I have been questioning my choice of 9mm for a survival round. I do feel comfortable with the 9 for home defence, but I am not sure if it is smart for all barriers like car doors. Is 10mm a good  choice?
I realize ammo can be hard to comeby. I am concidering a Glock 20 15+1 seems like it could be alot of firepower.
I have never been a big Glock guy but this really seems like a good value. Anyone want to talk me out of it?

I would imagine 100mm would have a rather stout recoil for home defense. Over penetration might be an issue also. It would be great for clearing trees and you'd never have to clean your windows again.

100mm for survival

Well a glock 20 will fire 40sw without modification although it might need to be cleaned before firing 10mm again. It isn't recommended that one fire 40sw though it without a conversion barrel though. In a pinch it would work though.

Anyway I'm a big fan of the 10mm handguns. Key would be to be stocked up on 10mm ammo. Georgia arms usually seems to have fair prices on their ammo.

It's good enough for Uncle Ted, so it ought to work for you too.   I'd personally stick with a more common caliber like the venerable 45ACP.  Nobody will have any 10mm to resupply you if you run out.

For that I'd go with 40sw as thats what the local police use. In a true shtf you could try to look some police cars.

100 mm might be a bit of overkill, but if you can make quick followup shots, go for it!

Comes with its own BOV

if the shtf the cops will go home with their cars & ammo, i saw it before in the L.A. riots when i lived there, best bet i think is common cal's 9MM, .45 , .223/5.56, & 7.62/.308, surplus ammo avail & cheaper at least right now. thats what ive done anyway.

I think you should have two of whatever you carry every day and shoot the living hell out of them.

100mm FTW!!!



Just remember $200 tax stamp for each round as its a DD.

Yea, but you would never forget that first time!!!

I have a G20 but I bought a G21 complete slide from a guy. I can switch back and forth quick.

I wouldn't suggest it for SHTF....Its a bit of a novelty nowadays.

YES

The GAU-8 in 30mm is also a viable choice

Not recommended is an understatement.  It shouldn't even be hinted at.  



And "in a pinch" should be "Someone's trying to kill me and all I've got is a 10mm pistol and .40 S&W ammo".



 

So do you guys make this shit up off the top of your head or are you listening to the morons working at gun stores again?



 

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

hmmmm ,walmat doesnt stock......gun store doesnt have much and no 10mm pistols in stock

i agree, anymore its obsolete in the real world. people who rely on .10mm are 1 of 2 things, 1. the same folks who buy .50 dessert eagles, or guys who are die hard fans & have plenty of ammo already.

Ok 100mm is a overkill. I guess I was in a little hurry to post this before dinner, but it looks like it sure got alot of people posting to rip me.
Anyway I did think about using 40 cal, but not sure why you would want to other then cheap target practice. Comparing 40cal to 10mm is like 38cal to 357mag.
A 45cal upper might be nice when ammo isn't available though. I havn't got a chance to fire one, but looking at some utube video makes it look very controlable for reasonable follow up shots.

i wasnt ripping you brother, i sympathize with ya , i lived in CA. a long long time. its hard enough to get a handgun once you know what you want. i would really stick with something common espescially with the new ammo laws going into effect ( depending where in Cali you are )

dosent a pistol headspace on the case neck how could you safely shoot 40 thru it without getting a 40 barrel?????????

If your going for SHTF, you are correct, I would want 1 100mm, but also a .50 BMG M2 AR-15 with a 5.56 & 7.62x39. As for side arm I would go .45 cal. Go for  something thats battle proven and has stood the times.

not exactly, most handgun cartridges dont have a bottleneck ( like most rifles ) so headspace is acheived from the fall of the breech to the finished chamber. ( almost no-one uses un-chambered barrels anymore ) bullet dia. is the issue , that & mags on autos.

I am someone who believes in stocking up on ammo for my go to firearms. I believe if things do go bad ammo of all caibers will be very difficult to get in no time unless you are military.

sounds good to me but ammo of all calibers is about to be a serious issue in most parts of Cali . limited purchase ( quanity ) & also allowed amount to be stored .

I am in the bay area, but hoping to move to Eastern Oregon  as soon as we get our home sold.

hope its not Marin county , thats one of the worst !

No I am in Campbell. We can still purchace firearms and ammo here. I think it is absolutly crazy the anti gun legislation this state desires.
I have some relitives that have really bought into the lies of the gun grabbers. I have tryed to talk sence ino them, but so far they still don't get it, they see the guns as the evil not the people who have no morals.

No I am in Campbell. We can still purchace firearms and ammo here. I think it is absolutly crazy the anti gun legislation this state desires.
I have some relitives that have really bought into the lies of the gun grabbers. I have tried to talk sence ino them, but so far they still don't get it, they see the guns as the evil not the people who have no morals.

Yea with the glock 20/29 the extractor will hold the round in place. With the shorter case length the bullet will not fully go into the barrel but will not be sticking out any further then a 10 would. With that tiny gap you will have carbon buildup. The gun might not chamber a 10mm round until that barrel is cleaned. Most people will say how this puts extra wear on the extractor. Someone here with a long slide glock 20 went into this is more detail then me. It is not the best solution but will work. Past that one should look at conversion barrels.

If there was a carbine for 10mm that had a good reputation, I think there would be a pretty good argument. As a good single caliber to go to for multiple purposes in a SHTF scenario it would be a semi-auto version of the .357. But 10mm in a pistol is still a pistol round, and  the only carbine I know of is from Olympic Arms.

Why? So you can have two guns with little to no ammunition available?

Ammo availability is the big reason I do not consider the 10mm to be one of my primary SHTF rounds.  So, what I did is buy a pair of Glock 21s and then I bought a pair of Glock 20 uppers.  Now, the 45APC is much easier to put away ammo by the case and ammo can be found almost everywhere that ammo is sold at all PLUS if I really want more performance I can swap the uppers and mags and move up to the 10mm.  

I really like the 10mm for a woods carry gun as 15-rounds of 200-gr hardcasts from double tap is some very serious power out of a relatively thin and light weapon.

I believe in sticking with ammo that can be bought at walmart. I am not always sitting in my ammo fort and might need re supply somewhere else.

If my view of potential scenarios expands to penetration of vehicles, I hope it also includes a .30-06. But I get that you may not be able to conceal a rifle as easy. I was also under the impression that 9mm ball had pretty good penetration?

For utility it's hard to beat the Glock20. I use one for EDC. You get 18 rds. of 10/40/357sig/9x25 dillon/ 224 boz/40Super with the change of the barrel. I know the last three are just fun calibers but you get the point. Change the upper and mags for 45acp. Have a spare barrel for 400corbon/45Super.  Change it out again with a 22lr conversion kit. If you really need/want the biggest bullet you can get, switch out the upper and mag for one in 50GI. The only one missing is 9mm but since you would stock up/reload, having a 10 isn't a problem.  Shooting 40/357 out of the heavier G20 slide gives you 9mm level recoil.  

You can shoot the 40 out of the 10 barrel, or 45 GAP out of the 45acp barrel for  that matter. When the round is chambered the cartridge rim slides up behind the extractor. The extractor holds it in place for the firing pin to strike the primer. I have put 150 40 rounds through my factory 10 barrel in one sitting with one round finding its way in front of the extractor. When this happens the round gets pushed into the chamber where the firing pin can't hit it. Click. I locked the slide back with the muzzle up and tapped the rear of the slide on my hand and the round fell right out. After I shot the 40s I fired a mag of 10s without cleaning the chamber and it fed and extracted fine. Would I recommend doing this as a normal practice? No. But , it does give you some versatility in an emergency.

Ammo weight is another plus for the 10. In the lighter bullets, it weighs less than any 45 by a wide margin and gives you more than twice the horsepower without, depending on bullet choice, over-penetration. Check out these 2 videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QdB8yo085Sw&NR=1, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jmJi36o1HkE&feature=related. Also look at the "long range" aspect. Full power 10 bullets only drop a few inches at 100 yards compared to the 2-2.5 feet a 45 does. Add a micro red dot like a jpoint or a RMR and 100-125 yard hits on a piece of notebook paper become pretty easy. Suppressor sights allow co witnessing in case your dot goes TU. This setup makes for a dandy bugout of get home gunBullet weights ranges from 125-230 grains not including Magsafes or Glasers.

Cons for the 10: Not all that available. You can buy it on line no problem at a reasonable price.
Ammo is expensive. People pay $25 for a box of 20 carry loads. 10s will run you about $40 per 50 for the carry loads. Reloading for it doesn't cost any more than it does for the 40. I have a few boxes of factory 10s for defense. If I need more than that, I'm not going to care if I'm using my handloads.
Recoil is too heavy. Change the spring to a 22#. Put the factory spring back in when do shoot the lesser calibers.
Grip is too big. Try a 20 SF. That frame, in my hand anyway, is just slightly bigger around than the 9/40 frames. It does have a different grip angle than the "normal" Glock frames so it won't point like the others. But, if these are your only Glocks, you will find them "normal". If I didn't already have my 20s, I would have gone with the 20SF. Slide is the same so it fits a standard holster.

Any handgun round is a compromise.
What sort of scenario do you see yourself shooting through car doors?

My only concern with 10mm for a SHTF gun is that when it comes to bartering for ammo it may be hard to find some one who has laid in a supply. 9mm, .38/.357, .40 not so much.

J-

10mm is the only way to go!

9mm Glock, and Ruger MKII/III 22LR for the win of SHTF pistols. You could carry a shit load of .22LR, and I know for a fact that I can pop you in the head easy at longer than usual pistol range with my MKIII, not to mention small to deer sized critters.

I would assume cars would be the main cover in a ambush on city streets.

I am and have been a fan of the 10mm since I was a kid and Don Johnson was shooting the Bren Ten.

As a survival caliber is has several things going for it:  It can be up or downloaded a lot.  It has the widest range of loadings of an autoloader cartridge.  My G20 can shoot .40S&W with just the change of a barrel.  In fact, 90% of the time I practice with my LWD .40 barrel in it.  So for carrying around just a barrel and making a switch that take 30 seconds, I have a high degree of flexibility.  It also has the advantage of being a versatile hunting round with 10mm being used to take down game up to whitetail and hog.  It has more range and retained energy than most autoloading pistol cartridge, so a shot at a hundred yards is still a decent shot, plus it can be loaded to shoot fairly flat out to that range.  For reloading I can use the same bullets and powders as the .40s&w.

As a survival caliber it has a few things against it:  As many have noted, it's not readily available out on the streets.  It takes more training to use effectively.  Fewer guns are available that are chambered for it.

As for the folks who claim it is an obsolete caliber, that is hardly the case.  In the 90s it was in danger of dying out, but in the last decade or so it has made quite a comeback and has an increasing following both among handgun hunters and among folks looking for more punch in an EDC weapon.  

Having said all that, my SHTF gun is my EDC gun, which is either a Glock 20 or 29, since that is the gun that I am most likely to have on me at the time.  Unlike many internet commandos, I don't forsee surviving so many running gun battles that ammo resupply will be a significant factor, and if I am bugging in then ammo supply really won't be a factor.  If my EDC gun were another caliber, I'd be perfectly happy with that too since a handgun is merely a tool used to fight your way to a rifle.  Anyone who spends excessive time debating the best caliber for the end of the world, yet doesn't have enough basic supplies on hand to survive a month, isn't worth listening to anyway.

Mad max man, what the heck are you training for?  



I like the 10mm.  but I have plenty of wondernines if I run out of 10.


TXL

I hear what you are saying I have been pretty much a one handgun caliber guy, but just recently I have been wondering if the 9mm is right for me. I am well supplied with it, but that dosn't mean my wife and kids can't use it.

If you are worried about expense, I sure hope you reload or you are making a mistake!  There is not much a 45acp can't do that the 10mm can do so for SHTF I really do thing the 45acp trumps 10mm.  You can always add a 10mm conversion barrel to a Glock 21 slide but you can't go the other way!  Later you can buy the glock 20 upper and have the full versitility described above.

If I want to shoot something other then 45acp or 10mm, I move to the Glock 19 or 17 and just use 9mm.  I sold off all my 40s a couple years ago when I consolidated as it was bad enough trying to keep track of my 9mm and 45acp stash.

Good luck and if you are looking for an excuse to buy a 10mm no problem.  I just don't agree that buying the 10mm Glock 20 for SHTF is smarter then buying a Glock 21!  A good 45acp load is good enough and you can get 45acp a whole lot easier.  Then you can add the way to convert the G21 to 10mm to have real options.

I would stay away from the 10mm andI would stay with the 9mm. The only way I would have a 10mm is to have lots of brass and reloading.. Most of the stuff you buy now is really underpowered and takes a lot out of your pocket book...



I like the 22/31 platform and I really like the .357 Sig but it is expensive...



Just my .02,



Amos1909

I has one...Oly Arms upper with 10 round Bren Mags.  Packs a good punch even at 100 yards.  I don't think I'll ever try shooting .40S&W out of it, though....

Oly is making 20 rounders, but they are still in testing after like 2 months on order.  Of couse, I'd rather them get it right than ship mme crap

This gun has not malfuncitoned once, but I only have a few hundred rounds thru it.  I think it'll make a great trunk gun.

Sorry, but you can't drop a 10 barrel into a 45 slide. The breach face is too big.  I would be like trying to get the extractor on a 40/357 slide to reliably hold on to a 9mm round with a standard, not conversion, barrel.

Funny thing is, you are WRONG

http://www.kkmprecision.com/custom_pistol_barrels/product.php?productid=39&cat=17&page=1

See:  http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1108240

There are actually a couple manufactures that make these.  Like I said, I have a paid of Glock 20 uppers as opposed to a conversion barrel but that doesn't mean they don't exist!

My mistake. I'm used to getting my stuff from LWD. Read the GT thread. Seems it has the same 9/40 problem though. The breach face being too wide and causing extraction issues. That is unless I'm missing something and am wrong twice in one day.