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Lobby Day 2021 (Page 3 of 4)
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Link Posted: 12/23/2020 10:27:02 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Ben:
A valid COA (course of action) should be suitable, feasible, acceptable, distinguishable and complete.

What if there is another, more effective, course of action than meeting in Richmond on January 18th?
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Well, meeting closer to DC with the same numbers as last year, with some equivalency to two mechanized infantry and half a light infantry division, would allow us to restore the constitutional republic?

Did I just ask that? (DISCLAIMER: This is a rhetorical set of questions, not a CoC.)

The guys with the grill and sausages are going to need a lot more coal, and a lot more sausages. It would certainly not be a cakewalk.
Link Posted: 12/26/2020 12:03:03 PM EST
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Originally Posted By homeyclaus:


That's exactly what I'd expect them to be doing, but mainly using SIGINT to match license plate readers with car audio bluetooth, phone bluetooth, and IMEI to reconstruct the contact network.
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@homeyclaus

This requires more than simple collection but processing. If you have actual evidence of this then there’l must be state-funded processing server somewhere with hundreds of people paid to do this. Or a contract vehicle explicitly spelling this out.

So, where and who would do this?
Link Posted: 12/26/2020 3:37:29 PM EST
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Originally Posted By kudzu630:


@homeyclaus

This requires more than simple collection but processing. If you have actual evidence of this then there’l must be state-funded processing server somewhere with hundreds of people paid to do this. Or a contract vehicle explicitly spelling this out.

So, where and who would do this?
View Quote


This does not require a federal law enforcement slush fund-sized budget, and hasn't for a long time. Just because the alphabet agencies pay tens of millions to bypass the bill of rights doesn't mean you have to.

This is well within the capability of the a hobbyist:
- License plate scanner
- Picks up BT signals MAC id's as it goes by. IMEI too.
Personally I'd use a GoPro Hero 3 or 4 off eBay and a Raspberry Pi 4 - so that's ~$150 of hardware plus battery pack, plus whatever the cell signal receiver costs.

Within a couple of collectors being passed you'll have a very good match of IMEI, MAC addresses and automobile. You'll be at least be able to ID the owner by license plate.

You don't need to know everyone's names and addresses - just the interesting folks your Bluetooth and IMEI collectors match to a point in time. The non-photo collectors would be Pi Zero W boards, add the 1900 MHz TDMA/CDMA receivers.

Object and unclear character recognition was a trivial machine learning exercise used in a two hour education session four years ago at AWS RE:Invent, so I guess for your monthly coffee money in processing you could get a lot of intel on who is where and how they're moving.
Link Posted: 12/26/2020 3:46:09 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Ben:
A valid COA (course of action) should be suitable, feasible, acceptable, distinguishable and complete.

What if there is another, more effective, course of action than meeting in Richmond on January 18th?
View Quote


I hope alternatives are considered.  There absolutely is and will continue to be identification/tracking and beyond that will occur.....and for what? Efforts should be focused on the people and our communities.  Let's have dialogue, or at the very least have a near neutral portrayal and possibility of engagement and understanding.  It doesn't take much to out think Northam, let's do it!
Link Posted: 12/26/2020 4:20:53 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Panta_Rei:


I hope alternatives are considered.  There absolutely is and will continue to be identification/tracking and beyond that will occur.....and for what? Efforts should be focused on the people and our communities.  Let's have dialogue, or at the very least have a near neutral portrayal and possibility of engagement and understanding.  It doesn't take much to out think Northam, let's do it!
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Originally Posted By Panta_Rei:
Originally Posted By Ben:
A valid COA (course of action) should be suitable, feasible, acceptable, distinguishable and complete.

What if there is another, more effective, course of action than meeting in Richmond on January 18th?


I hope alternatives are considered.  There absolutely is and will continue to be identification/tracking and beyond that will occur.....and for what? Efforts should be focused on the people and our communities.  Let's have dialogue, or at the very least have a near neutral portrayal and possibility of engagement and understanding.  It doesn't take much to out think Northam, let's do it!


The people we're arrayed against hate us to their very core and want us dead.

And they accuse us of not bargaining in good faith, when we stopped accepting yet another restriction on something in the bill of rights and called their approach incrementalism.

We stand in the way of the worker's and farmer's republic they have dreamed of - der Arbeiter-und-Bauernstaat.
Link Posted: 12/26/2020 6:19:53 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/26/2020 6:50:42 PM EST by Panta_Rei]
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Originally Posted By homeyclaus:


The people we're arrayed against hate us to their very core and want us dead.

And they accuse us of not bargaining in good faith, when we stopped accepting yet another restriction on something in the bill of rights and called their approach incrementalism.

We stand in the way of the worker's and farmer's republic they have dreamed of - der Arbeiter-und-Bauernstaat.
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Originally Posted By homeyclaus:
Originally Posted By Panta_Rei:
Originally Posted By Ben:
A valid COA (course of action) should be suitable, feasible, acceptable, distinguishable and complete.

What if there is another, more effective, course of action than meeting in Richmond on January 18th?


I hope alternatives are considered.  There absolutely is and will continue to be identification/tracking and beyond that will occur.....and for what? Efforts should be focused on the people and our communities.  Let's have dialogue, or at the very least have a near neutral portrayal and possibility of engagement and understanding.  It doesn't take much to out think Northam, let's do it!


The people we're arrayed against hate us to their very core and want us dead.

And they accuse us of not bargaining in good faith, when we stopped accepting yet another restriction on something in the bill of rights and called their approach incrementalism.

We stand in the way of the worker's and farmer's republic they have dreamed of - der Arbeiter-und-Bauernstaat.


I ain't skeered.....I'm just not fond of unclear objectives and a repetitive strategy for ever changing times.  How about putting  the effort into a pro gun community that has already told Coonman to pound sand? Give a respectable community and functional local government the business, and a positive story. Our dialogue/rights/integrity of procedure have been stripped in RVA.  IMO, we gain more contrasting racist/rapist tyrants to a constitutional government  of the people.  I'd like to bring some youth and women, but I understand why most will not step foot in RVA.  We need full support, not just those ready for whatever.   Brains will gets us farther than our bravado.

ETA:  Jan 6th is a more important capitol showing than RVA, if we want to demonstrate accurate numbers and not have more Coonman shenanigans.  Following this up with a productive engagement with a properly functioning local government on the 18th..... and our governor is better exposed as weak and derelict of oath and duty.
Link Posted: 12/27/2020 12:51:12 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Panta_Rei:


I ain't skeered.....I'm just not fond of unclear objectives and a repetitive strategy for ever changing times.  How about putting  the effort into a pro gun community that has already told Coonman to pound sand? Give a respectable community and functional local government the business, and a positive story. Our dialogue/rights/integrity of procedure have been stripped in RVA.  IMO, we gain more contrasting racist/rapist tyrants to a constitutional government  of the people.  I'd like to bring some youth and women, but I understand why most will not step foot in RVA.  We need full support, not just those ready for whatever.   Brains will gets us farther than our bravado.

ETA:  Jan 6th is a more important capitol showing than RVA, if we want to demonstrate accurate numbers and not have more Coonman shenanigans.  Following this up with a productive engagement with a properly functioning local government on the 18th..... and our governor is better exposed as weak and derelict of oath and duty.
View Quote


Years prior we dressed nicely, said "please" and went into their offices with agenda letters. This has been tried - were you there? I have been going as a guide on that day for 12 years. Last year was the first time in 13 I was not giving civics lessons to those seeking redress from their elected representatives.

Coonman and his bolsheviks will play games. And they aren't arguing in good faith. They never have. They'll ask "what's a little more give from your side, not too much? Be reasonable!" and when given, will demand more at every opportunity. This has been their strategy for over 50 years, and it has worked.

There are two proven pro-gun communities here: VCDL, which being a non-profit on the "wrong side" cannot waver from the straight, narrow, and law-abiding because anything for the enemy to grab onto will be used to the greatest extent as it can. They're the people the enemy can attempt to "reason" with, and they have only taken what they could get in "concessions" for "safety" and given nothing in return.

Last year we, those who went, supported local business with our money, we cleaned the streets, and did everything right. Result? We're painted as white supremacist nazis who are a threat to the America most of us took an oath to when we were younger.

Then there is everyone else - arfcom, VABB members (which aren't acting in an official capacity here), Multicam Mafia, and some others.

Get with the program.
Link Posted: 12/27/2020 2:17:19 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/27/2020 2:18:16 PM EST by SonofLiberty1775]
That is probably one of the most thoughtful, yet plainly stated assessments of where we are.
...and I'll stand with that program.
Link Posted: 12/27/2020 2:19:12 PM EST
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Originally Posted By homeyclaus:


Years prior we dressed nicely, said "please" and went into their offices with agenda letters. This has been tried - were you there? I have been going as a guide on that day for 12 years. Last year was the first time in 13 I was not giving civics lessons to those seeking redress from their elected representatives.

Coonman and his bolsheviks will play games. And they aren't arguing in good faith. They never have. They'll ask "what's a little more give from your side, not too much? Be reasonable!" and when given, will demand more at every opportunity. This has been their strategy for over 50 years, and it has worked.

There are two proven pro-gun communities here: VCDL, which being a non-profit on the "wrong side" cannot waver from the straight, narrow, and law-abiding because anything for the enemy to grab onto will be used to the greatest extent as it can. They're the people the enemy can attempt to "reason" with, and they have only taken what they could get in "concessions" for "safety" and given nothing in return.

Last year we, those who went, supported local business with our money, we cleaned the streets, and did everything right. Result? We're painted as white supremacist nazis who are a threat to the America most of us took an oath to when we were younger.

Then there is everyone else - arfcom, VABB members (which aren't acting in an official capacity here), Multicam Mafia, and some others.

Get with the program.
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Originally Posted By homeyclaus:
Originally Posted By Panta_Rei:


I ain't skeered.....I'm just not fond of unclear objectives and a repetitive strategy for ever changing times.  How about putting  the effort into a pro gun community that has already told Coonman to pound sand? Give a respectable community and functional local government the business, and a positive story. Our dialogue/rights/integrity of procedure have been stripped in RVA.  IMO, we gain more contrasting racist/rapist tyrants to a constitutional government  of the people.  I'd like to bring some youth and women, but I understand why most will not step foot in RVA.  We need full support, not just those ready for whatever.   Brains will gets us farther than our bravado.

ETA:  Jan 6th is a more important capitol showing than RVA, if we want to demonstrate accurate numbers and not have more Coonman shenanigans.  Following this up with a productive engagement with a properly functioning local government on the 18th..... and our governor is better exposed as weak and derelict of oath and duty.


Years prior we dressed nicely, said "please" and went into their offices with agenda letters. This has been tried - were you there? I have been going as a guide on that day for 12 years. Last year was the first time in 13 I was not giving civics lessons to those seeking redress from their elected representatives.

Coonman and his bolsheviks will play games. And they aren't arguing in good faith. They never have. They'll ask "what's a little more give from your side, not too much? Be reasonable!" and when given, will demand more at every opportunity. This has been their strategy for over 50 years, and it has worked.

There are two proven pro-gun communities here: VCDL, which being a non-profit on the "wrong side" cannot waver from the straight, narrow, and law-abiding because anything for the enemy to grab onto will be used to the greatest extent as it can. They're the people the enemy can attempt to "reason" with, and they have only taken what they could get in "concessions" for "safety" and given nothing in return.

Last year we, those who went, supported local business with our money, we cleaned the streets, and did everything right. Result? We're painted as white supremacist nazis who are a threat to the America most of us took an oath to when we were younger.

Then there is everyone else - arfcom, VABB members (which aren't acting in an official capacity here), Multicam Mafia, and some others.

Get with the program.


Yes, I too have been one of those dressing nice and miss the times that I could actually go with a gun into Del Plum's office and in very stern, but respectable means disagree with that prick.  I even supported the AR in Pochonotas Building and battle rattle folks before it was cool and certainly not my style for the situation.  Lobby Day 2020 turned out for the very best considering all that was against us, but there really wasn't going to much metric for success.  Expect to loose even more ground and have even more hurdles, while our message/character is further obfiscusted.  You identify divisions within us; agree, and as I mentioned there is another very large group of newbs, women and youth that are not going to engage in RVA for various reasons.  I maintain that rallying behind a local government that has stood firm against tyranny in their welcoming enviroment and with an opportunity for dialogue, networking and unity will best advance us and greatly reduces the risk of premature events that could very easily hijack everything you have done to support our cause.

Again, what are the objectives when there is no lobbying, no permit,  new "rules" against us,  and a quasi vacant GA? I only responded, b/c I saw Ben contemplating options.  He was very instrumental in leading an organized and disciplined display of force last time.  What is the program if even he recently stated this?  "What if there is another, more effective, course of action than meeting in Richmond on January 18th?"  It's worth a discussion
Link Posted: 12/28/2020 10:02:35 AM EST
That is the discussion, but as I said earlier, much of what we discussed in public fora was used against us last time.

So the thing to do is to either attend the meetings, or get vetted into private fora (by attending the meetings).

Driving around like VCDL proposes, while legal, is just an invitation to get fucked with. A spontaneous occupation of the clock tower with overwhelming force might be it, but if publicly organized, you can bet big bucks that they'll have countermeasures in place.
Link Posted: 12/28/2020 12:27:34 PM EST
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Originally Posted By homeyclaus:
That is the discussion, but as I said earlier, much of what we discussed in public fora was used against us last time.

So the thing to do is to either attend the meetings, or get vetted into private fora (by attending the meetings).

Driving around like VCDL proposes, while legal, is just an invitation to get fucked with. A spontaneous occupation of the clock tower with overwhelming force might be it, but if publicly organized, you can bet big bucks that they'll have countermeasures in place.
View Quote


In complete agreement. Some of this forum discussion was used against us; however, people knew ANTIFA/Dem plants were there and I think some finally got the message, they are not in solidarity.  Kudos to all last Lobby Day, you participated in a display of spirit, force, discipline and constitutionality that no leftist causes could have done, and the traps were not set.  IMO, none of this is replicable this year and trying to remain relevent in this GA just shows desperation.  Let's celebrate a locality brave enough to defy Coonman, not play into his shenanigans, and better recruit and merge the division we have.  Let's make an out of control state government irrelevant and support locally elected officials that can carry this discussion that we are now denied by tyrants.  We need a unity rally that all will participate in without restrictions, not a neutered response that could easily go South on us.
Link Posted: 12/28/2020 7:14:18 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Panta_Rei:
In complete agreement. Some of this forum discussion was used against us; however, people knew ANTIFA/Dem plants were there and I think some finally got the message, they are not in solidarity.  Kudos to all last Lobby Day, you participated in a display of spirit, force, discipline and constitutionality that no leftist causes could have done, and the traps were not set.  IMO, none of this is replicable this year and trying to remain relevent in this GA just shows desperation.  Let's celebrate a locality brave enough to defy Coonman, not play into his shenanigans, and better recruit and merge the division we have.  Let's make an out of control state government irrelevant and support locally elected officials that can carry this discussion that we are now denied by tyrants.  We need a unity rally that all will participate in without restrictions, not a neutered response that could easily go South on us.
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Why not both? You can protest against 2A infringements at the state level AND celebrate local leaders that respect the 2A.

I am behind enemy lines and so RVA is my only hope to be heard. I've spoken out locally and it gets us nowhere. Lots of bodies in Richmond makes the news and sends a message to the liberals that they have something to fear. Those of us in NoVa could use the help, brother.
Link Posted: 12/28/2020 8:07:23 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Gotterdammerung:


Why not both? You can protest against 2A infringements at the state level AND celebrate local leaders that respect the 2A.

I am behind enemy lines and so RVA is my only hope to be heard. I've spoken out locally and it gets us nowhere. Lots of bodies in Richmond makes the news and sends a message to the liberals that they have something to fear. Those of us in NoVa could use the help, brother.
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Because there isn't an effective plan, no lobbying, not a conducive place for community engagement,  too much distortion of actual attendence, new "rules"/ no permit, their turf set with their ID, tracking and response measures, corruptive elements that will be aggressive in RVA this time.  Why not drive the same distance to one of the Centrl VA town/counties that gave Coonman the finger and have a freedom fest and get better organized?  
Link Posted: 12/28/2020 8:53:20 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Panta_Rei:


Because there isn't an effective plan, no lobbying, not a conducive place for community engagement,  too much distortion of actual attendence, new "rules"/ no permit, their turf set with their ID, tracking and response measures, corruptive elements that will be aggressive in RVA this time.  Why not drive the same distance to one of the Centrl VA town/counties that gave Coonman the finger and have a freedom fest and get better organized?  
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Many of those in Richmond whose businesses we patronized became our supporters. Not saying they'll join us on the line, but we didn't make enemies there.

And abiding by their perversions of the rules isn't acceptable. Yes, there ought to be a court case by the vcdl if there is a chance to succeed and get the bell tower rally time back. However if it doesn't, there should be a protest not only against what's planned there, but also directly aimed at the government functionaries who aided and abetted the breach of the rules. They must know they are also accountable, there is no such thing as an anonymous apparatchik. This goes for the officers who so enthusiastically cleared the judiciary committee room the week prior to lobby day too.

We can obviously also do stuff to support those who support the bill of rights by having a celebration in their jurisdiction. This happens all the time, but more is better of course.
Link Posted: 12/28/2020 10:53:24 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/29/2020 12:46:13 PM EST by Riflenoob]
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Originally Posted By homeyclaus: officers who so enthusiastically cleared the judiciary committee room the week prior to lobby day too.
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Just leaving this video of mine here @homeyclaus , I know you were just a few seats away from me there.

Though it was after LD. As I recall -a comment in the original thread said “But they were so nice on lobby day. I wonder what changed?” rhetorically.

VIrginia Capitol and State Police Eject Citizens from House Committee after assault weapon ban vote


Just watching the support in the Vortex thread , etc , and not really sure yet what the deal is. Certainly seems like things are leaning in this thread to not having a lobby day showing @WhiskersTheCat @LexConcord where are you guys falling with this line of thought?
Link Posted: 12/28/2020 11:18:38 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Riflenoob:



Just leaving this video of mine here @homeyclaus , I know you were just a few seats away from me there.

Though it was after LD. As I recall -a comment in the original thread said “But they were so nice on lobby day. I wonder what changed?” rhetorically.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PebLrxV-dtg

Just watching the support in the Vortex thread , etc , and not really sure yet what the deal is. Certainly seems like things are leaning in this thread to not having a lobby day showing (I knew buying plates and carrier to not have a day in Richmond of being poked by a charging handle was getting ahead of myself! But I needed to have that stuff anyway). @WhiskersTheCat @LexConcord where are you guys falling with this line of thought?
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Originally Posted By Riflenoob:
Originally Posted By homeyclaus: officers who so enthusiastically cleared the judiciary committee room the week prior to lobby day too.



Just leaving this video of mine here @homeyclaus , I know you were just a few seats away from me there.

Though it was after LD. As I recall -a comment in the original thread said “But they were so nice on lobby day. I wonder what changed?” rhetorically.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PebLrxV-dtg

Just watching the support in the Vortex thread , etc , and not really sure yet what the deal is. Certainly seems like things are leaning in this thread to not having a lobby day showing (I knew buying plates and carrier to not have a day in Richmond of being poked by a charging handle was getting ahead of myself! But I needed to have that stuff anyway). @WhiskersTheCat @LexConcord where are you guys falling with this line of thought?

Decentralization will always be the key to freedom. Full stop.

Freedom can exist in spite of government, and do it peacefully. Thomas Jefferson knew this, you can observe this. How many upstate New Yorkers have d60s?

How many Marylanders just buy standard cap mags? It's about your community.

Society always beats government, every single time.
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 5:44:05 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Gotterdammerung:


Why not both? You can protest against 2A infringements at the state level AND celebrate local leaders that respect the 2A.

I am behind enemy lines and so RVA is my only hope to be heard. I've spoken out locally and it gets us nowhere. Lots of bodies in Richmond makes the news and sends a message to the liberals that they have something to fear. Those of us in NoVa could use the help, brother.
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Don't despair. Lobby day is happening. PM me.
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 7:14:17 AM EST
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Originally Posted By kilroymcb:
Don't despair. Lobby day is happening. PM me.
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Originally Posted By kilroymcb:
Originally Posted By Gotterdammerung:


Why not both? You can protest against 2A infringements at the state level AND celebrate local leaders that respect the 2A.

I am behind enemy lines and so RVA is my only hope to be heard. I've spoken out locally and it gets us nowhere. Lots of bodies in Richmond makes the news and sends a message to the liberals that they have something to fear. Those of us in NoVa could use the help, brother.
Don't despair. Lobby day is happening. PM me.


At least be accurate......there is no lobbying.....tough guy wanders aimlessly
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 8:04:02 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Panta_Rei:


At least be accurate......there is no lobbying.....tough guy wanders aimlessly
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Is that so? Thanks for clarifying.

Hey, before your membership expired, were you the guy with the satanic mask avatar that was constantly goading people? Like, accusing the community of being gutless, etc? Or am I confused?
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 8:18:15 AM EST
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Originally Posted By kilroymcb:
Is that so? Thanks for clarifying.

Hey, before your membership expired, were you the guy with the satanic mask avatar that was constantly goading people? Like, accusing the community of being gutless, etc? Or am I confused?
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Originally Posted By kilroymcb:
Originally Posted By Panta_Rei:


At least be accurate......there is no lobbying.....tough guy wanders aimlessly
Is that so? Thanks for clarifying.

Hey, before your membership expired, were you the guy with the satanic mask avatar that was constantly goading people? Like, accusing the community of being gutless, etc? Or am I confused?


Negative and I'm not saying you are gutless or all that confused.......the situation is screwed up and there is a lack of leadership and out of the box thinking for an entirely new and disadvantaged situation.  
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 8:26:26 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/29/2020 8:35:20 AM EST by kilroymcb]
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Originally Posted By Panta_Rei:


Negative and I'm not saying you are gutless or all that confused.......the situation is screwed up and there is a lack of leadership and out of the box thinking for an entirely new and disadvantaged situation.  
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It seems to me the only thing that has really changed is the degree to which the law is being perverted to try to shut our mouths and cover our eyes.

So, the legislators likely won't be there. They will be in Zoom meetings. So what? Do you think they don't watch the news? Do you think the image of thousands of people surrounding a tiny kernel of Moms Demanding Action will be lost on them? If anything, it will put a fitting exclamation mark on the sort of resistance they can expect under this new administration.

Two days before inauguration day. If you want to muster groups to go lobby at people's houses, that is fine as well.  How is that working out for you? But part of projecting power is the ability to mass despite current conditions at the place of your choosing, despite obstacles.

To reiterate, lobby day is happening. You don't see the open discussion of it on GD because we know the opposing force has a monitoring presence there. But if you go, you should know who you are going with.
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 8:28:06 AM EST
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 8:28:19 AM EST
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 8:36:03 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/29/2020 8:37:15 AM EST by Panta_Rei]
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Originally Posted By Ben:


Do not assume that a lapse of incoming artillery means anything except that the observer is adjusting fire.
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We are thinking in different timelines.  There's little to gain in the coming weeks and possibly much to lose.  We have far less momentum than last year, and a lot of people that previously attended are just fatigued with chaos and negativity this year.  You will recruit SOME of the toughest of the bunch, but is that enough or the right response right now? I'd still like to know the objectives.  ETA......I'd also like to know what made you rethink your question of alternatives a few days ago?
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 8:43:40 AM EST
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 8:52:05 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Ben:


I've not rethought taking alternative courses of action.

You are correct in that there is much to potentially lose, and seemingly little to gain.

So change the game.
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Your role is a bit independent of VCDL.  I can only speak to VCDL's proposal and it sucks. I'll PM you later.
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 10:43:24 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Panta_Rei:



Your role is a bit independent of VCDL.  I can only speak to VCDL's proposal and it sucks. I'll PM you later.
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Originally Posted By Panta_Rei:
Originally Posted By Ben:


I've not rethought taking alternative courses of action.

You are correct in that there is much to potentially lose, and seemingly little to gain.

So change the game.



Your role is a bit independent of VCDL.  I can only speak to VCDL's proposal and it sucks. I'll PM you later.


@Panta_Rei I don’t know you from Adam, maybe we have met at some point, I don’t remember.

What do you mean by “your role” in the comment to @Ben ?

What is your role as you see it?  

If you see a gap, step up and fill it with the leadership you seem to be looking for.

Otherwise, you just sound like you are complaining.
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 2:00:17 PM EST
While VCDL's approach for January may not be what I would have planned, I'll not speak ill of it.  Philip has poured blood, sweat, and tears into this for many, many years, and I support him and VCDL.  

I've been lobbying in Richmond for years (Since Wilder pushing one-gun-a-month), most years as part of the VCDL crowd, often with family, and not having to miss too many years over the past decades.  

But the times are changing, as has been mentioned.  Approaches are evolving, and there's plenty of space to give a thumbs up to VCDL while working alternative / additional approaches.  I'm sure word of those alternative / additional approaches will spread, and I agree that it's wise that the open forums are not ideal for planning.  
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 3:38:50 PM EST
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Originally Posted By kilroymcb:
It seems to me the only thing that has really changed is the degree to which the law is being perverted to try to shut our mouths and cover our eyes.

So, the legislators likely won't be there. They will be in Zoom meetings. So what? Do you think they don't watch the news? Do you think the image of thousands of people surrounding a tiny kernel of Moms Demanding Action will be lost on them? If anything, it will put a fitting exclamation mark on the sort of resistance they can expect under this new administration.

Two days before inauguration day. If you want to muster groups to go lobby at people's houses, that is fine as well.  How is that working out for you? But part of projecting power is the ability to mass despite current conditions at the place of your choosing, despite obstacles.

To reiterate, lobby day is happening. You don't see the open discussion of it on GD because we know the opposing force has a monitoring presence there. But if you go, you should know who you are going with.
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Exactly. This is still a political fight and we need to pressure them on all fronts.
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 3:40:59 PM EST
[Last Edit: 12/29/2020 3:41:28 PM EST by AndBen]
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Originally Posted By DrMark:
While VCDL's approach for January may not be what I would have planned, I'll not speak ill of it.  Philip has poured blood, sweat, and tears into this for many, many years, and I support him and VCDL.  

I've been lobbying in Richmond for years (Since Wilder pushing one-gun-a-month), most years as part of the VCDL crowd, often with family, and not having to miss too many years over the past decades.  

But the times are changing, as has been mentioned.  Approaches are evolving, and there's plenty of space to give a thumbs up to VCDL while working alternative / additional approaches.  I'm sure word of those alternative / additional approaches will spread, and I agree that it's wise that the open forums are not ideal for planning.  
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Well said. This is exactly where I am at too. I won't devalue VCDL and all the good they have done, but I am interested in other ideas too.
Link Posted: 12/29/2020 4:27:31 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Tim_in_CO:


@Panta_Rei I don’t know you from Adam, maybe we have met at some point, I don’t remember.

What do you mean by “your role” in the comment to @Ben ?

What is your role as you see it?  

If you see a gap, step up and fill it with the leadership you seem to be looking for.

Otherwise, you just sound like you are complaining.
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Originally Posted By Tim_in_CO:
Originally Posted By Panta_Rei:
Originally Posted By Ben:


I've not rethought taking alternative courses of action.

You are correct in that there is much to potentially lose, and seemingly little to gain.

So change the game.



Your role is a bit independent of VCDL.  I can only speak to VCDL's proposal and it sucks. I'll PM you later.


@Panta_Rei I don’t know you from Adam, maybe we have met at some point, I don’t remember.

What do you mean by “your role” in the comment to @Ben ?

What is your role as you see it?  

If you see a gap, step up and fill it with the leadership you seem to be looking for.

Otherwise, you just sound like you are complaining.


It's well known Ben has had an effective leadership role, so not sure why the comment is an issue.

Definitely a complaint, but did you ignore my questions and considerations????  I give kudos to VCDL often, as well as challenge when they need it.  Regardless, I give PVC a pat on the back whenever I see him, he does a lot.  I'm doing my part, focused on a Constitutional counties and cohesive communities. We meet weekly, but it's a personal challenge as I'm never home. What more do you suggest?



Be certain we have not met
Link Posted: 12/30/2020 11:55:54 AM EST
Ready to find out the plan with my ARF brothers. I am hoping if it’s the same place I last met with many of you, it’s not as windy!
Link Posted: 1/1/2021 8:49:28 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Riflenoob:
Ready to find out the plan with my ARF brothers. I am hoping if it’s the same place I last met with many of you, it’s not as windy!
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Same here. I don’t need to know the plan I just need to know where and when.
Link Posted: 1/7/2021 1:39:21 PM EST
A little worried on the timing of this, by this time last year we had 200 pages of threads. It may be hard to get out of staters in great numbers if a plan isn’t presented soon. I support what you’re doing but I hope I can start spreading the word and carpools soon.
Link Posted: 1/7/2021 1:46:35 PM EST
Link Posted: 1/7/2021 2:26:14 PM EST
Link Posted: 1/7/2021 2:54:51 PM EST
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Originally Posted By bulldog1967:
State of Emergency has been extended through January 20th.
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Just keep upping the stakes.
Link Posted: 1/7/2021 3:03:11 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/7/2021 3:03:26 PM EST by BennyFranklin]
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Originally Posted By bulldog1967:
State of Emergency has been extended through January 20th.
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...yeah because the whole country will be 'healed' after that moment in time.  Unicorns that crap gold bullion will fly across the land and cry healing tears until all are equal and whole.

Link Posted: 1/7/2021 3:14:04 PM EST
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Originally Posted By BennyFranklin:


...yeah because the whole country will be 'healed' after that moment in time.  Unicorns that crap gold bullion will fly across the land and cry healing tears until all are equal and whole.

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It won't be healed until the sinners have been punished.

That's how that ritual goes.

Are you ready to be punished?
Link Posted: 1/7/2021 3:28:57 PM EST
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Originally Posted By kilroymcb:
It won't be healed until the sinners have been punished.

That's how that ritual goes.

Are you ready to be punished?
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Only if it's Gina Carano doing the spanking.
Link Posted: 1/7/2021 9:39:00 PM EST
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Originally Posted By Ben:



Please understand that last year and this year were completely apples to oranges even before yesterday.  We have entered a time when we should all be ready to depart at a moments notice.  

We will have more info for you soon, in a few days.  There are important reasons nothing is being posted publically.
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Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 1/7/2021 10:49:33 PM EST
They can draw a box around the geographical area they are interested in, identify every cell connected device inside, and then track them forward and backwards to figure out where they went, what other devices they came in contact with, etc. This is commercially available technology, not government stuff. They don't need license plate readers etc. (but they have them too).
Link Posted: 1/8/2021 12:56:17 AM EST
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Originally Posted By vtmarine:
They can draw a box around the geographical area they are interested in, identify every cell connected device inside, and then track them forward and backwards to figure out where they went, what other devices they came in contact with, etc. This is commercially available technology, not government stuff. They don't need license plate readers etc. (but they have them too).
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You plan on carrying a phone?
Link Posted: 1/8/2021 6:48:34 AM EST
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Originally Posted By vtmarine:
They can draw a box around the geographical area they are interested in, identify every cell connected device inside, and then track them forward and backwards to figure out where they went, what other devices they came in contact with, etc. This is commercially available technology, not government stuff. They don't need license plate readers etc. (but they have them too).
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Don't even need to do that anymore.  Wi-Fi triangulation is much easier and more accurate.

Mr. Farady bag is your friend here.
Link Posted: 1/8/2021 8:31:18 AM EST
Not attending this year, but did last year.  I spent my "trip" money on DC.

God Bless and good luck!
Link Posted: 1/9/2021 11:48:17 PM EST
[Last Edit: 1/10/2021 11:17:58 AM EST by ad_nauseam]
Here is a Telegram group dedicated to the 2021 Rattlesnake Rally (but also suitable for any political topics posted on GD, as an alternative forum)

Telegram: 2021 Rattlesnake Rally

Go into Settings / Privacy and Security / Phone number.
In the section "who can see my phone number", set it to "Nobody".
Link Posted: 1/10/2021 6:45:12 PM EST
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Originally Posted By ad_nauseam:
Here is a Telegram group dedicated to the 2021 Rattlesnake Rally (but also suitable for any political topics posted on GD, as an alternative forum)

Telegram: 2021 Rattlesnake Rally

Go into Settings / Privacy and Security / Phone number.
In the section "who can see my phone number", set it to "Nobody".
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Joined. Sent a test message.
Link Posted: 1/11/2021 7:20:55 AM EST
[Last Edit: 1/11/2021 7:22:27 AM EST by hodgescl]
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Originally Posted By stone-age:


Joined. Sent a test message.
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Originally Posted By stone-age:
Originally Posted By ad_nauseam:
Here is a Telegram group dedicated to the 2021 Rattlesnake Rally (but also suitable for any political topics posted on GD, as an alternative forum)

Telegram: 2021 Rattlesnake Rally

Go into Settings / Privacy and Security / Phone number.
In the section "who can see my phone number", set it to "Nobody".


Joined. Sent a test message.


Same.

been the last two years, I’ll make it this year regardless.


Link Posted: 1/12/2021 1:43:30 AM EST
If I can figure out how to install telegram bypassing the google store, I'll make an appearance.  But maybe someone who's already in should let us know if it's even worth bothering now after APC's statement.
Link Posted: 1/12/2021 6:11:17 AM EST
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Originally Posted By Klaustrophobia:
If I can figure out how to install telegram bypassing the google store, I'll make an appearance.  But maybe someone who's already in should let us know if it's even worth bothering now after APC's statement.
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Here you go .   Just download and install this file on your phone.

TELEGRAM APK
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