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Posted: 10/3/2003 5:32:20 PM EDT
I was wonderin if any of you guy has a extra pre ban lower for an ar layin around. I would prefer it to be decently priced. I saw lowers for sale in the equipment exchange for arund 1000.00 There is no way I would pay that. I would rather chance having a collaspable stock on a post ban. If i can get one for a nice price, i plan to get a tax stamp for it so i dont need to bump fire it.

I am looking for a stripped lower for as low as you are willing to sell it. email me if you have one, and i will make the deal at this months DBS.
Link Posted: 10/3/2003 6:27:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/3/2003 6:27:47 PM EDT by Gunbert]
Save your money and send letters to your congressman. You'll be hard pressed to find a decent preban lower for less than $1000, even stripped. All you can do is help make the stupid assault weapon ban go away so that this time next year all weapons will be prebans and you can get all the evil features you want for the same price you'd pay for a postban.
Link Posted: 10/3/2003 8:51:37 PM EDT
Link Posted: 10/3/2003 9:19:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bigedmond:
IIf i can get one for a nice price, i plan to get a tax stamp for it so i dont need to bump fire it.



I think the "preban" lower you are talking about is the pre-1986 one. Those prebans are going for $8-10,000 dollars!!

If you are thinking pre-ban = full auto, you are mistaken. Stripped lowers can be had these days for as low as $89. Save your money and build a post-ban....you can trick it out all you want next September.


Link Posted: 10/3/2003 9:54:49 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/3/2003 9:55:16 PM EDT by Wolfpack]

Originally Posted By Bigedmond:
I would rather chance having a collaspable stock on a post ban.



No you wouldn't.

Quantico Arms is selling Eagle Arms post ban lowers for $89 in the EE right now.
Link Posted: 10/3/2003 11:01:37 PM EDT
I know that i would have to get the sears block removed to make it full auto. I honestly dont see th bad going away. But i dont see it getting worse either. I honestly think they are gonna keep it the same as it is now.

The reasoning wy is, there are alot of people that have no idea what the ban even entails. They hear assualt weapons ban, and think, good they are baning assault weapons. Not knowing that the ban is for certain items on the weapon. Then there are the people that want to get rid of the ban. I dont think we have the number of people we want. I have written to my representatives, signed ever patition against the ban i can find.

I hate the idea of making collapsable stocks illegal. Thats one of the main reasons i want a preban lower, because I dont like the fixed stoc that much. oh well, just have to order a lower next week. Now if i can find a nice 20 ffl transfer
Link Posted: 10/3/2003 11:45:20 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Bigedmond:
I know that i would have to get the sears block removed to make it full auto.




Ok, you are thinking of newer Colt lowers... they put the sear block in. Most other manufacturers don't do this. Please, don't even think of making a machinegun, unless you want the ATF to torch your house (with you in it), or at the very least send you to club Fed for 10 years.



I honestly dont see th bad going away. But i dont see it getting worse either. I honestly think they are gonna keep it the same as it is now.


Make no mistake, the ban will sunset next year... it's written right into the law. What we are fighting is a replacement law that would be even more prohibitive. Luckily it's easier to just let it fade away than to repeal
it.


I have written to my representatives, signed ever patition against the ban i can find.



Write again. And again next month. Et cetera.



I hate the idea of making collapsable stocks illegal.



Yeah, it's a stupid law.



Now if i can find a nice $20 ffl transfer


Try Discount Firearms on Boulder highway, last I heard they do them for $20... but only deal with Mike or Anna, the owners, some of the other guys there can be assholes.
Link Posted: 10/4/2003 6:47:06 AM EDT
Bigedmond, I think your confusing the 1986 Machine Gun Ban with the 1994 Assualt Weapon Ban. Ronald Reagan signed the 1986 ban and it makes it impossible for civilians to own any more full-auto machine guns then were alrealy out there in 1986, those are transferable but no new ones can be produced since 1986. If I'm not mistaken there are about 250,000 transferables out there. The 1994 AWB has nothing to do with full-auto, it only has to do with bayo lugs, collapsible stocks and flash suppressors.


Link Posted: 10/4/2003 9:56:33 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Wolfpack:
If I'm not mistaken there are about 250,000 transferables out there.




I think there are a lot more than that out there.
Link Posted: 10/4/2003 10:40:39 AM EDT
Ok, But i thought if you paid your 200 bucks, with finger prints and letter signed by the sheriff you could get the tax stamp from the ATF. That way, when you send in a serial number, that serial number can become a full auto???

Thats how I thought it worked.

ANd i wont make it full auto if its against the law. Im young, but not stupid.
Link Posted: 10/4/2003 10:48:39 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Bigedmond:
Ok, But i thought if you paid your 200 bucks, with finger prints and letter signed by the sheriff you could get the tax stamp from the ATF. That way, when you send in a serial number, that serial number can become a full auto???

Thats how I thought it worked.

ANd i wont make it full auto if its against the law. Im young, but not stupid.



Suppressors can still be newly manufactured and transfered but not full-auto weapons, what was made before the '86 ban is all there ever will be.
Link Posted: 10/4/2003 10:55:10 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Bigedmond:
Ok, But i thought if you paid your 200 bucks, with finger prints and letter signed by the sheriff you could get the tax stamp from the ATF. That way, when you send in a serial number, that serial number can become a full auto??? Thats how I thought it worked.



Alas, if it were that easy people would not be paying upwards of $5000 for an UZI or $15,000 for an MP5 or $7000 for an AK you could build for $200 worth of parts. Sorry Edmond, we missed the boat on that party. You are young, you have an excuse. Us 40ish year old guys are just stupid!

Link Posted: 10/4/2003 11:44:30 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Bigedmond:
Ok, But i thought if you paid your 200 bucks, with finger prints and letter signed by the sheriff you could get the tax stamp from the ATF. That way, when you send in a serial number, that serial number can become a full auto???

Thats how I thought it worked.

ANd i wont make it full auto if its against the law. Im young, but not stupid.





That would work for something like a short barrelled rifle or shotgun. Machineguns are different, they cannot be made by anyone but a class 2 manufacturer, and those can only be posessed by a government or law enforcement agency. Larry from the DBS is a C2, so he can make and posess new machineguns but he can't sell them to civilians.

Like Wolfpack said, when the '86 machinegun ban went into effect it stopped the production of new full auto guns, and made the ones already out there increase in value. For example, Colt M-16's are currently selling for around $10,000, give or take a grand, and the prices will only continue to increase.
You have 3 options to get into full auto fun:

1) Join the Army. They don't let you spray and pray for fun, but they have the best toys and unlimited ammo.
2) Buy into an NFA registered weapon. Sell your car and work a years worth of overtime to pay for it, but it's worth it, and you won't lose money. It's not a bad investment.
3)Become a Class 2 manufacturer. I have no idea how to do this, but it can be done. I think you still need a lot of money to it, but then you can make, buy and trade anything.
Link Posted: 10/4/2003 11:49:49 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Gunbert:

Originally Posted By Wolfpack:
If I'm not mistaken there are about 250,000 transferables out there.




I think there are a lot more than that out there.



I heard that number being tossed around on FA.com...I wasn't sure, anyone know?
Link Posted: 10/4/2003 2:04:38 PM EDT
250,000 is pretty close.
www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/pdf/guic.pdf
It's on the fourth page, first paragraph.


Under the provisions of the National
Firearms Act, all automatic weapons
such as machine guns must be registered
with the ATF. In 1995, over
240,000 automatic weapons were
registered with the ATF. As of March
1995, the NCIC stolen gun file contained
reports on about 7,700 machine
guns and submachine guns.

Link Posted: 10/4/2003 3:23:48 PM EDT


I don't care! I'm not listening!
Link Posted: 10/4/2003 3:44:52 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Gunbert:


I don't care! I'm not a hetrosexual!



Link Posted: 10/6/2003 1:10:02 PM EDT
To add more confusion to the fray:

my understanding is that even if you get the SBR stamp, you still cannot add the 'evil' features to the weapon (bayo lug, FS, collapsible, 'nade launcher, in addition to pistol grip and magwell), as it is still a semiauto rifle. you're stuck with crowned or MB'ed muzzles, and fixed stocks.
Link Posted: 10/6/2003 1:50:04 PM EDT

Originally Posted By chiz45:
To add more confusion to the fray:

my understanding is that even if you get the SBR stamp, you still cannot add the 'evil' features to the weapon (bayo lug, FS, collapsible, 'nade launcher, in addition to pistol grip and magwell), as it is still a semiauto rifle. you're stuck with crowned or MB'ed muzzles, and fixed stocks.



You are correct....at least until 9/14/04


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