very ineffecient. Gotta love the EPA. They are as efficient as an old Franklin stove which suck by the way. So unless you have a wood pile the size of you house dont bother with one of these.

You can still buy an old used Kodiak or Fisher on EBay. Ashley is another good brand, but they made very few inserts, mostly standups.

My Kodiak will run me out of my 2100 sqft house without turning on the blower and will run all night if I load it up and crank down the draft. Kodiaks were made in Alaska for the Alaska climate.


Edited. Cause I cant type.


Not true.. the Jotul line does not require a catalytic. They are super efficient and are air tight.



I don't think he wants to spend the $2000 for a Jotul when he can get a used Kodiak or Fisher for $300 ~ $400. At least I wouldn't.


Damn, are they that much now? Yikes!
Link Posted: 7/21/2008 3:14:55 PM EST
I was raised on wood stoves and like them....just don't like the mess they create.

I was looking up stoves on the net and came across this site....they are working to outlaw wood stoves because they make mean, nasty pollution. Al Gore doesn't like wood stoves

Liberal whiner site
Top Top