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9/22/2017 12:11:25 AM
Posted: 8/15/2005 6:23:05 AM EDT
Lifted from another site:


July 1st, 2005

Retired NYPD MOS who wish to take advantage of H.R. 218 and carry outside the state of New York; Commissioner Ray Kelly has screwed you too!

Regarding retired NYPD MOS and the federal provisions granted under HR 218. As per Commissioner Ray Kelly, the NYPD shall be the only entity who will provide federally recognized firearms training and provide identification of such qualification. For NYPD retirees who wish to possess a firearm, that must be department approved while traveling outside the state, Commissioner Kelly has indicated that only the make, model and caliber that the officer carried while “on-the-job” will be accepted. The department’s Division of Legal Matters shall be the sole arbiter as to whom and which retired MOS shall be able to qualify. It has been indicated that medical retirees will not be able to qualify to carry under H.R. 218, since their medical condition prevented them from serving as a police officer. It has also been indicated that any officer applying for status as “HR 218 qualified NYPD MOS retiree” will have their personnel file reviewed for any debilitating entries that can be utilized in the denial of such an application. The Commissioner has redefined what it means to be a “retired” police officer. He has effectively divided the department in two; those who will be allowed to exercise their federal right and those who will not. The NYS Department of Criminal Justice Services is the sole arbiter regarding the method of instruction and the parameters of the identification card. Firearms Training Section will be the administrator of all such training and the department will be charging several fees for obtaining such a formal designation as a “HR 218 qualified NYPD MOS retiree.” The Commissioner has decided that by doing so, it will eliminate “the corruption of the system,” by outside training entities. Retirees living outside the state will only be recognized as an “HR 218 qualified NYPD MOS retiree” only when they return to Rodman’s Neck and re-qualify. No other state’s training system will be recognized by the NYPD as a valid certification of HR 218 compliance.

Link Posted: 8/15/2005 6:51:42 AM EDT
How the fuck can NY dictate what is legal in another state? Assholes!!!!
Link Posted: 8/15/2005 7:12:45 AM EDT
Gotta love em...... and this is to thier own!
Link Posted: 8/15/2005 7:59:08 AM EDT
There are numerous departments that are refusing to assume the liability or expense for mandated training that is required to comply with H.R. 218. If you are changing Police departments in NYS they will not accept a firearm qualification from another department. Some departments like the NYPD and the NYSP will require a NYS certified PO to complete their department's certification training again in their own academy.
Link Posted: 8/15/2005 8:04:18 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/15/2005 8:12:45 AM EDT by rkbar15]

Originally Posted By PK90:
How the fuck can NY dictate what is legal in another state? Assholes!!!!



Any LEA can implement any department mandated regulation they want as long as it is not contray to law or in violation of a bargaining agreement.

I also read that NYPD is requiring certification from retired officer's that they have legally disposed of all +10 semi-auto magazines. I don't know if this is true or not.
Link Posted: 8/15/2005 8:32:14 AM EDT

Retirees living outside the state will only be recognized as an “HR 218 qualified NYPD MOS retiree” only when they return to Rodman’s Neck and re-qualify. No other state’s training system will be recognized by the NYPD as a valid certification of HR 218 compliance.

Maybe I am missing it here. How can NY dictate what a Retiree does in his new state of residence? HR218 says that the Retiree must comply with his new state of residency requirements, or his previous state. Page 2
Link Posted: 8/15/2005 11:43:04 AM EDT
In legal terms the NYPD can not. However, each retiree's ID is considered property of the NYPD. Thus if they get in trouble with their firearm and they did not comply with the Departments regulations then they will pull their ID's. This is what I have been told at least.


Originally Posted By PK90:

Retirees living outside the state will only be recognized as an “HR 218 qualified NYPD MOS retiree” only when they return to Rodman’s Neck and re-qualify. No other state’s training system will be recognized by the NYPD as a valid certification of HR 218 compliance.

Maybe I am missing it here. How can NY dictate what a Retiree does in his new state of residence? HR218 says that the Retiree must comply with his new state of residency requirements, or his previous state. Page 2

Link Posted: 8/15/2005 11:54:28 AM EDT
I believe that the way that law is written, for a retired police officer to be in compliance, he must have documentation from the department he retired from that he passed a firearms qualification test. There is nothing in the law that states that a police department is required to offer that training however, so while Kelly can't make his own laws, he can circumvent this law by simply not offering the training.
Link Posted: 8/15/2005 11:58:32 AM EDT

Originally Posted By rkbar15:

Originally Posted By PK90:
How the fuck can NY dictate what is legal in another state? Assholes!!!!



Any LEA can implement any department mandated regulation they want as long as it is not contray to law or in violation of a bargaining agreement.

I also read that NYPD is requiring certification from retired officer's that they have legally disposed of all +10 semi-auto magazines. I don't know if this is true or not.



Rkbar as far as I know, with the +10 round magazine issue...if you have a NYC pistol permit that has the "hi cap" mags listed on a purchase order for your firearm, your permit will not be renewed when the time comes if you can not show that you disposed of your mags to an FFL or a police officer, and there is no distinction made for pre-94 manufactured magazines.
Link Posted: 8/15/2005 4:31:46 PM EDT
Isn't this all done for the safety of the children?

Link Posted: 8/15/2005 4:32:18 PM EDT
Link Posted: 8/16/2005 11:15:26 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Wave:
Dunno yet.



Geez with an attitude like that you'll never make Chief. Just make up some new firearm regulation like Kelly does.

Has Kelly banned all semi-auto +10 mags in NYC for Pistol licensees?
Link Posted: 8/16/2005 1:27:24 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/16/2005 1:57:42 PM EDT by bear3351]

Originally Posted By rkbar15:

Originally Posted By Wave:
Dunno yet.



Geez with an attitude like that you'll never make Chief.



Or a Sensei.




Link Posted: 8/16/2005 2:17:07 PM EDT

Originally Posted By rkbar15:

Has Kelly banned all semi-auto +10 mags in NYC for Pistol licensees?



Not yet, but I always leave the mags at home for "gun check" when adding one to the permit.
Link Posted: 8/16/2005 2:25:21 PM EDT
Well people have been going to Hunter Sports to buy 10 round mags. These are people that have NYC permits and need to show they have 10 round mags to renew their permit. So I guess this is only NYC and not NYS.
Since I have pre-pre ban G19 15 rounder mags I am still ok to use them. I know any new gun you buy NO HIGH CAP.
Link Posted: 8/16/2005 2:49:49 PM EDT

Originally Posted By edpmedic:
Well people have been going to Hunter Sports to buy 10 round mags. These are people that have NYC permits and need to show they have 10 round mags to renew their permit. So I guess this is only NYC and not NYS.
Since I have pre-pre ban G19 15 rounder mags I am still ok to use them. I know any new gun you buy NO HIGH CAP.



There's really no basis for that. The NYC code clearly allows civilian ownership of up to 17 round pistol mags.

My renewal comes up in a few months; if NYC wants to make it a pain for me, I can push back just as hard.
Link Posted: 8/16/2005 3:22:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/19/2005 9:58:38 AM EDT by palmer]
.
Link Posted: 8/17/2005 3:33:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 8/17/2005 3:34:53 PM EDT by deltaopwong]
I'm sure retired-NYPD like Pat Rogers are going to come back to Rodman's Neck annually to quote unquote be 'Officially NYPD-certified Retired MOS' to be HR 218 compliant. Pat Rogers teaches tactical pistol and carbine classes to state, local, military LEO personnel and private contractors and can probably outshoot most people out there and is more well known in the firearms/tactical/law-enforcement industry than the PC outside of the tri-state area...HAAAAA!!! What a joke!!! Sorry, I thought this was the RANT page......
Link Posted: 8/18/2005 6:02:48 PM EDT

Originally Posted By fixxxer0:
Gotta love em...... and this is to thier own!



I believe the quote is, "They eat their own."
Link Posted: 8/18/2005 7:15:16 PM EDT

There's really no basis for that. The NYC code clearly allows civilian ownership of up to 17 round pistol mags.


I thouht that was only 22 rim fire pistols

HEY Palmer I thought you were still in PA that was a short stay.

I have been looking around and going out that way on weekends.

So far I got has far as College State PA.
Link Posted: 8/19/2005 7:47:41 AM EDT

Originally Posted By edpmedic:

There's really no basis for that. The NYC code clearly allows civilian ownership of up to 17 round pistol mags.


I thouht that was only 22 rim fire pistols



The NYC Administrative Code currently restricts rifle mags to 5 rounds and pistol mags to 17 rounds. It appears that the NYPD Commissioner has on his own restricted pistol mags to 10 rounds for pistol licensees. This needs to be confirmed.
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