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9/17/2020 5:59:48 PM
Posted: 9/5/2008 3:09:39 PM EDT
 A guy in CA wants me to ship him a pistol. I want to take it to my FFL to ship because now that is cheaper than UPS Next Day. I am afraid my FFL will balk when I tell him the address is CA.
 The guy in CA says it is still a transfer and I believe him, but where can I find the regs in print to show my FFL if he bucks up on me?
Link Posted: 9/5/2008 3:39:21 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/5/2008 3:44:56 PM EDT
I thought I heard about a recent change that only FFLs who jumped through some kind of state level hoop could ship to CA
Link Posted: 9/5/2008 4:30:11 PM EDT
Link Posted: 9/5/2008 5:45:15 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Paul:
Every year the federal government mails every FFL the current regulations. Have him look under C for California.

I thought FEDERAL law was FFL to FFL only on pistols - that's not a state law.

Actually, it doesn't have to come from an FFL for an in state FFL to accept a pistol.  Many prefer it, but not required.
Link Posted: 9/5/2008 6:04:58 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/5/2008 6:06:18 PM EDT by Rustygun]

Originally Posted By Paul:

Originally Posted By Rustygun:
I thought I heard about a recent change that only FFLs who jumped through some kind of state level hoop could ship to CA


Ah yes - they need a number from the state.


As of January 1, 2008, both in-state and out of state Federal Firearms License (FFL) holders will be required to obtain approval (e.g., a unique verification number) from the California Department of Justice prior to shipping firearms to any California FFL (Penal Code §§ 12072).


 The way that reads it means "ships" period whether it's a transfer from an individual in another state through an out of state FFL or whether it is a gun on an out of state FFL's book that belongs to that out of state FFL.
 I don't want to ship this gun to CA and then have a cluster when it gets there.
Link Posted: 9/5/2008 7:56:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 9/5/2008 8:04:23 PM EDT by bwiese]

Originally Posted By Rustygun:
A guy in CA wants me to ship him a pistol. I want to take it to my FFL to ship because now that is cheaper than UPS Next Day.  I am afraid my FFL will balk when I tell him the address is CA.
The guy in CA says it is still a transfer and I believe him, but where can I find the regs in print to show my FFL if he bucks up on me?


OK, lotta issues here.   (I will not address any C&R FFL stuff here.)

"A guy in CA" wants you to ship a pisto to him?
He's not an FFL, and there's no CA FFL in the middle of the deal?  
NOOOOOOO!

He better be an FFL to receive a gun across a state line, that's wholly aside from any separate Californai issues.  If he's not an FFL, he needs to get a CA FFL to handle his deal (more about this later).  FROM YOUR DESCRIPTION, THIS GUY IS ASKING YOU TO JOIN HIM COMMITTING A CRIME.   He's probably just stupid, and not trying to work off felonies with the ATF/US Attorney or doing work for Bradys trying to get bad press for gunnies.

Don't ship to that address unless it's a valid FFL location per BATF E-Z-Chek website. (!)

And, for your FFL to ship to a CA FFL, your FFL will have to sign up for the CA DOJ CFLC program (Calif. Firearms License Check) - or the CA destination FFL can't accept the gun.   It's a buncha BS, but it's easy to comply with - takes about 3 min to enter data on the website for the first time,  30 sec for subsequent transactions. Details are at  www.caag.state.ca.us/firearms/cflcoverview.php   Very simple stuff actually.

However, a non-FFL (which seems to be you) can indeed directly ship to a willing CA FFL without any CFLC issues; CFLC covers only for FFL->CA FFL, and does not deal with private parties shipping guns to CA FFLs.  

Also, if it's a pistol or DA revolver, it needs to be on the Roster of Handguns Approved for Sale in CA (drop tested, etc.)  Dimensionally-compliant single-shot pistols & single-action revolvers of a certain size are exempt from Rostering concerns, as are C&R guns/those over 50 years old, by 12133PC.

Please feel free to ask questions, glad to help...



Bill Wiese
San Jose CA

Link Posted: 9/5/2008 11:46:59 PM EDT
Even if the handgun is a C&R firearm, it still needs to be sent to a CA 01-FFL dealer.
Link Posted: 9/6/2008 5:38:42 AM EDT

Originally Posted By bwiese:

And, for your FFL to ship to a CA FFL, your FFL will have to sign up for the CA DOJ CFLC program (Calif. Firearms License Check) - or the CA destination FFL can't accept the gun.   It's a buncha BS, but it's easy to comply with - takes about 3 min to enter data on the website for the first time,  30 sec for subsequent transactions. Details are at  www.caag.state.ca.us/firearms/cflcoverview.php   Very simple stuff actually.

However, a non-FFL (which seems to be you) can indeed directly ship to a willing CA FFL without any CFLC issues; CFLC covers only for FFL->CA FFL, and does not deal with private parties shipping guns to CA FFLs.  


 This is what I was getting at. The buyer is providing an FFL to ship to, but I had planned to ship from an FFL here. I am afraid my FFL will balk at shipping to CA, but he may not. I may end up shipping it UPS myself I guess. The buyer made it sound like since this was a transfer my FFL did not need a CFLC but I wanted to be sure. It sounds like he does and even if he doesn't in this transfer instance, it would be better to have one anyway.  I appreciate the info and the link.
Link Posted: 9/6/2008 11:45:03 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Rustygun:
This is what I was getting at. The buyer is providing an FFL to ship to, but I had planned to ship from an FFL here. I am afraid my FFL will balk at shipping to CA, but he may not. I may end up shipping it UPS myself I guess. The buyer made it sound like since this was a transfer my FFL did not need a CFLC but I wanted to be sure. It sounds like he does and even if he doesn't in this transfer instance, it would be better to have one anyway.


Ah OK.  It sounded from your orig post that he wanted to receive the gun directly, without going thru a CA FFL - thanks for clarification.

If your FFL balks, ship it direct to his FFL (some CA FFLs don't accept from non FFLs, but that's their personal choice, it's not a legal requirement).  

Your buyer is flat-out plain wrong that 'since this is a transfer a CFLC is not needed':  any FFL=> a CA FFL sale/transfer/shipment (other than repair/gunsmithing send out & return) requires the CFLC dance.   The language of CFLC laws allows individuals to ship to an FFL without CFLC dance.

Good luck, feel free to ask more questions if you have 'em...


Bill Wiese
San Jose CA
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