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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 7/22/2005 7:02:46 AM EDT
Dumb question, but wanted to clarify things before a friend makes a potential mistake.

A friend of mine recently got back in touch with his estranged father.

The father has willed his gun collection (about 12-15 rifles and handguns) to my friend. The father also knows that other family members aren't very scrupulous, so he's asked my friend to take the firearms off his hands now.

My friend lives here in Oregon, his father, in Arizona.

As these are a "gift", and being passed from father to son, is there any issue with my friend driving down to Arizona and picking these up?

Or, does he have to go through the entire process of packing them up, shipping them to an FFL in the state, and then paying the transfer fee and filling out the paperwork?

Any reference to federal law you could provide would be most appreciated.

Thank you!
Link Posted: 7/22/2005 11:40:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 7/22/2005 11:47:36 AM EDT by Ellery_Holt]
My F-I-L is in WA, and he's given me firearms. He's in his 70s, and he learned what is right and what is wrong back before this country became a nanny state.

Others may be more indoctrinated into the current idea of 'good citizen,' and so may feel a programmed urge to comply with the legal restrictions. Or they may be free from pc indoctrination but may fear what the government may do to them if (or when) they get caught.

ETA: Be sure they have documented appraisals done too, so the correct estate taxes can be paid.



YOMV (Your Obedience May Vary)




Link Posted: 7/22/2005 2:34:25 PM EDT
Yeah, I agree that there shouldn't be an issue with it, and we should just get them and drive home.

The problem is, we have zero interest in driving Oregon-California-Arizona or, even, Oregon-Idaho-Utah-Arizona, with the remote chance that we might be stopped and searched, and then have to deal with all of those issues.

Link Posted: 7/22/2005 2:50:15 PM EDT
iim going to to be moving from calif to oregon next year what do i need to know about bringing my guns into your state? what type of background checks does your state do?



There are NO background checks for guns you already own. You can bring any conventional gun into Oregon with no hassle and no paperwork. (If you own machine guns please contact us for more info.)

If you buy a gun from a federally licensed dealer, there will be the standard federal background check done through the police state police. The police state police will keep a record of your purchase as long as they can. Oregon law says they can keep the info for 5 years. (If you think they'll destroy the info after 5 years we have bridge we'd like to sell you.)

If you buy a gun at a gun show, the geniuses who vote in Oregon have decided that you must also pass a background check even if you are buying from a private collector. Of course, nothing prevents you from finding a gun you want to buy from a collector at a gun show and making the actual purchase across the street at McDonalds. Oregon gun laws were written by and for idiots.

Welcome to our state.


========================================================================

So, the short answer is. When you travel to Arizona, you do a FTF sale by the laws of that state. Then, you are the legal owner of that weapon with no FFL/background checks (as provided by AZ law). Make him give you a receipt showing the sale or gift of the guns.

Drive home.

Now, while this is legal, some other advice if you get stopped for speeding, etc.

1) Keep the guns covered and out of sight (but not loaded). The officer has no right to search your car unless suspicious.
2) If you have a carry permit, take it out of your wallet. Seeing that prompts, "DO you have any weapons in the vehicle". Do not lie to the office.
3) Unless asked, make no mention of the guns in the back.

If you do have to show the weapons, make sure that they are unloaded. Make sure you have a "bill of sale" for each of the guns with contact info. Print it out to make it look professional. If asked, explain what you just said here. Your FIL is giving these to you before they go in the will or something or other....

Quite honestly, for a simple traffic stop, you should have no problem. The office will never know they are there and should have no reason to be suspicious.
Link Posted: 7/22/2005 6:37:59 PM EDT
See, but Oregon law requires you be a citizen of Oregon to do an FTF sale - or so I've been lead to believe.

These aren't a sale, so I dunno...
Link Posted: 7/23/2005 3:00:03 AM EDT

Originally Posted By kythri:
See, but Oregon law requires you be a citizen of Oregon to do an FTF sale - or so I've been lead to believe.

These aren't a sale, so I dunno...


thats bs someone fed you a line of shit
thats only for handguns and i dont think its state law
dont worrie about it tho these are all laws about ownership
your friends dad still owns them till he dies posetion has vary little to do with it

btw id stay away from cali if i was you
Link Posted: 7/23/2005 7:34:28 AM EDT
OK, how about this:


(B2) From whom may an unlicensed person acquire a firearm under the
GCA?

A person may only buy a firearm within his own State except that he may buy a rifle or shotgun, in person, at a licensee's premises in any State, provided the sale complies with State laws applicable in the State of sale and the State where the purchaser resides.

[18 U.S.C 922(a)(3) and (5), 922(b)(3), 27 CFR 178.29]



www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/faq2.htm#b2

So, what that says to me is, I can buy it from anyone in my state, but only from a licensee in another state...

Oy vey.

We'll, we'll see if the ATF answers their phone on Monday.

Link Posted: 7/23/2005 9:06:50 AM EDT
Just as a CYA measure, follow the advice of having a bill of sale for each weapon. Make sure the Bill lists his name, your name, the date, the serial number of the weapon and his and your address. You might want to hold onto them in your gunsafe to help out in any fights about the will if he passes away. Shitty way to have to htink of things I know, but I've seen it happen. Then, don't drive through california and go through nevada instead coming into oregon through mcdermitt or....ummmm...that other town along the nevada border that I can't think of the name of. That puts you down by the Steens mountain area and you never had to even poke a finger at cali.
Link Posted: 7/23/2005 9:49:06 AM EDT
The route that's being taken will probably end up being Hwy 20 to Idaho, hitting up to I-84, and taking that down to Utah/Arizona.

Oregon has CHL reciprocity with Idaho, Utah and Arizona - they don't with Califorina and Nevada, so, this route would allow CHL the entire duration of the trip.
Link Posted: 7/26/2005 12:45:39 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/20/2005 3:18:36 PM EDT by Hoppy]
Like I said in another thread, legally you have to do the FFL transfer if ownership is being transferred from one person to another and each is a resident of different states. In reality, if Dad wants to give junior a rifle then junior just says "Thanks" and puts it in the trunk for the trip home.

Even if you were stopped and the rifles discovered it's a non-issue unless the rifles come back stolen. I never carry bills of sale for my rifles when I'm transporting them from one place to another.

"I was visiting my Dad, we were doing a little target shooting, I'm on my way home."
Link Posted: 7/28/2005 12:06:14 AM EDT
Fuck 'em. You'll be fine. If you call any LE, they'll probably tell you, "Yes, we need the serial numbers and your name. This will prevent crime, and make all the worlds' pussies feel safer." Or something to that effect. The worst mistake your friend could make is taking valuable family heirloom weaponry and putting it into the regis- I mean confis- I mean FFL/background check record system.
Link Posted: 7/28/2005 11:47:44 AM EDT
Not a lawyer but have a question. Couldn't you just say the guns are his? Given there is no registry, how would some cop on a traffic stop know the difference? Besides, it is true that the guns are his.
Link Posted: 7/31/2005 3:17:44 PM EDT
STAY OUT OF CALIFORNIA!!!
Link Posted: 7/31/2005 3:23:19 PM EDT
Meh, I avoid California like the plague, regardless of the reason.

Been there 4 times, and it sucked each and every time.

Sacramento, San Jose, Los Angeles, San Diego...nothing at all redeeming about that state.
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 9:06:16 PM EDT
Question: It seems the ATF laws presented here pertain to long guns. Does anyone know if the law prohibits purchasing/obtaining a handgun in State A while carrying a driver's license from State B?
Link Posted: 8/9/2005 10:29:58 PM EDT

Originally Posted By killerk:
Question: It seems the ATF laws presented here pertain to long guns. Does anyone know if the law prohibits purchasing/obtaining a handgun in State A while carrying a driver's license from State B?




They would not let me purchase a 10/22 for my birthday here in Oregon while I still had my Texas drivers license. The wife was with me so she said she'd buy it as she had an Oregon license. No deal says the guy at GI Joes as she would probably be purchasing it for me. No shit genius, weren't you part of the conversation we were having about it being a birthday gift?

Went to another GI Joes down the street and she bought it there.

As far as I know you cannot buy a handgun in a state you don't reside in.
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 3:35:30 AM EDT
What would the difference be between these and having something you bought FTF? Don't speed, cruise control has saved me a mint, and don't consent to search. If they aren't reported as stolen, there is no "registered owner" anyway. Depending on how long he has had them, there is most likely no record of the sale anymore.
YOMV
Link Posted: 8/10/2005 7:13:11 AM EDT

Originally Posted By kythri:
The route that's being taken will probably end up being Hwy 20 to Idaho, hitting up to I-84, and taking that down to Utah/Arizona.

Oregon has CHL reciprocity with Idaho, Utah and Arizona Idaho, Utah, and Arizona honor Oregon CHL's even though Oregon won't return the favor. - they don't with Califorina and Nevada, so, this route would allow CHL the entire duration of the trip.



Minor point of order.

"Those are my guns officer." Joe Smoe LEO shouldn't be a problem, but I wouln't be doing 90 on my way home either.
Link Posted: 8/20/2005 12:38:41 PM EDT
Put the guns in trunk of the car and drive home. Stay within the speed limit.

It's nice that he got back in touch with his father, especially since his dad gave him all those guns before he moved out of state. Now maybe his estranged father can see them again someday.
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