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Posted: 4/23/2004 4:46:02 AM EST



Texas law.
Sec. 46.01. DEFINITIONS.
~ ~ (6) "Illegal knife" means a:
~ ~ ~ (A) knife with a blade over five and one-half inches;
~ ~ ~ (B) hand instrument designed to cut or stab another by being thrown;
~ ~ ~ (C) dagger, including but not limited to a dirk, stilletto, and poniard;
~ ~ ~ (D) bowie knife;
~ ~ ~ (E) sword; or
~ ~ ~ (F) spear.

~ ~ (11) "Switchblade knife" means any knife that has a blade that folds, closes, or retracts into the handle or sheath, and that:
~ ~ ~ (A) opens automatically by pressure applied to a button or other device located on the handle; or
~ ~ ~ (B) opens or releases a blade from the handle or sheath by the force of gravity or by the application of centrifugal force.


Ok, so now the questions.
1. can I carry a knife that has both top and bottom edges sharpened?.
2. anyone have good defininitions for dagger, dirk and stilletto?
3. most tactical knives can be “whipped or slung” open. Are they all illegal?
4. how do you measure the length of a knife? Is it from point to back of the cutting edge or do you have to follow the contour of the blade?

Thanks,
Link Posted: 4/23/2004 6:15:22 AM EST
Google is your friend:

Dirk: A two edged weapon, a dagger with a slender triangular or square blade. Not synonymous with a "dagger or a Bowie knife". Bivens v. State, 113 S.W. 2d 921.

Dagger: A short weapon for stabbing (Webster's Eighth Collegiate) A knife which was sharpened on both edqes for slightly more than an inch from the point and on which the blade locked inplace when open was a "dagger" within the statute prohibiting carrying a dagger. Armendariz v. State, 396 S.W. 2d 132.

To answer your questions:

Your knife with both edges sharpened........ I guess it would depend on the shape and length of the blade. Is it a triangular blade? Does it fall under any of the catagories of illegal knife? If not I guess the reasonable man would say that it is not an illegal knife. Think of one of those hunting knives that are made for skinning. The ones with the gut hook ground into the top edge of the knife. Would you consider this illegal? The top edge is sharpened.

Knife blades are measured in a straight line, from the tip to either the hilt on a fixed blade knife, or the handle on a folder.

As far as a tactical knife being whipped or slung open, if I handed you a knife and said simply, "open it", and you pushed the blade open with your thumb, like it was "designed" to be opened. Then it would not be an illegal knife.

Hope this helps.

Link Posted: 4/23/2004 6:20:12 AM EST
yea, thanks.
but you know what i am talking about?
one of my folding knives is loose enough you can snap your wrist and it will open.
Link Posted: 4/23/2004 6:30:20 AM EST
Hey Mike...alot of this is left up to a loose interpretation by the district attorney's office. Depending on who you talk to they will say something different. Same goes for us cops opinions of this law too.

1) That's gonna depend on who you are dealing with as to their interpretation of dagger.

2) I'm too lazy find a dictionary

3) No...the centrifugal force law was designed more for butterfly knives.

4) Blade measured from end to end of metal blade.
Link Posted: 4/23/2004 6:31:44 AM EST

Originally Posted By 308wood:
one of my folding knives is loose enough you can snap your wrist and it will open.



Many of the pocket knives out there can be opened this way-- probably most of them... does it have a lock on it? my torsion assisted Ken Onion Boa doesn't open with the snap of my wrist if carried "correctly" with the lock in place , and there is no switch on the handle, but tapping the blade will pop it open... hehe.
Link Posted: 4/23/2004 6:33:12 AM EST
A police chief told me recently that a knife with both edges sharpened is illegal in Texas. The practical application is this: don't carry one. If you have bayonets, don't carry them on you. Otherwise, in Texas, the cops only get excited if you have on your person a blade longer than 5.5 inches, a blade sharpened on both edges, or a spring-loaded switch blade.

Regards,
Mahatma
Link Posted: 4/23/2004 9:04:56 AM EST
I think as far as folding knives go, the correct way to look at it would be to say, "Was it originally designed, or modified to work that way." I have a buck 110 that you can whip your wrist hard enough and open. No it wasn't designed that way, it is just worn out. Does that make it illegal? It all comes down to this, if they want something to charge you with, they will find it.

Link Posted: 4/23/2004 12:17:47 PM EST
[Last Edit: 4/23/2004 12:19:01 PM EST by TEXICAN1972]
BUTTERFLY KNIVES IS CONSIDERED A "SWITCH BLADE". I HAVE LEARNED THROUGH PERSONAL EXPERIENCE. SO AGAIN A BUTTERFLY KNIVE IS ILLEGAL.
Link Posted: 4/23/2004 4:38:57 PM EST
thanks to all...

i am finding knives are strange things.
with lots of room for sticky situations.
Link Posted: 5/3/2004 6:03:05 PM EST
Let's carry it to the next level. What about an honest-to-gosh sword. Think a modern repro of a Gladius or some of the battle ready swords that you could pick up from the SCA crowd? Definitely not a knife.

Just curious.

Will
Link Posted: 5/3/2004 6:16:31 PM EST
FYI: the second Amendment applies to knives too...
Link Posted: 5/3/2004 6:22:08 PM EST
On the battle sword. Is the blade longer than 5 in ? If it is, its illegal! If both sides of blade are sharpen, its illegal. Does the sword have a retractable blade???????? LOL
Link Posted: 5/3/2004 6:49:56 PM EST

Originally Posted By MAXP:
FYI: the second Amendment applies to knives too...



what second amendment?
the one that says you can only have what we tell you is ok?
Link Posted: 5/3/2004 7:05:25 PM EST

Originally Posted By 308wood:


Texas law.
Sec. 46.01. DEFINITIONS.
~ ~ (6) "Illegal knife" means a:
~ ~ ~ (A) knife with a blade over five and one-half inches;
~ ~ ~ (B) hand instrument designed to cut or stab another by being thrown;
~ ~ ~ (C) dagger, including but not limited to a dirk, stilletto, and poniard;
~ ~ ~ (D) bowie knife;
~ ~ ~ (E) sword; or
~ ~ ~ (F) spear.

~ ~ (11) "Switchblade knife" means any knife that has a blade that folds, closes, or retracts into the handle or sheath, and that:
~ ~ ~ (A) opens automatically by pressure applied to a button or other device located on the handle; or
~ ~ ~ (B) opens or releases a blade from the handle or sheath by the force of gravity or by the application of centrifugal force.


Ok, so now the questions.
1. can I carry a knife that has both top and bottom edges sharpened?.
2. anyone have good defininitions for dagger, dirk and stilletto?
3. most tactical knives can be “whipped or slung” open. Are they all illegal?
4. how do you measure the length of a knife? Is it from point to back of the cutting edge or do you have to follow the contour of the blade?

Thanks,



1. can I carry a knife that has both top and bottom edges sharpened?.

On your own property is fine - yes.....away from home - no.


2. anyone have good defininitions for dagger, dirk and stilletto?

two sharpened or partial sharpened edges.

3. most tactical knives can be “whipped or slung” open. Are they all illegal?

Not unless designed that way: e.g., switchblade, auto openers, balisong.

4. how do you measure the length of a knife? Is it from point to back of the cutting edge or do you have to follow the contour of the blade?

If you are caring a "non-illegal" knife: Follow the contour of the blade to be safe. It won't make much different in a 5.5" blade knife. - maybe an 1/16 - 1.8". My suggestion is to look at the length specified in the manufacturer's catalog.


5. BOWIE KNIFE: THis one serves the worst problem if enforced. I've never seen/heard it enforced. I have legal knives (as defined by Texas law) with the exception of a Bowie-style blade.

.02

Jeff

Link Posted: 5/4/2004 6:46:36 AM EST

Texas law.
Sec. 46.01. DEFINITIONS.
~ ~ (6) "Illegal knife" means a:
~ ~ ~ (A) knife with a blade over five and one-half inches;
~ ~ ~ (B) hand instrument designed to cut or stab another by being thrown;
~ ~ ~ (C) dagger, including but not limited to a dirk, stilletto, and poniard;
~ ~ ~ (D) bowie knife;
~ ~ ~ (E) sword; or
~ ~ ~ (F) spear.



I wonder, if Jim Bowie was alive today, what he would say about his knife being "illegal."

Link Posted: 5/4/2004 11:00:53 AM EST
[Last Edit: 5/4/2004 11:01:16 AM EST by mattld]

Originally Posted By De_Professor:
5. BOWIE KNIFE: THis one serves the worst problem if enforced. I've never seen/heard it enforced. I have legal knives (as defined by Texas law) with the exception of a Bowie-style blade.


If a cop ever enforces the law if you have, say, a Bowie knife in your truck, then I highly doubt he is a true Texan.
Link Posted: 5/4/2004 5:44:48 PM EST
don't confuse a legal "Bowie-style blade" (butcher knife design) with a real bowie knife which is illegal in that it is longer than 8".
Link Posted: 5/4/2004 6:18:51 PM EST
I guess a K-Bar is illegal anyway (7" blade). It does have the "bowie" shape, though.
Link Posted: 5/6/2004 8:20:52 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/7/2004 7:09:15 PM EST by wise_jake]
Yup, kind of ironic that I can't carry my Glock78 Field Knife (6 1/2") into the/an actual field.....
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 10:52:03 AM EST

Originally Posted By 308wood:
don't confuse a legal "Bowie-style blade" (butcher knife design) with a real bowie knife which is illegal in that it is longer than 8".



According to the LETTER of the law. It's a "bowie knife". It's not Bowie's knife, therefore it's legal. The part of the law that is ignorant is a 5 7/16" Bowie-style knife is considered illegal. I understand where you are coming from but, after 5 1/2" it's an illegal knife. Sword really doesn't need to be reference the way the law is written. Spear really doesn't need to be reference the way the law is written (see dirk). Basically, it's a stupid law.

.02

Jeff
Link Posted: 5/7/2004 6:26:31 PM EST
[Last Edit: 5/7/2004 7:06:53 PM EST by wise_jake]
Kind of ironic (crap, 2 posts I've used that word in in two days - I need to invest in a new thesaurus....), but 2 weekends ago my father-in-law (retired private atty, ex county judge, ex county atty, ex-JAG officer) and I (who me? oh, I'm nobody...) were going over just that section of the TX law. Since I don't have the booklet in front of me anymore (it's his), I can't be sure, but I thought I remember things like swords and spears being covered elsewhere. Perhaps immediately preceding or following the section/part in question.

[edited to add that I'm a retard. I got caught up in the middle section, I forgot that swords and spears were listed in 6(E) and 6(F), respectively.... interestingly enough, in 308wood's original post. The part I was actually thinking about, however, was absent from the excerpt:

(7) "Knife" means any bladed hand instrument that is
capable of inflicting serious bodily injury or death by cutting or
stabbing a person with the instrument.

So, even if swords were not specifically mentioned in 6E, they would still be illegal thanks to 6A, since they are both over 5 1/2" and capable of (blah blah) by cutting or stabbing. Further, this could loosely include such implements as machetes, since they are not necessarily de facto "swords" under 6A. Also, spears, if not mentioned explicitly in 6F, would still be illegal under 6B.]
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