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Posted: 7/3/2013 9:46:27 PM EST

http://online.wsj.com/article/AP6a31668e08f74b55abe1563993bcb907.html


On college campuses across the United States, the eternal optimism of youth has been throttled out by a fear of crushing student debt. That's certainly the case in Oregon, where the cost of tuition has soared as public funding for higher education has declined.



Link Posted: 7/4/2013 9:49:48 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/4/2013 9:53:46 AM EST by haLfLiFe]
Link Posted: 7/5/2013 11:35:23 AM EST
This is all nice and good feeling, but when the tuition costs 75,000 USD and the 25 yr repayment from the kid's future earnings only nets $18,000 as the example given for $600,000 Adj Gross Income, who is going to pick up the tab for the difference of $57,000??

The state will and the state will go bankrupt just like California
Link Posted: 7/6/2013 6:18:37 AM EST
stupid idea unless they limit which schools and which degrees

there are alot of bogus colleges in oregon with bogus degrees.

How much do you think a major in dance, western lit, history, art history, etc will make

they should only offer this in the top 5 colleges in oregon and only in degrees with a greater than 80% chance of finding a job in that field after graduation and they make at the least $80,000/year after 5 years of work.
Link Posted: 7/6/2013 8:17:22 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/6/2013 8:21:58 AM EST by haLfLiFe]
Link Posted: 7/6/2013 1:51:16 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/6/2013 1:52:34 PM EST by mpmax]
Anybody besides me with a 4 year degree that has never been used? Looking back, I would have come out ahead focusing on a career and skipping college. It was good for drinking and sex, though.
College is a waste of money for the majority of graduates.......An OPINION.
Link Posted: 7/6/2013 3:37:11 PM EST
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
Originally Posted By ronin556:
stupid idea unless they limit which schools and which degrees

Only in degrees with a greater than 80% chance of finding a job in that field after graduation and they make at the least $80,000/year after 5 years of work.


Well, that would be one small % of folks who graduate. Good luck finding anywhere near 80% chance of finding a job in the field in which you studied after graduation before our current president or after.

To limit it to folks who make $80k a year is also a small portion of whom walk out with a degree. This should be aimed at helping most everyone and not specifically for just those landing jobs above poverty level wages. Think about the teachers who instruct your children; on average if teaching below college level do you think they make anywhere near $80K Tell me how this would help folks in this field and educating the next generation that runs our country

It took me 3 years after graduating PSU w/ an Administration of Justice degree to land a job as a Parole/Probation Officer. Even after I top out in this position I would only be at $69k year. Your philosophy would place me out of the equation, so tell me how this would help someone in my position



He's an elitist. $80k a year is still poverty level to him when he pretends on the internet.

His only valid point was limiting this service to certain fields. Arts majors are pretty much worthless.
Link Posted: 7/6/2013 5:36:43 PM EST
No such thing as a "free lunch" for anyone. Free just means that someone else is paying for it.
Link Posted: 7/6/2013 6:39:29 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/7/2013 2:31:34 AM EST
How bout offering interest free student loans? The state won't go backrupt, schools still get their absurd tuition, and students may actually be able to pay back their loans without defaulting.
Link Posted: 7/7/2013 5:26:14 AM EST
Link Posted: 7/7/2013 8:16:46 AM EST
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
Originally Posted By Danielisright:
No such thing as a "free lunch" for anyone. Free just means that someone else is paying for it.


I completely agree with this, but 6.8% interest is absurd and the government should be ashamed of themselves with the amount of debt they are putting college grads in
.

Something has to change because we have gone from around 3% in 2002 to 6.8% from 2010 to current date. If this cycle continues who in the hell can afford to even think of registering for classes unless you are already wealthy upon enrolling.


Its called not getting it if you can't afford it. Government isn't forcing anyone to attend. It is people that have this fantasy notion of what college will do. An increase in rates will hopefully prevent people from getting in debt who shouldn't be in the first place.
Link Posted: 7/7/2013 12:09:53 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/7/2013 12:14:22 PM EST by haLfLiFe]
Link Posted: 7/8/2013 2:17:43 PM EST
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
Originally Posted By Chromekilla:
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
Originally Posted By Danielisright:
No such thing as a "free lunch" for anyone. Free just means that someone else is paying for it.


I completely agree with this, but 6.8% interest is absurd and the government should be ashamed of themselves with the amount of debt they are putting college grads in
.

Something has to change because we have gone from around 3% in 2002 to 6.8% from 2010 to current date. If this cycle continues who in the hell can afford to even think of registering for classes unless you are already wealthy upon enrolling.


Its called not getting it if you can't afford it. Government isn't forcing anyone to attend. It is people that have this fantasy notion of what college will do. An increase in rates will hopefully prevent people from getting in debt who shouldn't be in the first place.


Sure the government is not forcing us to attend, but a college degree is the new HS diploma. Without it what type of half way decent paying job is one to expect

I can afford my loans pre poverty level wage and now, so I don't want you to think I am a dead beat who can't repay what I borrowed. Truly what are folks to do when they want to be able to provide for their children by enhancing their education and acquiring a better paying job Not everyone is born into money and watching it burn a hole in their pocket. Surly the answer is not to settle for a HS diploma and for a high paying job that is not going to happen.

I am not sure what times you grew up in as a child, but without a college education in 2013 you will be lucky to acquire a poverty/slightly above poverty level wage job at best. If this is what you hope for your fellow citizen then I ask what do you want for your own children who may be running the country one day Your statement to me means only the wealthy will be able to get good paying jobs and be the leaders of our country, that is truly sad and not looking out for your fellow American but for those whom fall into the class you associate with


The rail road for one. Energy companies for two. There are many good jobs available that don't require a degree. They just require hard work and dedication something that many people are not willing to give. A college degree is not a ticket to success.

If a kid wants nothing more than to attend college they can work their ass of in high school and get almost all of their college paid for with merit scholarships.



For the last statement it is neither my job or the governments job to lookout for the welfare of anyone.

I'm not going to get into my life story, but suffice to say I didn't grow up rich and the only way I got to where I am is through hard work, dedication, sacrifice and luck.
Link Posted: 7/8/2013 3:34:31 PM EST
Originally Posted By Chromekilla:
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
Originally Posted By Chromekilla:
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
Originally Posted By Danielisright:
No such thing as a "free lunch" for anyone. Free just means that someone else is paying for it.


I completely agree with this, but 6.8% interest is absurd and the government should be ashamed of themselves with the amount of debt they are putting college grads in
.

Something has to change because we have gone from around 3% in 2002 to 6.8% from 2010 to current date. If this cycle continues who in the hell can afford to even think of registering for classes unless you are already wealthy upon enrolling.


Its called not getting it if you can't afford it. Government isn't forcing anyone to attend. It is people that have this fantasy notion of what college will do. An increase in rates will hopefully prevent people from getting in debt who shouldn't be in the first place.


Sure the government is not forcing us to attend, but a college degree is the new HS diploma. Without it what type of half way decent paying job is one to expect

I can afford my loans pre poverty level wage and now, so I don't want you to think I am a dead beat who can't repay what I borrowed. Truly what are folks to do when they want to be able to provide for their children by enhancing their education and acquiring a better paying job Not everyone is born into money and watching it burn a hole in their pocket. Surly the answer is not to settle for a HS diploma and for a high paying job that is not going to happen.

I am not sure what times you grew up in as a child, but without a college education in 2013 you will be lucky to acquire a poverty/slightly above poverty level wage job at best. If this is what you hope for your fellow citizen then I ask what do you want for your own children who may be running the country one day Your statement to me means only the wealthy will be able to get good paying jobs and be the leaders of our country, that is truly sad and not looking out for your fellow American but for those whom fall into the class you associate with


The rail road for one. Energy companies for two. There are many good jobs available that don't require a degree. They just require hard work and dedication something that many people are not willing to give. A college degree is not a ticket to success.

If a kid wants nothing more than to attend college they can work their ass of in high school and get almost all of their college paid for with merit scholarships.



For the last statement it is neither my job or the governments job to lookout for the welfare of anyone.

I'm not going to get into my life story, but suffice to say I didn't grow up rich and the only way I got to where I am is through hard work, dedication, sacrifice and luck.


There are places in which hard work will suffice, but they are few and far between. A degree increases your options by quite a bit.
Link Posted: 7/8/2013 3:43:54 PM EST
Originally Posted By smithc6:
There are places in which hard work will suffice, but they are few and far between. A degree increases your options by quite a bit.


I don't disagree, but it is not required and no way in heck should the public be required to fund it and that is exactly what will happen here.

Link Posted: 7/8/2013 6:02:15 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/8/2013 6:04:42 PM EST by haLfLiFe]
Link Posted: 7/8/2013 6:13:00 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/8/2013 6:16:54 PM EST
Link Posted: 7/8/2013 7:41:51 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/8/2013 7:42:43 PM EST by OSUBeaver]
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:


You cannot expect everyone who attends high school to work their ass off to get their college paid for since this accounts for an extremely small % of students; this is why they are called teenagers because they don't have mature minds to put the picture together like you are explaining. Not everyone in high school is thinking about what job they want to work for the rest of their life and gain college credits in this area. Just because you settled for your position in life does not mean others should sacrifice their future college education and think like you.



I think what you will find in the big nasty world is that people who make a good living for themselves bust their ass from day one regardless of if they went to college or not. It's a mindset and drive more than anything.

And as far as sacrificing college education, I think that is BS. Not everybody needs, wants, or should to go to college. I know a fair amount of people that make good-to stupid-good money without a college education. Again the common theme is they bust, or have busted their ass along the way. I really can't think of anybody I know that makes good money solely because they have a degree. It doesn't work like that.
Link Posted: 7/8/2013 8:05:31 PM EST
Originally Posted By ncoday:
Originally Posted By smithc6:
There are places in which hard work will suffice, but they are few and far between. A degree increases your options by quite a bit.


I don't disagree, but it is not required and no way in heck should the public be required to fund it and that is exactly what will happen here.



Im not saying they should.
Link Posted: 7/8/2013 8:08:10 PM EST
How about get the government out of the student loan business? Let banks, credit unions, non-profits, etc go and compete for the loan business.
Link Posted: 7/8/2013 8:08:26 PM EST
Originally Posted By OSUBeaver:
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:


You cannot expect everyone who attends high school to work their ass off to get their college paid for since this accounts for an extremely small % of students; this is why they are called teenagers because they don't have mature minds to put the picture together like you are explaining. Not everyone in high school is thinking about what job they want to work for the rest of their life and gain college credits in this area. Just because you settled for your position in life does not mean others should sacrifice their future college education and think like you.



I think what you will find in the big nasty world is that people who make a good living for themselves bust their ass from day one regardless of if they went to college or not. It's a mindset and drive more than anything.

And as far as sacrificing college education, I think that is BS. Not everybody needs, wants, or should to go to college. I know a fair amount of people that make good-to stupid-good money without a college education. Again the common theme is they bust, or have busted their ass along the way. I really can't think of anybody I know that makes good money solely because they have a degree. It doesn't work like that.


Tell that to a Stanford grad.
Link Posted: 7/9/2013 4:46:51 AM EST
Link Posted: 7/9/2013 5:14:33 AM EST
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
Originally Posted By ncoday:
Originally Posted By smithc6:
There are places in which hard work will suffice, but they are few and far between. A degree increases your options by quite a bit.


I don't disagree, but it is not required and no way in heck should the public be required to fund it and that is exactly what will happen here.



I don't think the public should fund their education either, but the government could start by lowering their interests rates on FAFSA loans to make repayment more realistic. To have jumped interest up from 3% in 2002 to 6.8% today is called greed.


6.8% is nothing when you compare it to most other types of loans considering there is no collateral and no credit check done.
Link Posted: 7/9/2013 3:04:11 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/9/2013 3:05:40 PM EST by haLfLiFe]
Link Posted: 7/10/2013 5:11:22 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/10/2013 5:36:21 AM EST by ncoday]
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
Originally Posted By ncoday:
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:
Originally Posted By ncoday:
Originally Posted By smithc6:
There are places in which hard work will suffice, but they are few and far between. A degree increases your options by quite a bit.


I don't disagree, but it is not required and no way in heck should the public be required to fund it and that is exactly what will happen here.



I don't think the public should fund their education either, but the government could start by lowering their interests rates on FAFSA loans to make repayment more realistic. To have jumped interest up from 3% in 2002 to 6.8% today is called greed.


6.8% is nothing when you compare it to most other types of loans considering there is no collateral and no credit check done.


Have you ever had to pay 6.8% on a FAFSA loan Because if you have not then anyone can come on here and say it's cheap. If you pay the minimum balance or close to it if that's all you can afford then you are paying double the loan back over the duration. Sounds fair uh

We know it's not credit card interest rates, and it shouldn't be. The government should not be in business to make money off students getting educations, they should be private loans. When you figure a home loan is cheaper interest than a FAFSA loan then I have every leg to stand on when I say 6.8% is too high.

The theme I am starting to hear from you guys even though you won't say it is that you are pro government.


A home loan is cheaper because there is collateral that they can take away from you if you stop paying. Unsecured loans are more expensive because there is nothing tangible they can take away from you and sell to get their money back if you decide to stop paying.

I am not pro-government. I am pro- taking responsibility for the fact you took out an unsecured loan and what it means to do that. Honestly, I think it is pro-government for people to think the US Government should give out free or low interest, unsecured loans of any type.

And by the way, I have paid interest rates alot higher than 6.8% on an unsecured loan, so don't try to lecture me on that aspect.

ETA - Yes, I know if you make the minimum payment on a 6.8% loan you will likely pay a bit in interest, but that is part of the deal when you take out a loan and make only the minimum payment.
Link Posted: 7/10/2013 5:46:49 PM EST
Originally Posted By haLfLiFe:

I never said everyone needs, wants and should go to college. But, those who choose to have a higher education should have access too it. How do you think anyone who runs this country or is in politics gets there They sure don't do it with just a HS diploma.



And those who choose to have a higher education via loans should think long and hard about if it is likely to pay off or not. It shouldn't be anybody else's problem. If somebody is so sure it will be a means to be NBA rich or whatever, then no problem....sign here. If somebody thinks they want to get an English, history, liberal studies, poly-sci degree, etc. because they love it so much and maybe they can be President of the United States someday they should probably hedge their bet. An example of hedging might be by, oh say, getting a job and working during college. It can be done. I graduated after the 5 year plan with not a single penny owed to anybody. Yes it sucked sometimes. Trying to balance school, work, friends, girlfriend, partying, going to football games, and all that made for some late nights to say the least. Maybe I'm just a cold-hearted asshole. YMMV.



Link Posted: 7/10/2013 6:12:42 PM EST
Colleges themselves should be underwriting tuition and keep the govt [and ultimately, the taxpayer] out of it. It could possibly foster a little competitiveness to lower both interest and tuition costs.
Link Posted: 7/10/2013 6:28:13 PM EST
[Last Edit: 7/10/2013 6:38:43 PM EST by OSUBeaver]
Originally Posted By fxntime:
Colleges themselves should be underwriting tuition and keep the govt [and ultimately, the taxpayer] out of it. It could possibly foster a little competitiveness to lower both interest and tuition costs.


Oh no. We can't have that. It would be way too similar to the private sector Everybody must go to college so they say.....because after all that's what they're selling.

Link Posted: 7/13/2013 6:41:48 AM EST
Link Posted: 7/13/2013 6:47:16 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/13/2013 6:48:12 AM EST by haLfLiFe]
Link Posted: 7/13/2013 6:50:49 AM EST
IMO, one reason tuition is so high is because of easy to get loans that are independent of major or grades or any other measure of potential ROI. The universities are cashing in on this because they know that with easy to get loans they will always have naive students who will fork over hundreds per credit hour for a degree with little practical application.

This is why the .gov needs to get out of the loans business.

PS for some degrees a 6.8% rate should be considered a bargain, given how useless they are.

In before someone with a degree in french lit tells me I shouldn't judge a degree only by its tangible (pay potential and employment) value.
Link Posted: 7/24/2013 10:03:21 PM EST
I have to say as a person that works at a college, far more "students" abuse the system than are using it to get a degree. I admit I work for a Community college, and Universities may hold a slightly different clientele. Thing is I see far more students using college as a form of unemployment. I have talked to people that have been on FASA for near to ten years, and only have a food services associates degree to show for it. I know that people won't believe me or say that it's not the norm, but attendance actually drops by about 20% after the first FASA payout. The lines for the ATM's on those days actually stretch around the building. The ATM's have to be restocked nightly. Even sadder is the lines at Walmart later that day. I thought it was a joke until I ran into students buying a new TV with their FASA.

I remember going to college, I also remember going overseas and having a job to pay for it. I also remember dropping out of college, because it cost to much & the degree I was working on would make $20K less than I make now. I hear students tell me all about how they are owed an education, and cheaper tuition, and more affordable rates, and how they just got a new tattoo, or car, or motorcycle, or are going on a ski trip for winter break. I also remember turning a wrench more days than not, to keep my car running, not going on ski trips, and three guys pooling their cash for a good used TV. College wasn't cheap back then either.

What baffles me is it's no secret about the earning potential of the career they are going for, so why elect for more debt than the job could ever support? I kills me to hearing these kids serving me drinks complaining of the $40K they owe for some degree that they have to explain how it could possibly be used, and how they're are no job openings in that field in this area... The final nail for me is always the graduation rates, UO is heralded as having a great rate at 40ish %. Less than half is a great success rate? Hell most colleges are lucky to claim 20%.

College isn't cheap, its no secret. What you can do with your degree is no secret. The average wage of your chosen career path is no secret.

I quit... I can't keep making this argument, I've done it daily for years, and for some reason, people still think they are owed a degree, a great job, and a wonderful life.

Link Posted: 7/25/2013 5:38:32 AM EST
[Last Edit: 7/25/2013 5:39:11 AM EST by haLfLiFe]
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