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Posted: 4/9/2006 4:30:33 PM EST
Howdy,

I carry a little backpack with me to work and back every day. I throw all my stuff that I tend to forget like spare keys and sundries etc.

My question: Is it legal to have a fixed blade knife inside the backpack? I don't walk around town with it but it's on my shoulder into work and out of work and in my car in between.

I don't mean some big Rambo blade. It's a BKT Campanion specifically.

Any ideas?
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 7:12:15 PM EST
Don't think its legal since it's a fixed blade. IIRC if you conceal one on your person it's a felony and I'd imagine having it in your backpack would be the same.
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 7:27:01 PM EST
I suspect that is the case also. Hopefully one of our LEO members will weigh in with the definitive. As it is, I don't think I'll be a test case.

I'll just get one of those big-ass Benchmade folders. That'll be safer for the children.
Link Posted: 4/9/2006 8:23:44 PM EST
12020 P.C. states a concealed fixed blade knife capable of being readily used as a stabbing weapon would be a felony. Seeing as how the knife is concealed in a backpack, it is not readily accessible as a stabbing weapon. This is just the opinion of a lone Deputy, I can’t say an over zealous city cop would say the same.
Link Posted: 4/10/2006 12:46:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/10/2006 12:48:38 AM EST by cobracommand]
If you dont need regular access to it but you just want it in your pack, maybe it could be locked in an internal pocket or something...treat it kind of like transporting a pistol. Just a thought.

I'm sure someday there will be a CA DOJ approved knife lock that will need to be supplied (at a price no less than eight dollars) with all blades sold in the PRK

edited for spelling
Link Posted: 4/10/2006 5:43:48 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/10/2006 5:44:00 AM EST by photog]
If you strapped it to the OUTSIDE of the pack, it would not be concealed. Its not illegal to carry a fixed blade, just to conceal it.
Link Posted: 4/10/2006 5:59:04 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/10/2006 5:59:59 AM EST by brassburn]

12020 P.C. states a concealed fixed blade knife capable of being readily used as a stabbing weapon would be a felony. Seeing as how the knife is concealed in a backpack, it is not readily accessible as a stabbing weapon. This is just the opinion of a lone Deputy, I can’t say an over zealous city cop would say the same.


Thanks couvillion. Looks like that is pretty open to interpretation as you pointed out. To me, it's cut and dried: it's in a backpack and it is a stretch to imagine that it would be "readily used".

However, I still have no desire to test the waters!

Photog: It's true that it would no longer be concealed if strapped to the outside of my pack. This is a simple day pack for an IT manager type. It would draw unwanted attention!

ETA: Thanks for the responses. Based on all replies, I think I'll just throw a good folder in there and not worry about it.
Link Posted: 4/10/2006 6:45:46 AM EST
Its funny that you cant conceal a 3" fixed blade knife, but you can strap a machete to your leg and walk around perfectly legal.

I was watching some late night TV last night and on the knife show, they had like 25 different folders and once big ass fixed blade on sale for $34.50. Almost thought about getting them just to throw them in bags and in cars and whatnot as essentially disposable knives.
Link Posted: 4/10/2006 8:33:14 AM EST
is okay to carry conceal foldable knife?
Link Posted: 4/10/2006 9:08:33 AM EST

Originally Posted By tpliquid:
is okay to carry conceal foldable knife?



Yes, if it's folded and doesn't fit the definition of "switchblade knife" in PC 653k.


653k. Every person who possesses in the passenger's or driver's
area of any motor vehicle in any public place or place open to the
public, carries upon his or her person, and every person who sells,
offers for sale, exposes for sale, loans, transfers, or gives to any
other person a switchblade knife having a blade two or more inches in
length is guilty of a misdemeanor.
For the purposes of this section, "switchblade knife" means a
knife having the appearance of a pocketknife and includes a
spring-blade knife, snap-blade knife, gravity knife or any other
similar type knife, the blade or blades of which are two or more
inches in length and which can be released automatically by a flick
of a button, pressure on the handle, flip of the wrist or other
mechanical device, or is released by the weight of the blade or by
any type of mechanism whatsoever. "Switchblade knife" does not
include a knife that opens with one hand utilizing thumb pressure
applied solely to the blade of the knife or a thumb stud attached to
the blade, provided that the knife has a detent or other mechanism
that provides resistance that must be overcome in opening the blade,
or that biases the blade back toward its closed position.
For purposes of this section, "passenger's or driver's area" means
that part of a motor vehicle which is designed to carry the driver
and passengers, including any interior compartment or space therein.



Linky www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=pen&group=00001-01000&file=639-653.1
Link Posted: 4/10/2006 9:59:54 AM EST
Correct, as long as it's a folder and has no "automatic" functionality you are good to go.
Link Posted: 4/10/2006 4:32:51 PM EST
Kershaw's Assisted-open folders are legal. If you push the blade and it opens its ok, if you push something other than the blade and it opens is not ok. I carry a Kershaw Leek, very nice for daily use.
Link Posted: 4/10/2006 5:26:02 PM EST
I've got one of the Kershaws as well, very nice knife, and the assisted opening requires very little effort to get it to pop open. The only down side to it, is the blade material isn't as strong as some of the others out there. But for the price it's hard to beat.
Link Posted: 4/10/2006 7:04:48 PM EST
Link Posted: 4/10/2006 11:56:16 PM EST

Originally Posted By tpliquid:
is okay to carry conceal foldable knife?



Yes, as mentioned. I carry a CRKT M16-14LE almost everywhere I go. It's a pretty big folder, but it's narrow, like a 1911.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 6:58:37 PM EST

Originally Posted By tpliquid:
is okay to carry conceal foldable knife?

I think there is a limit on the length of the blade.
Link Posted: 4/11/2006 7:36:21 PM EST

Originally Posted By pieeater:

Originally Posted By tpliquid:
is okay to carry conceal foldable knife?

I think there is a limit on the length of the blade.



The City of Los Angeles, L.A. County, Berkeley, and a few other localities have limits on blade length of a folder. Some of those laws have exceptions for knives that are being carried as tools, so selective enforcement is possible.

State law i.e. PC 653k (quoted above) does not have a blade length limit other than exempting switchblades with blades under 2 inches.
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 7:08:18 AM EST
so I can wear a straight blade that is not concealed while riding my motorcycle, at the mall, etc... it just cannot be a double edge, right?
no length limitations at all?
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 7:15:42 AM EST
[Last Edit: 4/12/2006 7:19:12 AM EST by California_Kid]

Originally Posted By 2T2_Crash:
so I can wear a straight blade that is not concealed while riding my motorcycle, at the mall, etc... it just cannot be a double edge, right?
no length limitations at all?



I believe a double-edged knife is legal if it's exposed.

I'd think riding a motorcycle with a Claymore or Conan the Barbarian sword would be kind of a hassle.

See PC Section 12020 etc. Look for the terms "dirk" and "dagger".
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 9:27:19 AM EST

Originally Posted By California_Kid:

I believe a double-edged knife is legal if it's exposed.

I'd think riding a motorcycle with a Claymore or Conan the Barbarian sword would be kind of a hassle.

See PC Section 12020 etc. Look for the terms "dirk" and "dagger".



Thanks! I hate not being armed... I cannot carry my normal carry knife unless it im in uniform, its a benchmade auto that was issued to me, and my Benchmade Applegate is a tad big for a folder.
Link Posted: 4/12/2006 11:36:47 AM EST

Originally Posted By Paul:
My fixed is 7.5" long and hangs from my pack. That's it at the bottom of the picture between the desert camo first aid kit and the boots.

photos.ar15.com/ImageGallery/Attachments/DownloadAttach.asp?iImageUnq=46282

Is that a gen-u-ine Bauer man purse?
Link Posted: 4/13/2006 12:16:52 PM EST

Originally Posted By couvillion:
12020 P.C. states a concealed fixed blade knife capable of being readily used as a stabbing weapon would be a felony. Seeing as how the knife is concealed in a backpack, it is not readily accessible as a stabbing weapon. This is just the opinion of a lone Deputy, I can’t say an over zealous city cop would say the same.



I agree.

the elements of the crime for CPC 12020 Dirk or dagger are;
1. concealed on the person.
2. Capable of ready use as a stabbing instrument.

A concealed fix blade in a backback, tool box, glove compartment, ect is not concealed on your person or capable of ready use.

The majority of my "dirk or dagger" arrests have been gang bangers with screwdrivers stuffed in their waist band or lock blade knives locked open and carried concealed in their pocket.

Like everything, if you're a documented criminal street gang members the cops will push it as far as they can and might arrest you for a concealed fixed blade in your backpack. especially if you are on probation or pareol with a no weapons provision. But for the average person, its very unlikely you would be arrested.
Link Posted: 4/13/2006 12:20:01 PM EST

Originally Posted By LOW2000:
Its funny that you cant conceal a 3" fixed blade knife, but you can strap a machete to your leg and walk around perfectly legal.




the legislative intent of the law is to prevent a person from producing a hidden blade in a dispute. If you're in a heated arguement with a guy openly carrying a machete you are going to exercise a certain level of caution.
Link Posted: 4/13/2006 12:24:57 PM EST

Originally Posted By photog:
Kershaw's Assisted-open folders are legal. If you push the blade and it opens its ok, if you push something other than the blade and it opens is not ok. I carry a Kershaw Leek, very nice for daily use.



You are correct. However i have seen several people ticketed for CPC 653k for the assisted opener Kershaws. Some plead out and are thus wrongly convcted. Some fight their cases and get them dismissed. It's a problem of the law not keeping up with technology and the cops and the DA's not getting good legal updates/training.

If you find yourself arrested or cited for CPC 653k for an assisted opener or thumb stud/hole in the blade opener do not plead out. Fight the case and contact Kershaw. I have seen kershaws response to dicovery requests on this issue and they will provide legal opinion in support of the defense for those wrongly arrested for their assisted openers.
Link Posted: 4/13/2006 12:54:44 PM EST

Originally Posted By brassburn:
Correct, as long as it's a folder and has no "automatic" functionality you are good to go.


with the exception of public school grounds to include colleges and universitys.

See
CPC 171b(3) Knife over 4" in public meeting or public building.

CPC 626.10 Knives, Razors, Tasers, Stun Guns on school grounds.
Link Posted: 4/13/2006 2:07:50 PM EST
[Last Edit: 4/13/2006 2:08:31 PM EST by Paul]
Link Posted: 4/14/2006 9:30:29 AM EST

with the exception of public school grounds to include colleges and universitys.

See
CPC 171b(3) Knife over 4" in public meeting or public building.

CPC 626.10 Knives, Razors, Tasers, Stun Guns on school grounds.



Got it. Thanks for the clarification.
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