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9/19/2017 7:27:10 PM
Posted: 3/11/2006 3:26:36 PM EDT
leverguns.sixgunner.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=15595

Do any and everything you can to help!
Link Posted: 3/11/2006 3:45:23 PM EDT
Thanks for the heads-up.

What are some of the makes and models of leverguns that would be legalized? (I'm levergun illiterate.) I'd also have to put a scope on one if I were to have any hopes of hitting a deer.
Link Posted: 3/11/2006 6:54:07 PM EDT
Introduced by Senator Waterman:

SENATE BILL No. 263

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A BILL FOR AN ACT concerning natural and cultural resources.

Be it enacted by the General Assembly of the State of Indiana:


SOURCE: ; (06)IN0263.1.1. --> SECTION 1. [EFFECTIVE JULY 1, 2006] (a) As used in this SECTION, "department" refers to the department of natural resources.
(b) Before July 1, 2007, the director of the department shall adopt rules under IC 14-22-2-6 to establish a hunting season in which rifles that meet the following requirements may be used:
(1) The rifle is an authentic or reproduction of an exposed hammer or carbine rifle manufactured between 1860 and 1899.
(2) The rifle uses lever, rolling block, or slide action.
(3) The rifle uses ammunition that is tubular fed.
(4) The rifle uses centerfire ammunition that is not less than .25-20 caliber.
(5) The rifle has a barrel length of at least sixteen (16) inches.
(6) The rifle does not use a box magazine.
(7) The rifle meets any other requirements established by the department.
(c) The department may allow the use of other firearms that are
authentic or reproductions of firearms that were manufactured before 1899 that meet requirements established by the department.
(d) This SECTION expires July 1, 2010.

Link Posted: 3/12/2006 2:09:40 PM EDT
This could be good news for the deer hunter.......especially with the introduction of the new ballistic tip 30/30 ammo that is offering much better ballistic trajectories than the common soft points.
Link Posted: 3/12/2006 4:41:25 PM EDT
I'm wondering what repro means or implies. Does that mean the old standby Marlin 336 would be usable?
Just from what I've seen in this post, I don't expect this to go through, but who knows.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 5:41:34 AM EDT
Doesn't look like it is happening anytime soon. I emailed Brent Steele about it. He sent an email through his assistant.

The following is a message from Senator Brent Steele:

Thank you for your recent email. I appreciate your support for my
funeral sanctity bill. This was an important piece of legislation for
our soldiers and their families.

Regarding Senate Bill 263, the bill was assigned to the Senate Committee
on Natural Resources in January. The bill did not receive a hearing in
this committee; therefore, it will not advance in the General Assembly
during this legislative session.

Again, thank you for contacting me. If I can ever be of assistance to
you in the future, please let me know.

Brent

Jennifer L. Pearsey
Legislative Assistant
Indiana Senate Majority Caucus
200 West Washington Street
Indianapolis, IN 46204
317.232.9814
jpearsey@iga.state.in.us
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 11:20:48 AM EDT
Being from Michigan originally, the Lever 30/30 has probably taken more deer up there than anything else. But on the flip side, I recall an article or two in years past on the number of "poorly shot 30/30 deer" that were never recovered.

Of course....shot placement is most important.

We were die hard bolt action .308, .30-06, 7mm Rem Mag etc.... but we hunted the fields, sod farms, swamps and the power lines that offered the longer shots (150+ yds).

It would be a nice option to carry a Lever for deer in Indiana though.

Thanks for the update,
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 11:59:39 AM EDT

Originally Posted By L0CK_N_L0AD:

We were die hard bolt action .308, .30-06, 7mm Rem Mag etc....

It would be a nice option to carry a Lever for deer in Indiana though.


I have a friend in Ohio who uses a light weight Browning lever in .308. I was thinking of adding a .308 bolt to my arsenal for deer hunting in KY but a lever could do double duty here in the future.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 2:07:54 PM EDT
To quote a DNR conservation officer who frequents another website:

"This bill was pulled with the understanding that the DNR will address the issue of a rifle season in the near future. I did say "address" not pass. With the administration now I find it hard see a rifle season at anytime in the future."
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 2:24:15 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/13/2006 2:26:46 PM EDT by Gunluster]
First off, I would not support centerfired rifle hunting in Indiana. Second, the author of this legislation did not think it through very well. The deer population is usually stated to be in the 300,000 to 350,000 range. Roughly 1/3 of that population is killed every year by Hoosier hunters. They do re-populate rather quickly. The average length of shot taken by Hoosier hunters (info that I have gathered from the hunters at this check station) would be roughly 40 yards. Yes, I know that hunters in the northern part of the state might lengthen that some, but not that often. What advantage would the lever action rifle give the Hoosier hunter? In my opinion none.
The legislation has a major flaw. A hunter in Indiana can use a handgun with a minimum bullet diameter of .243. The minimum bullet diameter in the "lever legislation" is .25-20. Why would you want to support a piece of legislature that would not let hunters use rifles of modern design? Do you not want hunters to have the advantage of a detachable magazine to safely unload in the field? Under this legislation the only two rifle designs that would lend themselves to scope use would be the Marlin 336 series, and the Winchester 94 AE series(RIP). There would be a fine line according to this legislation to whether the Savage 99 could be used. So, on that note, who can afford to go out and buy a Browning High wall, or Low wall, rifle just for the hell of it? It just doesn't make the grade.
Another issue that should have been made manditory in this legislation, in my opinion, would be EVERY hunter go through a state certified hunter's safety course. I have seen too damn many hunters other the years that can hardly write their name, let alone read a NO TREASPASSING sign. If the huge step is to be taken to allow centerfire rifles education needs to be implemented.
These are my opinions, but I think they are valid points. I might be flamed, but oh well. I have checked in deer for 13 years, and sold licenses for 16 years. I have thought this over many, many times. That's my two cents.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 3:51:23 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Gunluster:
First off, I would not support centerfired rifle hunting in Indiana. Second, the author of this legislation did not think it through very well. The deer population is usually stated to be in the 300,000 to 350,000 range. Roughly 1/3 of that population is killed every year by Hoosier hunters. They do re-populate rather quickly. The average length of shot taken by Hoosier hunters (info that I have gathered from the hunters at this check station) would be roughly 40 yards. Yes, I know that hunters in the northern part of the state might lengthen that some, but not that often. What advantage would the lever action rifle give the Hoosier hunter? In my opinion none.
The legislation has a major flaw. A hunter in Indiana can use a handgun with a minimum bullet diameter of .243. The minimum bullet diameter in the "lever legislation" is .25-20. Why would you want to support a piece of legislature that would not let hunters use rifles of modern design? Do you not want hunters to have the advantage of a detachable magazine to safely unload in the field? Under this legislation the only two rifle designs that would lend themselves to scope use would be the Marlin 336 series, and the Winchester 94 AE series(RIP). There would be a fine line according to this legislation to whether the Savage 99 could be used. So, on that note, who can afford to go out and buy a Browning High wall, or Low wall, rifle just for the hell of it? It just doesn't make the grade.
Another issue that should have been made manditory in this legislation, in my opinion, would be EVERY hunter go through a state certified hunter's safety course. I have seen too damn many hunters other the years that can hardly write their name, let alone read a NO TREASPASSING sign. If the huge step is to be taken to allow centerfire rifles education needs to be implemented.
These are my opinions, but I think they are valid points. I might be flamed, but oh well. I have checked in deer for 13 years, and sold licenses for 16 years. I have thought this over many, many times. That's my two cents.



You make a good argument......I have been at your place of business and seen a few of the people you mention above.

I would be in favor of a mandatory hunter education class but someone would have to fund it, and that someone would not be the state of IN. Therefore, it would be left up to the hunter to pay for it, and many hunters are already giving up hunting
b/c of the increasing license fees....well, they are either giving it up or hunting w/out a license.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 3:57:58 PM EDT
I also fail to understand why in the hell it is legal to hunt deer w/ a 20" barreled Pistol but not legal to do so with a shoulder-fired rifle.

The argument against rifles here is that there are too many houses, people, yada yada yada......
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 4:20:33 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/13/2006 4:21:24 PM EDT by Zoub]

Originally Posted By Gunluster:
If the huge step is to be taken to allow centerfire rifles education needs to be implemented.....


I don't think it is a huge step when I am shooting the equivalent of a .50 caliber now with my rifled sabots. Only difference is range. I treat all my shots the same way and when I hunt in KY I use both rifle and shotgun.

Now since I believe in training, do it for a living daily, I think the case could be made that training for use of center fire rifles would help reduce hunting accidents. I took the hunter ed class when it first came out. Back then it was not required; we all just did it anyway. I am older then the minimum age now required to have it, but by the laws of nature eventually everyone in the field will have a hunter ed card.

In some states like VA, they do it by county. Some county's allow rifle others do not, I think based on population density. That could be a good model for us too.

But I would not want to see hunting end being only for the rich, educated and privileged. Sounds too much like Britain to me.
Link Posted: 3/13/2006 4:26:35 PM EDT

Originally Posted By buckfever34:
I also fail to understand why in the hell it is legal to hunt deer w/ a 20" barreled Pistol but not legal to do so with a shoulder-fired rifle.

The argument against rifles here is that there are too many houses, people, yada yada yada......



There isn't much logic behind the decision to permit a .44 Magnum revolver with a barrel as long as your forearm and prohibiting a lever action rifle like a Marlin M-1894. I dare anyone to show me a statistically significant study that predicts an increase in the fatality rate among Hoosier deer hunters and innocent bystanders as a result of allowing the use of rifles in straight wall center fire cartridges now permitted in handguns.

The strongest reason that legislation permitting these lever action rifles will die is because none of the major firearm manufacturers like Marlin are based in Indiana. Also, no legislator or IDNR official wants to stick her or his neck out by proposing a higher license fee for hunters who want to use the rifles. In effect, there is no answer to the "What's in it for me?" question.

The best way to influence the passage of legislation is for Hoosier gun shop owners to lobby for it. Unfortunately, since a lot of those firearms would be purchased at Wal-Mart, and Wal-Mart won't 'dirty'' themselves by lobbying for new 'gun laws', the power of the local gun shop owners is diluted.
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