Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login
Page Hometown » Ohio
Site Notices
9/19/2017 7:27:10 PM
Posted: 8/31/2010 5:02:26 PM EDT

Utah gun-permit process draws Ohioans

Western state's easier requirements for getting license proving attractive
Tuesday, August 31, 2010 02:51 AM

By James Nash
THE COLUMBUS DISPATCH

While about 200,000 Ohioans have obtained permits to carry concealed firearms through the state, nearly 2,000 others have bypassed Ohio's requirements and gotten licenses from Utah - without even having to visit that state.

Ohio requires people to undergo 12 hours of handgun-proficiency training before they're eligible for a license to discreetly pack heat. Utah requires applicants to take a certified course but doesn't specify a number of hours.

Ohio also adds the names of permit holders to a law-enforcement database, whereas Utah does not.

Because the two states honor each other's handgun licenses, a resident of Ohio can take a Utah-certified course in Columbus or another Ohio city, send $65.25 to the Utah Department of Public Safety, pass a background check and be eligible to carry a handgun into public establishments across Ohio.

According to the Utah Department of Public Safety, 1,885 Ohioans have done just that.

Utah has attracted a huge number of out-of-state handgun permit holders - 138,418 in all - because of its low costs, comparatively lenient requirements and the large number of other states that honor Utah permits.

In 2004, then-Ohio Attorney General Jim Petro began honoring Utah's permits even though the states' agreement requires "substantially comparable" eligibility requirements. Current Attorney General Richard Cordray interprets the rules as comparable.

Gun opponents say that's a loophole some Ohioans use to get around their state's more-stringent requirements.

"There has to be a reason someone wants to get (a permit from Utah), and it's usually because they don't qualify to go through the Ohio program," said Toby Hoover, executive director of the Ohio Coalition Against Gun Violence.

Jim Irvine, chairman of the Buckeye Firearms Association, said some Ohioans turned to other states - chiefly Utah - because the names of Ohio permit holders had been public record.

"Some people are still afraid of having their names printed in the papers, even though that hasn't been a problem in the last couple of years," Irvine said.

He dismissed the idea that Ohioans have obtained permits from Utah to get around the Buckeye State's requirement that they undergo 12 hours of firearms training.

"Our training bar is pretty high, although I'd say that's a pretty minor reason," Irvine said. "If you're going to carry, the idea of having the least possible training doesn't apply to many people."

A number of firearms training facilities in Ohio, including the Mid-Ohio Firearms Training Academy in Columbus, advertise their Utah-certified courses as a way to obtain licenses honored in a large number of states.

Ohio ranks 21st among states in the number of residents certified by Utah for concealed firearms. The top states are Utah itself, California, Nevada and Missouri.

http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2010/08/31/utah-gun-permit-process-draws-ohioans.html?sid=101
Link Posted: 8/31/2010 6:06:23 PM EDT
I'm already an NRA Instructor but I wonder how I can offer this training .
Any idea Knight?
Link Posted: 9/1/2010 2:40:50 AM EDT
Tag for interest.
Link Posted: 9/1/2010 2:47:26 AM EDT
I can't believe Toby Hoover is still at it.
Link Posted: 9/1/2010 4:44:00 PM EDT
I read about the Utah permit this week, and thought it was a great idea but can't find anyone offering it.

I did some additional web browsing, and found that more states have reciprocity with the Utah permit, some states don't recognize a non-resident permit. For example, Ohio resident with Ohio permit carrying travels in Florida, Florida recognizes the permit. But Ohio resident traveling carrying in Florida with a permit from Utah, would not be legal to carry in Florida.

I read this as a FAQ, not the law, if anyone can refute that, please let me know.
Link Posted: 9/2/2010 12:20:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/2/2010 12:22:21 PM EDT by Dragracer_Rob]
Originally Posted By RPGJoe:
I'm already an NRA Instructor but I wonder how I can offer this training .
Any idea Knight?


Interested as well.

Little digging found this post elsewhere from 2009.

To become a Utah instructor is a simple process.

1. first, become an NRA instructor (you need some secondary certification before applying to Utah)

2. attend an instructor's class in Utah (no option...must be in Utah) and pass a test on basic safety and their law (open book...not a problem).

3. pay them their application fee ...sit back and wait for approval...about 10 days.

4. done, repeat #2 and # 3 again in 3 years
Link Posted: 9/2/2010 1:17:13 PM EDT
If anyone locally does get Utah Training Certified or know where we can get this training please post it up here. I have an Ohio CCW permit as well as Pennsylvania and New Hampshire. Utah would add to the overall amount of states I would be legal to carry in.
Link Posted: 9/2/2010 1:43:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/2/2010 1:45:49 PM EDT by KnightofTheOldeCode]
Here is the “more information than you asked for” answer.

I was a Utah certified instructor. I let it lapse, it isn’t worth it. The demand is low, and you do just about as good by getting PA. For 3 years I have referred my Utah inquiries to John Farquahr, and he tells me he tells all the people just to get PA instead.

The article is incredibly misleading; people are not getting the permit to circumvent Ohio’s training. They get it to be in addition to the Ohio license, to gain states. And with that motivation, getting the PA is a no-brainer compared to getting Utah. I had just over 120 students as a Utah instructor, EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. Already had the Ohio CHL, and we always tell the reporters that. Both Nash and Bischoff were told that, but it isn’t sexy to include that information.

But, if you really want to do it, you'll need to fly to Utah to take one of their instructor certification classes. This is the reason I let it lapse, it ain’t worth the $800 or so a trip out and back, hotel etc would cost. At one point Utah BCI would fly an instructor out here to do the training/requalification, but they dropped this.


http://publicsafety.utah.gov/bci/documents/TRANGUIDELINES_009.pdf



http://publicsafety.utah.gov/bci/documents/CFinstructor_004.pdf



Originally Posted By RPGJoe:
I'm already an NRA Instructor but I wonder how I can offer this training .
Any idea Knight?


Link Posted: 9/2/2010 2:21:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/2/2010 2:22:50 PM EDT by hkusp]
Utah Application

I'm just going to get my Ohio permit from someone local like Black Wing in Delaware.
Link Posted: 9/3/2010 2:36:08 PM EDT

Dude.. I'd have gotten you into a class a long time ago if you'd have let me, lol. Still willing, if you are ready.

Originally Posted By hkusp:
Utah Application

I'm just going to get my Ohio permit from someone local like Black Wing in Delaware.


Link Posted: 9/4/2010 8:40:30 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/4/2010 8:49:26 AM EDT by AirRaceFan]
Originally Posted By JETWC:
If anyone locally does get Utah Training Certified or know where we can get this training please post it up here. I have an Ohio CCW permit as well as Pennsylvania and New Hampshire. Utah would add to the overall amount of states I would be legal to carry in.


If you mean training to be a Utah instructor I would go the the Utah BCI site, if you mean training for the permit, and you're in the Xenia area, contact younggold2@aol.com
That's who I got mine from.

Got the Utah permit since renewal is much cheaper than Ohio's and I needed a few states that don't recognize Ohio CCW permits

ETA: Instructor list from Utah BCI site. Instructors
Link Posted: 9/4/2010 2:50:49 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 1:37:50 AM EDT
[
Wonderful point Steve, it does not!

quote]Originally Posted By bigbore:
Regardless of the UT qualifications, Since when does OH recognize non-resident permits?[/quote]

Link Posted: 9/5/2010 4:51:48 AM EDT
Originally Posted By KnightofTheOldeCode:
[
Wonderful point Steve, it does not!

quote]Originally Posted By bigbore:
Regardless of the UT qualifications, Since when does OH recognize non-resident permits?


[/quote]

Since 2004 LINK The reciprocity agreement signed in 2004 states that all Utah permits honored, no distinction made

Utah gun-permit process draws Ohioans

Western state's easier requirements for getting license proving attractive
Tuesday, August 31, 2010 02:51 AM
By James Nash
THE COLUMBUS DISPATCH


While about 200,000 Ohioans have obtained permits to carry concealed firearms through the state, nearly 2,000 others have bypassed Ohio's requirements and gotten licenses from Utah - without even having to visit that state.

Ohio requires people to undergo 12 hours of handgun-proficiency training before they're eligible for a license to discreetly pack heat. Utah requires applicants to take a certified course but doesn't specify a number of hours.

Ohio also adds the names of permit holders to a law-enforcement database, whereas Utah does not.

Because the two states honor each other's handgun licenses, a resident of Ohio can take a Utah-certified course in Columbus or another Ohio city, send $65.25 to the Utah Department of Public Safety, pass a background check and be eligible to carry a handgun into public establishments across Ohio.

According to the Utah Department of Public Safety, 1,885 Ohioans have done just that.

Utah has attracted a huge number of out-of-state handgun permit holders - 138,418 in all - because of its low costs, comparatively lenient requirements and the large number of other states that honor Utah permits.

In 2004, then-Ohio Attorney General Jim Petro began honoring Utah's permits even though the states' agreement requires "substantially comparable" eligibility requirements. Current Attorney General Richard Cordray interprets the rules as comparable.

Gun opponents say that's a loophole some Ohioans use to get around their state's more-stringent requirements.

"There has to be a reason someone wants to get (a permit from Utah), and it's usually because they don't qualify to go through the Ohio program," said Toby Hoover, executive director of the Ohio Coalition Against Gun Violence.

Jim Irvine, chairman of the Buckeye Firearms Association, said some Ohioans turned to other states - chiefly Utah - because the names of Ohio permit holders had been public record.

"Some people are still afraid of having their names printed in the papers, even though that hasn't been a problem in the last couple of years," Irvine said.

He dismissed the idea that Ohioans have obtained permits from Utah to get around the Buckeye State's requirement that they undergo 12 hours of firearms training.

"Our training bar is pretty high, although I'd say that's a pretty minor reason," Irvine said. "If you're going to carry, the idea of having the least possible training doesn't apply to many people."

A number of firearms training facilities in Ohio, including the Mid-Ohio Firearms Training Academy in Columbus, advertise their Utah-certified courses as a way to obtain licenses honored in a large number of states.

Ohio ranks 21st among states in the number of residents certified by Utah for concealed firearms. The top states are Utah itself, California, Nevada and Missouri.

jnash@dispatch.com

If I'm missing something, please enlighten me. NO snarkiness intended.
Link Posted: 9/5/2010 5:11:16 AM EDT
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 3:38:53 AM EDT
Link Posted: 9/7/2010 5:52:50 PM EDT
I just got my renewal in the mail today for New Hampshire. It went from $20.00 in 2006 to $100.00 this year, what a crock.
Link Posted: 9/8/2010 4:13:46 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/8/2010 4:14:33 AM EDT by Chuck]
Page Hometown » Ohio
Top Top