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11/20/2019 5:07:11 PM
Posted: 7/12/2010 6:21:26 AM EST

there is an old black couple in my town, the lady used to clean house for my parents. They called me to come look at their window unit (it wasn't working and they don't have much money at all). anyway after church my dad and i went to their house and got the unit working. while i was waiting for my DeWalt battery to charge we chatted with the couple and they told me they had to hide the guns and anything else of value from their son who had a crack problem. He told me his grandaddy gave the guns to him years ago, i told them before i left i would like to see the guns. his wife laughed and told me they hid them in the washing machine so she brought me two old heavy rags. One contained a .30 DWM Luger and the other was a Walther P38. He said he was scared of them (he has had a stroke and not in strong condition) and i could take them and keep them as long as i liked.
Link Posted: 7/12/2010 6:39:31 AM EST
First good job on taking care of the neighbors!

And its always nice to get a couple of new toys for safe!

I'm pretty ignorant on Lugers so what is or what makes a DMW Luger special?


7mm
Link Posted: 7/12/2010 6:53:18 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/12/2010 6:54:29 AM EST by JMO]
i didn't take his guns.. i wanted to though. i think the way the conversation started is he told me he had a .30.30 handgun, that is when i asked to see it.
Link Posted: 7/12/2010 7:08:48 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/12/2010 7:20:10 AM EST by M4-Stag]
A Luger and a P-38? . I would have thought I'd have died and gone to heaven. Those are numbers one and two on my all time want list. I'd be glad to give them a new home and be taken care of in the manner they deserve. I'm willing to make an offer!
Link Posted: 7/12/2010 7:10:19 AM EST

Make him an offer on the luger.

Then his son can steal the cash instead of the pistol...saves everybody time and you get the pistol.
Link Posted: 7/12/2010 8:18:17 AM EST
DWM (Deutsche Waffen und Munitionsfabriken) was the primary manufactuer of Parabellums (which we in America call "Lugers") until the 1920's when the Jewish firm Simson took over.

The early "Lugers" were chambered in .30 Luger. What we call the 9mm Luger round resulted from recommendations for a more powerful round, from foreign military trials (including the U.S.).

After WWI, Germany was restricted on the number 9mm military weapons, so many .30 Luger chambered pistols continued to be produced for the commercial market.

So if your "Luger" has a DWM forward toggle link and is chambered for .30 Luger, it could be an early military; but is most likely a commercial.

Post pics if possible. If not, describe carefully.

Did it have a grip safety? Barrel length? Date(s) on Chamber? Toggle lock? Dished or flat toggle grips?

Although, the 1920 Model Commercial is the most common variation of 300 "Luger" variations, any Luger find is exciting. These pistols are rich in history and the proof markings tell a lot.

You never know, you might stumble across one of the really rare ones and never know about it. If you want to IM me the info, I'll share with you what I know about it.

Best online source of info for "Lugers" are Jan Still's Luger Forum and The Lugerforum

Watch out. Lugers are addictive.
Link Posted: 7/12/2010 8:03:51 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/12/2010 8:40:01 PM EST by treedawg]
Originally Posted By M4-Stag:
A Luger and a P-38? . I would have thought I'd have died and gone to heaven. Those are numbers one and two on my all time want list. I'd be glad to give them a new home and be taken care of in the manner they deserve. I'm willing to make an offer!


I just purchased a large private collection and there's several Lugers in it along with other WWI and WWII guns.

Shoot me a PM if you are looking to buy.

TD

Link Posted: 7/12/2010 8:32:24 PM EST
Made a house payment instead.
Link Posted: 7/17/2010 3:26:37 PM EST
OK i got the guns and snapped some pics, but don't know how to post.

can i email them to a volunteer?
Link Posted: 7/17/2010 4:27:41 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/17/2010 4:29:06 PM EST by bgcoop8784]
email them to me if ya want, i'll post for ya, cooperbk@comcast.net
Link Posted: 7/18/2010 3:38:18 AM EST
tag for pics.
Link Posted: 7/18/2010 4:17:28 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/18/2010 4:18:19 AM EST by bgcoop8784]
Here's the pics ...



Link Posted: 7/18/2010 5:20:04 AM EST
I am very glad to hear that you picked these up. If only for the sake that they will now be safe and not lost. More than likely they would have been traded for $25 worth of rock. After that they would have eventually been destroyed as seized “drug guns”. The thought of these being destroyed would have been a terrible shame.

Hopefully you compensated the family. I know I couldn’t have given them “fair market” value. But at least give tem some cash or what you can afford.

PS Good find!!!!!
Link Posted: 7/18/2010 5:55:27 AM EST
Pardon me while I sit and drool a bit.
Link Posted: 7/18/2010 8:01:30 AM EST
sorry for my lack or clarity..........i'm not keeping them, just got them to take pics and clean. (maybe shoot a round or two). don't know much about lugers, the recoil spring or whatever keeps it tight is apparently worn out.
Link Posted: 7/18/2010 8:57:48 AM EST
why don't you find out if they wanna sell them then IM ME their contact info.
Link Posted: 7/18/2010 2:31:22 PM EST
those are some nice pistols
Link Posted: 7/18/2010 6:07:48 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/18/2010 6:09:37 PM EST by herd118]
The Luger is a 1900 DWM "American Eagle" Luger, it has the U.S. seal over the chamber. They are very expensive in good condition. Check the serial number, it might be one of the 1000 purchased by the military for tests in 1901.

"Specific characteristics of the 1st Test Lugers are: Serial No 6099-7098, 7.65mm, 4 3/4" Barrel, no export (Germany) markings, Great Seal of US over chamber, no proofs, commercial style numbering, rust blue finish with strawed small parts."
Link Posted: 7/18/2010 6:12:27 PM EST
Please don’t return these to them. I mean this in a nice way. They obviously don’t want them and their son will eventually find them. Drug addicts are very persistent to say the least. Then they will be lost forever. If the old couple are in need of funds and you don’t have the cash to buy the guns then please assist the owners in selling for a fair price. Then everyone is happy. Seriously, just tell them that you will hold them and arrange a sale. Even if you place them 30% below market value to move them quickly it should make a nice little check for the couple. Then the guns are also in the hands of a collector/shooter.

PS please be careful about cleaning them. Many old guns have there value ruined when people “clean” the patina right off of them. I am sure there are many collectors that are much smarter than me around here. They can tell you what is a acceptable way to clean them.
Link Posted: 7/18/2010 6:25:22 PM EST
I'll buy em.
Link Posted: 7/18/2010 9:44:06 PM EST
Yep, I agree with helping to sell them. Keep 5% if you need to, but it's a win-win. You help two people out, a person who will appreciate them and the old couple (assuming that the money doesn't go to their druggie son).
Link Posted: 7/19/2010 1:16:03 AM EST
Originally Posted By dana:
Please don’t return these to them. I mean this in a nice way. They obviously don’t want them and their son will eventually find them. Drug addicts are very persistent to say the least. Then they will be lost forever. If the old couple are in need of funds and you don’t have the cash to buy the guns then please assist the owners in selling for a fair price. Then everyone is happy. Seriously, just tell them that you will hold them and arrange a sale. Even if you place them 30% below market value to move them quickly it should make a nice little check for the couple. Then the guns are also in the hands of a collector/shooter.

PS please be careful about cleaning them. Many old guns have there value ruined when people “clean” the patina right off of them. I am sure there are many collectors that are much smarter than me around here. They can tell you what is a acceptable way to clean them.


I agree with this 100%. Even if your only involvement is to find a trustworthy broker to sell the guns for them. The owners have no appreciation for the historic importance of these weapons and could probably use a nice windfall to ease their retirement years.
Link Posted: 7/19/2010 7:48:26 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/19/2010 7:52:51 AM EST by Brownie63]
Believe it or not, this might very well be an American Eagle Test Luger.

Generally, it is a Model 1900 commercial. it has the grip safety, the toggle lock, chambered in .30 Luger, square checked safety, etc.

In 1901, 1,000 of the Model 1900 were sent to the Springfield Armory for U.S. military trials. These are Model 1900 American Eagle test lugers.

There are three characteristic of AE Test Lugers. 1. No "Germany" import mark. 2. Last two serial number digits are stamped on the right side of the takedown lever (As in the OP's picture), rather than on the bottom left side for normal Model 1900 commercials. 3. Serial number range: Generally 6100-7100 (there are exceptions outside this range).

I own an AE test with sn 63xx.

OP. Here is what you need to check to identify it as an AE Test Luger: 1. Serial number. Do the numbers on the front of the frame match the bottom base of the barrel? Are the last two digits, the same digits as on the right side of the takedown lever? If not, then it is a replacement takedown lever. Is "GERMANY" stamped on the front of the frame or on either side? If so, then no joy.

IIRC, the correct mag for this pistol is wood bottom, no markings.

Just judging from the pics, this appears to have quite a bit of wear on it. But it could very well be a desireable American Eagle Test Luger.

A gentleman by the name of Bannerman bought quite a few of the surplused AE Test Lugers and kept a list of serial numbers. If your pistol's sn is on that list, it is considered a "Bannerman AE Test Luger".

Good Luck.

eta: BTW, beware the toggle lock when you work the action. Grasp the toggles and pull them to the rear to disengage the lock, before you pull them up.
Link Posted: 7/19/2010 8:01:55 AM EST
ok if it is one of those how much would it be worth? I don't have one I am just curious. Plus that might help him give a respectable offer to the owners.
Link Posted: 7/19/2010 8:17:06 AM EST
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=180039685

Of course, as always, condition matters.
Link Posted: 7/19/2010 11:54:13 AM EST

Originally Posted By BillyPumper:
ok if it is one of those how much would it be worth? I don't have one I am just curious. Plus that might help him give a respectable offer to the owners.


There are a lot of "if's", but I'll take a stab at it:

Crazy internet numbers for a Model 1900 American Eagle Test are: $8,000-9,500+. These pistols are pristine, numbers-matching, will stay listed for years, and seldom move.

IF it is a Model 1900 American Eagle Test, AND all numbers match, AND it has a correct magazine, the market price for a GOOD condition runs $3,500-5,000. However the one in the pic, is not a GOOD condition. I'd rate it at Low FAIR to POOR. A good real world price would be $1,000-1,500 in its current condition based upon the photos. I might feel differently upwards or downwards upon physical inspection as photos sometimes change the appearance drastically.

IF it has even one mismatched part (as does my Mdl 1900 AE Test) or has ever been re-blued, that will cut the value almost in half. Mine is a GOOD condition with an incorrect firing pin, not visible unless the pistol is field stripped. This incorrect firing pin made a $3,000 pistol into a $1,700 (at least to me) pistol. A Low FAIR or POOR condition Mdl 1900 AE Test with a mismatched part is still worth $900-1000.

IF it is a Mdl 1900 Commercial American Eagle (but not a Test), then we know the takedown lever is incorrect. That would make it a mismatched POOR condition shooter or parts pistol. I would consider purchasing it for the firing pin and other parts. Real world range = $600-800.

Just MHO and based on these few photos.

Here's a tidbit to show the historical signifigance of this model. A result of the 1901-1902 evaluation of the Model 1900 American Eagle Test, was a recommendation by the Americans for a larger caliber. Upon this advice, was born the 9mm Luger round. Georg Luger even built as many as five Lugers in .45ACP. Two were sent to the Springfield Armory for evaluation. One was destroyed in testing and possibly thrown in the trash bin. The survivors are too rare to price, but well worth over a million $$$.
Link Posted: 7/19/2010 5:01:31 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/19/2010 5:10:18 PM EST by JMO]
i work out of town during the week and can not log on to this site at work. if anyone wants i can email pics to you

"
There are three characteristic of AE Test Lugers. 1. No "Germany" import mark. 2. Last two serial number digits are stamped on the right side of the takedown lever (As in the OP's picture), rather than on the bottom left side for normal Model 1900 commercials. 3. Serial number range: Generally 6100-7100 (there are exceptions outside this range)."


1) there is no import mark

2) last two digits are stamped on the right side of takedown lever

3) serial # 63xx

4) magazine has wooden bottom
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