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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 2/7/2006 1:58:55 PM EDT
Does anyone have too many firearms?

Or, is too much just right?

We sat down with our insurance agent a week or so ago and went over everything. The cost of insuring these things is not exactly cheap. That got me to thinking, why do I have some of these (so many) things. Do I really need an elephant rifle? Probably not. Where do you draw the line though, how much, how many?

12 months ago the plan was to build up all these different ARs (19 or so), but I don’t even shoot the ones I have now. I mean, I think everybody should have an M14 or two, but am I in this for collecting (to accumulate) or to have a few different guns to shoot?

Your thoughts?

Link Posted: 2/7/2006 2:01:23 PM EDT
Enough to arm your family and friends.

Then shoot what you like, sell the rest to try new ones.....repeat and keep the ones you like.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 2:07:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By WS4LIF:
Enough to arm your family and friends.

Then shoot what you like, sell the rest to try new ones.....repeat and keep the ones you like.



You sell guns? Shit. I only sold one and I've regretted it ever since. Not to mention the two offers I decided to sleep on and lost.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 2:08:39 PM EDT
Too many is when you have more than you and your offspring can shoot in your lifetimes.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 2:10:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By WS4LIF:
sell the rest to try new ones.....


That's why i have you guys.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 2:11:00 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 2:19:29 PM EDT
Technicly I dont think it does......it covers the parts though....like uppers, scopes, etc.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 2:19:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2006 2:21:26 PM EDT by ch139]

Originally Posted By petagunner:
Insure them?

Won't your homeowners insurance or renters insurance cover them?


Only up to $5K, beyond that it's $1.42/$100 of value/year.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 2:20:29 PM EDT
Really though.

The list of things I’d like to have is vast and growing. If I were to win Powerball type of list.

For instance, I love big Smith revolvers. A friend just picked up a 625-3 3-inch (45ACP). I am completely geeked up on it and would love to add it to my collection, but it would probably just sit in the safe… like a bunch of other guns. Don’t need it, already have a Smith revolver in 45ACP (5-inch), but would love it… and a 4-inch.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 2:21:17 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 2:24:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2006 2:26:35 PM EDT by ch139]
No problem at all.

It’s not like $300 a year for an additional $20K worth of coverage will kill me or anything.

Just thinking…

I don’t hunt, probably never will, do I really need a 30/30, 30-06 and a 300Win Mag, not to mention the 458... all impulse buys. well the 458 I got when I was into the big game thing.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 2:37:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ch139:
12 months ago the plan was to build up all these different ARs (19 or so), but I don’t even shoot the ones I have now. I mean, I think everybody should have an M14 Glock or two, but am I in this for collecting (to accumulate) or to have a few different guns to shoot?



Fixed your post.

I'm seeing the same thing. There are some toys, etc. but I think where it is now is just fine. There's some odd ones like Mausers, etc. that I doubt I'll shoot much, but would still like to have. I'm actually going to sell the AK I have and not buy another one. I'm sticking with the AR platform and should have 3-4 flavors. Couple that with the usual home defense, some .22's and a few collector pieces and that's enough for me.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 2:46:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By NoAim:

Originally Posted By ch139:
12 months ago the plan was to build up all these different ARs (19 or so), but I don’t even shoot the ones I have now. I mean, I think everybody should have an M14 Glock or two, but am I in this for collecting (to accumulate) or to have a few different guns to shoot?



Fixed your post.

I'm seeing the same thing. There are some toys, etc. but I think where it is now is just fine. There's some odd ones like Mausers, etc. that I doubt I'll shoot much, but would still like to have. I'm actually going to sell the AK I have and not buy another one. I'm sticking with the AR platform and should have 3-4 flavors. Couple that with the usual home defense, some .22's and a few collector pieces and that's enough for me.



Ditto........should have another AR together in a few weeks.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 2:58:45 PM EDT
Yes then the AKs

Two existing rifles (Bulgarian SLR-100H and a Hungarian SA 85M) three Romanian AKM (AIM) kits and a beautiful AKS-74U (Krinkov) kit. How many are needed? I’ve shot the SA 85M about 8-months ago, but haven’t shot the SLR-100H in years.

Keep, Build, Sell?
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 3:05:12 PM EDT
Wait a second! Most insurance policies limit "theft" to 1 or 1.5K... And they usually have provisions to increase that by 5 or 10K but usually with a max of 1K per item.... Burning done the house you should be covered..... Talk to your agent boys and girls... Do your homework...
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 3:06:32 PM EDT
Adopt me. I'll shoot them for you.

I'm both too cheap and too poor to be a collector, but that's not my mentality anyway. If I buy it, I want it to be something I use pretty often. Just no room or resources for things that don't do anything.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 3:11:44 PM EDT
Yes, yes.

Basic coverage covers firearms from theft to $2500, I upped that for an additional $10/year to $5000 in THEFT ONLY. If the house burns down there’s $75K to cover contents (including guns and accessories).

To cover more than $5000 in firearms from theft is where I’m getting $1.42/$100 in value/year. The insurance agent mentioned a scheduled policy, list of serial numbers and pics.

Like I mentioned $284/year for an additional $20K worth of insurance from theft isn’t a piggy bank breaker, but it did get me to thinking.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 3:22:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By WS4LIF:
Enough to arm your family and friends.

Then shoot what you like, sell the rest to try new ones.....repeat and keep the ones you like.



To do otherwise would be considered a pack-rat... and 19 of one type of arm is getting close to it.

Start giving them away to family that won't turn around and sell it. It's what I do, sort of. "Hey, (family member). You like this rifle? Want to hold on to it for me? Shoot it all you want if you clean it afterwards...."
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 3:25:11 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ch139:
Yes, yes.

Basic coverage covers firearms from theft to $2500, I upped that for an additional $10/year to $5000 in THEFT ONLY. If the house burns down there’s $75K to cover contents (including guns and accessories).

To cover more than $5000 in firearms from theft is where I’m getting $1.42/$100 in value/year. The insurance agent mentioned a scheduled policy, list of serial numbers and pics.

Like I mentioned $284/year for an additional $20K worth of insurance from theft isn’t a piggy bank breaker, but it did get me to thinking.




You should check out The Historic Firearms and Collectibles Insurance Program at 1-800-545-9326. I think 100K was quoted at a little over 300 bucks a year plus it is an all risk program... Your 25k classIII blows up it's covered. And it is a blanket policy so you don't have to name all your guns.

Link Posted: 2/7/2006 4:13:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ch139:
Yes, yes.

Basic coverage covers firearms from theft to $2500, I upped that for an additional $10/year to $5000 in THEFT ONLY. If the house burns down there’s $75K to cover contents (including guns and accessories).

To cover more than $5000 in firearms from theft is where I’m getting $1.42/$100 in value/year. The insurance agent mentioned a scheduled policy, list of serial numbers and pics.

Like I mentioned $284/year for an additional $20K worth of insurance from theft isn’t a piggy bank breaker, but it did get me to thinking.



Noooo! Don't do it!

No I will not take off the hat, thank you very much.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 4:18:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2006 4:21:09 PM EDT by KeptKirk]
Point being, if you want your guns to play with. They are there!

"Two existing rifles (Bulgarian SLR-100H and a Hungarian SA 85M) three Romanian AKM (AIM) kits and a beautiful AKS-74U (Krinkov) kit. How many are needed? I’ve shot the SA 85M about 8-months ago, but haven’t shot the SLR-100H in years.

Keep, Build, Sell?"

My dad has probably 15 rifles he hasnt used in the last 10 years, he wouldnt dream of selling them. hes sold one pistol the past 20 years and hes regretted it ever since (every time we bring up a gun and selling he brings that up and how bad it sucked)

Guns dont go bad :) When you want it 5 years from now and have the time to play with it itll be there.

As many are needed as you need :) If I had a favorite weapon I would most likely get 2 or 3 so when friends come along I dont have to take turns sharing and we can all play together at the same time. Loaning them out to family/friends is also a reason I get more than 1 of my favorites.

Id keep the buildable ones around, heck if you enjoy doing it no need to rush off and do em quick as you can or to sell them when youll probably just buy different kits anyways :)

Sorry if its spaced out and all, was at work and typed this over 2 hours :P
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 4:22:55 PM EDT
POST your inventory and we will help you trim the fat.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 5:18:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2006 5:19:43 PM EDT by Hartmann]
If you haven't read this, it's a good advice on gun insurance from John Ross, who wrote Unintended Consequences.

Link

"What you want is not separate firearms coverage but a homeowners policy that DOES NOT HAVE A GUN EXCLUSION. Get "Replacement cost contents, all risks" on your homeowners policy from a company that sells a policy without a gun exclusion...

If it’s written as a REPLACEMENT COST CONTENTS, ALL RISKS policy (which is what you want,) that means if you take your expensive double rifle to Africa and it gets lost/stolen/confiscated/falls in the river, it’s covered for whatever it takes to replace it. Same deal if your vehicle is stolen with a bunch of guns in it while you’re eating a meal in a roadside restaurant on a cross-country trip. (The guns are covered by your homeowner’s policy, the vehicle needs its own policy, obviously.) Ditto shipping guns to a gunsmith for repair or modification, or shipping guns ahead by common carrier to some other place you want to shoot them. Don’t pay UPS for insurance--the guns are already covered...

Take good digital photos of every gun you own and keep a file in case anything is stolen or otherwise lost. (Digital means you won’t get some mouth-breather at the photofinishers blabbing about you.)..."

It turns out I needed to get an add-on for my guns, but it's not that much. For me it's worth the peace of mind.


edited to keep it HF related: Oregon rocks!
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 6:15:19 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2006 7:12:24 PM EDT by petagunner]
<Keep that via IM not in here>
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 6:51:07 PM EDT
Talk about being direct to the point.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 7:12:06 PM EDT
Could have been worse: He could have said "Eat a hot, steaming bowl of dick"...
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 7:22:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2006 7:23:06 PM EDT by VA-gunnut]
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 7:27:00 PM EDT

Originally Posted By PromptCritical:
Could have been worse: He could have said "Eat a hot, steaming bowl of dick"...



Someone doesn't know that ch139 = family :(
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 7:30:12 PM EDT
YOU must not ever pay attention in forums that you feel like Nazi'ing whenever you feel like it.
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 7:40:04 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 7:50:39 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/7/2006 7:51:45 PM EDT by kythri]
...wrong topic...
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 8:37:52 PM EDT
GeeeZe LouiZe in a Summer BreeZe... What happened to the thread? Anyhow back to insurance... It will be very hard to find a homeowers/renters aka fire policy that does not limit guns.... I would submit that one does not exist.... If you have a serious collection you need specialized insurance... JMHO
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 8:50:06 PM EDT
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 9:11:33 PM EDT
Me and PIL just dropped a chunk at Del-ton tonight..............what started as a barrel and stock turned into a kit for me, then he decided he wanted a rifle kit.....lowers will be later this week too....when it rains, it pours...

Lil' Boo is gonna make out like a bandit someday.....
Link Posted: 2/7/2006 9:22:20 PM EDT
Per discussions with my Allstate agent on this very matter, there's no requirement you get your firearms appraised.

Allstate insures for REPLACEMENT value, not what you paid for it 20 years ago, not the $10,000 you paid for a $9,000 gun, but what it would cost an average person to replace.

There's also no requirement for you to have video/photo evidence of your collection, since everything has a de-facto registration with a 4473 (his words).

Of course, (and my agent agreed), you'd do a better job of covering your butt by having every little bit of information you could.

Receipts are good, but not required - all they'll do is help prove you bought it.

Photographic/video evidence is some of the best cover you can provide yourself.

A nice detailed list of your firearms and firearm accessories (Allstate defines accessories as everything for the gun except the gun itself - optics, magazines, cases, tools, even ammunition) is good, too - something that has the make/model/serial number and a description of the weapon if it's other than a stock, out of the box firearm).

As far as assessing the replacement value of the firearms, for some people, they may have to get an appraisal. If you've got a rare, 100-year-old elephant gun that's worth some serious bank, and the five people in the country that may have one for sale are asking anywhere from $1500 to $15000 for it, you're going to need to have something to prove that your gun is worth closer to the $15000 rather than the $1500.

I've got an easier time of things, because all of my stuff is reasonably new, military-styled weapons. With the exception of a couple pieces like my SVD and my G36, given the money, I could probably replace my entire collection from GunsAmerica in a couple of days. Provided the replacements are the quality and condition of the pieces I lost, I wouldn't really care if they cost significantly less than what I put into them.

Of course, since I've prided myself on using what I consider to be the "best" parts in my kit builds, and going above and beyond on some accessories, I'm in the process of photographically documenting my entire collection, taking care to make sure I have clear pictures of certain parts - if my AK-74's get skanked, I want to make sure I get K-Var and RSA parts (like I put into them), not Hesse and Tapco.
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 8:43:45 AM EDT
Wait a second your agent said "all risk" "no limits" on firearms? Get it in writing or ask to see the exclusion portion of the policy. Heck I sell insurance but if that is true I'll kiss my company Good Night and Good Luck....
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 11:38:55 AM EDT

Originally Posted By z3bigdaddy:
Wait a second your agent said "all risk" "no limits" on firearms? Get it in writing or ask to see the exclusion portion of the policy. Heck I sell insurance but if that is true I'll kiss my company Good Night and Good Luck....



Er, sorry, should have put that information in my post.

It covers up to $2000 or $2500 of firearms if stolen.

Further coverage is required to be scheduled. That extended coverage (Say, $25,000, for example) is for theft only.
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 11:54:12 AM EDT
It’s not the insurance that I’m concerned about.

It’s keeping all these different things I don’t shoot, and are taking up room in the safe. I think the idea that holding on to everything you ever buy is kinda silly. I’d still have a 9mm Taurus PT92 then. There are a lot of different gun that have gone down the road from my place; some I miss some I don’t, it’s an evolution I guess. The collection though, is the vast collection necessary?
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 11:56:55 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/8/2006 12:01:23 PM EDT by z3bigdaddy]
"Er, sorry, should have put that information in my post.

It covers up to $2000 or $2500 of firearms if stolen.

Further coverage is required to be scheduled. That extended coverage (Say, $25,000, for example) is for theft only.
"


That makes sense now... Even on the extended there will limit per item I'll wager..... Probably $1,500 so if you have any kind of quality guns you will be out of luck covering full value... If you have say 50K in guns, as I suspect many here do, you really need to look for serious safe protection and/or collectors insurance....
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 11:59:39 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/8/2006 1:38:45 PM EDT by z3bigdaddy]

Originally Posted By ch139:
It’s not the insurance that I’m concerned about.

It’s keeping all these different things I don’t shoot, and are taking up room in the safe. I think the idea that holding on to everything you ever buy is kinda silly. I’d still have a 9mm Taurus PT92 then. There are a lot of different gun that have gone down the road from my place; some I miss some I don’t, it’s an evolution I guess. The collection though, is the vast collection necessary?



You never have enuff guns... I own more guns that I've never chambered a round in than many people have total... If you were collecting loose women and didn't have to pay upkeep on em how many would you have? I just happen to like guns bettern loose women is all...
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 12:18:27 PM EDT

Originally Posted By z3bigdaddy:
If you were collecting loose women and didn't have to pay to upkeep on em how many would you have?



5.

Two for me. Two to watch. One to cook/clean/fetch my booze.

Thank you, I'll be here (by myself) all night!
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 12:27:56 PM EDT
I don’t necessarily want a huge collection of guns though.

There’s a bunch of things I have that I’ll probably keep, but then there’s also things I think would be cool, but I’d never really shoot or do anything with.

An 8 3/8-inch Smith & Wesson model 57 .41 Magnum something I’ve always thought would be cool, but I’d probably never get around to shooting it much. The aforementioned 3-inch S&W 625



There’s so much to want and so many of em are duplicates, why such a vast collection? of...
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 12:40:50 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/8/2006 12:42:01 PM EDT by ch139]
For instance, I’ve got this M1 Garand.

It’s SN is 328xxx mid 1941. The barrel is dated 8-41. Everything but the rear sights are correct to the rifle. Talking to Ron Smith before I left Arizona, he said it all appears to be original (say for the sights), he said to "put it into the back of the safe and forget about it, get another one to shoot."

The rifle is used and abused; it has been used as a match rifle over the years. Is it something I dig for the rear sight (about $400), find a better condition correct stock and have it restored only to store it in the safe to say "look I’ve got a correct 1941 Garand," and not shoot it for fear of something breaking and loosing any value it has at being correct. Do I shoot it as is and hope I don’t bend the op-rod. Or sell it off and pick up a good shooter.

As it is, after talking to Ron, I thoroughly cleaned the entire rifle, oiled it and put it away. At that point it was all fine as I wanted a safe full of Garands as well as a safe full of M14s and ars and…

I’d just like to have one that shoots good and looks nice.
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 12:56:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By ch139:
For instance, I’ve got this M1 Garand.

It’s SN is 328xxx mid 1941. The barrel is dated 8-41. Everything but the rear sights are correct to the rifle. Talking to Ron Smith before I left Arizona, he said it all appears to be original (say for the sights), he said to "put it into the back of the safe and forget about it, get another one to shoot."

The rifle is used and abused; it has been used as a match rifle over the years. Is it something I dig for the rear sight (about $400), find a better condition correct stock and have it restored only to store it in the safe to say "look I’ve got a correct 1941 Garand," and not shoot it for fear of something breaking and loosing any value it has at being correct. Do I shoot it as is and hope I don’t bend the op-rod. Or sell it off and pick up a good shooter.

As it is, after talking to Ron, I thoroughly cleaned the entire rifle, oiled it and put it away. At that point it was all fine as I wanted a safe full of Garands as well as a safe full of M14s and ars and…

I’d just like to have one that shoots good and looks nice.



You know, I've got an all original Yugo AK in .308 that hasn't been imported in over 12 years. I picked it up for less than the current going asking price of around $850 or so. It was NIB.

I shot it, and enjoy it. I don't believe in holding onto things for their investment purposes. All things I own WILL get used. Otherwise, my house would be full of things that I'm just "holding on to".
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 1:31:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/8/2006 1:32:25 PM EDT by Hartmann]
FWIW my insurance agent (State Farm) said what kythri's agent said.


All things I own WILL get used. Otherwise, my house would be full of things that I'm just "holding on to".


I'm into photography as well as guns, and years ago there was an great article by a photographer who had taken some awesome pics in the Utah desert, in the caverns where the sandstone has been worn away and is all sorts of red and orange colors (kinda like this one). Anyway he said that to get these photos he had to expose his $5000 camera to the wind & blowing sand. And the sand got into the workings of the camera, and ever since then it didn't really work right.

What impressed me was that he said that it didn't matter that his camera was nearly ruined -- he used the camera for what it was made for: taking great pictures. The other option -- to baby the camera for life, maybe never take it out of the house for fear it would get damaged was stupid. What would be the point in having it then?

Anyway, that's kinda my philosophy on all my toys now.

edited to add: Hey this is post #308 for me! Woo Hoo!
Link Posted: 2/8/2006 3:01:25 PM EDT
If I remember correctly, the NRA also provides up to $5K of insurance.
Link Posted: 2/9/2006 9:47:05 AM EDT
Have to check into that NRA thing too.

Lately I’ve just been getting steamed at them; it seems as thought I get something once a week asking for more money and they have also sold my name/address.
Link Posted: 2/10/2006 7:39:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By petagunner:

Originally Posted By z3bigdaddy:
GeeeZe LouiZe in a Summer BreeZe... What happened to the thread? Anyhow back to insurance... It will be very hard to find a homeowers/renters aka fire policy that does not limit guns.... I would submit that one does not exist.... If you have a serious collection you need specialized insurance... JMHO



And for that you would need to have them appraised, right? Either that or receipts, which, for what I do mostly (ee trades and such) would be pretty hard.

I'm gonna call my agent tmrw and see what he has to say (allstate)

I'll post the info tmrw.


generally you can call your homeowners and add a clause...allstate which i have, asks you to have them appraised(be it a gunshop or whatever) and send them the reciept, and they'll be happy to cover it. fo r$10,000 worth of coverge, it came out to an extra $100/yr on my insurance
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