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Posted: 9/25/2004 5:54:24 PM EST
Yup, cooler, crisp mornings....football on the weekends
October is just about here and I don't see any plans for a Casa Grande shoot !!!
Whats the deal people, anyone up for some lead slingin fun ?!?!?
Link Posted: 9/25/2004 6:15:07 PM EST
Steve_ and I spoke about this just today at the range. It's in the works. We're just hoping the DMG'ers will come even with the no alcohol, tannerite or 50 cal rules set by the city..

Steve_ will let me know and I'll get the potty's....
Link Posted: 9/25/2004 6:23:17 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/25/2004 6:23:42 PM EST by Neanderthal]
If you can set a date for this shoot asap. I'll know if I'm off work or not. And I'll see if I can bring my little girl.


Neanderthal
Link Posted: 9/25/2004 6:46:49 PM EST
Hi gang,
I am new to the forum, live in phoenix and would like to meet-up for a shoot. Please let me know the dates.
Link Posted: 9/25/2004 9:32:32 PM EST

Originally Posted By NC_Goose:
Hi gang,
I am new to the forum, live in phoenix and would like to meet-up for a shoot. Please let me know the dates.



Welcome aboard
I'm sure steve and AZ_redneck will get the ifno posted, once they get it locked down.
Link Posted: 9/25/2004 9:55:33 PM EST
I was out at Desert Trails trying out the underfolder Derek built and Hot Dammm it was sweet.
Will keep an eye out for data on the shoot.
Link Posted: 9/26/2004 5:48:53 AM EST
... I'll have to get the 'ole AZ-ARFCOMMER BBQ grill tuned up!

... woO0Oo hoO0Oo
Link Posted: 9/26/2004 6:28:14 AM EST

Originally Posted By SJetwrench:
I was out at Desert Trails trying out the underfolder Derek built and Hot Dammm it was sweet.
Will keep an eye out for data on the shoot.



What's an underfolder?
Link Posted: 9/26/2004 6:48:37 AM EST

Originally Posted By markm:

Originally Posted By SJetwrench:
I was out at Desert Trails trying out the underfolder Derek built and Hot Dammm it was sweet.
Will keep an eye out for data on the shoot.



What's an underfolder?



You been hanging around lotboy again huh.......
Link Posted: 9/26/2004 7:18:17 AM EST

[Larry the cable guy]

Git R Done

[/Larry the cable guy]

Link Posted: 9/26/2004 12:14:18 PM EST

Originally Posted By SPECTRE:

You been hanging around lotboy again huh.......



Nope. He's commited to a life of online gaming. I have to shoot with others these days.
Link Posted: 9/26/2004 1:11:39 PM EST

Originally Posted By Az_Redneck:
We're just hoping the DMG'ers will come even with the no alcohol, tannerite or 50 cal rules set by the city..




So what are those guys suppose to do? Stand around and stare?
Link Posted: 9/26/2004 2:07:49 PM EST
[Last Edit: 9/26/2004 2:08:14 PM EST by SJetwrench]
Markm- Underfolder as in AK-47" When you absolutely have to kill every M-F'er in the room except no substiutes" oh and J/K
Link Posted: 9/27/2004 4:56:19 AM EST

Originally Posted By SPECTRE:

Originally Posted By markm:

Originally Posted By SJetwrench:
I was out at Desert Trails trying out the underfolder Derek built and Hot Dammm it was sweet.
Will keep an eye out for data on the shoot.



What's an underfolder?



You been hanging around lotboy again huh.......



AK-47 underfolder... The stock folds under the gun-- the butt area actually folks up horizontal and fits against the front handguards.

Mike
Link Posted: 9/27/2004 2:22:03 PM EST

Originally Posted By Winston_Wolf:
... I'll have to get the 'ole AZ-ARFCOMMER BBQ grill tuned up!

... woO0Oo hoO0Oo



Lemme know when and where, HAVE GRILL, WILL TRAVEL!
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 9:45:05 AM EST
Any new word ?
Link Posted: 10/2/2004 7:05:43 PM EST
Don't you have to reserve the range and have a ton of insurance to have a group shoot there?

I believe that is what Was talked about back in January just before the last shoot.

If I'm wrong and I really hope I am. Maybe ill sneak some Tannerite there. I don't think it is posted is it?
Link Posted: 10/4/2004 2:56:08 PM EST
Looks like the October shoot may get turned into a November shoot this year. The range will be closed down for improvments either late this month or early next month. I can't make a reservation until the City decides what dates the range will be shut down. I am going to call next week and will hopefully be able to get some more info.


Steve
Link Posted: 10/4/2004 5:56:37 PM EST
Well, I got 500 Hornady 75 grain .224" Match bullets and 300 Speer 200 grain .45 Gold Dots, so all I've got to do now is sit down and LOAD.

Y'all just tell me when.

Oh, and I'm working on getting some more armor steel targets made up.
Link Posted: 10/4/2004 6:05:04 PM EST

Originally Posted By WolverineAtWork:

Originally Posted By Winston_Wolf:
... I'll have to get the 'ole AZ-ARFCOMMER BBQ grill tuned up!

... woO0Oo hoO0Oo



Lemme know when and where, HAVE GRILL, WILL TRAVEL!



No Tannerite? !@#%$@??? That's it. I'm bringing cheese brats then.
cgj
Link Posted: 10/5/2004 7:46:49 AM EST

Originally Posted By Az_Redneck:
Steve_ and I spoke about this just today at the range. It's in the works. We're just hoping the DMG'ers will come even with the no alcohol, tannerite or 50 cal rules set by the city..



You know, I hate to be a butthead, but I wonder if the city can actually set rules like this if it's a public range:



http://www.azleg.state.az.us/FormatDocument.asp?inDoc=/ars/13/03108.htm&Title=13&DocType=ARS

13-3108. Firearms regulated by state; state preemption; violation; classification

A. Except as provided in subsection C of this section, a political subdivision of this state shall not enact any ordinance, rule or tax relating to the transportation, possession, carrying, sale, transfer or use of firearms or ammunition or any firearm or ammunition components in this state.

B. A political subdivision of this state shall not require the licensing or registration of firearms or ammunition or any firearm or ammunition components or prohibit the ownership, purchase, sale or transfer of firearms or ammunition or any firearm or ammunition components.

C. This section does not prohibit a political subdivision of this state from enacting and enforcing any ordinance or rule pursuant to state law, to implement or enforce state law or relating to any of the following:

1. Imposing any privilege or use tax on the retail sale, lease or rental of, or the gross proceeds or gross income from the sale, lease or rental of, firearms or ammunition or any firearm or ammunition components at a rate that applies generally to other items of tangible personal property.

2. Prohibiting a minor who is unaccompanied by a parent, grandparent or guardian or a certified hunter safety instructor or certified firearms safety instructor acting with the consent of the minor's parent, grandparent or guardian from knowingly possessing or carrying on the minor's person, within the minor's immediate control or in or on a means of transportation a firearm in any place that is open to the public or on any street or highway or on any private property except private property that is owned or leased by the minor or the minor's parent, grandparent or guardian. Any ordinance or rule that is adopted pursuant to this paragraph shall not apply to a minor who is fourteen, fifteen, sixteen or seventeen years of age and who is engaged in any of the following:

(a) Lawful hunting or shooting events or marksmanship practice at established ranges or other areas where the discharge of a firearm is not prohibited.

(b) Lawful transportation of an unloaded firearm for the purpose of lawful hunting.

(c) Lawful transportation of an unloaded firearm between the hours of 5:00 a.m. and 10:00 p.m. for the purpose of shooting events or marksmanship practice at established ranges or other areas where the discharge of a firearm is not prohibited.

(d) Any activity that is related to the production of crops, livestock, poultry, livestock products, poultry products or ratites or storage of agricultural commodities.

3. The use of land and structures, including a business relating to firearms or ammunition or their components or a shooting range in the same manner as other commercial businesses. Notwithstanding any other law, this paragraph does not authorize a political subdivision to regulate the sale or transfer of firearms on property it owns, leases, operates or controls in a manner that is different than or inconsistent with state law. For the purposes of this paragraph, a use permit or other contract that provides for the use of property owned, leased, operated or controlled by a political subdivision shall not be considered a sale, conveyance or disposition of property.

4. Regulating employees or independent contractors of the political subdivision who are acting within the course and scope of their employment or contract.

5. Limiting firearms possession in parks or preserves of one square mile or less in area to persons who possess a concealed weapons permit issued pursuant to section 13-3112. The political subdivision shall post reasonable notice at each park or preserve. The notice shall state the following: "Carrying a firearm in this park is limited to persons who possess a permit issued pursuant to section 13-3112." In parks or preserves that are more than one square mile in area, a political subdivision may designate developed or improved areas in which the political subdivision may limit firearms possession to persons who possess a concealed weapons permit issued pursuant to section 13-3112. The political subdivision shall post reasonable notice at each designated developed or improved area. The notice shall state the following: "Carrying a firearm in this developed or improved area is limited to persons with a permit issued pursuant to section 13-3112." For the purposes of this paragraph, "developed or improved area" means an area of property developed for public recreation or family activity, including picnic areas, concessions, playgrounds, amphitheaters, racquet courts, swimming areas, golf courses, zoos, horseback riding facilities and boat landing and docking facilities. Developed or improved area does not include campgrounds, trails, paths or roadways except trails, paths and roadways directly associated with and adjacent to designated developed or improved areas. Any notice that is required by this paragraph shall be conspicuously posted at all public entrances and at intervals of one-fourth mile or less where the park, preserve or developed or improved area has an open perimeter. Any limitation imposed by a political subdivision pursuant to this paragraph shall not apply to a person:

(a) Engaged in a permitted firearms or hunter safety course conducted in a park by a certified hunter safety instructor or certified firearms safety instructor.

(b) At a properly supervised range, as defined in section 13-3107, at a permitted shooting event, at a permitted firearms show or in a permitted hunting area.

(c) Legally transporting, carrying, storing or possessing a firearm in a vehicle.

(d) Going directly to or from an area where the person is lawfully engaged in hunting, marksmanship practice or recreational shooting.

(e) Traversing a trailhead area in order to gain access to areas where the possession of firearms is not limited.

(f) Using trails, paths or roadways to go directly to or from an area where the possession of firearms is not limited and where no reasonable alternate means of access is available.

6. Limiting or prohibiting the discharge of firearms in parks and preserves except:

(a) As allowed pursuant to chapter 4 of this title.

(b) On a properly supervised range as defined in section 13-3107.

(c) In an area recommended as a hunting area by the Arizona game and fish department and approved and posted as required by the political subdivision's chief law enforcement officer. Any such area may be closed when deemed unsafe by the political subdivision's chief law enforcement officer or the director of the Arizona game and fish department.

(d) To control nuisance wildlife by permit from the Arizona game and fish department or the United States fish and wildlife service.

(e) By special permit of the chief law enforcement officer of the political subdivision.

(f) As required by an animal control officer in performing duties specified in section 9-499.04 and title 11, chapter 7, article 6.

(g) In self-defense or defense of another person against an animal attack if a reasonable person would believe that deadly physical force against the animal is immediately necessary and reasonable under the circumstances to protect oneself or the other person.

D. A violation of any ordinance established pursuant to subsection C, paragraph 6 of this section is a class 2 misdemeanor unless the political subdivision designates a lesser classification by ordinance



Thus, it seems to me that there is nothing in this law giving the city the right to regulate the use of the facility in terms of what we can or cannot shoot. If you really want to be buttheads about it, send the city a copy of this, or merely reference it.....

TimW
Phoenix
Practical Tactical, LLC
Link Posted: 10/18/2004 8:25:50 AM EST
When we get this set up finally, I have some new steel targets to use. I just got five 10" x 11" x 1" AR500 rectangular plates (think "chest-sized") that should make some interesting sounds. These will stop a .50 BMG round. A .30-06 shouldn't leave a mark.
Link Posted: 10/27/2004 8:07:30 AM EST
BTT!

Any news? I'm good for any weekend date excluding November 27.
Link Posted: 10/27/2004 12:16:44 PM EST
TimW,

Interesting idea with the preemption clause and public ranges.

Ben Avery has a .50 ban.
Link Posted: 10/27/2004 4:29:01 PM EST
[Last Edit: 10/27/2004 4:29:37 PM EST by Steve_]

Originally Posted By KBaker:
BTT!

Any news? I'm good for any weekend date excluding November 27.



Yeah, November 20. Check the tacked thread.


Steve_
Link Posted: 10/27/2004 4:39:33 PM EST

Originally Posted By innocent_bystander:
TimW,

Interesting idea with the preemption clause and public ranges.

Ben Avery has a .50 ban.



Yes, they do. However, they also have something that the Casa Grande range don't...they're owned by the state and the state isn't a "municipal locatlity", so the preemption statute doesn't strictly apply to them.

We went round-and-round with the state on this, vis-a-vis the AZ Dept of Revenue. Very long story short, the state declared itself exempt from the statute and that it wasn't required to check weapons on-site, but instead made one walk 400 yards to the main Capitol building to check a gun.

So, Ben Avery can restrict .50 and there's not much can be said about it. Casa Grande, however, may be open to legitimate preemption dispute.

TimW
Phoenix
Practical Tactical, LLC
Link Posted: 10/28/2004 1:08:37 PM EST

Originally Posted By Steve_:

Originally Posted By KBaker:
BTT!

Any news? I'm good for any weekend date excluding November 27.



Yeah, November 20. Check the tacked thread.


Steve_

Oh.

D'OH!
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