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1/22/2020 12:12:56 PM
Posted: 1/17/2015 8:53:27 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/17/2015 8:54:40 PM EST by pjc]
Guys
We are selling our house and we had the home inspection today. The agent told my agent that septic guy ran at least 2 tubs on full for over 20 minutes. Quite possible he ran faucets as well. He made the tank start overflowing. My dad is a retired plumber and he said that is no way to test a system especially in winter because it is way beyond a systems capacity. Can anyone shed light on whether this is a legit test or a tactic to get a negotiating chip for their client.
Link Posted: 1/17/2015 9:12:11 PM EST
Home inspectors are for the most part idiots. If they have any training beyond a seminar and DVD it is in one area. I would tell the prospective buyer that you disagree with the "test". if the buyer is good and the offer is good why not have an engineer look at it. I would pay the couple hundred bucks and have a second opinion by a license professional not some jackass of all trades.

A proper septic test involves loading and a dye. Just running water is not a test. How many gallons per minute of water was going down the drain? What is the design load for gallons per minute of water that the system can handle?

Link Posted: 1/17/2015 9:58:01 PM EST
I had a few questions about my septic system when I bought my house 14 years ago. I had a septic installation company check out my system. They flowed a metered amount of water based on the size of my system and a bright green dye to check for breakouts. My system passed and I proceeded with the sale. I wish it had failed at that point because 2 years latter I had to install a new system. The one thing I learned, unless you dig up part of the system and physically inspect the condition of the fields, it's just a guessing game. My house went from 2 business professionals who were never home, to a family of 5 that was always home. The system passed because only 2 people were using it. It failed with five, and until we dug it up we didn't know what the problem was.

Mike
Link Posted: 1/17/2015 10:00:37 PM EST
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Originally Posted By MikeScouter:
I had a few questions about my septic system when I bought my house 14 years ago. I had a septic installation company check out my system. They flowed a metered amount of water based on the size of my system and a bright green dye to check for breakouts. My system passed and I proceeded with the sale. I wish it had failed at that point because 2 years latter I had to install a new system. The one thing I learned, unless you dig up part of the system and physically inspect the condition of the fields, it's just a guessing game. My house went from 2 business professionals who were never home, to a family of 5 that was always home. The system passed because only 2 people were using it. It failed with five, and until we dug it up we didn't know what the problem was.

Mike
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Mike just explained the loading and dye test. A septic system is sized to the house it serves. I would call BS on the home inspectors "test". Call a septic company and get a proper test performed. If it fails a proper test than you have some shit to deal with. (pun intended).
Link Posted: 1/18/2015 12:09:46 AM EST
Have a septic company clean and inspect the tank. Clogged outlet baffles could 'possibly' cause the tank to over flow/backup. Not the end of the world to fix.

Failed fields are a much bigger thing...
Link Posted: 1/18/2015 2:39:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: 1/18/2015 2:40:11 AM EST by pjc]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By fearme:
Have a septic company clean and inspect the tank. Clogged outlet baffles could 'possibly' cause the tank to over flow/backup. Not the end of the world to fix.

Failed fields are a much bigger thing...
View Quote



All true, we have tank cleaned every 1.5 hrs, but I still don't think the system is designed to withstand the gallon per minute load of 2 tubs running on full for 20 minutes or more. Before I have it cleaned again or have anyone look at it I think we're gonna wait to see what buyers say...they still want house and conducted a 3 hour inspection after the so called septic test. If I hear back from them with an attempt to use test as price leverage I am going to tell them the septic test was not a proper test due to the fact that it in no way accounted for the actual load being placed on the system and invite them to have a company conduct a proper evaluation. We have 4 people in house, showering every day, dishwasher 2x week, running kitchen sink constantly and have no problem at all. So sick of this crap and never want to move again after this
Link Posted: 1/18/2015 8:47:07 AM EST
My test used a flow meter on a garden hose directly into the tank.
Link Posted: 1/18/2015 9:02:01 AM EST
I'm a septic installer.
If you're tank is pre 1999 it won't have a filter on the outlet unless that's been updated. They tend to clog easy.

If you're tank is a 2 compartment tank, which most are unless it was installed in the 60's or older. The baffle usually doesn't clog unless the tank is crushed and the baffles are on top of each other.

There could be a d box that deteriorated and crushed upon itself and won't let effluent flow. The d box is the connection to one or more trenches.

If tank and d boxes and pipes leading to the trenches are all flowing your septic shouldn't have any problem what so ever to flow the tubs and running water. So as stated above if every thing is flowing up to the trenches and it's backing up then the septic is at capacity and ready to fail.

Septic systems for the last 30 years have been designed by mottles in the ground which is the maximum water table. So winter or rainy season won't have or very little effect on the septic system. If your septic system is older and was just put in the ground without regards to the mottling , well then the winter and rainy seasons may and will have an effect on the systems performance. And if it is, well - somebody is buying into a problem if the systems at capacity or in general being effected by the winter and high ground water
Link Posted: 1/18/2015 10:45:55 AM EST
Thanks for your input. It is an older system. Wouldn't any accurate test have to measure the flow rate based on requirements and engineering for a 3 bedroom house? I don't need to meet the demand of a condo complex or a 5 bedroom house... As long as system is meeting those demands specified for 3 bedrooms, which it has been for the eight years we've lived here and having 4 people showering daily excetera with no issues. Still no issues after test yesterday as system is back to handling its normal load.(ha load...now that's funny)


Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Digsafe:
I'm a septic installer.
If you're tank is pre 1999 it won't have a filter on the outlet unless that's been updated. They tend to clog easy.

If you're tank is a 2 compartment tank, which most are unless it was installed in the 60's or older. The baffle usually doesn't clog unless the tank is crushed and the baffles are on top of each other.

There could be a d box that deteriorated and crushed upon itself and won't let effluent flow. The d box is the connection to one or more trenches.

If tank and d boxes and pipes leading to the trenches are all flowing your septic shouldn't have any problem what so ever to flow the tubs and running water. So as stated above if every thing is flowing up to the trenches and it's backing up then the septic is at capacity and ready to fail.

Septic systems for the last 30 years have been designed by mottles in the ground which is the maximum water table. So winter or rainy season won't have or very little effect on the septic system. If your septic system is older and was just put in the ground without regards to the mottling , well then the winter and rainy seasons may and will have an effect on the systems performance. And if it is, well - somebody is buying into a problem if the systems at capacity or in general being effected by the winter and high ground water
View Quote

Link Posted: 1/18/2015 11:07:40 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By pjc:
Thanks for your input. It is an older system. Wouldn't any accurate test have to measure the flow rate based on requirements and engineering for a 3 bedroom house? I don't need to meet the demand of a condo complex or a 5 bedroom house... As long as system is meeting those demands specified for 3 bedrooms, which it has been for the eight years we've lived here and having 4 people showering daily excetera with no issues. Still no issues after test yesterday as system is back to handling its normal load.(ha load...now that's funny)

View Quote


Yes your septic system has a "design capacity". This is why you need a septic dye and loading test. It needs to be performed by a company who employs an engineer. If it is just a contractor without an engineers license they are not qualified to perform any testing. Only an engineer can design a system and give a legal opinion on a systems function. A contractor can install, test and repair. However the contractor is legally only supposed to follow the instructions of the engineer when installing.

As you said I would wait until the prospective buyers have come back to you. They may and probably will use this as price leverage. You may find that the amount they are looking for is worth it to avoid a hassle and stay on track with the sale.

A bank might balk at giving a mortgage on a house that technically is not fit for occupancy since the septic system is unsanitary. Worse thing is the town is informed and your town engineer comes knocking. The town can force you to fix the system. Legally they can force you out of the house because it is unsanitary to live in a house without a proper septic.

Most likely your buyers are going to ask for the septic to be fixed and certified functioning before moving forward with the sale.

If I were in your shoes I would find a good company and have them ready to go for a test.

Good luck with the sale!! Where are you going?
Link Posted: 1/18/2015 5:44:07 PM EST
I bought my home 4 yrs ago. I had a septic company do the test instead of the inspector.
He pumped the tank and checked the internals.
He dug up the D box and physically inspected it.
He went to the end of each galley and dug till he could inspect the pipes.

It ended up needing a baffle fix and D box fix. I had him repair these upon purchasing the home.
He charged me $650 for everything.
Link Posted: 1/18/2015 5:59:29 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By User55645:
I bought my home 4 yrs ago. I had a septic company do the test instead of the inspector.
He pumped the tank and checked the internals.
He dug up the D box and physically inspected it.
He went to the end of each galley and dug till he could inspect the pipes.

It ended up needing a baffle fix and D box fix. I had him repair these upon purchasing the home.
He charged me $650 for everything.
View Quote


Now that is an inspection!

My father just sold his house this past May. The home inspector was an idiot. Dad's house was in near perfect condition. People paid full price.

The home inspector said the oil tank was 10 years old and insisted it needed replacement. This tank was install the winter of 2012 because his old one developed a leak. His oil company pulled a permit and replaced it as part of his service contract. The inspector insisted that the tank was old and needed replacement. Finally a letter from the oil company satisfied that.

The other sticking point was the home inspector said there was signs of arcing in the panel box. He completely missed the rusted meter box outside. There was no arcing. He left the rusty meter box purposely to give the inspector something to find. We had a laugh about the "thorough inspection". Dad had the meter box replaced before sale and had the electrician write a letter stating there is no arcing in the main panel box.

A friend of mine bought a house and had a home inspection because the bank insisted on it. Inspection went well. 2 days after moving in the house caught fire. It started in the electrical panel. Fire was contained but suffer extreme smoke damage. Turns out the panel had water leaking into it.

I can name countless other things home inspector "find" or miss because they really do not know what they are doing.
Link Posted: 1/18/2015 6:57:17 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By edgephoto:


Yes your septic system has a "design capacity". This is why you need a septic dye and loading test. It needs to be performed by a company who employs an engineer. If it is just a contractor without an engineers license they are not qualified to perform any testing. Only an engineer can design a system and give a legal opinion on a systems function. A contractor can install, test and repair. However the contractor is legally only supposed to follow the instructions of the engineer when installing.

As you said I would wait until the prospective buyers have come back to you. They may and probably will use this as price leverage. You may find that the amount they are looking for is worth it to avoid a hassle and stay on track with the sale.

A bank might balk at giving a mortgage on a house that technically is not fit for occupancy since the septic system is unsanitary. Worse thing is the town is informed and your town engineer comes knocking. The town can force you to fix the system. Legally they can force you out of the house because it is unsanitary to live in a house without a proper septic.

Most likely your buyers are going to ask for the septic to be fixed and certified functioning before moving forward with the sale.

If I were in your shoes I would find a good company and have them ready to go for a test.

Good luck with the sale!! Where are you going?
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By edgephoto:
Originally Posted By pjc:
Thanks for your input. It is an older system. Wouldn't any accurate test have to measure the flow rate based on requirements and engineering for a 3 bedroom house? I don't need to meet the demand of a condo complex or a 5 bedroom house... As long as system is meeting those demands specified for 3 bedrooms, which it has been for the eight years we've lived here and having 4 people showering daily excetera with no issues. Still no issues after test yesterday as system is back to handling its normal load.(ha load...now that's funny)



Yes your septic system has a "design capacity". This is why you need a septic dye and loading test. It needs to be performed by a company who employs an engineer. If it is just a contractor without an engineers license they are not qualified to perform any testing. Only an engineer can design a system and give a legal opinion on a systems function. A contractor can install, test and repair. However the contractor is legally only supposed to follow the instructions of the engineer when installing.

As you said I would wait until the prospective buyers have come back to you. They may and probably will use this as price leverage. You may find that the amount they are looking for is worth it to avoid a hassle and stay on track with the sale.

A bank might balk at giving a mortgage on a house that technically is not fit for occupancy since the septic system is unsanitary. Worse thing is the town is informed and your town engineer comes knocking. The town can force you to fix the system. Legally they can force you out of the house because it is unsanitary to live in a house without a proper septic.

Most likely your buyers are going to ask for the septic to be fixed and certified functioning before moving forward with the sale.

If I were in your shoes I would find a good company and have them ready to go for a test.

Good luck with the sale!! Where are you going?



Out of west side of danbury near brewster and new fairfield to sherman new fairfield or God willing, South Carolina.
Link Posted: 1/18/2015 7:05:26 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By pjc:



Out of west side of danbury near brewster and new fairfield to sherman new fairfield or God willing, South Carolina.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By pjc:
Originally Posted By edgephoto:
Originally Posted By pjc:
Thanks for your input. It is an older system. Wouldn't any accurate test have to measure the flow rate based on requirements and engineering for a 3 bedroom house? I don't need to meet the demand of a condo complex or a 5 bedroom house... As long as system is meeting those demands specified for 3 bedrooms, which it has been for the eight years we've lived here and having 4 people showering daily excetera with no issues. Still no issues after test yesterday as system is back to handling its normal load.(ha load...now that's funny)



Yes your septic system has a "design capacity". This is why you need a septic dye and loading test. It needs to be performed by a company who employs an engineer. If it is just a contractor without an engineers license they are not qualified to perform any testing. Only an engineer can design a system and give a legal opinion on a systems function. A contractor can install, test and repair. However the contractor is legally only supposed to follow the instructions of the engineer when installing.

As you said I would wait until the prospective buyers have come back to you. They may and probably will use this as price leverage. You may find that the amount they are looking for is worth it to avoid a hassle and stay on track with the sale.

A bank might balk at giving a mortgage on a house that technically is not fit for occupancy since the septic system is unsanitary. Worse thing is the town is informed and your town engineer comes knocking. The town can force you to fix the system. Legally they can force you out of the house because it is unsanitary to live in a house without a proper septic.

Most likely your buyers are going to ask for the septic to be fixed and certified functioning before moving forward with the sale.

If I were in your shoes I would find a good company and have them ready to go for a test.

Good luck with the sale!! Where are you going?



Out of west side of danbury near brewster and new fairfield to sherman new fairfield or God willing, South Carolina.


I vote for SC!
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