I am 20. I have a single rifle, it's Rimfire, but it is a good starter. I want to move up higher into Centerfire, Shotguns, and Pistols when I turn 21. The problem is I am always treated as a child no mater where I go. I know that sounds cliche, but I seem to get it bad. I went into one store who refused to sell me a rifle I wanted to buy because they felt that I was overpaying on it. They just brushed me off saying "why don't you go home and think about it, and when you have the money for it, you can come back." even though I had the money in my wallet, which was in my hand in plain view of the shop owner. It also seems like people ignore me when I go in to ask about rifles or to buy ammo. I don't like guns to show off to my friends (as if I had anyh
Is it just shops who see too much underage kids trying to pull a fast one or do most people look down on someone my age who is a gun aficionado? What are your personal opinions on this subject?

I no how you feel. I am 22 and when I go to the range they are like "what is that punk doing here". Then they start talking to me and relize I know as much or more then them. But pretty much every place I have gone it is like this.

I'm 23 and have owned firearms since I was 8.  I have been shooting IDPA for a while now and have never had any problems with people giving me a hard time.  In fact I traded time sorting brass for ammo at a local range.  They were very helpfull in keeping me around shooting.  

yea one of the best things to do is be informed.  this web forum is a great resource for knowledge.  spend some reading the posts, and spend some serious time getting to know the crappy laws in the PRK.  i know what your feeling, i'm 21 years old and it is tough getting the respect one deserves.   generally speaking if you sound like you know what your talking about  your on the right track being treated like an adult the gun marketplace.  

btw, gun stores are NOT the best place to buy firearms, for a variety of reasons (price, lack of respect, fees, etc).  if you looking to get something check out my friend Leo (he's in manhattan beach).  very respectable guy and he will treat you like an adult.

here is his website:  www.davidsonsinc.com/consumers/subsites/dealer_home.asp?dealer_id=149563

if you got any questions shoot me an email: [email protected]  

I do this. I fingerfuck their rifles, and if they look at me like I'm a joker I buy a box of ammo  or something. I make sure they can see into my wallet, then take my $10 part or box and leave. I'm normally not a showoff or anything, but when I walk into a gunshop I have a grand or so in my pocket.

Quoted: I am 20. I have a single rifle, it's Rimfire, but it is a good starter. I want to move up higher into Centerfire, Shotguns, and Pistols when I turn 21. The problem is I am always treated as a child no mater where I go. I know that sounds cliche, but I seem to get it bad. I went into one store who refused to sell me a rifle I wanted to buy because they felt that I was overpaying on it. They just brushed me off saying "why don't you go home and think about it, and when you have the money for it, you can come back." even though I had the money in my wallet, which was in my hand in plain view of the shop owner. It also seems like people ignore me when I go in to ask about rifles or to buy ammo. I don't like guns to show off to my friends (as if I had any), and I am not reckless with them. I have a passion for guns, and now that it is legal I want to indulge in it more than I have been able to. Is it just shops who see too much underage kids trying to pull a fast one or do most people look down on someone my age who is a gun aficionado? What are your personal opinions on this subject?

Why wait until 21 for rifles and shotguns?

What I mean was I want to get into Centerfire rifles and shotguns, then into Pistols when I turn 21. It sounds good in your head so when you type it, it all makes perfect sense, but now I see how easily that lines was confused.

I usually try to be as informed as possible. I'm not the type to go in and say things like "whoa, that's cool" or "dang I want that one." The few questions I usually ask are in the lines of "do you have....?" or "do you carry from this compant....?" I would imagine that if you walked into a shop, didn't look at the wall or case, and asked for a gun by name they would at least assume that you know what you want. I guess some people just never learn, or maybe it is a superiority thing.

I'd love to help friends out when it comes to business, but Manhattan beach is a near 2 hour drive. Take into consideration rush hour traffic and I'd never get there by 9:30 (I'm lucky to be home and showered from work at 6:00). Maybe next time I am in that area I will give him a look.

I just find it discouraging sometimes. Shooting is without doubt the funnest thing I have ever done in my life. Ihave always wanted to own my own, but when I shot my uncle's gun several years ago, I knew I would have as many as I could afford when I was older. My family isn't exactly the type to like Guns. They aren't hippie like, it's just my mom's cousin was a cop and was killed on duty, so she hates them. As she raised us, it was kind of passed on; I just never caught on. Take that, the fact that every looks down on it, and add in that the few people who do support it look down one me, and you basically got no one on my side save for a brother or cousin from time to time just when they are bored. I guess it just gives me reason to try that much harder, and be that much nicer to the younger kids when I become the old one.

On a funnier note, my mom (I live on my own, but I work on the family ranch still FYI) hounds me from time to time to get rid of my rifle. She HATES them, as I said earlier, and she thinks I should get rid of it like it's a toy I don't use anymore or something. Like I am going to just sell a <1year old Ruger 10/22 that I have invested over a $1k in like it's a GIJoe. I dropped a big bombshell the other day when I told her I was buying a shotgun. She nearly dropped her breakfast bowl. I don't do it to upset her, but I figure I should at least warn her so the shock isn't as bad.

I got the "go away ya little punk" look from the first few shops I was in.  That look went away real quick when I was asking specifc questions they had no answers for.  (ok, it was AR15 related and I'd been lurking here for about two months doing nothing but reading and learning, so I *was* probably a bit above their knowledge level)


Oh, and the fact I was trying to find a place to special-order a $1200 rifle changed their minds.  First three shops said "oh, well, if thats what you're wanting, sure, we can get that for you"  and they were PISSED when I said "well, since you treated me like a kid you didn't want in here, I'll take my business elsewhere from now on"  They don't like seeing a $1000+ sale walk out the door.

Quoted: I am 20. I have a single rifle, it's Rimfire, but it is a good starter. I want to move up higher into Centerfire, Shotguns, and Pistols when I turn 21. The problem is I am always treated as a child no mater where I go. I know that sounds cliche, but I seem to get it bad. I went into one store who refused to sell me a rifle I wanted to buy because they felt that I was overpaying on it. They just brushed me off saying "why don't you go home and think about it, and when you have the money for it, you can come back." even though I had the money in my wallet, which was in my hand in plain view of the shop owner. It also seems like people ignore me when I go in to ask about rifles or to buy ammo. I don't like guns to show off to my friends (as if I had anyh Is it just shops who see too much underage kids trying to pull a fast one or do most people look down on someone my age who is a gun aficionado? What are your personal opinions on this subject?

I am 25 and I get it all the time. That is why I give all of my business to 3 Bay Area gun shops and most I WILL NOT deal with for this very reason. I do not look like a gang-banger/pot-head/loser etc. and I still get BS. I also do not patronize some local ranges because of this. I am an adult and will not be treated like a 12 year old. Just don't give them your business.

they dont treat you like a customer then dont be one.

Ive been to 5-6 different FFL's untill I finally settled on 2 that have earned my business. Same thing with ranges.

If your in Orange County Ade's gun shop will treat you right. 714-744-3373

There's only one gunshop in the Bay Area I would give my business to, that's because the owner treated me with respect when I bought my 10/22 when I turned 18.  When I bought a shotgun from him a couple years later, he still remembered me because he asked: "How's that 10/22 shooting?"  Now that's not only taking care of your customers, but connecting with them to make them feel welcome so they come back.  Bummer to hear how you've been mistreated.

These days it's hard to believe someone behind the counter wouldn't be helpful, especially if a potential customer shows some knowledge of firearms on a level above the Tupac crowd.

The place I went that treated me REAL bad is about 2 minutes from my house. I won't even buy ammo from them anymore. I'd rather drive for 20 minutes to a place that will treat me as a customer than a nusance. The funny thing, at leas to me, was that I was going to drop about $4k on that one visit alone, their lose, not mine. I was going in for an M14, possibly a milled 10/22 reciever instead of the Ruger cast receiver (this is the item that they gave me trouble for), and a gun safe. I didn't even get around to asking about the safe, and told them to forget it about the other two items and then I left.

It's not like I look like trouble either. I have a maintained appearance, conducted myself responsably, and I don't talk with slang or use many modern phrases. I'm sure you can tell by the way I type that I'm not exactly the "homie" style. I grew up working on a farm, and from top to bottom, I am as down to earth in the working class as you can get.

Still looking for a decent FFL though. The closest one that I can find is down in San Bernardino, which isn't exactly an area I want to go. It's not that bad, but it's a long ways out, and I can only really go late afternoon/night time because of work.  A white farmer like me in San Bernardino and I would be standing out like a sore thumb. Not to mention the whole money thing.....

I found a few FFLs I deal with, everything I normally just get through them,

Alot of places here are assholes.

Aside from that place, the next closest FFL is a Pawn Shop like 20 minutes away. I haven't tried to purchase anything from them, but I think they only have it to sell the guns people pawn, and won't actually order anything. The next closest one besides that one is another 20 minutes past that one.

I am located in one of the worst areas ever

And the stupid Kali ffl's wonder why people are buying off the internet.
If they just treated all their customers like sustomers rather than peices of sh#*, I think they would get a whole lot more repeat business.

I'm a minority, I get a unwelcome vibe at a lot of places.  Gun stores in CA have been respectful to me, I hear a lot of non-PC talk/jokes in gun stores...I think they are just trying to impress me into a sale though(this is CA's AR-15, the FAG-10 etc.)

If someone rubs you the wrong way, call em' on it.  More than likely it's a misunderstanding and they'll make it right.  If the guy still wants to be a punk, get the manager or fire off a letter/email to the owner or corporate.

If they are a good company they will make it right.  If not, don't shop there again, and tell everyone you know about your experience.  There are a few businesses in town that can kiss my ass, thankfully no gun shops.

I'm 20 and I get the same stuff sometimes. I bought a mini-14 from turners in fountain valley and the entire transaction they acted like something was wrong with me.  When I go in for ammo, I have a look at the guns, but they look at me like I'm gonna steal one cause I'm underage.

I stopped by the turners in Orange once though, and they treated me great. I could ask questions, and the guys behind the gun counter were friendly and happy and it was great. I now do most of my shopping for stuff there.

It's hard to want to do something we have a legal right to do, and to be treated as if we are somehow betraying people by doing it. It's mainly how society has raised people in CA. My parents are that way. "Guns are just bad." Young people especially should not have them. I hate this state. My parents are in Washington now. I am trying to talk them into getting pistols and CCWs.  The laws in this state have bred a general fear of guns.  this thread is discussing th fact that there are GUN RETAILERS who are afraid to sell guns to the people they initially wanted to sell guns to. It's just plain sad.

Rayn

You need to come out to our next Burro Canyon shoot and meet all the like minded individuals there. You will not feel like an outsider.


BTW, I'm way older now but still act like I'm in my 20's (though my body sometimes doesn't agree). I can still hang with you youngins.

The great thing about the AR15.com guys, is never at any group event, since I was 16 years old, was I treated poorly due to my age. Sure, we had to sit in the restaurant instead of the bar, but nobody seemed to mind. Pretty cool guys.

u know, haivng parents in washington aint a bad thing.
They can transfer u handguns that arent state approved list. AS long as they dont have any assault weapon characteristics (barrel shroud, foward grip, or detachable magazine separate from the grip a la sp89 or tec-9) its good to go. So if daddy happens to have around a few handugns he no longer wants, he can transfer them to u legally. I think thats pretty bad ass.

Quoted: u know, haivng parents in washington aint a bad thing. They can transfer u handguns that arent state approved list. AS long as they dont have any assault weapon characteristics (barrel shroud, foward grip, or detachable magazine separate from the grip a la sp89 or tec-9) its good to go. So if daddy happens to have around a few handugns he no longer wants, he can transfer them to u legally. I think thats pretty bad ass.

I have a bunch of guns I got as gift from my parents. I was so moved when he told me that I was gonna get a USP45 that I gave him $625 that very day, even before he went to get it

My parents? guns? No. they were raised here. I think it'd take a miricle to get them to transfer a gun, even if it was legal. They are pretty afraid of everything. I told them I'd get a CCW up there so I could carry a gun and they didn't understand. It was as if I was going to renounce my family. My mom asked me why I'd want to do that. Carrying concealed has NO other purpose but defense.  I've had good long talks about the neccessity of defence and the benefits of the 2nd amendment and my mom says she understands, but it's just not for her.  Hmm.

Anyhow, I can talk to them, but chances are they'd never do anything like that. They aren't real good about stuff like that and they don't understand the need.

also, how am I supposed to explain that if I purchase a gun retail here, it's illegal, but if I have it transferred in...even through an FFL... it is legal. That'll baffle the hell out of them. It's allright. I'm moving soon anyhow. Where I go, the gun pastures are green and open as far as the eye can see and .50 BMG round can fly. I've joined the navy. And when I get out, I won't move back here.

Rayn

I was under the understanding that as long as the pistol is in a belt holster, you don't need a permit. How then do you get around proving that you have a need for one? That always confused me, and aside from a enforcement/security job, I coudln't think of any REAL reasons. Sure I could think of some, but none that would pass through a sheriff I am sure. How exactly do you say for protection with unknown cause? here
I would love to go shooting with you guys sometime. I may be new and unknown, but I hope to change that over time. I wish I wasn't saving money for a NY trip early next year, otherwise I would have about 5 other rifles right now. As I said, I am buying a shotgun probably within the week, and after the new year probably that m14 I have wanted for so long (finally, I hope). Get the safe around the same time, maybe a Fab-10 SR-25 rip off....man I hate having to save when there is so much to go for How

How exactly do you do the shoots?

Basically everyone shows up with whatever they choose to bring.  They bring all the ammo they want (you foot your own bill).  There is a lot of ammo comonality(i.e. 5.56).  You talk to people and you can ask them if they are willing to let you shoot their gear, lots will offer.  I wouldn't bring anything that I'm not willing to share because that is what the day is about; sharing, and shooting.

Cheers

I could see that happening, but the town I live in is quite small, and not to be racist, has very few minorities in it. It is also towards the mountains, and is the last town before you get into camping territory, so they get a lot of hunters and outdoors types with few 'punks' (to put it lightly).

This topic reminded me of something. They, the manager/owner and two other guys, were sitting around talking when I walked in. It as around 5:15, and the shop closed at 6:00. They wouldn't do anything, and even said "we can call them tomorrow, but I don't like making phone calls this late. Why don't you come in earlier next time." This upset me for 2 BIG reasons: 1. I start work several hours before they even get to the shop, let alone open it, and I get off work at 5:00 if I am lucky. 2. If you don't like doing business after that time, then don't stay open that late. I think the fact that he had the audacity to tell me to come back later, as if his time was more important than mine, is what really pissed me off and finally made me leave. I can deal with someone giving me a hard time to get something, as long as I get it and don't have to deal with them again. Treating me like that, it finally blew my top.

You don't know me, but in person I am very calm, cool, and collected and and a pacifist by nature. I don't mean I try to solve all my problems with non-violent force or anything, I just have always been able to avoid problems and fights in my past, which is a good thing. But try and take my guns or hurt my family, and you have another thing coming. It may just be lead and super sonic too, if your lucky.

yeah ive had a problem with many of the stores in the antelope valley/high desert. you would think that it being a highly conservative area itd help but most of the gunstore employees are pricks. and most if not all of the stores are privately owned; there is no big corporation or anyone to whine to. if the employees are pricks, the owners usually reflect that personality. the one place i have enjoyed here is the Gun Shop here in lancaster. i just turned 21 and ive stopped by there alot since i  was like 18, theyre always nice, and when i inquired about a 1911 they were willing to do whatever it took to find out all options i had for purchasing one. there are a couple good stores around here with really personable ppl...the ratio of good to bad just hurts though

and gun owners wonder why so many young people arent involved in the shooting sports the protection of the 2nd Amendment.

I wish I could find a place to take my patronage to, but there are few and far between. I have bought about 80% of my ammo from Wal-mart. Don't get me wrong, I love Wal-mart and I love their prices, but it is pathetic when a high-school drop out who doesn't even know what grain, velocity, or mm is can give you better gun related service then a fellow brethern in arms. I honestly think if I found a shop I liked, I would spend at least $3k a year there. Easy. First year, maybe even $5k. That isn't even considering ammo....

But then again, I guess that is why we are forced to drive for an hour just to get to a respectable shop.



So far it has seemed that a fairly large percent of the people, on this forum at least, are in the 20-30 range. Is that accurate, or do old users simply see "kid problems" and automatically think 'that has nothing to do with me, I'm not a kid'?

Yeah, gun shops in California tend to treat EVERYONE like crap.  Unless they know you're some type of LEO, then you get treated like gawd (like us citizens don't need the same quality protection from slimeballs).  The few I've seen that treat you well have long since closed (barring two, maybe three stores), or have fairly high prices and refuse to order cheaper deals (or make deals).  Sad, sad, sad...

This is all very true, the first time i got treated like this was at Turners.I was 17 at the time, my dad went to go buy a Sig. While the paper work was being done , my dad asked  me what caliber we should get it in .357 sig or 9mm.The guy suddenly stoped all the paper and said " wait a second! i cant sell you this gun if your buying it for him"My dad was like whats is you problem? this is my son...we got it anyways , and it was for me lol  hen
Second time i got treated like a little kid by turners,was when i just asked for the price of a remington 870.When i asked the guy he  ignored me at first , then he told me i had to be 18 to buy that gun and just walked away he

That reminds me of two things that happened to me. I bought my Ruger 10/22 from Big 5 Sporting Goods. I went back about 2 weeks later to buy ammo for it. The guy behind the counter wouldn't see it to me, because it can be used in a pistol also, even though the law says it is fine to sell it to someone under the age of 21 as long as they say it is for a rifle. The second time I went to Walmart to buy ammo for it and got the same problem. I was with my cousin who is several years older than me, and when they said I wasn't old enough I just looked at him and said "heres the money, just buy it for me." and the guy sold it to him. Real good ammo control.

I think as long as we have ridiculous laws, people will be uninformed, and as long as that exists, there will be unnessessary fear and disregard for firearms. It's sad to think that people would lay down one of their rights just because when they were younger they were told they were bad. I wonder if they will start to teach that speaking your mind is bad and free speach is only for people who have something supportive to say.

I was just thinking of something.

Obviously it isn't illegal to own a pistol not on the safety roster, you just can't purcahse it in the state. What happens when you purcahse a pistol on the roster, then convert it into a pistol that isn't on the list. For examaple:

You purchase a .44Mag Desert Eagle Mark XIX
You order online a new .50AE barrel, bolt, mag, etc.
You swap the parts

Would you legally own it then? The Desert Eagle .50AE Mark XIX isn't on the roster, most likely from not being submitted, however the .44Mag model is. All Desert Eagles of the same model use the same reciever, just different barrels, bolts, mags, and maybe slides (I can't remember).

I've been waiting to get my hands on one, and I am trying to figure out if I am going to be able to.

i dont live in CA but i was bored and browsing. I am 20, but first i should say i dont look 20. i usually sport a full beard down my chest. ive been keeping it trimmed though lately for my new job. now its just a chinstrap.

At one local store ive been treated like crap on numerious occasions. Alot of people recommend it, but i think becuase its the only local indoor range. I decided with my last visit it would be the last time i would ever go there. I walked in and went straight for the ammo. I usually buy online but i was going to the range the next day and needed it then. Not a single box of 7.62x39 on the shelves. very little .223. This is suppose to be an "evil black rifle" friendly place. They sell ar15's and have a few ak's, some FALs etc etc. The guy behind the counter looks at us (i was there with a friend who was going with me to the range and need to get ammo as well) and said "what do you kids want.". And as if it didnt start out bad enough, they did have some wolf 7.62x39, about 20 BOXES (20rnd boxes) only, and they wanted 5.99!?!? a box. i was looking at buying a few thousand rounds that day. i turned around and left without saying a word.

At the gunshow where i bought my last rifle, my WASR-10 ak47, i had a few differnt experiences. If i remember correctly there were 4 dealers that had the rifle i was looking for. One wanted over 400$ and the sights were canted. though he did treat me well. Another would not even answer my questions. He just sort of ignored me and continuted to shoot hte sh*t with his buddy.  The dealer i eventually got the rifle from treated me like he would anyone else. the price was higher then the dealer who ignored me by about 20$, but the service was worth it. Not to mention his good looking daughter who was my age handled all my paper work!

I always buy my .22lr ammo at walmart. its cheap and good for killing cans. I bought my ruger 10/22 at walmart the day i turned 18. I have always had good experiences there. They ask me if its for a rifle or pistol. i say rifle, and they take my money. never been carded.

After i moved and got my new job in town, i no longer had a place to shoot like i did when i lived out in the country with my father. I went a few months without shooting. Just recently Someone in the SC hometown forum turned me onto a great range, though it is 40 miles from me :-). I showed up early in the morning on a saturday, not knowing what to expect. it was only my second time ever going to a public range. most of my shooting had been done alone or with my father in backyards and fields my entire life. People were already at the range. they were real nice and friendly. my age didnt seem to bother them (i was by far the youngest there). two there shooting SKS's loved the AK. we talked a bit. The bolt action shooters scoping in there hunting rifles were nice, just ignored us semi auto folks. Guy with the ar15, which i was checking out, told me he wanted an AK for christmas. All in all a great experience, and will probaly be going again next weekend if work permits. (being "on call" for a 200 unit apartment complex sucks, something always has to start leaking on the weekends....)

All in all, alot of a younger shooters problems can be avoided with the right self image. Walk into a store knowing what you want. Dont be afraid to ask questions and point things out the dealer might miss. Dont be a smartass, but dont act like an idoit either. No doubt many dealers will be "on their guard" when a younger person walks in, for various reasons. And when at a range, always be 10x more anal about saftey procedures then anyone else. There is nothing wrong with being safe, and some will be looking for faults.

Quoted: So far it has seemed that a fairly large percent of the people, on this forum at least, are in the 20-30 range. Is that accurate, or do old users simply see "kid problems" and automatically think 'that has nothing to do with me, I'm not a kid'?

Yeah, there's a pretty good representation from all of the age groups here. The majority are 30-40 IIRC. I wasn't going to reply to this until I saw the above quote. Just to let ya' know that even us old guys feel your pain. I get treated the same way at every gun store that I go into. I have literally spent thousands upon thousands of dollars on this hobby over the years. I don't think that I have ever bought more than 2-3 weapons at any one store ever. Simply because I am treated like shit repeatedly. And the owners/counter help are generally assholes. It doesn't matter if I'm inquiring about $5.00 of cleaning supplies or a $2,500.00 rifle. I am consistently treated like a turd. Even by the shops that I have made large/multiple purchases from. It gets really old, really quick. So I move on to the next shop in an ever widening circle.

It sounds as if you are just experiencing the norm.

Welcome to the gun culture.  

Quoted: All in all, alot of a younger shooters problems can be avoided with the right self image. Walk into a store knowing what you want. Dont be afraid to ask questions and point things out the dealer might miss. Dont be a smartass, but dont act like an idoit either.

This is VERY true for not only younger shooters but everyone (incuding old farts like me )

Before I first walked into a shop (Turners San Diego) to purchase my first gun I had spent months surfing the boards and learning everything I could about firearms and California laws.  When I went in I KNEW what I wanted, what questions to ask and what to expect.

We (my GF and I) were treated with respect and got a lot of good advice and support from the crew there.  As a result all but 2 of my 18 guns have been purchased at Turners.

To be honest having hung around listening to the type of bullshit that gunstore people have to put up with (from total idiots, bangers and homies and the SEAL/Commando types) I can cut them a *bit* of slack.  However that ends when the customer, no matter their age or sex, is serious about a purchase.  It's a business and they are there to conduct it.  If they fuck around with you, leave.  It's that simple and the loss for not taking you seriously is theirs.

That is acctualey very discouraging. It's sad to think that a large percentage of people out there are trying to take your right to own guns away, then most of the people who aren't trying to take them away think they are bad and need to be regulated more, and the small percentage of people who should be on your side make it harder than pulling teeth to get them. I wonder if the shops open and the passion for firearms slowly dies with all the customers, or if it is all profit driven from the very beginning.

Either way I am in need of a new place to shop. I think I am going to go to the Turner's in San Bernardino tomorrow to look for a small shotgun. I have heard Turner's can be either good or bad, so I am nervous. Maybe I will go on Yahoo real quick, find the 5 or so gun shops that are closest to me in San Bernardino and stop by each one tomorrow. Who knows, maybe I will get lucky and find a real gem.

I'll tell you guys if I find a gem, but I highly doubt I will.


I must admit, that these Forums and the Forums at Rimefirecenteral are some of the nicest places I have ever been, and take into consideration that they are firearms forums makes it that much better. I wish there was an arfcom shooting range that we could all hang out at on weekends. Who knows, we can always dream.