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Posted: 4/19/2018 11:39:35 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/19/2018 11:39:35 PM EDT by Forest]
Greeting, AR15 Lovers,

Sadly, I live on the "Left Coast", and as such, have until July 1, 2018, to make my Colt M4 "Featureless". So far, I've replaced my collapsing stock with a USGI A1 stock, which is what I used at Fort Ord, eons ago. I like it far better than the OEM collapsible stock. I will be replacing the "bullet button", and it will be great to get a regular mag release back.Still left to be done, are to choose a "featureless" grip, and replace the A2 Birdcage flash hider, with compensator, or muzzle brake. I don't worry about the flash so much as I want to keep the noise down for myself, and my fellow shooting folks at the range! I've been considering the KAW Linear Compensator, which looks to work pretty well at cutting down the concussion, and blast for the shooter and others on the range, whilst at the same time, directing all that forward. Yeah, I know..... fearsome flash from such a device. But, again, that's not the most important consideration, for me. Any other suggestions will be much appreciated.

What "featureless" grips can you recommend, please? I'm considering the Strike Industries MegaFin, and the Monsterman grips. Have these two been reviewed and compared here on the AR15 forums? If so, what was the consensus of opinion about which offered the most comfortable, and controllable grip?

Also, I was considering making a vise block for my barrel, out of some hardwood scraps, and use those, and some leather, to vise up my barrel out here the A2 Birdcage, in order to remove it. Am I on the right track here?

Last, I would find it very interesting to hear from other CA AR15 owners, to learn they did to make their own AR's "featureless". Thanks, very much, and I look forward to hearing what you all thing about this, and reading your suggestions and comments. Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc
Link Posted: 4/16/2018 9:31:13 PM EDT
Calguns.net is the forum you seek
Link Posted: 4/16/2018 9:33:32 PM EDT
Link Posted: 4/16/2018 9:43:16 PM EDT
Commenting on CA law is as foreign to me as commenting on the laws of Mozambique, so I'll refrain from any suggestions, but
will say, "Welcome to Arfcom!"
Link Posted: 4/16/2018 10:00:29 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/16/2018 10:01:48 PM EDT by North_42]
Originally Posted By DocMark:
Greeting, AR15 Lovers,

Sadly, I live on the "Left Coast", and as such, have until July 1, 2018, to make my Colt M4 "Featureless". So far, I've replaced my collapsing stock with a USGI A1 stock, which is what I used at Fort Ord, eons ago. I like it far better than the OEM collapsible stock. I will be replacing the "bullet button", and it will be great to get a regular mag release back.Still left to be done, are to choose a "featureless" grip, and replace the A2 Birdcage flash hider, with compensator, or muzzle brake. I don't worry about the flash so much as I want to keep the noise down for myself, and my fellow shooting folks at the range! I've been considering the KAW Linear Compensator, which looks to work pretty well at cutting down the concussion, and blast for the shooter and others on the range, whilst at the same time, directing all that forward. Yeah, I know..... fearsome flash from such a device. But, again, that's not the most important consideration, for me. Any other suggestions will be much appreciated.

What "featureless" grips can you recommend, please? I'm considering the Strike Industries MegaFin, and the Monsterman grips. Have these two been reviewed and compared here on the AR15 forums? If so, what was the consensus of opinion about which offered the most comfortable, and controllable grip?

Also, I was considering making a vise block for my barrel, out of some hardwood scraps, and use those, and some leather, to vise up my barrel out here the A2 Birdcage, in order to remove it. Am I on the right track here?

Last, I would find it very interesting to hear from other CA AR15 owners, to learn they did to make their own AR's "featureless". Thanks, very much, and I look forward to hearing what you all thing about this, and reading your suggestions and comments. Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc
View Quote
If I had an AR-15, wanted to comply with silly state laws, and did not want to use a mag lock, I would use a Thordsen FRS gen 3 http://www.thordsencustoms.com/frs-15-gen-iii-enhanced-stock-kit-black-474/

But I do not have any AR-15’s, they are baby killers. And I love babies.
Link Posted: 4/16/2018 11:36:01 PM EDT
I posted this in the CA section, but it doesn't hurt posting it here.
All of my AR's have this setup or a variation of it. It's the cheapest and less intrusive... meaning it gives the most standard AR experience. To me, this is the best, because you aren't hinging the Ar open every couple minutes which makes the upper and lower fit really loose. This also allows you to clear malfunctions and pretty much use the AR as a practical carbine whereas other methods don't allow you to do so and make simple malfunctions a pain in the ass. Remember, if you ever want to use the AR for anything other than punching holes in paper, this is the only way to go... even the bullet button was impractical and I loved watching the tactical guys reloading by putting a little pin into a little hole trying to get their gun into action.

Strike Industries Simple Grip


They are 10$ and come with the lock washer and pistol grip screw. An ARFcom sponsor, Right to bear has them for the best price usually 7-8$ on sale. Right To Bear.com Price

I also use the Aim Sports stock lock.
Link to it.


Usually around 5$. Some pictures show the stock lock being used without the adjustment piece on the stock, which can be installed with the stock lock, but it's purely for aesthetics.
They make stock locks for Magpul, daniel defense, M4 stocks, and Sopmod style.

With those two products, you can use a blank muzzle or add a compensator/ brake for a featureless on any build.

Here are a couple of pictures of them being used on different stocks.


Both the stock lock and simple grip are being used.

I had a picture of a stock lock on the Magpul ACS, but can't find it sorry.

Here are pictures of them on fixed stocks. You have to file a bit off the top to fit correctly. They will work perfectly fine together as the grip will bend to accommodate the fixed stock, but filing it will make it sit flush together.
Colt A2 Stock:

Colt A1 Stock, Type E:


I'm in the retro clone game, so I had to find some alternative muzzle devices. I saw those muzzle devices that are essentially closed end A2s. To me that's a little iffy and a gray area. I decided to contact John Thomas at Retro Arms Work and he created these for me. He took a standard A1 and A2 Flash Hider, bored it out and welded in a steel insert. That makes sure it will never or can never be construed as a flash hider.
FN A2 Flash Hider:

Colt A1 Flash Hider:
Link Posted: 4/16/2018 11:44:27 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Tigwelder1971:
Also here
View Quote
I clicked on the link, read several posts. WTF??? That's not America!
Link Posted: 4/16/2018 11:45:53 PM EDT
To add on to my previous post:

You mentioned the mega fin and the monsterman grip. After trying a bunch of the featureless grips, I've found the pistol grip style grips with fin on them are the most comfortable grip. All of those weird styles, monsterman, thordsen, and rifle grip are extremely uncomfortable for me. You have to hold the rifle with your hand cocked forward in a weird position. Similiar to the picture below (The bottom one). The pistol grip fin style is more natural and comfortable. I don't loose much control over the rifle because I tuck the stock in my arm pit to reload and I have two hands on the rifle. With the other weird styles, you don't have a lot of control of the weapon, the weight is above your hand and it's just sitting in your hand.

Link Posted: 4/17/2018 5:06:44 AM EDT
What ever happened to Will Not Comply ?
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 6:38:45 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 6:47:03 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By M4A1:
What ever happened to Will Not Comply ?
View Quote
He moved out of CA.
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 7:04:16 AM EDT
Originally Posted By DocMark:
Greeting, AR15 Lovers,

Sadly, I live on the "Left Coast", and as such, have until July 1, 2018, to make my Colt M4 "Featureless". ...

Also, I was considering making a vise block for my barrel, out of some hardwood scraps, and use those, and some leather, to vise up my barrel out here the A2 Birdcage, in order to remove it. Am I on the right track here?

Last, I would find it very interesting to hear from other CA AR15 owners, to learn they did to make their own AR's "featureless". Thanks, very much, and I look forward to hearing what you all thing about this, and reading your suggestions and comments. Take care, and God Bless!

Every Good Wish,
Doc
View Quote
Remove A2 FS:

Redneck method - Since yours is an m4 (flat top), an easy way to hold the receiver in the vise is to turn it sideway, use 2 pieces of wood (2x4 would do) cut to fit between the front and rear lugs, and the other for the flat top. Most A2 FS would not take too much to unscrew.

Better way - Get a Magpul Bev block, from any vendors here. This is a must have for anyone who wants to tinker with AR. http://www.primaryarms.com/magpul-ar-15-bev-block-mag536
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 7:38:18 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 7:42:41 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 7:43:39 AM EDT
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 8:37:47 AM EDT
Then they will just come up w more restrictive laws... And you wont be in compliance then either. Im in the same boat, different coast. Your not going to get anywhere playing by their ever changing rules. Fuck'em...
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 8:42:23 AM EDT
Wait, does CA have more new laws? Did they make everyone register bullet button then tell them to go features?
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 9:32:50 AM EDT
Yes, something like that. It's completely ridiculous, as usual.
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 11:56:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/17/2018 12:12:31 PM EDT by uniform64]
Build a "fixed" mag dedicated lower and you don't have to change anything.

FC Hook
[youtube]uvTqDwNpCL0[/youtube]

https://www.riflegear.com/p-7358-torque-precision-fc-hook-magazine-lock.aspx

DFM Magazine
[youtube]v7uiT-lP8gA[/youtube]

https://www.riflegear.com/p-7340-franklin-armory-dfm-magazine-ar15-556mm-10rd.aspx
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 12:03:40 PM EDT
Just did some reading. Is this to be allowed to the 30 rounders?
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 12:19:22 PM EDT
There's still a 10 round limit
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 12:28:09 PM EDT
I went Fixed Mag w/ Bear Flag BF-10 & Mean Arms Loader.. and 2x w/ the Juggernaut HellFighter kit..
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 9:54:01 PM EDT
MIAD grip with Exile Machine backfin is the way to go for grip. That way you can adapt it when outside CA.

Tactical Low Concussion muzzle break $16.98 on ebay to replace flash hider.
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 10:31:32 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By M4A1:
What ever happened to Will Not Comply ?
View Quote
Just read a couple posts, one guy had his shit checked while shooting at BLM land, another guy lost 3k worth of shit. I'm not going to jail, nor do I want to spend a shit ton in legal money. If you are, go for it.
Link Posted: 4/17/2018 10:32:49 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By assaultdog0351:
Wait, does CA have more new laws? Did they make everyone register bullet button then tell them to go features?
View Quote
No, if you want a bullet button you register, if you don't care and go featureless or the new mag lock method you don't do anything.
Link Posted: 4/19/2018 9:13:58 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By endermend:
Just read a couple posts, one guy had his shit checked while shooting at BLM land, another guy lost 3k worth of shit. I'm not going to jail, nor do I want to spend a shit ton in legal money. If you are, go for it.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By endermend:
Originally Posted By M4A1:
What ever happened to Will Not Comply ?
Just read a couple posts, one guy had his shit checked while shooting at BLM land, another guy lost 3k worth of shit. I'm not going to jail, nor do I want to spend a shit ton in legal money. If you are, go for it.
Don’t we have until Jun 30th to comply..?? Thought I saw it somewhere saying we CAN STILL go out shooting with our B.B Rifles
Link Posted: 4/19/2018 9:25:55 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By endermend:
I posted this in the CA section, but it doesn't hurt posting it here.
All of my AR's have this setup or a variation of it. It's the cheapest and less intrusive... meaning it gives the most standard AR experience. To me, this is the best, because you aren't hinging the Ar open every couple minutes which makes the upper and lower fit really loose. This also allows you to clear malfunctions and pretty much use the AR as a practical carbine whereas other methods don't allow you to do so and make simple malfunctions a pain in the ass. Remember, if you ever want to use the AR for anything other than punching holes in paper, this is the only way to go... even the bullet button was impractical and I loved watching the tactical guys reloading by putting a little pin into a little hole trying to get their gun into action.

Strike Industries Simple Grip
https://www.strikeindustries.com/shop/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/602f0fa2c1f0d1ba5e241f914e856ff9/d/s/dsc_0272_3.jpg

They are 10$ and come with the lock washer and pistol grip screw. An ARFcom sponsor, Right to bear has them for the best price usually 7-8$ on sale. Right To Bear.com Price

I also use the Aim Sports stock lock.
Link to it.
https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1271/7541/products/aim-sports-inc-m4-stock-lock-pin-lower-part-ar15discounts_151_x700.jpg?v=1520408175

Usually around 5$. Some pictures show the stock lock being used without the adjustment piece on the stock, which can be installed with the stock lock, but it's purely for aesthetics.
They make stock locks for Magpul, daniel defense, M4 stocks, and Sopmod style.

With those two products, you can use a blank muzzle or add a compensator/ brake for a featureless on any build.

Here are a couple of pictures of them being used on different stocks.

https://i.imgur.com/SfhHDnY.jpg
Both the stock lock and simple grip are being used.

I had a picture of a stock lock on the Magpul ACS, but can't find it sorry.

Here are pictures of them on fixed stocks. You have to file a bit off the top to fit correctly. They will work perfectly fine together as the grip will bend to accommodate the fixed stock, but filing it will make it sit flush together.
Colt A2 Stock:
https://i.imgur.com/Vv9Hw5s.jpg?1
Colt A1 Stock, Type E:
https://i.imgur.com/OnFJGRj.jpg

I'm in the retro clone game, so I had to find some alternative muzzle devices. I saw those muzzle devices that are essentially closed end A2s. To me that's a little iffy and a gray area. I decided to contact John Thomas at Retro Arms Work and he created these for me. He took a standard A1 and A2 Flash Hider, bored it out and welded in a steel insert. That makes sure it will never or can never be construed as a flash hider.
FN A2 Flash Hider:
https://i.imgur.com/xJfZYwQ.jpg
Colt A1 Flash Hider:
https://i.imgur.com/OEitE6n.jpg
View Quote
Looks safer already.
Link Posted: 4/19/2018 9:56:15 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/19/2018 9:59:12 AM EDT by uxo2]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Ej6fade:
Calguns.net is the forum you seek
View Quote
That the place to go for us.

ARFCOM hates us conservatives behind the lines
and wants us to slide off into the deep.

You see me there.

Any fixed stock
Solartac kydex grip wrap
any comp that you like
Link Posted: 4/19/2018 11:07:00 AM EDT
Any chance you could move out of CA?
Link Posted: 4/19/2018 12:27:11 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By SSOUNN:

Don’t we have until Jun 30th to comply..?? Thought I saw it somewhere saying we CAN STILL go out shooting with our B.B Rifles
View Quote
If BB rifle is with a pre 2017 receiver you have til then to register, make it featureless or fixed magazine. The thread about the guy that lost 3k of stuff is he built a couple BB rifles with receivers bought in 2017 and tried to register them. https://www.ar15.com/forums/Hometown/I-didn-t-understand-the-law-and-the-DOJ-confiscated-my-ARs/11-623550/
Link Posted: 4/19/2018 4:23:30 PM EDT
Move to Texas like I did
No stupid gun laws here
Link Posted: 4/19/2018 4:56:59 PM EDT
Keep your features and go with a CompMag fixed magazine.
It's pretty slick and an easy removal for your free state trips.

http://www.compmag.net
Link Posted: 4/19/2018 7:13:15 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Tigwelder1971:
Also here
View Quote
That place is so sad.
Link Posted: 4/20/2018 12:13:16 AM EDT
This thread catalogued at lot of the available devices. Look them over for thoughts.

Link to AR15.com Thread on Featureless Design Options
Link Posted: 4/20/2018 12:14:41 AM EDT
I don't live in CA, but all my lowers are pre-2017. Can I register some, and later bring them to CA temporarily with BBs if I want? Would that be advantageous?
Link Posted: 4/20/2018 12:43:42 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By KitBuilder:
I don't live in CA, but all my lowers are pre-2017. Can I register some, and later bring them to CA temporarily with BBs if I want? Would that be advantageous?
View Quote
I think it's easier to work backwards through your question. Why would you want to and what sort of advantage might there be in doing so? Without going to the Ca DoJ site and re-reading, here's what I think the rest of the answer - No - is going to come from. I believe to be eligible to be registered as a BB assault weapon, it had to have been legally possessed in Ca prior to 1/1/2017. I suppose there are some exceptions for FFLs doing business, etc., but am pretty sure there is no way to otherwise import an AW into California. It's possible to travel to/through California with compliant featureless or fixed magazine rifles.
Link Posted: 4/20/2018 1:34:14 AM EDT
Thanks. I was just curious, in case I visit the state sometime.

Yeah, it sounds like some FFL/SOT or LE exemption would be the best option. I guess I would wade through that info when planning a potential visit. It'll probably have changed by then anyway.
Link Posted: 4/21/2018 1:04:50 PM EDT
Not sure there is any benefit to jumping through various hoops for licenses, business, etc., to go bullet button for a temporary trip when you could go featureless or even fixed mag compliant for what would seem to be a lot less time, money and effort.
Link Posted: 4/22/2018 12:14:21 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By KitBuilder:
I don't live in CA, but all my lowers are pre-2017. Can I register some, and later bring them to CA temporarily with BBs if I want? Would that be advantageous?
View Quote
No, you can not. In order to register, you need to have a California driver's license or a California ID card. See CCR 5474(a). That legal requirement comes directly from the law, from PC 30900(b)(3). Without ever explicitly saying it, that section implies that only California residents can register assault weapons, because only residents will have a DL or ID card.
Link Posted: 4/23/2018 12:59:19 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/23/2018 1:07:35 AM EDT by operatorerror]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By uniform64:
There's still a 10 round limit
View Quote
10 rd limit on bullet button and fixed mag. No limit on featureless.

eta You need to be a CA resident to register a bullet button weapon (10rd limit), featureless requires no registration and can be used with a regular mag release and a high cap. Registering a bullet button rifle as an "assault weapon" that you CANNOT modify to a regular mag release is silly but to each their own.

And a threaded muzzle is okay, just need a thread protector , brake or compensator. Milling off the threads and capping the muzzle is unnecessary.
Link Posted: 4/23/2018 11:27:14 AM EDT
For the Op or any visitor's purposes, there is a 10 round limit for featureless as well. The only currently legal greater than 10 round mags are those that are grandfathered, pending final court actions on the current 10 round limit implementation. But no new sales or importations.
Link Posted: 4/23/2018 1:10:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 4/23/2018 1:15:38 PM EDT by treelogger]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By operatorerror:
And a threaded muzzle is okay, just need a thread protector , brake or compensator. Milling off the threads and capping the muzzle is unnecessary.
View Quote
ON A RIFLE: Threads are legal and don't trigger assault weapon status. You don't actually need a thread protector. Legally speaking having exposed threads would be fine. Practically speaking a thread protector is a much better idea, otherwise the threads will be damaged.

ON A PISTOL: A threaded barrel on a semiautomatic pistol makes it automatically an assault weapon. Unless you have already registered it or can do it now, you will have to remove the threads. But there is no need to mill off the threads, or permanently install a thread protector (I think the legal standard was to pin and silver solder). Just take the threaded barrel off, never reinstall it on the pistol, and put a non-threaded barrel in.
Link Posted: 4/24/2018 11:37:39 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By assaultdog0351:
Just did some reading. Is this to be allowed to the 30 rounders?
View Quote
You can use any pre-2000 mag on a featureless rifle, for now
Link Posted: 4/24/2018 10:25:03 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Chaingun:

You can use any pre-2000 mag on a featureless rifle, for now
View Quote
You can't bring in any, only what's been in California before 2000 gets to stay in California
Link Posted: 4/25/2018 12:00:48 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By KitBuilder:
I don't live in CA, but all my lowers are pre-2017. Can I register some, and later bring them to CA temporarily with BBs if I want? Would that be advantageous?
View Quote
If you want to visit just make them featureless.
Link Posted: 4/26/2018 4:23:02 AM EDT
FRANKLIN ARMORY DFM MAGAZINE

https://www.franklinarmory.com/collections/dfm/products/franklin-armory-10-round-dfm
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