Member Login
Member Login
Member Login
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 5:41:32 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/7/2009 5:50:20 PM EST by Glockfan]
It shoots great but it will not cycle. Its acting like it is under gassed. I tried 3 different types of ammo (Tap 75 grain) 77 grain Sierra reloads I use for three gun and 55 grain Federal American Eagle. I also tried 20 and 30 round mags. It fires and ejects the case (not very far) and does not pick up the next round. Its a 20 inch Stealth.
I am wondering if they set the rifle up for a carbine stock and buffer instead of a rifle stock and buffer. I may try a carbine buffer in it on my next RDO. I will also call Larue up on Monday. I checked the gas key and its staked properly and does not move. Pat |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 5:49:48 PM EST
Hmm, my Stealth works fine with a rifle tube/spring/buffer (and the same stock as yours  ).Someone might even answer the phone if you call tomorrow, based on what I've read here at arfcom. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 6:16:01 PM EST
I am sure they will make it right. I am a bit disappointed that it did not run of course. I am also not looking forward to having to pay to ship it back and waiting a while to have it fixed.
Pat |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 6:42:05 PM EST
First, is it soaking wet ? If not, douche it in that Machine Gunners's Oil ... everything's better wetter. Lather it up.
Try that and let me know ... ML |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 8:11:19 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/7/2009 8:19:22 PM EST by gregw45]
Originally Posted By Glockfan:
I am wondering if they set the rifle up for a carbine stock and buffer instead of a rifle stock and buffer. I may try a carbine buffer in it on my next RDO. I will also call Larue up on Monday. I checked the gas key and its staked properly and does not move. Pat do not Do Not DO NOT do that. There is no "setting up" for a particular stock configuration. Every AR15, M16, and M4 bolt carrier group must cycle the same distance no matter what barrel length, gas system, or rail / handguard is bolted to the upper receiver. Swapping out a rifle buffer for a carbine buffer will create a free space in the receiver extension (aka buffer tube) which would allow the gas key to slam into the rear of the charging handle. Repeat as necessary to ruin your upper. Straight from the MAGPUL website Note: The PRS™ requires a Rifle Receiver Extension tube, OEM Rifle Buffer and Spring. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 8:36:53 PM EST
I did not lube it from the factory but after taking it apart it appeared to be lubed properly. Its way under gassed. The bolt is not going far enough back to strip the next round from the magazine. It just goes back far enough to eject the spent casing.
Pat |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 8:37:54 PM EST
Originally Posted By gregw45:
Originally Posted By Glockfan:
I am wondering if they set the rifle up for a carbine stock and buffer instead of a rifle stock and buffer. I may try a carbine buffer in it on my next RDO. I will also call Larue up on Monday. I checked the gas key and its staked properly and does not move. Pat do not Do Not DO NOT do that. There is no "setting up" for a particular stock configuration. Every AR15, M16, and M4 bolt carrier group must cycle the same distance no matter what barrel length, gas system, or rail / handguard is bolted to the upper receiver. Swapping out a rifle buffer for a carbine buffer will create a free space in the receiver extension (aka buffer tube) which would allow the gas key to slam into the rear of the charging handle. Repeat as necessary to ruin your upper. Straight from the MAGPUL website Note: The PRS™ requires a Rifle Receiver Extension tube, OEM Rifle Buffer and Spring. Thanks I totally forgot about that. Thanks for saving me some problems. I guess it will have to go back to Larue. pat |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 8:47:15 PM EST
why not try following the manufacturers suggestion? SOAK the damn thing.
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 9:07:00 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/7/2009 9:17:43 PM EST by Glockfan]
Originally Posted By shiky:
why not try following the manufacturers suggestion? SOAK the damn thing. Its not going to make a difference. Its not dry now. And if it had to be that wet just to run as well as my other AR's I would not want it. I am not an expert but I have been shooting and working on AR's for a while now. I think the problem is that Larue must have mistakenly set this upper up to run on a carbine lower. When I ordered it I was asked if it was going to be for a rifle lower or a carbine lower. The clerk must have mixed it up. One other problem with soaking it too wet is I am shooting in 20 degree weather. Lube gels in the cold and can make things worse. In the cold its actually better to go with less lube and very thin lube. If I get time I may throw it on one of my carbine lowers and see if it runs. I have spent thousands with Larue over the last few years and I know they are a stand up company and I am worried about this being made right. I am more bummed about not being able to have fun with what is otherwise a fine rifle. Pat |
|
|
|
OR, USA
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 9:24:44 PM EST
Just dunk the damn thing in oil, clear the bore and shoot 200 rds after that it should be fine. just needs to be broken in. |
|
|
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 9:36:32 PM EST
Originally Posted By Sharpshooter27:
Just dunk the damn thing in oil, clear the bore and shoot 200 rds after that it should be fine. just needs to be broken in. I have never once had to do that with an AR before. Also I don't think you understand. It will not make it through one round with out a malfunction. If it were just a little sluggish I could see that as being a possible solution. But this problem is a bit more serious. I am not against trying it. But 200 rounds with a straight pull bolt AR is tedious. Pat |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 9:55:19 PM EST
i'm thinking you have drag from the parkerizing of the BCG and the anodizing in the upper meshing, hence the suggestion from the Mfg, to saturate it in oil..but that is a guess, regardless, i would go off of his suggestion and stop pretending i know everything.
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 10:03:49 PM EST
Sorry to come off like a know it all. I just have visions of Kimber telling its customers to just oil the gun and shoot 500 rounds through it to make it better and it never seems to work. I will try it. 200 rounds is not cheap however nor is it fun to shoot a AR like a single shot.
Pat |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 10:08:15 PM EST
i understand, and your problem could be related to many other things, such as...the magazine. I just think trying what they suggest is the first step.
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 10:32:28 PM EST
Got it and will do.
Pat |
|
|
|
USA
|
Posted: 2/7/2009 11:10:37 PM EST
Do you have any way to shoot it warm and compare? Seems like the fact you are shooting a very un-broken piece of machinery in below freezing temps could have something to do with it.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 4:28:35 AM EST
Originally Posted By Glockfan:
Originally Posted By Sharpshooter27:
Just dunk the damn thing in oil, clear the bore and shoot 200 rds after that it should be fine. just needs to be broken in. I have never once had to do that with an AR before. Also I don't think you understand. It will not make it through one round with out a malfunction. If it were just a little sluggish I could see that as being a possible solution. But this problem is a bit more serious. I am not against trying it. But 200 rounds with a straight pull bolt AR is tedious. Pat Most ARs come overgassed from the factory to avoid exactly the situation you describe, and to accommodate the shooting of weak .223 loads (like Wolf). Break-in is often required for ARs that have a properly regulated gas setup. As an example, my Sabre Defence barrel/Noveske upper carbine throws Wolf and PMC .223 casings to 3-4 o'clock, but tosses Hornady 5.56 pressure 75gr TAP casings to 1 o'clock. This upper is overgassed for 5.56, but I accept that because I need reliability and am willing to accept the tradeoff in accuracy and premature parts wear. If I were shooting a precision upper like a Stealth, I would want the gas system, buffer, and spring to operate together with JUST enough gas to cycle the action correctly. This aids accuracy, reduces recoil, and extends part life. You may yet get there if you break the rifle in as suggested, running the BCG soaking wet along the way. You can also run a reduced power Wolff spring until the rifle does break in, then swap in the standard spring. Of course, you might also have a gas system problem, but see what break-in does before asking for a larger gas port. Just my $.02, FWIW. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 9:58:27 AM EST
Originally Posted By vmpglenn:
Originally Posted By Glockfan:
Originally Posted By Sharpshooter27:
Just dunk the damn thing in oil, clear the bore and shoot 200 rds after that it should be fine. just needs to be broken in. I have never once had to do that with an AR before. Also I don't think you understand. It will not make it through one round with out a malfunction. If it were just a little sluggish I could see that as being a possible solution. But this problem is a bit more serious. I am not against trying it. But 200 rounds with a straight pull bolt AR is tedious. Pat Most ARs come overgassed from the factory to avoid exactly the situation you describe, and to accommodate the shooting of weak .223 loads (like Wolf). Break-in is often required for ARs that have a properly regulated gas setup. As an example, my Sabre Defence barrel/Noveske upper carbine throws Wolf and PMC .223 casings to 3-4 o'clock, but tosses Hornady 5.56 pressure 75gr TAP casings to 1 o'clock. This upper is overgassed for 5.56, but I accept that because I need reliability and am willing to accept the tradeoff in accuracy and premature parts wear. If I were shooting a precision upper like a Stealth, I would want the gas system, buffer, and spring to operate together with JUST enough gas to cycle the action correctly. This aids accuracy, reduces recoil, and extends part life. You may yet get there if you break the rifle in as suggested, running the BCG soaking wet along the way. You can also run a reduced power Wolff spring until the rifle does break in, then swap in the standard spring. Of course, you might also have a gas system problem, but see what break-in does before asking for a larger gas port. Just my $.02, FWIW. FYI the Hornady tap I use is the 5.56 pressure version for LEO's only and not the civilian .223 pressure rated tap. I won't be able to shoot this again until Thursday. But based on my experience with AR's in the past I think something is wrong past any sort of break in or lubrication fix. But I will give it a try. I put a bunch of oil on it last night. Pat |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 10:39:33 AM EST
I shoot my LaRue rifle at -30*F and colder with Machine Gunners Lube without any difficulties. That is 50* colder than you by the way.
Lube it, shoot it. Clean it. Repeat. It sounds like you are shooting quality ammo, so you should not have any issues. have fun. Danomite! |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 10:47:01 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/8/2009 10:49:20 AM EST by DvlDog]
Originally Posted By Glockfan:
Originally Posted By shiky:
why not try following the manufacturers suggestion? SOAK the damn thing. Its not going to make a difference. Its not dry now. And if it had to be that wet just to run as well as my other AR's I would not want it. I am not an expert but I have been shooting and working on AR's for a while now. I think the problem is that Larue must have mistakenly set this upper up to run on a carbine lower. When I ordered it I was asked if it was going to be for a rifle lower or a carbine lower. The clerk must have mixed it up. One other problem with soaking it too wet is I am shooting in 20 degree weather. Lube gels in the cold and can make things worse. In the cold its actually better to go with less lube and very thin lube. If I get time I may throw it on one of my carbine lowers and see if it runs. I have spent thousands with Larue over the last few years and I know they are a stand up company and I am worried about this being made right. I am more bummed about not being able to have fun with what is otherwise a fine rifle. Pat Whats that in your signature box? "Firearms Instructor. Urban Rifle Instructor. Colt M16/AR15 and 1911 Armorer" And yet you were going to put a carbine buffer in a rifle length receiver extension. you sure as hell shouldnt be working on any ones rifle. And yet you argue that the rifle MUST be under gassed. So Mr. Gunplumber/instructor. exactly how does one tweak an upper to only on a carbine buffer? Why do you not try Mark LaRue's advice? and how can you claim to be a Colt armorer and then say "Im not an expert" If you are a Colt armorer you SHOULD be a fucking expert. You can listen to the man who built your rifle...or I think you should try it with a carbine buffer, the clerk obviously made a mistake and they put a carbine length johnson-rod in it that keeps it from functioning with a rifle buffer. yeah do that. I'll be waiting for the pics of the cracks through the rear reciever pin hole in the inevitable "OMG I BROKE MY LOWER" thread. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 10:58:34 AM EST
Originally Posted By DvlDog:
Originally Posted By Glockfan:
Originally Posted By shiky:
why not try following the manufacturers suggestion? SOAK the damn thing. Its not going to make a difference. Its not dry now. And if it had to be that wet just to run as well as my other AR's I would not want it. I am not an expert but I have been shooting and working on AR's for a while now. I think the problem is that Larue must have mistakenly set this upper up to run on a carbine lower. When I ordered it I was asked if it was going to be for a rifle lower or a carbine lower. The clerk must have mixed it up. One other problem with soaking it too wet is I am shooting in 20 degree weather. Lube gels in the cold and can make things worse. In the cold its actually better to go with less lube and very thin lube. If I get time I may throw it on one of my carbine lowers and see if it runs. I have spent thousands with Larue over the last few years and I know they are a stand up company and I am worried about this being made right. I am more bummed about not being able to have fun with what is otherwise a fine rifle. Pat Whats that in your signature box? "Firearms Instructor. Urban Rifle Instructor. Colt M16/AR15 and 1911 Armorer" And yet you were going to put a carbine buffer in a rifle length receiver extension. you sure as hell shouldnt be working on any ones rifle. And yet you argue that the rifle MUST be under gassed. So Mr. Gunplumber/instructor. exactly how does one tweak an upper to only on a carbine buffer? Why do you not try Mark LaRue's advice? and how can you claim to be a Colt armorer and then say "Im not an expert" If you are a Colt armorer you SHOULD be a fucking expert. You can listen to the man who built your rifle...or I think you should try it with a carbine buffer, the clerk obviously made a mistake and they put a carbine length johnson-rod in it that keeps it from functioning with a rifle buffer. yeah do that. I'll be waiting for the pics of the cracks through the rear reciever pin hole in the inevitable "OMG I BROKE MY LOWER" thread. This |
|
|
|
USA
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 2:42:55 PM EST
is that lower a new build? check to make sure you have the right size bolt in the end of the tube.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 2:52:35 PM EST
Originally Posted By shiky:
why not try following the manufacturers suggestion? SOAK the damn thing. I've seen more than one AR need to be broken in before working smoothly. I'm guessing that Larue's tolerences are pretty tight so a small break in (i.e. soaking the BCG and firing some rounds) would help fix the problem you are experiencing. Just because it hasn't happened to you before doesn't mean that it isn't happening to you now. Curious to see if this is a gas block/port/key problem or if it just needs to have some rounds put through it. -X |
|
|
|
OR, USA
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 5:05:43 PM EST
Originally Posted By Black-X:
Originally Posted By shiky:
why not try following the manufacturers suggestion? SOAK the damn thing. I've seen more than one AR need to be broken in before working smoothly. I'm guessing that Larue's tolerences are pretty tight so a small break in (i.e. soaking the BCG and firing some rounds) would help fix the problem you are experiencing. Just because it hasn't happened to you before doesn't mean that it isn't happening to you now. Curious to see if this is a gas block/port/key problem or if it just needs to have some rounds put through it. -X This, just wet it down. Just yesterday I was having issues with my bcg getting stuck, it wouldn't pull back today I lubed it up and it functions flawlessly. The bolt also wouldn't fully close if I rode the CH, with lube it does. |
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 8:41:10 PM EST
Also, to help expedite break in, you could hand cycle (I've done it watching TV) your rifle for a while (100-200 cycles) to see if things improve.
Good Luck! Jeff |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 9:13:53 PM EST
Originally Posted By Glockfan: Originally Posted By shiky: why not try following the manufacturers suggestion? SOAK the damn thing. Its not going to make a difference. Its not dry now. And if it had to be that wet just to run as well as my other AR's I would not want it. I am not an expert but I have been shooting and working on AR's for a while now. I think the problem is that Larue must have mistakenly set this upper up to run on a carbine lower. When I ordered it I was asked if it was going to be for a rifle lower or a carbine lower. The clerk must have mixed it up. One other problem with soaking it too wet is I am shooting in 20 degree weather. Lube gels in the cold and can make things worse. In the cold its actually better to go with less lube and very thin lube. If I get time I may throw it on one of my carbine lowers and see if it runs. I have spent thousands with Larue over the last few years and I know they are a stand up company and I am worried about this being made right. I am more bummed about not being able to have fun with what is otherwise a fine rifle. Pat I am not following you here? |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 9:31:19 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/8/2009 11:29:45 PM EST by Glockfan]
Originally Posted By supersix4:
Originally Posted By Glockfan:
Originally Posted By shiky:
why not try following the manufacturers suggestion? SOAK the damn thing. Its not going to make a difference. Its not dry now. And if it had to be that wet just to run as well as my other AR's I would not want it. I am not an expert but I have been shooting and working on AR's for a while now. I think the problem is that Larue must have mistakenly set this upper up to run on a carbine lower. When I ordered it I was asked if it was going to be for a rifle lower or a carbine lower. The clerk must have mixed it up. One other problem with soaking it too wet is I am shooting in 20 degree weather. Lube gels in the cold and can make things worse. In the cold its actually better to go with less lube and very thin lube. If I get time I may throw it on one of my carbine lowers and see if it runs. I have spent thousands with Larue over the last few years and I know they are a stand up company and I am worried about this being made right. I am more bummed about not being able to have fun with what is otherwise a fine rifle. Pat I am not following you here? I have seen rifle uppers work on carbine lowers and then sometimes not work. This is from Larue's own web site. . NOTE: The 20" Stealth Upper is optimized for use with a rifle-length buffer system. Please let us know, in advance, if you are planning on using a carbine lower (and carbine buffer system) with our 20" Stealth. We want to make sure you will be setup properly. Don't take this thread as a bash on Larue. I love their stuff. I believe I just got a lemon this time. Pat |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 9:41:55 PM EST
Originally Posted By DvlDog:
Originally Posted By Glockfan:
Originally Posted By shiky:
why not try following the manufacturers suggestion? SOAK the damn thing. Its not going to make a difference. Its not dry now. And if it had to be that wet just to run as well as my other AR's I would not want it. I am not an expert but I have been shooting and working on AR's for a while now. I think the problem is that Larue must have mistakenly set this upper up to run on a carbine lower. When I ordered it I was asked if it was going to be for a rifle lower or a carbine lower. The clerk must have mixed it up. One other problem with soaking it too wet is I am shooting in 20 degree weather. Lube gels in the cold and can make things worse. In the cold its actually better to go with less lube and very thin lube. If I get time I may throw it on one of my carbine lowers and see if it runs. I have spent thousands with Larue over the last few years and I know they are a stand up company and I am worried about this being made right. I am more bummed about not being able to have fun with what is otherwise a fine rifle. Pat Whats that in your signature box? "Firearms Instructor. Urban Rifle Instructor. Colt M16/AR15 and 1911 Armorer" And yet you were going to put a carbine buffer in a rifle length receiver extension. you sure as hell shouldnt be working on any ones rifle. And yet you argue that the rifle MUST be under gassed. So Mr. Gunplumber/instructor. exactly how does one tweak an upper to only on a carbine buffer? Why do you not try Mark LaRue's advice? and how can you claim to be a Colt armorer and then say "Im not an expert" If you are a Colt armorer you SHOULD be a fucking expert. You can listen to the man who built your rifle...or I think you should try it with a carbine buffer, the clerk obviously made a mistake and they put a carbine length johnson-rod in it that keeps it from functioning with a rifle buffer. yeah do that. I'll be waiting for the pics of the cracks through the rear reciever pin hole in the inevitable "OMG I BROKE MY LOWER" thread. You can kiss my ass. For everyone else in the thread thank you for your comments. As for calling me out on being an Armorer.  If it matters I got the highest test score in the class and have one of Kens T shirts to prove it.
I am not an expert. An armorer simply trouble shoots problems and replaces the parts that need swapped out. I am not a gun smith or a gun plumber. It sounds like you are a very angry immature jerk who has nothing better to do than to start internet pissing matches. Grow up and talk in a civil tone if you want to be taken seriously. Jerks like you are what make messages boards like this get a bad name. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 10:03:35 PM EST
For Devldog who called me out on being what I said I was.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 10:04:49 PM EST
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 10:06:13 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/9/2009 9:36:51 PM EST by Glockfan]
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 10:24:18 PM EST
I got some help from Grant at m4 carbine this is what he posted. It should be an example to devldog on how to be professional.
POST I see from this post that the LT Stealth is not running so well. http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.htm...f=219&t=169882 I also see that the stereotypical TOS trouble shooting team is hard at work (you are stupid and just put more oil on it). So let's look at some things. From reading your post, you are using Hornady 556 NATO pressured ammo (T2 I am assuming). This ammo has plenty of pressure so that is not the issue. I am also guessing that you have put one round into the weapon and fired it to see if the bolt locks back? Since LT does not pin the GB on the gun, the first thing I would do is to see if the alignment is off. You can get a good idea by looking at the GB's position inside the rail. Is it leaning to one side? Is the GB pushed all the way back against the shoulder? Next, look at the gas key. Staked properly and not loose? Does it appear that the key is sitting squarely on the carrier? Next, measure the buffer spring and make sure it is too spec. Is the buffer spring SS or CS? Last couple trouble shooting techniques to narrow down the cause. Take the BCG out and run it in another gun. Then take a KNOWN good BCG and run it in the LT upper and see what you get. C4 __________________ www.GRTactical.com Sales@GRTactical.com 330-343-2800 This is what I found. The gas block is canted slightly. Thanks Grant. I 
It does look like its leaning slightly to the right. I really do appreciate this help. You are a true gentleman. Pat |
|
|
|
OH, USA
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 10:38:11 PM EST
If the gas block is canted at all(I'm having a hard time telling due to the photo angle) I doubt it's enough to reduce the gas flow, most after market gas blocks have considerable larger holes than the gas port to make up for any issues from cant or not being in the proper distance from the shoulder.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 11:26:35 PM EST
Grant "the price fixer" professional? You need to find a better example there. He was banned from here for a reason.
|
|
|
|
USA
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 11:34:18 PM EST
Originally Posted By DvlDog:
Originally Posted By Glockfan:
Originally Posted By shiky:
why not try following the manufacturers suggestion? SOAK the damn thing. Its not going to make a difference. Its not dry now. And if it had to be that wet just to run as well as my other AR's I would not want it. I am not an expert but I have been shooting and working on AR's for a while now. I think the problem is that Larue must have mistakenly set this upper up to run on a carbine lower. When I ordered it I was asked if it was going to be for a rifle lower or a carbine lower. The clerk must have mixed it up. One other problem with soaking it too wet is I am shooting in 20 degree weather. Lube gels in the cold and can make things worse. In the cold its actually better to go with less lube and very thin lube. If I get time I may throw it on one of my carbine lowers and see if it runs. I have spent thousands with Larue over the last few years and I know they are a stand up company and I am worried about this being made right. I am more bummed about not being able to have fun with what is otherwise a fine rifle. Pat Whats that in your signature box? "Firearms Instructor. Urban Rifle Instructor. Colt M16/AR15 and 1911 Armorer" And yet you were going to put a carbine buffer in a rifle length receiver extension. you sure as hell shouldnt be working on any ones rifle. And yet you argue that the rifle MUST be under gassed. So Mr. Gunplumber/instructor. exactly how does one tweak an upper to only on a carbine buffer? Why do you not try Mark LaRue's advice? and how can you claim to be a Colt armorer and then say "Im not an expert" If you are a Colt armorer you SHOULD be a fucking expert. You can listen to the man who built your rifle...or I think you should try it with a carbine buffer, the clerk obviously made a mistake and they put a carbine length johnson-rod in it that keeps it from functioning with a rifle buffer. yeah do that. I'll be waiting for the pics of the cracks through the rear reciever pin hole in the inevitable "OMG I BROKE MY LOWER" thread. wow... what kind of cock sucker are you? your wify send you some hot pix of her fuckin your brother or something? eat shit, man. |
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 11:39:53 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/8/2009 11:42:22 PM EST by Glockfan]
Originally Posted By yekimak:
Grant "the price fixer" professional? You need to find a better example there. He was banned from here for a reason. I don't know about that but he did give me some helpful ideas. Pat |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/8/2009 11:45:11 PM EST
Originally Posted By Glockfan:
Originally Posted By yekimak:
Grant "the price fixer" professional? You need to find a better example there. He was banned from here for a reason. I don't know about that but he did give me some helpful ideas. Pat True. And that block dont look right. I am anxious to see what punishment Mark is going to inflict on his assembler. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 2:13:39 AM EST
I read this thread the other day, saw the op's posts and then saw LT respond; thought, "All seems right and good." I wake up this morning and it's up to page two; hmmm, must be something interesting here. I then read this post: Originally Posted By DvlDog:
Originally Posted By Glockfan:
Originally Posted By shiky:
why not try following the manufacturers suggestion? SOAK the damn thing. Its not going to make a difference. Its not dry now. And if it had to be that wet just to run as well as my other AR's I would not want it. I am not an expert but I have been shooting and working on AR's for a while now. I think the problem is that Larue must have mistakenly set this upper up to run on a carbine lower. When I ordered it I was asked if it was going to be for a rifle lower or a carbine lower. The clerk must have mixed it up. One other problem with soaking it too wet is I am shooting in 20 degree weather. Lube gels in the cold and can make things worse. In the cold its actually better to go with less lube and very thin lube. If I get time I may throw it on one of my carbine lowers and see if it runs. I have spent thousands with Larue over the last few years and I know they are a stand up company and I am worried about this being made right. I am more bummed about not being able to have fun with what is otherwise a fine rifle. Pat Whats that in your signature box? "Firearms Instructor. Urban Rifle Instructor. Colt M16/AR15 and 1911 Armorer" And yet you were going to put a carbine buffer in a rifle length receiver extension. you sure as hell shouldnt be working on any ones rifle. And yet you argue that the rifle MUST be under gassed. So Mr. Gunplumber/instructor. exactly how does one tweak an upper to only on a carbine buffer? Why do you not try Mark LaRue's advice? and how can you claim to be a Colt armorer and then say "Im not an expert" If you are a Colt armorer you SHOULD be a fucking expert. You can listen to the man who built your rifle...or I think you should try it with a carbine buffer, the clerk obviously made a mistake and they put a carbine length johnson-rod in it that keeps it from functioning with a rifle buffer. yeah do that. I'll be waiting for the pics of the cracks through the rear reciever pin hole in the inevitable "OMG I BROKE MY LOWER" thread. Wow! Tough crowd. 
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 2:20:31 AM EST
Originally Posted By evileyeswatchin:
is that lower a new build? check to make sure you have the right size bolt in the end of the tube. This, and have you tried shooting that upper on a different lower? |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 4:04:21 AM EST
Originally Posted By snoopaloop:
Originally Posted By evileyeswatchin:
is that lower a new build? check to make sure you have the right size bolt in the end of the tube. This, and have you tried shooting that upper on a different lower? I'd try that. If you are that concerned with the gas block, here's my jig you can check the locations of the dimples. I assume the LaRue barrels are dimpled for the gas blocks. http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=1089 In reality, the gas block will take some amount of cant since the hole in the block is way bigger then the port in the barrel. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 4:40:36 AM EST
Respectfully,
We test fire every single Stealth Upper leaving leaving our facility. Yours was no different. The gas block does look off center, but I highly doubt it is the problem. Now that the office is open, I suggest you call the shop for further assistance...as your upper shouldn't have gone out the door looking like that to begin with, and I'm guessing your order was tagged and tested for a carbine lower. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 5:19:51 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/9/2009 5:56:59 AM EST by LaRue_Tactical]
Originally Posted By Glockfan:
I got some help from Grant at m4 carbine this is what he posted. It should be an example to devldog on how to be professional. POST I see from this post that the LT Stealth is not running so well. http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.htm...f=219&t=169882 I also see that the stereotypical TOS trouble shooting team is hard at work (you are stupid and just put more oil on it). So let's look at some things. From reading your post, you are using Hornady 556 NATO pressured ammo (T2 I am assuming). This ammo has plenty of pressure so that is not the issue. I am also guessing that you have put one round into the weapon and fired it to see if the bolt locks back? Since LT does not pin the GB on the gun, the first thing I would do is to see if the alignment is off. You can get a good idea by looking at the GB's position inside the rail. Is it leaning to one side? Is the GB pushed all the way back against the shoulder? Next, look at the gas key. Staked properly and not loose? Does it appear that the key is sitting squarely on the carrier? Next, measure the buffer spring and make sure it is too spec. Is the buffer spring SS or CS? Last couple trouble shooting techniques to narrow down the cause. Take the BCG out and run it in another gun. Then take a KNOWN good BCG and run it in the LT upper and see what you get. C4 __________________ www.GRTactical.com Sales@GRTactical.com 330-343-2800 This is what I found. The gas block is canted slightly. Thanks Grant. I http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g299/355sigfan/IM001177_edited-1.jpg http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g299/355sigfan/IM001178_edited-1.jpg It does look like its leaning slightly to the right. I really do appreciate this help. You are a true gentleman. Pat The proprietor of that obscure, remote little Ohio gun shop needs to watch who he calls stupid. Reading is fundamental. G-Rant does read all my posts, but had he had read my post correctly, emphasis on correctly, then he would have seen I said oil the bitch first and then let's go from there. Why did I say that ? Because they make oil for a good reason. Other than that, when it comes to mechanics, he is all but clueless. His recent position of insinuating stupidity on my part regarding bolt carrier groups puts an exclamation point to it. His comment that "pinning" the gas block somehow makes it straight is another clue. Never seen a canted sight tower, now have we ? FYI, given the size of the hole in the barrel and the size of the hole in the gasblock, the small amount of visible cant in that gasblock most likely means it ain't cutting the gas off, not even a little. Unless something has gone way wrong ... which I doubt. Other than that, all of his little "everything an armorer would know" hints are tacked in every AR forum coming and going. Oil it first, that makes a lot of stuff run, that's why they make oil. If that doesn't work, your 50 below temps might be gelling the lube, if that turns out to be the case, degrease it completely and them run it again. Alaska has it's own conditions to deal with, conditions the lower 48 doesn't often see. Either way, I'm known to cross-ship replacements. M. LaRue ETA - Viva Sarah Palin. 
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 5:31:16 AM EST
Originally Posted By yekimak:
Originally Posted By Glockfan:
Originally Posted By yekimak:
Grant "the price fixer" professional? You need to find a better example there. He was banned from here for a reason. I don't know about that but he did give me some helpful ideas. Pat True. And that block dont look right. I am anxious to see what punishment Mark is going to inflict on his assembler. I just ripped him a new a$$hole. If he's off-center with the set-screw indentations, by just .005" .... then the two gaps (between the top of the block and the handguard) are different by ~.012", meaningless, but easy to detect with the half-naked eye. 
ML |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 5:47:21 AM EST
Originally Posted By LaRue_Tactical:
I just ripped him a new a$$hole. If he's off-center with the set-screw indentations, by just .005" .... then the two gaps (between the top of the block and the handguard) are different by ~.012", meaningless, but easy to detect with the half-naked eye.
ML 
Not really sure why I found that so damn funny, but it was. |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 6:36:57 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/9/2009 6:42:59 AM EST by eric10mm]
Originally Posted By Warthog86:
This is fun to do while some "gun" show/movie is on. Also, to help expedite break in, you could hand cycle (I've done it watching TV) your rifle for a while (100-200 cycles) to see if things improve. Good Luck! Jeff 
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 6:40:41 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/9/2009 6:44:23 AM EST by eric10mm]
Originally Posted By AdamTheFarmer:
If the gas block is canted at all(I'm having a hard time telling due to the photo angle) I doubt it's enough to reduce the gas flow, most after market gas blocks have considerable larger holes than the gas port to make up for any issues from cant or not being in the proper distance from the shoulder. This. All those certificates of having learned stuff from other folks and you won't take the manufacturer's advice of oiling it a lot and breaking it in?
Better send it to me for a full and unbiased third-party evaluation. I will return it once a full evaluation is completed. 
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 7:44:21 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/9/2009 8:15:50 AM EST by Glockfan]
I spoke with Austin at Larue and the situation is under control. Thanks for all the help to those that offered help.
Pat |
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 8:18:06 AM EST
Now for a rookie question. I am getting ready to order a 20" Stealth Upper for my first AR-15. What is the difference between a rifle and carbine buffer system? I have a Bushmaster lower with a Tapco adjustable stock. Is that a rifle or a carbine?
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 8:31:14 AM EST
Carbine.
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 9:40:37 AM EST
Originally Posted By RookieBuilder:
Now for a rookie question. I am getting ready to order a 20" Stealth Upper for my first AR-15. What is the difference between a rifle and carbine buffer system? I have a Bushmaster lower with a Tapco adjustable stock. Is that a rifle or a carbine? 
|
|
|
|
|
Posted: 2/9/2009 9:48:53 AM EST
Originally Posted By mfingar:
Originally Posted By RookieBuilder:
Now for a rookie question. I am getting ready to order a 20" Stealth Upper for my first AR-15. What is the difference between a rifle and carbine buffer system? I have a Bushmaster lower with a Tapco adjustable stock. Is that a rifle or a carbine? http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y44/mfingar/Misc/Buffers.jpg thanks Mark, So, if I change out my stock, spring and buffer, I should have no problems with the 20"? |
|
|
|
AR15.COM is the world’s largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2020 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
