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11/20/2019 5:07:11 PM
Posted: 7/27/2009 5:34:01 PM EST
I have a 62 cj5 that I trail ride and use for IceCream runs .Its lifted 2.5 inches ,on 33x13.5s swampers ,custom bumpers front and back ,5.38 gears locked front and back with a craw of 84:1. Ive always looked at it as a handy little vehicle to have around . Great for salvaging fire wood out of logging decks , clearing the road after a storm , trailblazing and checking on things around the farm. I figured if things got bad it would be just as handy especially bugging in . Its offroad capability along with its utility is a nice compromise plus its easy to shoot from if it came to that and since I upgraded the front end can do a 180 in very little room .

Was going to put a 203 or 236 perkins diesel my 62 CJ-5 jeep but have totally scratched it , I really wanted to do it but reality hit . The 72hp F Head 134Cu hurricane is on the last days of its life down to around 50hp . The hurricane has got me to the point of not liking my jeep because of lack of umhhp to push it down the road even if I rebuilt it 55 mph on a rolling hwy is very hard on it . The diesel wouldnt really give it much more umph and I would loose about 1500 of my rpm band . Thought about just selling it and buying an YJ (square head lights) and starting over but after a some tinkering I really dont think I can get rid of her . 2 jeeps are not an option right now. Though if I rebuilt a perkins and put a injection pump on her it would be running when Im old and grey.

So Ive regrouped and think Im going to go with the all common 4.3 TBI swap . I hate to do it but old school (name of my jeep) might be going to be bought up to date with Throttle body injection ,power steering and maybe even heat if Im feeling industrious . Ive been pricing stuff for the swap and I figure I can do it for around 1000 bucks tops . If I do it Im going to rebuild the engine and collect parts this fall and do the swap next winter . I think I have every thing necessary to adapt it to my T-98 transmission that I was , if not I have a SM420 that it will bolt directly to then Ill just have to adapt it to my Dana 18 transfer case .Either way either will stand to any thing the 4.3 will put to it.

Pros:
It will over double my HP and Torque (4.3 =160 Hp 230 Torque) Which will really move the 2600 lbs jeep or I could pull a trailer over 25 mph finally lol
TBI should really help offroad no float bounce as with a carb and off angles will not effect it
The 4.3 is very common and shares parts with SBC V8s so if I break something most likly will be able to find replacement parts fairly easy
Roughly 50 pound lighter then my Hurricane
More responsive pedal
Power steering , I can ditch my 6 turn box for a 4 turn ps unit to have more responsive steering on the road .
Cost the same to properly rebuild the hurricane or 500 bucks less then the estimated perkins swap.


Cons:
Exhaust routing outside of frame rails easier to trail damage
Bigger motor = more heat more to keep cool .
More HP means more drive line strain
TBI = more parts to break and more wiring to have faults
needs quality fuel no more rusty water filled stuff the hurricane can drink with out sputtering
Electronic components and water do not mix which means special mounting considerations. ECM mounted under dash in waterproof box all wiring sealed
And for you EMP believers out there TBI could be a problem , but easy corrected with a intake and carb from the junk yard hanging on the wall .

Then theres the unseen problems with any swap.

What do yall think ?
Link Posted: 7/27/2009 5:41:18 PM EST
What is this quality fuel you speak of?

My 4.3 gets the cheapest gas it can find. It does get pretty decent mileage in my full size Chevy/short bed with a 5 speed.

Switch over to electric fans and cooling shouldn't be an issue and will free up the engine by eliminating the clutch fan. The engines are cheap and VERY easy to work on. It's a 350 missing two cylinders and they put the damn things in enough vehicles to make it easy to find parts.

I believe you are on to a great project and I would really like to see this in a huge pictorial thread. Good luck.
Link Posted: 7/27/2009 5:53:37 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/27/2009 6:07:57 PM EST by Hawk_308]
The fuel I speak of is gas that I cant dump back into the tanks when Im working do to many different reasons . Most of the time its full of rust , microbes , water or other fuels such as diesel . The hurricane had burned through a whole tank of 50/50 gas diesel mix on one trail ride , its free lol .

The pros con list is a hurrican vs the 4.3 , The hurricane will cool fine with less then 50 % of the radiator full and go quite a ways with out a belt on it .
Link Posted: 7/27/2009 6:01:07 PM EST
I would go with common parts availability. Either way, DO IT, and post pics.
Link Posted: 7/27/2009 6:12:39 PM EST
Oh there will be pics ,theres always pics . Heres Old School for yall that never saw her .


Link Posted: 7/27/2009 6:15:22 PM EST
Originally Posted By Hawk_308:
Oh there will be pics ,theres always pics . Heres Old School for yall that never saw her .

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c241/Hawk_308/Jeep/IMG_0802.jpg
http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c241/Hawk_308/Guns/DSCF0106.jpg


Looks a lot like my 80 CJ5. I'll keep mine old school, with the original 4.2L though!
Link Posted: 7/27/2009 6:20:34 PM EST
4.3 would be a good swap. Or you could swap in a 4.0l AMC. Yeah it's fuel injected, but it wouldn't be that hard to do.
Link Posted: 7/27/2009 6:30:56 PM EST
For what it is worth, I spend a lot of time in Colorado and Utah far from civilization. I run a similar engine. (Ford 4.0 V6). The electronics don't scare me. Even though you have to put a lot of trust in those little circuits, I have found them to be quite robust under adverse conditions, from extreme cold, to extreme heat, water, dust and vibration. In a lot of ways, the electronics make the engine more reliable. Distributless ignition on my truck is great. No moving parts to wear out or break. I'm not a Chevy fan, but I will admit that the 4.3 has good power and decent economy. Parts are going to be more common than your current engine simply because it is related to the 350 SB.
Link Posted: 7/27/2009 6:37:11 PM EST
i, like you, wanted a play toy and BOV so i bought a 89XJ, dropped a shitload of money in it($4k for a new motor and all the fluids replaced with synthetic, 3" lift and bigger tires) and now it just sits. i have been thinking about selling it but i know i wont get much out of it. i say hit the junk yards for the drive line out of a s10/blazer and go from there. unless you would like a XJ with a new motor.
Link Posted: 7/27/2009 6:45:37 PM EST
Will the 304 fit?

I have the 304 in my 75 CJ5 and it has plenty of torque and HP for me.
Would cost about the same at the 4.3 though....?

You have a great CJ there, I think the 4.3 with TBI would be an awesome upgrade!
Link Posted: 7/27/2009 7:12:06 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/27/2009 7:13:35 PM EST by Hawk_308]
I built this jeep 5 years ago and have wheeled about every trail on the east coast that I have found out about . I normally make 2 big runs a year and 3 to 5 smaller ones . So mine isnt exactly setting.

I have a 4.3 and all the TBI goodies in the shed on the farm , I also have a Chevy engine to Jeep T90 bell housing and I have a T-98 tranny with an adapter to make it look like a T90 lol So in theory I already have every thing for the swap but it never works that way.

Going with a 304 would be killing 3 of my pros plus I would also have to find adapters , my jeep is 9 years pre AMC and is 4 inches shorter making a V8 a tight fit , but its possible but opens multiple cans of worms . The early 5s like mine in 66 started to come with buick odd fire V6s which are very similar to the 4.3 in size and layout . The only real notible change was the factory Grill fan shroud and radiator being about 3 inchs shorter and 6 inches wider . Which BTW I have a V6 grill assembly also down on the farm lol.
Link Posted: 7/28/2009 6:18:52 AM EST
If I had the time, tools and skill... I think an old Mercedes 240D engine would be the bomb in a Jeep. You could get one of these to burn just about anything in a pinch. Imagine a Jeep "Brute" pick-up...
Link Posted: 7/28/2009 7:17:09 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/28/2009 7:59:41 AM EST by JPC]
Hawk,,I had a '67 CJ-6,,with the Dauntless V-6 Buick odd fire,great little engine,lots of torque.
Your 55 have the 3spd or a 4? If memory serves,,a ford V-6 might not require an adapter.
Have you looked at Advance Adapters or Novacks?

Oh I did the 4.3 with a Chevy NP435 4spd so didn't need the adapter.
Also Saginaw steering was needed to get the exhaust routed,made for better steering too.
Might want to add a tilt steering column.
Don't forget engine mounts .Electric fan,,it all ads up.
Link Posted: 7/28/2009 7:35:12 AM EST
The 4.3 would be a good swap, and you can get a 4bbl intake and go with a carb if you want
Link Posted: 7/28/2009 7:57:01 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/28/2009 8:18:27 AM EST by Hawk_308]
Had a friend about 90% done on a 240 in a cj 5 swap when his wife left him , not sure if he has ever started back on it.

I currently have a 3 speed T90 but I have a T98 4 speed that I rebuilt and is ready to go in. But Im not sure if the sm 420 I have might be shorter and make the better tranny since it will bolt directly to the 4.3 and the T98 I will need to stack adapters . The down side to the SM420 I would have to adapt it to my Transfer case which is a $422 part from novak. Both trannys came in 1 ton trucks of their day so strength is not an issue . I will also have to shorten or lengthen my drive shafts but me and my best friend have made plenty of drive shafts so thats not an issue . The motor and tranny mounts are not a problem either , they are easy to fab. I have already preformed a saggie swap along with a D30 front end last year so thats out of the way . I kept the steering shaft tucked in as close to the frame as possible because I wasnt sure how the perkins diesel was going to fit.

Never mind the poor condition of the donor parts lol I have a rebuild kit for that box on my computer desk I just havnt gotten around to yet lol
Link Posted: 7/28/2009 8:30:58 AM EST
Jeeps prior to 1962 or so had the Perkins A4-236 as an option, so parts are out there somewhere.

Diesel pro's..

Incredible torque at low end
great fuel economy
runs on kerosene, mineral spirits, jet fuel, etc
longevity
low maintainence

To each, his own. the old Hurricane 4 banger was a bit anemic when it was in great shape.

Ops
Link Posted: 7/28/2009 8:34:36 AM EST
it was the 192 perkins here in the states , the 203 and 236 were options on foreign built models.
Link Posted: 7/28/2009 2:19:01 PM EST
You have most of the parts and you have the need for another engine so I would drop the 4.3 into it.

I would do everything you can to make the electronic fuel infection and electric fuel pump repairable or rebuildable but in my opinon a lot of this stuff has proven itself to be reliable if you keep up on looking it over now and then and taking care of your stuff.

There is an old cj-5 I drive past to get to one of my posts at my job and other than way too much body rust I would love to bring it home.

I like the new jeeps but there is something to be said for an old jeep and all the options you have when thinking about making some changes.

And if money were available I would rank a diesel at the top of the engine swap list but when you have all the parts sitting around to drop in a gasser v6 I figure it might be time to drop in a gasser v6 for a while and then the next time around maybe you have have all the parts for the diesel swap sitting around.

I had a 4.3 v6 in a 96 oldsmobile bravada and I can't say anything bad about the engine.
Link Posted: 7/28/2009 3:47:29 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/28/2009 3:52:42 PM EST by Hawk_308]
Rust Ha I laugh at Rust HA HA ,







Link Posted: 7/30/2009 7:33:51 AM EST
That's awesome!
Link Posted: 7/31/2009 4:03:18 AM EST
Hawk,

Why didn't you just get a fiberglass tub?

Seems that would have saved a lot of time and maybe some money. That was a pile of work.

By the way, great job
Link Posted: 7/31/2009 4:35:42 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/31/2009 9:49:40 AM EST by Hawk_308]
Thanks yall .
I like steel and fiberglass makes me itch I grew up with a dad and 2 uncles racing circle track so Im used to working with sheet metal and prefer repairing it over glass . Plus I was able to incorporate some upgrades when building the body like the rear of the jeep and the rocker panels are made out of 1/8 steel . I dont have to worry about my antennas pulling loose and my rocker panels are alot stronger now . It took about 350 bucks to fix the tub and about 2 weeks at night, so not to bad . My sister has a fiberglass tub on one of her jeeps and its nice but makes it a pain when trying to install stuff and you have to keep ground bars everywhere.

Last night I dug around and found an ammo can that fit behind the glove box on the passenger side perfectly to mount the ECM and fuse box in. I figure I can weld some mounting tabs under the dash and cowl and make me a waterproof removable electronics box. I can wire it all up in the basement then mount it when I do the swap.
Link Posted: 7/31/2009 6:13:03 AM EST
hawk, sounds like a good project and since you already have the main components, i'd say go for it. i wish i had more wrenching and fabrication skills.
Link Posted: 7/31/2009 9:30:29 AM EST
i wish i had more wrenching and fabrication skills.


a big +1

Link Posted: 7/31/2009 10:16:34 AM EST
Originally Posted By Lungbuster:
i wish i had more wrenching and fabrication skills.


a big +1



That makes 3 of us.

My 78' 5 is going pretty quick & I do not have the skills or the money to fix it right now. Just yesterday while washing the winter dirt off it (yeah it's been a while), I noticed the drivers rear tub mount is all but gone. The floors have had patches pop riveted in already & need a permanent fix.

I would not go with a fiberglass tub cause of grounding issue either. Plus I like the nostalgia of the original metal stampings, like the shovel recess below the drivers door & the Jeep stamped into the fender in front of the doors.
Link Posted: 7/31/2009 10:38:08 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/31/2009 1:42:35 PM EST by Hawk_308]
My fab skills are not that good , my best friend does a whole lot cleaner work then I do but he is a fire fighter and works one and 2 days off to so he has alot more time to deal with issues and does very clean work. I can get buy but I will not win any awards for neatness nor finish but Im not normaly concerned with looks as long as it works and will not break.
Link Posted: 8/2/2009 5:05:18 AM EST
Originally Posted By Hawk_308:
My fab skills are not that good , my best friend does a whole lot cleaner work then I do but he is a fire fighter and works one and 2 days off to so he has alot more time to deal with issues and does very clean work. I can get buy but I will not win any awards for neatness nor finish but Im not normaly concerned with looks as long as it works and will not break.


As long as the welds are solid who cares if she is pretty. Keep up the good work and make sure you are up to date on your tetanus shots.
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