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Posted: 2/19/2005 8:54:18 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2005 2:06:47 PM EST by Colt-653]
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 9:09:47 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2005 9:11:06 AM EST by innocent_bystander]
So fat ass Bob is going to remain the owner?

You are going to have a hell of a time getting beyond the bad name ASA has created for itself.

I have to wonder why you want to get involved with ASA? Why not start your own new company?

Edited to add: Are you Sara's new boyfriend?
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 9:12:08 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2005 9:37:57 AM EST by kuhlewulf]
I met and talk with Colt-653 and hes not a joker and does not strike me as a bullshitter. Just check out what hes offering to do in some of his other threads. I have not gotten along with or liked Bob for a long time, but knowing a little about him has softened my opinions of him. Lets be supportive and hope good things and good people show up at ASA. Who knows there might be an ARFCOM discount in there somewhere.


edited because I no spella so good anymore Kapish?
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 9:26:11 AM EST
tag
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 9:49:10 AM EST
anytime a new player gets involved with supplying us goodies for our sport, its a great thing.
Ive bought some parts from ASA, and never had a prob with the parts. Bob can be grumpy, so what?
many gunstore owners/dealers are asses. thats just the way it is.
Im glad ASA is trying to correct the issues that has given it a bad name..
Im also glad ASA is close to my house when i shoot a takedown pin detent across the room and have a local vendor to get another one.
good luck in renewing ASA.
also, last i talked to Bob, he was closing the store front and going totaly internet sales. is this still the plan?
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 9:58:47 AM EST
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 10:20:16 AM EST
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 10:20:58 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2005 10:21:51 AM EST by mindtrix]

Originally Posted By EX11B:
anytime a new player gets involved with supplying us goodies for our sport, its a great thing.
Ive bought some parts from ASA, and never had a prob with the parts. Bob can be grumpy, so what?
many gunstore owners/dealers are asses. thats just the way it is.
Im glad ASA is trying to correct the issues that has given it a bad name..
Im also glad ASA is close to my house when i shoot a takedown pin detent across the room and have a local vendor to get another one.
good luck in renewing ASA.
also, last i talked to Bob, he was closing the store front and going totaly internet sales. is this still the plan?



Thats the mentality that allows that sort of customer/shop owner attitude to thrive. The firearms industry needs an enema to clean these types of assholes out.
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 10:55:03 AM EST

Originally Posted By Colt-653:

innocent_bystander…you know me to some degree…….let’s try and let the past be the past….help us make the company a place that locals as well as others can count on and trust…….stop in an say hello some time…..and hurry up and get that GCC plus class going….I’m getting rusty



Fat ass Bob banned me from the store as he was throwing money at me from the cash register.

Sorry, but I'll never support or speak well of a company he is involved with.
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 11:18:38 AM EST
Thank you for taking the time to update us. Many of use have used you in the past and wil continue to. We are all a little grumpy from time to time but that is okay. I look forward to see those deals come our direction.
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 11:41:46 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2005 12:48:13 PM EST by Colt-653]
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 12:19:45 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2005 1:15:44 PM EST by SinistralRifleman]
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 12:24:32 PM EST
As with what Colt 653 stated, we are attemting to aquire ASA. Right now Bob is still involved with the company but the goal is to get him out so he retire. In the past few months we have sought out problems with the product line and have corrected or eliminated them. This is still a work in progress. But rest assured we are working hard to regain the trust and support from the firearms community.

We understand that ASA has built a bad name for itself. And we also know that you guys may give us some hell for this. So here we are......... give us hell.

We are looking forward to hearing your comments, concerns, questions and advise.


Brian
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 12:27:17 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2005 12:27:37 PM EST by SDG]

You guys have an uphill battle to fight, and I personally wish you the best of luck.



Thanks Sinistral rifleman for your support.

Brian
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 1:10:22 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2005 1:25:52 PM EST by innocent_bystander]
Colt-653,

Who is TACTICS, LLC?

They are not registered with the Arizina Corp. Comm or the Secretary of State as a foreign/ domestic corp or a registered trade name.

Link Posted: 2/19/2005 1:29:26 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2005 1:34:00 PM EST by Colt-653]
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 1:31:16 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2005 1:33:56 PM EST by innocent_bystander]
What is the origin of these ripoff sights and scope mounts that ASA sells?

Last I saw they looked like the Guntec stuff that is made in China you see at all the gun shows.
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 1:37:10 PM EST
[Last Edit: 2/19/2005 2:10:20 PM EST by Colt-653]
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 2:17:37 PM EST
So what are the store hours?
Who is working the counter?
I'd like to meet/know who is who.
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 2:58:08 PM EST
Store hrs are tue - fri 10a - 5p
soon we are going to be open on mondays also.
and our hours may expand depending on customer demand.

Brad and I will be handling customers in the showroom.

Please come in.

Brian
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 3:32:29 PM EST
I've had multiple horrible experiences with Bob, but the products have been great to me thus far. I'll probably give them another shot, so long as that dickhead isn't ever in the store when I go there.
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 4:09:14 PM EST
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 4:13:14 PM EST

Originally Posted By TREETOP:
Will we still get the "cash-in-the-pocket-meet-me-around-back-for-the-parts" discount? hr


Only if your really really niceh.gif
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 5:22:20 PM EST

Originally Posted By SDG:

Originally Posted By TREETOP:
Will we still get the "cash-in-the-pocket-meet-me-around-back-for-the-parts" discount?



Only if your really really nice



Q: What types of information should be sent to Criminal Investigations?

Those tax violations that appear to be willful and intentional on the part of the taxpayer.

Q: What is the telephone number for DOR Criminal Investigations?

(602) 542-4023 (HOTLINE)


Link Posted: 2/19/2005 5:39:56 PM EST
Link Posted: 2/19/2005 6:19:05 PM EST

Originally Posted By Colt-653:
It's my Colorado based company...in the process of moving it down to AZ as well as rebuilding/updating my website that was posted on here last year with the XM177E2 kits I make.


Why do you ask?......do I have a store front....no.......do I deal in firearms...no....only kits....do I pay taxes....yes I do...I wish I didn't have to but the State and Feds like to take their piece of the pie



Just curious what company would get involved with ASA.

Looks like the Colorado one has been dissolved. Might want to check into that.

ID Number: 20031174455
Name: TACTICS, L.L.C.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Registered Agent: JAMES XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Registered Agent Street Address: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Registered Agent Mailing Address:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Principal Office Street Address:
Principal Office Mailing Address:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Status: Administratively Dissolved - Name Not Avail
Form: Limited Liability Company
Jurisdiction: Colorado
Formation Date: 05/30/2003
Term of Duration: Perpetual
Annual Report Month: May


Link Posted: 2/19/2005 9:49:58 PM EST

Originally Posted By booger-hooker:
Good Luck and thanks for the update on the current situation of ASA and keep us informed on how everything is going! hat



thanks man. this whole thread is way before its time. but look us up in a few weeks. we'll have our new website up. And by the way the customer service issue is in the past.

Brian
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 12:25:49 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/20/2005 12:35:55 AM EST by Colt-653]
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 5:08:53 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/20/2005 7:38:42 AM EST by desertmoon]
Colt 653, I, also, wish you the best in your endeavour. That you have an uphill battle is an UNDERSTATEMENT. ASA has earned every single bit of its' shitheel reputation and you will probably never live it down. This, of course, isn't your fault....but I don't take Bob's diabetes as an excuse for his behavior. I have pretty wild blood sugar myself and suffer from SEVERE insomnia and I have always let people know that I am in a "messed up" way when this is causing me trouble. I also take the time to correct my sugar levels and let folks know beforehand that I have to get my head straight BEFORE I deal with them. There are tons of folks out there inconveninced by maladies and handicaps that DON'T treat people the way Bob has, so I ( and others ) cannot except that as an excuse. Period.

This being sadi it is a WISE move indeed that you'll be buying him out of the company....kudos to you for doing that. MAJOR kudos.

The fact is that in order for you to undo the catastrophic nature of the damage done to the ASA name by lousy business practices, piss poor quality and terrible PR you are gonna have to change the name of your business. Once a business has marked itself the way ASA has....you are doomed to suffer from sales loss due to the negative stigma attached to the name. Oh, you'll still get business, ASA still does get business but not like it COULD.

As it stands, if you can get ASA to a quality level that is at least equivalent to Bushie, Armalite or RRA and you can HOLD IT then a part of your battle will be won. If you can get to or surpass the Colt level of QC then I salute you. I know you admire the Colt name as much ( if not more ) than I do and notice this: Colt spent many years building it's name into an American Icon and despite the MORONS who have run Colt for the past 30 years, that name is STILL respected by many inside and outside of the arms industry. None of us has to like it, necessarily, or even agree with it...but as it stands Colt can screw the pooch, fart in church then take a leisurely swim through a septic field and still come out smelling like a rose.

ASA cannot do that because ASA's name has been SHIT from the get go.

ERGO: you must change the name.


I've seen a couple of your threads and as such I am very glad to see someone who loves the classic AR's like the XM series and the early 600 model guns like the 601 and 602. I'd love to see you take this poor excuse for a company and turn it into something great....hell, I want you to!

Being involved in QC and manufacturing on a daily basis, here's some things you are going to have to stand by every single day from here on out:

1: Quality

2: Quality

3: Oustanding customer service, communication and relations.

4: Keep a clean, organized, efficient shop...KNOW YOUR OWN PRODUCT and know how to build and trouble shoot it. Then learn how to avoid making anything you need to troubleshoot.....make it right one time: the FIRST time.

5: Excellence of design, excellence of execution REPEATEDLY!

6: Make your employees KNOWLEDGEABLE about what they are building. For instance: often, things built to apparent spec. don't or won't operate properly because they are manufactured with stacked specs. Improperly trained employees sometimes don't understand how tolerances can sometimes work against one another. Things get put together that are technically in spec....but at such extremes of the spec that the product malfunctions despite being theoretically "in print". Etc.

( note: I edited the above comment so that it makes sense now.......insomnia in action )


This isn't from some TQM or ISO program, this is simply from my experience in manufacturing.

Again, best of luck to you in your new endeavour.

Link Posted: 2/20/2005 5:37:11 AM EST
why don't you give these guys a fukin break innocent_bystander and quit trying to sutley undermine and sabotage their efforts.

It looks like they're sincere in their attempt and have been forthright in their approach so far.

Let them have a fair shot at trying to bring this place (ASA) around.
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 5:49:52 AM EST

Originally Posted By Boog:
why don't you give these guys a fukin break innocent_bystander and quit trying to sutley undermine and sabotage their efforts.

It looks like they're sincere in their attempt and have been forthright in their approach so far.

Let them have a fair shot at trying to bring this place (ASA) around.



Why?

Because the friend of my enemy becomes my enemy.
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 5:56:08 AM EST
Name changes don't work, it's a shell game. Besides, "Bobcat" is already taken. There are plenty of companies that had good reps and ruined them. There are a few that have gone the other way, and turned themselves around. But a rose, or a turd, by any other name...
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 6:00:40 AM EST

Originally Posted By GLOCKshooter:
Name changes don't work, it's a shell game. Besides, "Bobcat" is already taken. There are plenty of companies that had good reps and ruined them. There are a few that have gone the other way, and turned themselves around. But a rose, or a turd, by any other name...



I know, but "reorganizing", "remanaging" and "renaming" are their best options.....
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 6:01:36 AM EST

Originally Posted By SGB:
Best Wishes in your endevor.



+1
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 6:14:36 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/20/2005 6:39:01 AM EST by innocent_bystander]

Originally Posted By desertmoon:

Originally Posted By GLOCKshooter:
Name changes don't work, it's a shell game. Besides, "Bobcat" is already taken. There are plenty of companies that had good reps and ruined them. There are a few that have gone the other way, and turned themselves around. But a rose, or a turd, by any other name...



I know, but "reorganizing", "remanaging" and "renaming" are their best options.....



Forming a new company and picking through what is left of ASA's inventory would be the best choice, but I'll bet they don't have the capital to do this. As a result they end up working for fat ass Bob.

Just off the top of my head ASA has been sued and burned bridges with LMT, Harris Gunworks and Armalite. I'm sure there are a few more I'm missing.
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 6:15:40 AM EST
New-ASA, what do you have to me? What is going to make me want to buy your product? What will make your product better?

Link Posted: 2/20/2005 6:27:18 AM EST
how about calling it "Red Horseman Arms"

all I ask for is a 2% cut


seriously, who could resist a funny logo of two safes humping? hell I'd buy a rifle with that on it.
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 6:45:15 AM EST
Guns by SAMM in Fountain Hills is for sale for only 70K.
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 7:03:30 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/20/2005 7:04:56 AM EST by 3rdpig]


many gunstore owners/dealers are asses. thats just the way it is.



And that's one of the main reasons that I no longer do ANY business with local gunstores, there's not a single one of them in my area that's treated me even halfway decently, even the stores where I'd recently made multiple gun purchases in the recent past. If I could find one local gunstore that didn't treat me like a red headed stepson anytime I wasn't ready to purchase an expensive item, they'd get a ton of my business.

And as far as ASA goes, I've only got one experience with them even though I probably pass them several times a week. Not surprisingly it's a bad experience with the entity known as "Bob". I was looking for a replacement part, small and not very expensive, and was told that I must be an idiot for walking into his store just to buy that little part, that was my first experience with them and my last. They've got a reputation among the local AR owners that's on par with the rep JoeKen has among AK owners.

But, since they are local, and IF they can get a face at the front counter that's even halfway civil to people who walk in, then I might consider stopping in and taking another look.
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 7:22:44 AM EST
[Last Edit: 2/20/2005 7:28:39 AM EST by desertmoon]

Originally Posted By desertmoon:

Originally Posted By GLOCKshooter:
Name changes don't work, it's a shell game. Besides, "Bobcat" is already taken. There are plenty of companies that had good reps and ruined them. There are a few that have gone the other way, and turned themselves around. But a rose, or a turd, by any other name...



I know, but "reorganizing", "remanaging" and "renaming" are their best options.....



I've reached a new high....I just quoted myself!

Another thing to consider about a name change here is that if Colt 653 and others are serious about revamping ASA, then a name change is being used as a fresh start and an attempt to shed a stigma whilst also redefining their nich in the business by embracing better business ethics and practices......as far as SpEshUl WepUns goes, the name changes there are a weak attempt to escape a bad reputation whilst doing nothing at all to prevent getting another bad reputation. A viciously inept practive, at best, considering this thing called the "internet" that allows folks to communicate any news good or bad, far and wide.......QUICKLY.
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 7:30:26 AM EST

I've reached a new high....I just quoted myself!

Another thing to consider about a name change here is that if Colt 653 and others are serious about revamping ASA, then a name change is being used as a fresh start and an attempt to shed a stigma whilst also redefining their nich in the business by embracing better business ethics and practices......as far as SpEshUl WepUns goes, the name changes there are a weak attempt to escape a bad reputation whilst doing nothing at all to prevent getting another bad reputation. A viciously inept practive, at best, considering this thing called the "internet" that allows folks to communicate any news good or bad, far and wide.......QUICKLY.

You bring up good points. like i said before this thread is way before its time. thanks for the advise.


brian
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 7:38:02 AM EST

Originally Posted By SDG:
You bring up good points. like i said before this thread is way before its time. thanks for the advise.

brian



I always like to be of service to those who desire to make positive changes.

Again, good luck.
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 7:49:43 AM EST
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 7:52:03 AM EST

Originally Posted By innocent_bystander:
Guns by SAMM in Fountain Hills is for sale for only 70K.



Now there's another fat ass dickhead slob that didn't know how to run a shop (not talking about the old codger, but the son)! But still not even in the same dickhead league as one-legged Bob...
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 8:16:48 AM EST
My .02 I've met Colt 653 Seems like a nice guy. I'm glad to hear that ASA is going to be saved. My experience with ASA has always been good and I know a couple of other people who say the same. I guess we just got lucky. If Colt653 and friends are going to improve on both quality and customer service it seems to me we all win by having another company make and selling the guns we love.

Holding a grudge against ASA for problems in the past seems kind of strange, If I did the same against car companys I would have to walk every where, every car company has sold lemons and had asshole work for them.Get over it, grow up, move on.

As far as a name change, not worth the effort. People would just scream that if was still ASA with a new name.

My suggestion. Warranty everything with ASAs name on it no matter when it was sold, Lower the price on those 308 rifles that take the fal mags,so that I can afford one.

Don't put a "NO CONCEALED WEAPONS" sign on your door. How do I explain not doing busisness at places that have those signs when even gun shops have those signs?!?! Copy Dillons sign. "All firearms must remain holstered or cased"

And lastly good luck!
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 8:22:01 AM EST
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 8:35:05 AM EST

Originally Posted By HeavyMetal:

New-ASA


NASA?



Only if they stay f-k-d-up!
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 2:00:53 PM EST
Good luck, guys!

I wish I were back in AZ to assist you right now.

I've known Bob for 4 years or so. I have known alot of his employees as well. I consider a lot of them friends. Bob can be touchy. I have known about his condition and took it into account. There are many cantankerous business owners in AZ, including Jeff Cooper at one time or another. I have seen some of the idiots that Bob has had to deal with. I've had to put up with them myself working at another gun shop. If you had to deal with brain dead people day in and day out, you'd get grouchy as well. I sometimes wished stupidty hurt. Sometimes it does, but not long enough. Bob has gone off of me a few times, but not really bad. I get over it and laugh about it.

I have several ASA products and had some issues at first, but Bob and his staff repaired all the problems and they work great now. My problems were due to chamber issues prior to 2001.

Are you guys still dealing with Dan Young and Young Manufactering? Dan is a very near and dear friend.


Well, as soon as I get back into town, I'll check on you guys and offer all the help I can. Stuck in Ohio assisting Grandpa is getting recovered from a stroke and ALZ. I'm probably here for his lifetime. He's 90 right now. Hope it won't last too long.

God bless and all the best.

Link Posted: 2/20/2005 5:21:25 PM EST
I would like to wish the new crew the best of luck. It is nice to have several places to buy gun stuff from close to work. I have bought parts from ASA, and a friend bought a 16" upper. The experience was as expected. Not note worthy great, but not note worthy bad. In, get what I need and done. I work in the Scottsdale airpark, so Dillon,Bear Arms and ASA are right there.
I will not argue pro or con on any of these shops, I will just state that when I have needed something, I was able to fix my problem.
If there is new blood in ASA and the problems are past, this should be good for all of us. It sounds like they are puting things in perspective with Bob stepping aside to be the silent invester and allowing others to run the shop and invest as they see fit. I look forward to the next time I need a part, the experience will tell if the new plan is working. See you soon Brian, Lonny
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 6:38:15 PM EST
The only thing I have ever had to do with ASA was owning one of the MADD knock-off rear sights they sold. It was actually quite accurate. The thing I didn't like was that it would not fold down flat against the receiver. I do wish you luck in your endeavors.
Link Posted: 2/20/2005 6:58:37 PM EST
I made the mistake of buying an ASA when I turned 18. It took me about 3 months and a shit load of visits to ASA to get it "fixed." I mostly just got lied to. There were however, a few employees willing to bend over backwards to help me, it just seemed they weren't knowledgeable enough to fix the problem.
After I had the rifle "fixed" enough times to get it working, I never went back and I started telling everyone that would listen not to even go to ASA.
I also received a nice little talking to by the dumb ass owner on my second or third trip to have my rifle fixed. I said something about his crap product in front of a few other customers and he let me know what he thought of me. Those of you telling me he has personal problems/has to deal with dumb asses all day...I SPENT A LOT OF HARD EARNED MONEY ON AN M4 THAT DIDN'T EVEN WORK FOR ALMOST 3 MONTHS! It also had a KB after my second visit to have it fixed. All I got was yelled at! I have dealt with personal problems and dumb asses ever since I was 16; I never took it out on the customer. That's simply called BAD CUSTOMER SERVICE. I don't want an apology or excuse, I want a solution.

Currently, my rifle runs OK. I don't trust it, and I don't like it because of all of the problems it has had. I want nothing more than to take a cutting torch to it and put it up for everyone to see. However, seeing as how you folks to appear to really want to change, and make the company work, I might be willing to forgive and move on if you can actually do something with my rifle/upper specifically...make good enough for me to trust it.
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