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Posted: 3/16/2009 4:35:55 PM EDT
I suppose this is just a rant more then anything.


http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=123470232

I will take responsibility for the first part. I was under the impression that these were of Remington manufacture. I suppose that is not directly stated but it could have been worded better. Now I got the box to find they are a mix of re-loads and a handful of older military surplus. Mostly IMI head stamps with a few random ones mixed in there. They defiantly do not all have the head stamp he describes, about 50 of them are different. Some of them are dented to the point they are un-usable.

Now my biggest concern. One of the cartriges (and I've only checked 50 so far) is not .223. It is stamped .223 on the side just like the rest of them. It is really a .222 round reloaded with the same bullet the guy used on the .223. This leads me to believe that whoever loaded them had no idea what they were doing and that these were made in someones basement, not by a company that reloads as a buisness. Honestly I'm a little afraid to fire them, I have no idea how much powder is in them, if the cases were sized properly, how many times they have been reloaded, etc. What would happen had I tried to put that .222 through my AR or Mini-14?

I just sent them an e-mail expressing my dissatisfaction and will see what they say.

End rant.
Link Posted: 3/16/2009 4:42:23 PM EDT
Bite the bullet, learn your lesson, and throw it all out.

I don't reload myself, but I'd never put any cartridge in my gun that was hand loaded by someone else.

the only thing that will piss you off more is when you try to fire it and it explodes in your face ruining your gun and or injuring you.
Link Posted: 3/16/2009 5:12:59 PM EDT
i would say you got ripped. leave a negative feedback
Link Posted: 3/16/2009 5:20:13 PM EDT
Originally Posted By Phil_A_Steen:
i would say you got ripped. leave a negative feedback


Yeah the more I think about it the more I think I got plain ol' ripped off. This ammo is really useless, I can't fire it not knowing what I have. I'm going to give them a chance to give me a refund and make it right before I leave them a negative. Who knows maybe it's someone who just plain doesn't know any better and will be willing to give me a refund. I suppose being out 40 bucks would be better then being out $220.
Link Posted: 3/16/2009 5:28:05 PM EDT
if they won't make it right, primed brass and bullets still have some value in today's market. get a puller
Link Posted: 3/16/2009 6:06:08 PM EDT
Dude, he misspelled Remington at least twice in the ad!

Link Posted: 3/17/2009 2:30:54 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/17/2009 2:32:12 AM EDT by TMB9862]
Well I got this e-mail from him

Hi, I am sorry you are disapointeted, I purchase the ammo at at gun show a few year back and was under the impresson that it was remington ammo, what little did I know. I do not want you to get stuckwith it if it is reloads, If you are willing to ship it back to me I will refund your money or give you a parcel credit if you decide to keep it and throw the bad out.


At least I get my $200 back, still stuck with $20 to ship it here and $20 to send it back though. An example of people with no idea what they're doing jumping on Gun Broker and selling grandpas guns and ammo to make a few bucks with these high prices lately. I guess it's a lesson learned. If someone can't spell don't buy ammo from them.
Link Posted: 3/17/2009 2:41:48 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/17/2009 2:42:34 AM EDT by screen-name]
he knew it was shit ammo...why you think he put it on GB.

need to start watching what you buy. theres ALOT of sharks out there taking advantage of the buying frenzy, you just got had by one of them
Link Posted: 3/17/2009 4:12:51 AM EDT
Originally Posted By TMB9862:
Well I got this e-mail from him

Hi, I am sorry you are disapointeted, I purchase the ammo at at gun show a few year back and was under the impresson that it was remington ammo, what little did I know. I do not want you to get stuckwith it if it is reloads, If you are willing to ship it back to me I will refund your money or give you a parcel credit if you decide to keep it and throw the bad out.


At least I get my $200 back, still stuck with $20 to ship it here and $20 to send it back though. An example of people with no idea what they're doing jumping on Gun Broker and selling grandpas guns and ammo to make a few bucks with these high prices lately. I guess it's a lesson learned. If someone can't spell don't buy ammo from them.


His description was a little vague but also misleading. Accept the refund and take a lesson learned. A couple questions on your part were probably necessary prior to bidding and may have lead you to avoid this crap he sold.
Glad to see you have a mostly positive resolution in the works.

Link Posted: 3/17/2009 4:38:22 AM EDT
Originally Posted By screen-name:
he knew it was shit ammo...why you think he put it on GB.

need to start watching what you buy. theres ALOT of sharks out there taking advantage of the buying frenzy, you just got had by one of them


I wouldn't call this guy a shark. He sounds more like an idiot.
Link Posted: 3/17/2009 5:20:30 AM EDT
Damn, $200 for 500rds of .223 ammo?!?!?!?!

Take that $200 refund, and go buy a Lee Anniversary Reloading kit, buy another reloading manual in addition to what comes with the Lee kit and read up on reloading. 80% of what you need to get started here for $130

Then beg, borrow, or shanghai some small rifle primers, worst case they will cost $4-5 per 100, buy as much as you can afford to. Gunshows are good places to find them when online/local places are out...not the best prices, but they have them.

Pick up a few pounds of H335, its the same powder as used in M193 and M855 ball ammo. Look for it to cost about $20 per pound out the door. 1lb should get you at least 200rds of loaded ammo. It is cheaper to buy it in bulk in 5lb jugs, but that may not be possible with todays buy it now climate of panic buying...

Check out midway for 55gr Dogtown bullets or Hornady 55gr bullets. I recommend 55gr bullets to start with as their is alot of reloading data out there and its a very forgiving bullet weight in .223 reloads. Pick up Lee .223 dies at Midway as well, in stock for $14.50 at midway for lee .223 dies

Digital calipers cost under $20 at Harbor Freight or even Lowes/Home Depot.


Link Posted: 3/17/2009 1:15:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/17/2009 1:16:10 PM EDT by TMB9862]
Actually I have a Lee Anniversary Kit. In fact I have six of them all new in the box and a pile of small pistol primers. I was going to toss five of the presses up on eBay considering they seem to be selling for about $50 more then Midway is selling them for. That money was to pay for the rest of the stuff I need to get set up re-loading. I actually bought this ammo because I thought I was getting 500 rounds of Remington .223 which once shot I could re-load. Turns out I was wrong on that one but yes, I will be buying re-loading gear. Now to try and find small rifle primers.
Link Posted: 3/17/2009 7:25:05 PM EDT
TMB9862 Sent you and Im about reloading hope it helps

Pretty Much the only problem Im running into is finding .223 Brass everything else seems to be ok to find
Link Posted: 3/18/2009 2:45:22 AM EDT
Originally Posted By TMB9862:
I suppose this is just a rant more then anything.


http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=123470232

I will take responsibility for the first part. I was under the impression that these were of Remington manufacture. I suppose that is not directly stated but it could have been worded better. Now I got the box to find they are a mix of re-loads and a handful of older military surplus. Mostly IMI head stamps with a few random ones mixed in there. They defiantly do not all have the head stamp he describes, about 50 of them are different. Some of them are dented to the point they are un-usable.

Now my biggest concern. One of the cartriges (and I've only checked 50 so far) is not .223. It is stamped .223 on the side just like the rest of them. It is really a .222 round reloaded with the same bullet the guy used on the .223. This leads me to believe that whoever loaded them had no idea what they were doing and that these were made in someones basement, not by a company that reloads as a buisness. Honestly I'm a little afraid to fire them, I have no idea how much powder is in them, if the cases were sized properly, how many times they have been reloaded, etc. What would happen had I tried to put that .222 through my AR or Mini-14?

I just sent them an e-mail expressing my dissatisfaction and will see what they say.

End rant.


You were lucky this time. I would not buy ammo from anyone with a low feedback. Live and learn

Link Posted: 3/18/2009 5:05:33 AM EDT
gunbroker is a fool's paradise. It's a gathering of all the nation's unscrupulous gun dealers and gun show SEALs. Be wary.

There were numerous red flags in that auction. If you see one red flag, you shouldn't attempt to go through with the deal.
Link Posted: 3/18/2009 3:26:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/18/2009 3:28:01 PM EDT by TMB9862]
I just sent him this e-mail.

Yeah, it's defiantly not Remington brand ammo. The caliber is .223 Remington but it's made by a different company. I went through it and their are about 40 miscellaneous military surplus rounds that are probably ok to shoot. Their are a few .223 rounds that are badly dented, 2 .222 rounds stamped .223, a round that the bullet fell into because it wasn't seated right, a couple .30 carbine rounds with no primer, a.30-06 round with the primer half way out of it, and some other round that I don't know what it is. It's obviously reloaded and whoever did it did not really know what they are doing. As such it is unsafe to fire save those 40 or so surplus rounds.
I would like to ship it back to you for a refund. I take it I get to eat the shipping cost both ways? Please give me your address and I'll get it in the mail.



Here is the reply

I just got this e-mail from him.

Hi,
It sound a total mess. I have no need for the ammo, If you would destroy the ammo and I will send your money back in a few days when I get back home.
Jimmy



I'm not sure if that means he is going to refund the cost of shipping as well but I if he does actually send me a refund I can deal with coughing up $20 for a lesson on buying off Gunbroker. I feel bad destroying it if it is somehow usable. Is the primed brass and hollow point bullets usable again once pulled? They are mostly IMI head stamps. Or should they be considered junk not knowing the history of them? I'm just thinking if the stuff is usable I'll offer to give him something for them. I can't in good conscious tell him I'm going to destroy it then go use the casings/bullets. This is assuming I actually do get a refund from the guy.
Link Posted: 3/18/2009 8:31:19 PM EDT
the bullets and the primed cases are primo for reloaders. keep them, dump the powder, and sell them.
Link Posted: 3/19/2009 1:03:55 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/19/2009 1:05:05 AM EDT by fp1201]
IF he does make good on refunding your money it would be fair to pay him the value of the components should you salvage the ammo.
Since you have a press; RCBS makes a good collet type bullet puller and if you reload, you should have one. The kinetic pullers (hammer type) work fairly well, but I feel their use is better served with handgun ammo.
Put those extra press kits on the EE, it's a far better place to deal than flea-bay.
Link Posted: 3/28/2009 8:15:04 AM EDT
Well he says a check is going out on Mondays mail, so it sounds like it is going to make it here. He has good feedback on Gunbroker so my hopes are high that I will get a refund.

So what would a fair price to offer him for me keeping the ammo vs. destroying it? Keep in mind that the brass is of unknown origin, is it once fired, or six time fired, I don't know. I also have to spend presumably a couple hours pulling all the bullets and now I have a pound or so of useless powder since I don't know what it is. What do I do with the powder, can I just saturate it and toss it in the woods/throw it out? I'm thinking not a whole lot.
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