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Posted: 3/27/2009 8:48:49 AM EDT
I didn't want to hijack the other shotgun thread.

those of you that have pistol grips/folding stocks, how are they to shoot? I've never shot one like that. I've heard that the web of the fireing hand gets sore. true? how is it for wing shooting? or are they more suited for stationary targets?

I've seen all kind of stocks. top folders, side folders, underfolders. and plain pistol grips.
pro's cons of these?
I myself would think that an underfolder would be the one to get. it won't get in the way of the sight picture, and not put the gun out of balance like a side folder.

thoughts???????
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 9:01:00 AM EDT
A pistol grip shotgun sucks. Nearly completely worthless. Slow to aim, hard to control, and painful to shoot. I have one I can sell super cheap if you like pointless pain and loosing just about everything that makes a shotgun quick and easy to shoot.

I just switched out my ATI M4style stock for several reasons. It made getting to the action release harder, the stock is too straight so it kept me from getting a good sight picture unless it was all the way out meaning that I ended up with a longer stock than original, the pistol grip on that stock too massively more time to get onto than just gripping the wrist on a normal stock.

The combination of all the bad changes that happened with the new stock just made the shotgun much slower and less accurate at speed.

The best possible way to give your shotgun a tactical upgrade that will help make it better for close up work is to buy a 18.5" barrel for it.

The stock is nothing but an advantage. The way you hold a pistol grip shotgun is the same as holding a shotgun by the wrist with the stock under your arm. This leaves the same length sticking out from your body and you have much better control. It makes for a short package while maintaining the huge speed advantage of having a stock for firing fast.

Link Posted: 3/27/2009 9:14:53 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/27/2009 2:49:54 PM EDT by Daisycutter123]
Originally Posted By batmanacw:
A pistol grip shotgun sucks. Nearly completely worthless. Slow to aim, hard to control, and painful to shoot. I have one I can sell super cheap if you like pointless pain and loosing just about everything that makes a shotgun quick and easy to shoot.

I just switched out my ATI M4style stock for several reasons. It made getting to the action release harder, the stock is too straight so it kept me from getting a good sight picture unless it was all the way out meaning that I ended up with a longer stock than original, the pistol grip on that stock too massively more time to get onto than just gripping the wrist on a normal stock.

The combination of all the bad changes that happened with the new stock just made the shotgun much slower and less accurate at speed.

The best possible way to give your shotgun a tactical upgrade that will help make it better for close up work is to buy a 18.5" barrel for it.

The stock is nothing but an advantage. The way you hold a pistol grip shotgun is the same as holding a shotgun by the wrist with the stock under your arm. This leaves the same length sticking out from your body and you have much better control. It makes for a short package while maintaining the huge speed advantage of having a stock for firing fast.



I agree w/ Batman, just make sure the LOP is right for the smallest shooter using it. Mossbergs seem to have their forearm/slide mech. further foward and for me require a shorter stock. Just cut it to required length and install a good recoil pad.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 9:42:25 AM EDT
GREAT ADVICE, I second it all. I had a pistol grip on my home-defense Mossy 500s, but soon swapped them out for the factory stocks, and we're much happier.

If you're dead-set on installing a replacement stock, consider a Speed-Feed stock; I use these on my work 'guns & love them.


Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 9:43:57 AM EDT
I do not like a pistol grip on a shotgun. I converted a Saiga 12 and then sold it and got a regular sporter-stock Saiga 12. Everyone thought I was crazy. Glad to see there are some here who agree with me.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 9:47:17 AM EDT
Originally Posted By silverstate55:
GREAT ADVICE, I second it all. I had a pistol grip on my home-defense Mossy 500s, but soon swapped them out for the factory stocks, and we're much happier.

If you're dead-set on installing a replacement stock, consider a Speed-Feed stock; I use these on my work 'guns & love them.


Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile


I have been eyeballing one of those speedfeed stocks. Don't know how much more they weigh, but with magnum loads a slightly heavier stock would be a good thing. Might buy a nicer shotgun for the new stock and leave my old rattle trap alone. Its just plain perfect the way it is.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 9:58:24 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/27/2009 9:59:10 AM EDT by LesterFlatts]
I've also been thinking about getting a stock for my Mossy 500, it's just the pistol grip/barrel shroud type right now. I'll look into the speed feed.

I have shot skeet with it, was hitting about 60%, which I thought was alright for a pistol-grip shotgun.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 10:59:20 AM EDT
If you get a pistol grip... put a stock on it. The reduction in size you get with a pistol grip alone is worthless because you lose accuracy and the ability to rapidly produce follow up shots. So yeah what everyone else said.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 11:03:43 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/27/2009 11:04:09 AM EDT by Badlatitude]
I had one and shot it once before putting a stock and foregrip on it lol.


The only adgantage to buying a pistol grip is u can get them for DIRT cheap most times. Then just order up a stock and fore end for it from one of the discount places.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 11:06:53 AM EDT
Pistol grips get in the way when you are trying to load fast, I like my shotguns with standard stocks.

PTK
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 11:13:01 AM EDT
I have a Hogue Tamer on my HD Mossy 500. Here is what I have learned shooting it.

-accuracy past about 15 feet is almost nonexistent. Anything within about 10 feet is hard to miss. It is only beneficial indoors and in close quarters. I have a 180 degree corner in my home and the reduced length helps to transition the corner without exposing myself first.
-can continuously shoot 2 3/4" 00 buck (non-reduced recoil) with no discomfort (can even shoot it one-handed like a pistol) however, 3" 00 buck starts to hurt only after about 4 rounds.

Having a pistol grip greatly reduces a shotgun's capability but, they do have their advantages. It all depends on it's intended use based on your own situation.

Link Posted: 3/27/2009 11:45:03 AM EDT
I have the Speedfeed full stock that has a molded in pistol grip on my home defense Moss 500. I had to chop it a touch shorter than it came standard but I like it. It will be going with me to a fighting shotgun course in June.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 12:06:20 PM EDT
I've had almost every conceivable kind of stock on my 870 at some point or another, I always come back to the original wood.

It just feels right, presentation is easier and more natural, and is much less painful to shoot.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 12:58:49 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Slave1:
I've had almost every conceivable kind of stock on my 870 at some point or another, I always come back to the original wood.

It just feels right, presentation is easier and more natural, and is much less painful to shoot.


good info here,, thanks,, I've never shot an altered shotgun and always wondered, .

thanks guys.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 1:07:55 PM EDT
I've shot a few pistol grip only shotguns and I think for a very limited advantage you give up alot. Compact , close quater handling....hard to shoot and hit anything past 10 15 feet... To me makes more sense to have a full stock.
I had a factory folding police stock on my 870 and hated it and went back to the standard wood stock.
As others said i think these after market pistol grip stock while neato looking make handling your shotgun harder and slower. To me one of the main advantage of a shotgun is that it is a fast handling fast pointing weapon....starting hanging these stocks on them you loose this.....T
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 1:21:27 PM EDT
Originally Posted By traprmike:
I didn't want to hijack the other shotgun thread.

those of you that have pistol grips/folding stocks, how are they to shoot? I've never shot one like that. I've heard that the web of the fireing hand gets sore. true? how is it for wing shooting? or are they more suited for stationary targets?

I've seen all kind of stocks. top folders, side folders, underfolders. and plain pistol grips.
pro's cons of these?
I myself would think that an underfolder would be the one to get. it won't get in the way of the sight picture, and not put the gun out of balance like a side folder.

thoughts???????


pistol grips are GREAT if you have them on breaching shotguns with 14'' barrels or less, and your sole use is for breaching/ back up weapon. as far as for HD, or a fighting shotgun i think the full stock would be best.. as far as the folders there just not for me..

Link Posted: 3/27/2009 1:48:45 PM EDT
A shotgun with a pistol grip is nothing more than an expensive club. I've seen some collapsible stocks that work pretty well, only problem is on the mossbergs you can't get to the safety easily.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 2:31:12 PM EDT
Originally Posted By akang:
A shotgun with a pistol grip is nothing more than an expensive club. I've seen some collapsible stocks that work pretty well, only problem is on the mossbergs you can't get to the safety easily.



i wont go that far, the pistol grip has its place..

Link Posted: 3/27/2009 3:27:54 PM EDT
One guy I knew had a pistol grip defender and took it out hunting(!). Out pops the partridge, up goes his defender. BLAM! The damn thing recoils right into his cheek.
Hard too.

That story being related, I still think pistol grip shotguns are cool and I'll get one someday. They are fun to shoot at least.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 3:36:06 PM EDT
I have owned one shotgun with a pistol grip. It was a painful useless piece of dung. My thumb is noticeably weaker due to the intense recoil from that shotgun. I'd consider a 28 ga o/u pistol that was an AOW or SBS as a toy. 12 gauges and pistol grips IMHO don't mix.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 5:30:31 PM EDT
For me I like a full stock on a shotgun. I have tried and used a side folder, top folder and a pistol grip. None of them ever felt right. The cheek weld was uncomfortable to shoot on the folders. I used the pistol grip because of size for awhile but then went back to my M12 and 1897 take downs for the size issue. I still have the folders and PG in a box some where........... I have wood or synthetic on my 9 shotguns now and wont be changing them.
RLTW
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 5:54:38 PM EDT
Any comments on the Advanced Technology (ATI) Top-Folding Shotgun Stock?
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 6:23:21 PM EDT
I put a CopStock pistol grip and collapsable stock on my Mossberg 500 SPS 12 guage. I had this idea I could shoot it from a weaver stance like an M4 carbine with the stock up against my clavacle.

Tried it with bird shot, worked pretty good.

Decided to try it with 00 buck which I use for home defense and damn near broke my colar bone.

Don't try that at home. It's painful.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 7:59:31 PM EDT
I'll agree with most of the above. Painfull to shoot with just a pistol grip, but it makes for a compact package that will clear a hallway easily. Mine serves most of the time as a HD weapon and is never out of arms reach. When hunting season rolls around, the wood goes back on and the pistol grip goes in the drawer. It's also a good weapon to take camping loaded with slugs or buckshot for those pesky bears.
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 8:22:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/27/2009 8:31:17 PM EDT by Kar15]
i'm pretty happy with my pair of mossbergs set up with ATI 6 pos collapseable stocks. but i'm a big guy and don't mind the recoil though, i shortened the LOP by removing the recoil pad even.

i can't recall if there is a pic of each, or if both pics are of the same gun. but i do have 2 and they are identical, 2 is 1 and all that. buying guns has gotten a lot more expensive ever since i found the SF a couple years back and started subscribing to that principal. now i buy everything in pairs, fellow member and best friend armedsuspect likes to bust on me(though he does understand and agrees but not to the level i've reached) because of it...

i don't really have a problem with reaching the safety on the top of the reciever on mossbergs either but again, what works for one, may feel like ass for another...

K.

ETA: i do plan on swapping out to a better pair of lights and probably loosing those stupid barrel shrouds...
Link Posted: 3/27/2009 8:36:38 PM EDT
now, I love shooting skeet and trap with my o/u, but...

for defense or SHTF, I love a pistol grip - for shorter range targets, I can't believe the control. Granted, if you were shooting hundred of rounds you'd need a wrist replacement, but for aiming and knocking a target, a pistol grip can't be beat.

M
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 3:08:25 AM EDT
i dont mind a pistol grip at all i have even shot clays with it kinda joking around making fun of my buddy who couldnt hit the broad side of a barn with a cadillac...mine is for inside the house...my favorite furniture for 18" barreled shotguns is hogue overmolded...im actually in the market for another pistol grip shotgun mossy500 or rem870 for my summer get away...
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 3:49:09 AM EDT
Originally Posted By geegee:
Any comments on the Advanced Technology (ATI) Top-Folding Shotgun Stock?


From what I've read (over and over again) general consensus on the ATI top folding stock (and anything that starts out ATI) is that it is a P.O.S..

Haven't tried one myself, but I haven't read a single good review of the ATI top folding stock.

Just sayin'.....

Michael

Link Posted: 3/28/2009 4:20:55 AM EDT
Originally Posted By Kar15:


K.

ETA: i do plan on swapping out to a better pair of lights and probably loosing those stupid barrel shrouds...



yeah, those barrel shrouds are shit. i could never get mine to stay on right. Everytime I pulled the trigger the thing went out o place. Now it sits in a dark and dry place and never sees the sun.

Link Posted: 3/28/2009 11:03:34 AM EDT
I really enjoy shooting my Saiga 12. All my ARs have pistol grips, so it just comes natural that my shotgun does. Shooting 2 3/4" rounds is nothing on the shoulder or hand with the stock or pistol grip. I'd put this against anything in my arsenal in regards to home defense.

Link Posted: 3/28/2009 12:58:13 PM EDT
Originally Posted By jmzd4:
Originally Posted By Kar15:


K.

ETA: i do plan on swapping out to a better pair of lights and probably loosing those stupid barrel shrouds...



yeah, those barrel shrouds are shit. i could never get mine to stay on right. Everytime I pulled the trigger the thing went out o place. Now it sits in a dark and dry place and never sees the sun.



mine stay in place just fine infact they don't move at all, but if i've put enough lead down range through a shotgun to burn my hands on the barrel i'm doing somethng wrong anyway. my mossys' are the cruiser 7+1 models with 6 shell side saddle and 5 shell stock saddle. that's 19 rnds total, grab and go ou tthe door. i fgure if i can't fix the problem with-in those 19 shells i probably can;t fix it with a shotgun. and 19 shells unless fired as fast as i can load pull reload and repeat shouldn't burn me up to bad. the barrel shrouds look "tough", but are really just extra added weight i.m.h.o. but i also don't see my shotty as a primary. i have a couple expensive and tricked out ARs and a couple simple and cheap(when i bought them) AKs for that...

just my $.02, K.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 1:24:38 PM EDT
A pistol grip stock or just a pistol grip, in my opinion, are the worst possible idea for a Mossberg. This is due to the placement of the safety. Cav Arms addressed that with their adapter which has a replacement safety that can extends past the sides of the reciever. Otherwise the hand has to move too far to engage/disengage the safety.

I think a PG on a "breacher" would be ok. I'm no ninja. I prefer a shot LOP stop for control and less than lethal persuasion.

BK
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