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Posted: 7/24/2011 9:33:01 PM EST
Like most I have been working on BOBs for the family. I am now looking at sleeping bags for myself, the wife, and our daughter. I haven't spent much time outdoors since the military humping around my issued sleeping bag. I am looking at two different Marmot sleeping bags, one is synthetic and the other is down and both are rated to "0 degrees". Of course down is near useless if it gets wet but it is 1.5lbs lighter than the other I am considering and it compresses smaller. The interesting thing is that the EN rating system on Marmot.com indicates the synthetic bag out performs the down for minimum comfortable sleeping temperature for women 11 degrees vs 15 degrees for the down bag. My concern of course is for my wife and daughter. So, the question is, would the 1.5lbs weight savings justify the doubling of price from synthetic to down? I always thought down was warmer. Any feedback would be appreciated. While these would be for the BOBs I am looking for quality bags if I can find time to take the family camping and such. I am also pretty set on the Marmot bags. I am currently looking on Campmor's website, the link to both the tents are below. Thanks.

Marmot Trestles 0 Degree Bag

Marmot Never Summer 0 Degree Bag
Link Posted: 7/24/2011 10:27:31 PM EST
[#1]
I like down bags. Are you sure you need 0 degree bags? They're going to be too hot in the summer. My 20 degree North Face down bag works well most of the time in the Northwest.
Link Posted: 7/24/2011 11:14:54 PM EST
[#2]
Personally, for me if you are not doing Mt. Everest or something similar probably not worth the extra money.

If you need extra warmth, you may want to consider some silk sheets etc. My toes get cold at night so I wear an extra of wool socks. Of course that all of that adds to the extra weight, so 6 of that or a half a dozen of the other.
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 12:20:34 AM EST
[#3]
This is for a BOB right?

No way would I have a down bag in a bug out bag.

Down is worthless when wet and if you need a BOB, you aren't going to be able to choose the conditions of when you need it. If it's 35 degrees and raining that expensive and normally warm down bag will weigh an extra couple of pounds, the down will clump and be forever worthless even when you eventually dry it out without a drier that tumbles the down to break it up.

Down bags are only for sub freezing dry temps. Anything else will get the bag damp and require it to be aired out in dry sunny daytime to dry out. It does not lend itself to a BOB reqyired type situation.

And when it's wet, the person that needs it will die because it is useless.

I have slept in a soaking wet polarguard bag and stayed perfectly warm.

Synthetic , IMO, is the only option for a BOB or post
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 2:22:40 AM EST
[#4]
Thanks guys, I appreciate it. Yes, I was going to go with a 0 degree bag because I would rather have too warm of a bag and be able to open it up than one that was not warm enough. I am thinking primarily for my wife and daughter who obviously don't generate as much body heat as I do and I wanted something that would be very comfortable for them at the 20-30 degree mark. The manufacturers always over estimate the temperature rating of the bag such as this bag is 0 degrees but comforatbly ratied to 15 degrees. I thought the extra rating would help, but I could be wrong . You guys make some good points about down bags so I am starting to lean towards the synthetic due to it being half the price and having a higher comfort rating as well as the worthless when wet factor. Looks like the 1.5lbs savings with a down bag isn't worth the hassle of a down bag for SHTF, which I was thinking but I wanted to as the been there done that crowd to be sure. Thanks alot guys, I appreciate the feedback!
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 4:42:29 AM EST
[#5]
I have a Marmot 15* synthetic bag and it was a bit chilly in the high 20s/low 30s. A 0* bag would have kept me toasty, but I didn't want to deal with the extra size and weight.

I only have synthetic sleeping bags. My bag got damp on my last trip because it rained almost the entire trip. Temps were in the 30s and it kept me warm and dried out pretty quickly.
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 5:09:51 AM EST
[#6]
Quoted:
Thanks guys, I appreciate it. Yes, I was going to go with a 0 degree bag because I would rather have too warm of a bag and be able to open it up than one that was not warm enough. I am thinking primarily for my wife and daughter who obviously don't generate as much body heat as I do and I wanted something that would be very comfortable for them at the 20-30 degree mark. The manufacturers always over estimate the temperature rating of the bag such as this bag is 0 degrees but comforatbly ratied to 15 degrees. I thought the extra rating would help, but I could be wrong . You guys make some good points about down bags so I am starting to lean towards the synthetic due to it being half the price and having a higher comfort rating as well as the worthless when wet factor. Looks like the 1.5lbs savings with a down bag isn't worth the hassle of a down bag for SHTF, which I was thinking but I wanted to as the been there done that crowd to be sure. Thanks alot guys, I appreciate the feedback!


I just purchased a couple of 20* synthetic bags for myself and my wife.  I figure these will be good year around if I have a wool or polar fleece blanket to supplement in the winter.  We have not had to opportunity to try them yet.
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 5:27:24 AM EST
[#7]
for a BOB, you should go synthetic.  Down will not insullate when wet.
If you're tight on space and weight (BOBs usually are), look into the Recon series of bags or something similiar.
I bought Recon 3 bags for my family.

I waited for a good deal on ebay and payed $75 each.

I haven't actually used them yet, but they are built to be very durable.  They are in military use etc.
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 5:48:03 AM EST
[#8]
I always use the manufacturer's rating as a survival rating, not a comfort rating.  

0 degrees is not an unreasonable rating for WA state.
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 5:52:48 AM EST
[#9]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Thanks guys, I appreciate it. Yes, I was going to go with a 0 degree bag because I would rather have too warm of a bag and be able to open it up than one that was not warm enough. I am thinking primarily for my wife and daughter who obviously don't generate as much body heat as I do and I wanted something that would be very comfortable for them at the 20-30 degree mark. The manufacturers always over estimate the temperature rating of the bag such as this bag is 0 degrees but comforatbly ratied to 15 degrees. I thought the extra rating would help, but I could be wrong . You guys make some good points about down bags so I am starting to lean towards the synthetic due to it being half the price and having a higher comfort rating as well as the worthless when wet factor. Looks like the 1.5lbs savings with a down bag isn't worth the hassle of a down bag for SHTF, which I was thinking but I wanted to as the been there done that crowd to be sure. Thanks alot guys, I appreciate the feedback!


I just purchased a couple of 20* synthetic bags for myself and my wife.  I figure these will be good year around if I have a wool or polar fleece blanket to supplement in the winter.   We have not had to opportunity to try them yet.


Not necessarily the best plan, especially in your neck of the woods (SD winters can be COLD, as you know).  A fleece blanket will only add about 5-10 degrees to the bag, and don't work the best in mummy bags.  There's not a whole lot of extra room in a mummy, and the fleece blankets tend to clump up around you; they "grab" your clothing, but slide around inside the bag.  You'll have big balls of fleece blanket in some spots and skin to sleeping bag gaps in others.  In other words, you'll spend all night fighting the blanket for little reward.  

Ask me how I know.  
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 6:40:30 AM EST
[#10]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Thanks guys, I appreciate it. Yes, I was going to go with a 0 degree bag because I would rather have too warm of a bag and be able to open it up than one that was not warm enough. I am thinking primarily for my wife and daughter who obviously don't generate as much body heat as I do and I wanted something that would be very comfortable for them at the 20-30 degree mark. The manufacturers always over estimate the temperature rating of the bag such as this bag is 0 degrees but comforatbly ratied to 15 degrees. I thought the extra rating would help, but I could be wrong . You guys make some good points about down bags so I am starting to lean towards the synthetic due to it being half the price and having a higher comfort rating as well as the worthless when wet factor. Looks like the 1.5lbs savings with a down bag isn't worth the hassle of a down bag for SHTF, which I was thinking but I wanted to as the been there done that crowd to be sure. Thanks alot guys, I appreciate the feedback!


I just purchased a couple of 20* synthetic bags for myself and my wife.  I figure these will be good year around if I have a wool or polar fleece blanket to supplement in the winter.   We have not had to opportunity to try them yet.


Not necessarily the best plan, especially in your neck of the woods (SD winters can be COLD, as you know).  A fleece blanket will only add about 5-10 degrees to the bag, and don't work the best in mummy bags.  There's not a whole lot of extra room in a mummy, and the fleece blankets tend to clump up around you; they "grab" your clothing, but slide around inside the bag.  You'll have big balls of fleece blanket in some spots and skin to sleeping bag gaps in others.  In other words, you'll spend all night fighting the blanket for little reward.  

Ask me how I know.  


Thanks for the insight - what about using the blanket around the outside of the sleeping bag?  extra insulation under and a wrap over the top?
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 7:36:09 AM EST
[#11]
Don't forget a decent pad of some sort to keep the bag off the ground.

TXL
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 11:12:52 AM EST
[#12]
One less lb of lightness isn't enough for me to spend extra $ for down. My sythetic works in more weather conditions and is cheaper.

Also, at least with me, just opening the bag on a bag rated for way cooler temps doesn't work for me. I'll still get too hot, and that's why I have multiple bags for different seasons.
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 11:34:43 AM EST
[#13]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Thanks guys, I appreciate it. Yes, I was going to go with a 0 degree bag because I would rather have too warm of a bag and be able to open it up than one that was not warm enough. I am thinking primarily for my wife and daughter who obviously don't generate as much body heat as I do and I wanted something that would be very comfortable for them at the 20-30 degree mark. The manufacturers always over estimate the temperature rating of the bag such as this bag is 0 degrees but comforatbly ratied to 15 degrees. I thought the extra rating would help, but I could be wrong . You guys make some good points about down bags so I am starting to lean towards the synthetic due to it being half the price and having a higher comfort rating as well as the worthless when wet factor. Looks like the 1.5lbs savings with a down bag isn't worth the hassle of a down bag for SHTF, which I was thinking but I wanted to as the been there done that crowd to be sure. Thanks alot guys, I appreciate the feedback!


I just purchased a couple of 20* synthetic bags for myself and my wife.  I figure these will be good year around if I have a wool or polar fleece blanket to supplement in the winter.   We have not had to opportunity to try them yet.


Not necessarily the best plan, especially in your neck of the woods (SD winters can be COLD, as you know).  A fleece blanket will only add about 5-10 degrees to the bag, and don't work the best in mummy bags.  There's not a whole lot of extra room in a mummy, and the fleece blankets tend to clump up around you; they "grab" your clothing, but slide around inside the bag.  You'll have big balls of fleece blanket in some spots and skin to sleeping bag gaps in others.  In other words, you'll spend all night fighting the blanket for little reward.  

Ask me how I know.  


Thanks for the insight - what about using the blanket around the outside of the sleeping bag?  extra insulation under and a wrap over the top?


I've done that before (slept in -30 that way, but the blankets I use are...different*), but the problem is the design of the sleeping bag works against having the blanket be effective on the outside, unless you use a LOT of insulation.  

(ETA:  By that I mean, the amount of insulation needed to trap and reflect the heat the sleeping bag is NOT capturing is higher than you'd think, because the sleeping bag is doing its job as best it can.  If we're talking about a 5 degree difference, maybe not that big a deal, but if you're trying to use a blanket to supplement a 45 deg bag in 20 deg weather, it's going to have to be pretty thick.  Law of diminishing returns, and all that.)

Insulation under––ABSOLUTELY necessary.  You're actually better off with a self-inflating pad than a blanket (air is a better insulator than a blanket, IMO, plus it's lighter and more packable).

In my experience, you're better off with a lower manufacturer's rating from the beginning, then wrap the bag with a gortex bivy bag (or for that matter, a tarp) on the outside.  That gives you a windproof barrier to keep any air currents (no matter how slight) from penetrating the bag.  

One other thing about cold-weather camping––baffle control is CRITICAL.  Most of the time I've been chilled (even at 45 degrees), it's been because I've got a leak of cold air past the baffles around my neck, NOT because the sleeping bag wasn't rated for it.  You'd be surprised how little air it takes to chill you significantly.  

My below-freezing sleeping system is:

- 0 to -30 rated bag (depending on the temps)
- Gortex bivy bag
- USAF helmet liner to keep the heat in on my melon
- Neoprene ski mask (keeps nose and lips from freezing)
- Towel or fleece jacket wrapped around my shoulders to supplement the baffles in keeping the air out
- Long johns (you should only wear one layer in your sleeping bag, makes the bag more efficient)
- Wool socks

Clothing is all fresh (as in, not worn that day) before crawling in the sack.

For -10 or below, I add a blanket between the pad and the sleeping bag, a Snickers bar in the belly to give your body a quick burst of energy, and a couple of handwarmers at the foot of the sleeping bag about 15 minutes before lights-out to make things really snug.  

 


*The blankets I used for -30 sleeping are USGI casualty blankets, rumored to be made of gortex and thinsulate.  I bought mine about 15 years ago and haven't seen any on the market in years.  These shed water like gortex and have a VERY high R-value.
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 11:40:15 AM EST
[#14]
I own/use Wiggy's sleeping bags.  They'll keep you warm if they get wet, that alone is worth their weight in gold.
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 12:01:51 PM EST
[#15]
Quoted:
I own/use Wiggy's sleeping bags.  They'll keep you warm if they get wet, that alone is worth their weight in gold.

This is all that needs to be said. I got wet and cold, and got in my wiggys and was wet and toasty warm. Call me a fan boy, but this is the only way to fly.
Link Posted: 7/25/2011 2:48:13 PM EST
[#16]
Quoted:
Quoted:
I own/use Wiggy's sleeping bags.  They'll keep you warm if they get wet, that alone is worth their weight in gold.

This is all that needs to be said. I got wet and cold, and got in my wiggys and was wet and toasty warm. Call me a fan boy, but this is the only way to fly.


And that's one thing that needs to be said.  Buy once, cry once.  Good, quality gear costs $$s, and don't expect Wiggy's performance out of the Walmart slumber party bag.

Link Posted: 7/26/2011 1:10:27 AM EST
[#17]
This is what I carry on OK

bag is synthetic and rated at 45

http://www.rei.com/product/747887/mountain-hardwear-ultralamina-45-sleeping-bag

Liner

Said to add 15 to bag

http://www.rei.com/product/705534/sea-to-summit-reactor-thermolite-mummy-bag-liner



both fit in the xs size stuff sack

http://www.rei.com/product/766677/sea-to-summit-ultra-sil-compression-sack



And have been personally tested to work in colder than planned temps

weather man said it would get down to mid 40s at night and 30% chance of rain

go camping

feel cold so use both and a wobby

wake up to 1 inch of white stuff on my bivy tent
Link Posted: 7/26/2011 1:52:19 AM EST
[#18]
i run a marmot 3o trestles.

its g2g till around 20f..then it gets chilly for me( gotta put on poly pros etc)

I also have a slumberjack 0f rated bag. its to damn hot even if its below 20f out .

I have a 20f rated down kelty. It cost me sub 40$...i plan to test it this winter.



i test and use my gear. As i evolve so does my gear and my needs.

Just because you purchased a prosche  doesnt mean your a good driver or will win the race.
Link Posted: 7/26/2011 5:29:45 AM EST
[#19]
For warmer weather I have a Marmot bag (think it's like Protus', had it for a long time and I'm not 100% sure).  I am good down to about freezing in that bag (with a wool liner).  For anything colder I prefer my down (big agnes) bag, which is toasty in the teens (and probably beyond... it's rated at 15* and I was shedding layers at that temp).

If you want to see fur fly, start the "down vs. synthetic" argument among hardcore military/survival/hiker/mountaineer/whatever been-there-done-that types.  You'll get all kinds of different answers (I literally saw two army rangers damned near end up in a fist fight on this subject... and yes, there was alcohol involved).   If you're going with down, you save a ton of weight/bulk, but you do need to take precautions to keep it dry.  This is not as impossible a task as some would lead you to believe, but it's not a no brainer either.  If you want an idiot proof solution, and weight isn't a concern, synthetic is the way to go (but the difference is in pounds, not ounces).
Link Posted: 7/26/2011 12:49:46 PM EST
[#20]
Link Posted: 7/26/2011 10:52:13 PM EST
[#21]
Quoted:

Meh, I use nothing but down and go out in all four seasons. Never a problem. I always have a light weight shelter in my pack, keep dry and warm.

Not that hard to keep your bag dry.

I'm never giving up my down bags, flame away. I don't care and you're wasting your time doing it.
If it works for you, then go for it.

Link Posted: 7/27/2011 4:47:23 AM EST
[#22]
Quoted:
I also have a slumberjack 0f rated bag. its to damn hot even if its below 20f out .


I have been using one of these (down) for probably about 10 years now.  Back when I used to do a lot of winter camping (in NH and ME) I would supplement with a fleece liner from L.L. Bean.  Summer time I usually just use the fleece as the bag is, like you said, too damn hot.

I've slept in it soaking wet before.  It was not a fun weekend.  

That being said, my bag is light, and stuffs down to almost nothing (enough room in the stuff sack for me to fit the fleece liner in there) and it's the only sleeping bag I have.  So it's part of my BOB.
Link Posted: 7/27/2011 5:04:23 PM EST
[#23]
I have both but when I'm hiking and in my BOB, it is DOWN all the way for space saving reasons and weight. I do keep it in a waterproof stuff sack though. But when it's hot out I use a thermarest pad my bivy and a sleeping bag liner or poncho liner for wraps.
Link Posted: 7/27/2011 7:10:00 PM EST
[#24]
I am a down fan as well.  Although the synthetics get better all the time, and they are pretty close any more.

Down still has the edge in weight, compressibility, and especially longevity.  I still have the -20 down bag I bought with my paper route money when I was 16 (26 years ago), and it still has great loft.  I also am sleeping tonight in the Blue Kazoo that I bought when I was 18, and it is still a great bag.

If I were to buy a synthetic, I would stick with polargard/ climashield or primaloft.  These seem to have the best reputation for standing up over time.  If I were looking for an "all around" bag, I would get either a Snowshoe or a Superlight.  If I lived in warmer climate, I would get either a Cats Meow or a Blue Kazoo.

I am a big North Face fan, as they not only build good stuff, they really stand behind their products.  I had a friend who hiked the continental divide from Canada to Mexico using a blue kazoo, and then basically slept every night in the bag for the next two years.  He wore it out.  He sent it back to North Face to get it "fixed" and they sent him a new one.

When my wife and I climbed Denali about 15 years ago, I had the top of the line Marmot down/ gortex -40 bag, and she had the equivalent bag from North Face.  Her's clearly had more loft, and was the warmer bag.  Both of these were $600-$700 bags at the time.  Marmot is a good company, and my info is dated, but back then the north face bags were superior in my mind.  In reality, the Marmot bags you are looking at will probably make you very happy, just my personal preference/ observations.  

The snow shoe is $60 more than the synthetic Marmot bag you linked, but it is also 1 lb 12 oz less, and it compresses a little smaller.  It also uses climashield, which is the newer version of polargard.  North Face has been using polargard for over 20 years, and if it didn't stand up over time they wouldn't use it, because they would have to waranty bags as they get older.  I would probably buy the Snowshoe over the Marmot down bag that you listed, as it is lighter and you get the advantage of the water resistant nature of the synthetic insulation.

If I were buying a new bag today, I would serously consider a synthetic, because as I said they are getting much closer.

In my opinion, selecting a pad is as important, or more important than the bag.  The inflatable pads make you MUCH warmer, and much more comfortable.  I don't know how accurate this chart is, but at least it lists a lot of the choices.  Just like people say that you should spend a certain percentage of the price of your gun on your scope, I would say that spending $50-$75 on a good pad will be well worth it, and make you more likely to use your sleeping bags more than once a year.

I am not a wiggys fan.  I met the "inventor" back when he was starting out.  I was doing Search and Rescue in Gunnison which is about 125 miles from Grand Junction, which is where he started out.  He came to one of our meetings and tried to sell us on his bags.  He "discovered" that you could use the material used in pillows as an insulator for sleeping bags.  As I remember, it is silicone coated, so it is pretty water proof, but that is about the only advantage you get.  There isn't much "engineering" in their insulation.  It is heavy, and not very compressible unless you keep the bag vaccum packed in the original packing it comes in.  Once it is out of that packaging, you won't get it that small again.  They are warm, durable, heavy, and not very compressible in my experience, and I think overpriced for what you get.  That's just my $.02.  
Link Posted: 7/28/2011 2:59:38 AM EST
[#25]
For years I car camped very comfortably in a cheap coleman sleeping bag with a 50? some degree rating IIRC. It was a lot warmer with a wool blanket inside.

A lot depends on the intended use. You can get by with a lot less than you think. One of the big issues is air infiltration. A lot of bags work well until there is a 5 mph wind blowing over them. A wind resistant cover can make a huge difference, but has the disadvantage of holding moisture in the bag.

No bag is really warm when it is damp, but some less than others, and some take forever to dry (like down).

My personal opinion is that you are better off with a system that has an inner and an outer bag, and some kind of bivy type outer covering. Then you can match the bag to the conditions. But that adds bulk and cost.

I do not think there is a perfect solution to some problems.

Link Posted: 7/28/2011 4:08:51 AM EST
[#26]
Link Posted: 7/28/2011 4:28:45 AM EST
[#27]
North Face Elkhorn

Another option in the lower price range.  This is lighter (4oz) than the Marmot you referenced for about the same price.  I don't know much about the insulation used.
Link Posted: 7/28/2011 10:16:41 AM EST
[#28]
Wiggys FTW, as has already been stated in this thread.  They are not expensive for what you get.  I have 4, will be adding another before winter.
Link Posted: 7/28/2011 11:38:06 AM EST
[#29]
Link Posted: 7/30/2011 7:49:55 PM EST
[#30]
Quoted:
for a BOB, you should go synthetic.  Down will not insullate when wet.
If you're tight on space and weight (BOBs usually are), look into the Recon series of bags or something similiar.
I bought Recon 3 bags for my family.

I waited for a good deal on ebay and payed $75 each.

I haven't actually used them yet, but they are built to be very durable.  They are in military use etc.

Anybody know the difference between the older Halo Recon OD bags and the newer "tactical" brown ones?

The older OD green Recon 3 bag is listed as 10 x 6.3 inches compressed, whereas the newer "tactical" brown recon bag is listed as: "Brown has a larger compressed size of 13"L x 9"D"

It would seem odd that the "newer" bag actually got larger but has the same rating???

I need a smallish bag for my bug home kit for use in the Appalachian region (WV).  I'm kind of on a budget, so I'm interested in this bag if it's a good one for the price.

TIA for any help!

Link Posted: 7/31/2011 8:18:57 AM EST
[#31]
I don't drink the wiggy koolaid.

REI has some nice bags for the price. And a return policy that can't be beat if you buy something that doesnt work for you.

I have a snugpak for my bob. Works for the temps I would commonly face around here.
Link Posted: 7/31/2011 7:29:20 PM EST
[#32]
Useful thread, it's extra-sure-convinced me that I want a synth. bag....

FWIW:
At the moment, I have a down bag, an older model but its insulation  still fluffs up pretty well. Got it (and its wool liner bag––actually a couple of each) for the low price of "Free-ninety-nine."
But sometimes, even with the liner bag in (and it's mass-production wool, so it's ITCHY stuff), I get chilled on cooler nights. Say, low 40s to higher 30s.  Folding a GI wool blanket lengthwise and stashing it under me as ground cover helps a lot, even more so when I do that on top of a GI canvas shelter half.

But for those really, really chilly ones, I decided I needed a modern fleece liner. Looked at 'em at REI and the like, couldn't bring myself to spend $25 for about 3-4 yards of fleece fabric that, raw, retails for maybe $10, including the zipper.
So I held off.
Then, apparently my wonderful girlfriend had a stroke of inspiration. Last Christmas, her mother (yes, future MIL, I know––great lady) handed me a bundle of synthetic fleece with a zipper sewn on.
She'd grabbed a couple yards or so of spare material, and a little zipper (reminds me, I need to put a paracord or twine pull-loop into the toggle) facing inward, and stitched it up quite neatly into a homemade liner bag. According to her, she'd gotten the material on sale and the whole shebang had cost her maybe $5-7 in materials, plus about 30 mins work, measuring, cutting, sewing all included.
It's nice and tapered, and has enough material at the hood to gather into a nice neck-baffle design with a couple minutes' thought, and still have decent hood coverage.
Tested it a couple times in the coastal hills of CA a bit into spring, with lows into frosting territory, and emerged in the morning snug and toasty!



I guess the point of my ramble is that it's possible to do the fleece liner-bag, and it's possible to do it for a lot less money (even including the time investment) at home, if you or the SO has a halfway-decent sewing machine and the patience to work it through, than you would spend buying such a thing at a store, except at clearance-level prices.
And it works great! Easily adds another 15 degrees to the comfort rating of a bag.


Though, based on the advice in this thread, as soon as I have the available funds (), I'll be in the market for a decent-grade synthetic-fill sleeping bag, for my camping and disaster-prep purposes.
I'll still keep the old-school wool and down bags, but I think I'll relegate those to reenacting-only duty.
Link Posted: 8/1/2011 5:53:26 PM EST
[#33]
Quoted:

Meh, I use nothing but down and go out in all four seasons. Never a problem. I always have a light weight shelter in my pack, keep dry and warm.

Not that hard to keep your bag dry.

I'm never giving up my down bags, flame away. I don't care and you're wasting your time doing it.





Using down in all 4 seasons for trips is very different that relying on it when the shit hits the fan and you need to bug out and possibly the only stuff you will have form a long time, is in that bag. The future unknown and not being in control of the situation for a very extended period of time means betting your life that down bag isn't going to be wet when you need it.

no thanks
Link Posted: 8/1/2011 8:30:08 PM EST
[#34]
Thanks for all the feedback everyone! I really do appreciate it. Based on my own observations/research as well as valuable feedback on here I have decided to go with the synthetic sleeping bag for my BOB bags for my family. Thanks again for everyone's responses!
Link Posted: 8/5/2011 3:33:11 PM EST
[#35]
I'd recommend down because the bags generally will compress tighter and be lighter for equivalent warmth vs synthetic. REMEMBER: The lighter you are, the faster and less tired you will be on foot. As for down not working when wet, a wet synthetic is only slightly better than down; basically they both stink when they are wet. So I wouldn't make my decision on that alone. A 5 ounce bivy sack solves that problem and provides some rain protection as well. I might also add getting something to augment the rating for especially women. They always sleep colder and a 20 degree bag might be cold for them in 40 degree weather. YMMV.

Personally, I would spend the money on a Feathered Friends or Western Mountaineering bag. Accurately rated and probably the highest quality sleeping bags on the market. This is an area I would not skimp. IMHO, your sleeping bag is in all probability going to safe your life before your gun would.

BUT, if you are one a super tight budget, I would recommend a Marmot Aspen adventurer 15 degree down bag. It is like between a Marmot Sawtooth and a Pinnacle except with cheaper down. They only sell them at Dicks Sporting Goods or you might spot one on ebay, but they are an excellent value. I got mine from Ebay for about $70-80. I have taken it down to low teens with a down jacket with comfort. It wasn't even zipped up all the way.
Link Posted: 8/10/2011 10:32:14 AM EST
[#36]

Modern cover materials make the "down gets wet" argument moot. For a discussion on another forum, I poured a cup of water on one of my down bags and took this pic an hour later:





I got caught sleeping in the open in this bag once by a torrential thunderstorm. I gave up trying to rig a tarp in the wind and just hunkered down. I was amazed in the morning when, after shaking it out, it was essentially dry.

As for Wiggy's, I had one, and my usual partner-in-crime still has one. They're very over-hyped. "Lamilite" is exactly the same stuff also marketed as both Polarguard and Climashield. It's nothing but polypro, no better and no worse than all the other "proprietary" polypros. Wiggy's just glues it together with silicone so it can be washed a few more times before it clumps up. That's the "lamination" in "Lamilite". The good news is that it's hydrophobic like all polypro. The bad news is that it's heavy and bulky like all polypro. Wiggy (his real name is Jerry) sends out kind of crazy ranting "newsletters" forever once you buy one of his products. He loves to compare his Lamilite to chopped-fiber synthetics, but no major company has used the latter for over a decade.

There are a lot of synthetic insulation brands: Lamilite, Hollofill, Primaloft, Qualofill, Thermax, Climashield, Polarguard 3D, etc. They're all pretty similar. None of them are as light, warm, compressible, durable or as comfortable over as wide a temperature range as down. Their only advantages are that they're hydrophobic and cheap.

If you're an occasional car-camper, and price is your primary consideration, then a Polarguard bag may be a good choice. If you're a frequent camper, a good down bag will pay for itself with longevity and be much more pleasant to use. I concur with TheJammer, I think Western Mountaineering makes the best, with Feathered Friends a close second.
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