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Posted: 3/26/2006 4:09:41 PM EDT
Reading about the "Capital Hill MASSACRE" all day long from the news reporters who seem to be overjoyed to sensationalize this situation, my guess is tomorrow, Gregoire is going to be calling for an assault weapons ban even though none were used in the crime. Gerlikowski seem very focused on the fact that the murderer used a pistol grip shotgun, and had bandoleers of ammo, "banana" clips etc. Seems to be a gift for Washington Ceasefire's hopes of disarming us. I hope I'm wrong, but it seems like the liberals in this state will use any excuse to ban firearms they can, nevermind the facts. So what do you all think?
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 4:15:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2006 4:17:01 PM EDT by R-32]
It dont matter...


I dont have a assault weapon.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:01:51 PM EDT
By the time the next legislative session rolls around this will be old news.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:02:07 PM EDT
I'm suprised we havn't heard more on the subject. Surely it will come up again before she succumbs to Dino.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:11:46 PM EDT
The Tacoma Mall incident didn't do anything to even come CLOSE to closing the "Gunshow Loophole".....It would seem that one or two people try to get these laws passed, and every year, they find out that there are WAY more people interested in them not passing.....

Lets keep it this way. and work on keeping the nutjobs in prison or California.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:15:51 PM EDT
They started on it right away

releases.usnewswire.com/GetRelease.asp?id=62930


Washington CeaseFire Mourns Victims of Early Morning Gun Violence:
Capitol Hill, Puyallup Shootings Expose Lax Gun Safety Laws

3/25/2006 3:04:00 PM

To: State Desk

Contact: Natalie Reber, 206-683-0160 or Jon Scholes, 206-280-4032,
both of Washington CeaseFire

SEATTLE, March 25 /U.S. Newswire/ -- Washington CeaseFire, the
State's largest gun safety advocacy organization, today reacted to
the tragic incidents of gun violence that have shaken the Puget Sound
region. Early reports indicate six individuals were gunned down and
several others were injured by a heavily armed man on Capitol Hill.
In Puyallup, a police officer was recovering after being shot in the
face after responding to suspicious activity.

"These tragedies highlight that is it all too easy for the wrong
people in our State to gain access to guns and do harm," said Natalie
Reber, executive director of Washington CeaseFire. "Washington
elected leaders must do more to strengthen our guns laws so we can
keep guns out of the wrong hands and keep our communities safe."

The Capitol Hill shooting occurred less than 24 hours after over 120
CeaseFire members, civic leaders and law enforcement officials
gathered in downtown Seattle on Friday to honor Seattle Police Chief
Gil Kerlikowske and thank Seattle Mayor Greg Nickels for their
dedication and work to end gun violence in Washington State. Chief
Kerlikowske was presented with the Delores Jones Person of the Year
award for his National and local efforts to pass tough gun safety
laws. The Chief and the Mayor called for closing loopholes in
existing Washington State laws to prevent criminals and other
prohibited individuals from obtaining access to guns.

"It is a sad irony, that in less than 24 hours after receiving an
award for his work to end gun violence, Chief Kerlikowske is on the
scene of one of Seattle's deadliest shootings ever," said Ralph
Fasceteli, president of Washington CeaseFire.

"It should not take tragedies such as the one we have witnessed today
on Capitol Hill in Seattle, to call attention to the need for
stronger gun safety laws in Washington State," said Jon Scholes, vice
president of Washington CeaseFire. "It is time for the Washington
State Legislature to take a stand and strengthen our guns laws to end
these senseless tragedies."

Washington CeaseFire has lobbied the State Legislature for the past 5
years to require background checks at gun shows, calling its number
one legislative priority. Currently, thousands of firearms are sold
at gun shows in Washington State with no questions asked and no
background checks required. There are approximately 60 gun shows held
throughout Washington State every year.

Gun Facts:

-- Two thirds of King County firearm deaths occur in the home.
(Seattle and King County Public Health Death Watch, August 2000)

-- 33 percent of Washington homes contain a gun. (Washington State
Department of Health, Behavioral Health Survey, 2002)

-- One out of seven guns in Washington State is stored unlocked.
(Belo Marketing Solutions, 2002)

Washington CeaseFire is a nonprofit advocacy organization dedicated
to reducing gun violence in Washington State through education and
legislative action. Founded in 1983, CeaseFire has grown to more than
3,500 members throughout the State.



Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:20:27 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/26/2006 5:22:53 PM EDT by PCR-00]

Originally Posted By Phil_in_Seattle:
Chief
Kerlikowske was presented with the Delores Jones Person of the Year
award for his National and local efforts to pass tough gun safety
laws.
The Chief and the Mayor called for closing loopholes in
existing Washington State laws to prevent criminals and other
prohibited individuals from obtaining access to guns.





RCW 9.41.050
Carrying firearms.
(1)(a) Except in the person's place of abode or fixed place of business, a person shall not carry a pistol concealed on his or her person without a license to carry a concealed pistol.

(b) Every licensee shall have his or her concealed pistol license in his or her immediate possession at all times that he or she is required by this section to have a concealed pistol license and shall display the same upon demand to any police officer or to any other person when and if required by law to do so. Any violation of this subsection (1)(b) shall be a class 1 civil infraction under chapter 7.80 RCW and shall be punished accordingly pursuant to chapter 7.80 RCW and the infraction rules for courts of limited jurisdiction.

(2)(a) A person shall not carry or place a loaded pistol in any vehicle unless the person has a license to carry a concealed pistol and: (i) The pistol is on the licensee's person, (ii) the licensee is within the vehicle at all times that the pistol is there, or (iii) the licensee is away from the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle. (b) A violation of this subsection is a misdemeanor.

(3)(a) A person at least eighteen years of age who is in possession of an unloaded pistol shall not leave the unloaded pistol in a vehicle unless the unloaded pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle.

(b) A violation of this subsection is a misdemeanor.

(4) Nothing in this section permits the possession of firearms illegal to possess under state or federal law.


[2003 c 53 § 28; 1997 c 200 § 1; 1996 c 295 § 4; 1994 sp.s. c 7 § 405; 1982 1st ex.s. c 47 § 3; 1961 c 124 § 4; 1935 c 172 § 5; RRS § 2516-5.]









ETA: Fuck I'm gonna piss my pants.....




Several questions remained unanswered yesterday regarding the theft of Police Chief Gil Kerlikowske's gun from his parked car Dec. 26 — including why the chief was not carrying the weapon.

With few exceptions, Seattle police officers are required to carry a gun at all times within the city limits. Officers sometimes will not carry a gun if it is impractical or inappropriate to do so during their free time, such as if they are at the gym, playing in a soccer game or drinking alcohol, police officials said.

The stolen pistol, a 9-mm Glock semiautomatic, is Kerlikowske's personal weapon, which he carries when off duty, not the gun issued by the department. Department spokesman Sean Whitcomb said he did not know whether Kerlikowske was carrying another gun at the time of the theft or what the chief was doing while his car was parked downtown.

Whitcomb said he also did not know:

• How the chief secured the gun in the vehicle, except to say he had not left it in plain view.

• How the car was broken into, except to say the car was locked.

• Whether the chief had secured the pistol with a trigger lock or other safety device, although Whitcomb said he assumes the gun was loaded.

Whitcomb said Kerlikowske was out of town yesterday and would not page him to provide more details. Reached at home, Kerlikowske's wife, Anna Laszlo, said her husband was on his way home from a business trip and unavailable to comment. The chief was expected back at work today, she said.

Kerlikowske's gun was stolen from his work vehicle, an unmarked Ford Crown Victoria, while it was parked near Sixth Avenue and Olive Way between 10:30 a.m. and 3:30 p.m. Nothing else was stolen from the car, Whitcomb said.

Whitcomb said Dec. 26 was the chief's day off.




Kerlikowske reported the theft last week, but it did not become public until Monday night, after a TV station pursued a news tip.

"This is certainly something people have an interest in, but it's not exactly information that would be a benefit for us to release on our own," Whitcomb said. "It's an unfortunate incident, but we'd like to remind everyone that even the chief of police is not immune to these types of crimes."

As of yesterday, Mayor Greg Nickels had not talked to Kerlikowske, having learned of the theft only a couple of days ago, said Marianne Bichsel, Nickels' spokeswoman.

"The mayor is going to have an opportunity to talk to the police chief and see if there are any issues," she said. "The presumption is that there are not any issues."

Whitcomb said the Seattle Police Department has no specific policy related to storing a gun in a vehicle. State law prohibits gun owners from keeping loaded handguns in plain sight in their vehicles.

The Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear Arms, a pro-gun group in Bellevue, is offering a $500 reward for information leading to the arrest and conviction of the thief and for the weapon's recovery.

"It's embarrassing for the chief," said Joe Waldron, committee president. "I am in the gun business, and if somebody broke into my car, it would be personally and professionally embarrassing for me, too."

He said the reward is being offered in part to point out that gun theft can happen to anyone.

"As a general rule, we don't like people to leave guns in vehicles," Waldron said. If storing a gun in a vehicle is necessary, "we recommend locking it in a glove compartment or in the console between the seats. We also recommend that the firearm be unloaded and the ammunition be emptied, but we realize that is inconvenient and unlikely to happen."

The important thing is not calling attention to the act of storing a gun in a vehicle. Locking it in a trunk is usually conspicuous and therefore not a good option, Waldron said.

The Seattle Times reported in July 2001 that between 1996 and 2000, 15 Seattle Police Department guns were stolen from either cars or homes. More recent figures are not immediately available, Whitcomb said.

Sgt. Kevin Haistings, president of the Seattle Police Officers' Guild, said he knows of no situation where an officer has been disciplined or investigated for having a gun stolen.

"We can be victims of crime like anyone else," he said. "I'm glad it didn't happen to me."



Link Posted: 3/26/2006 5:50:16 PM EDT
I am sure ceasefire and the news media will start polling in the next few days.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 6:32:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Phil_in_Seattle:
They started on it right away
Gun Facts:

-- Two thirds of King County firearm deaths occur in the home.
(Seattle and King County Public Health Death Watch, August 2000)

-- 33 percent of Washington homes contain a gun. (Washington State
Department of Health, Behavioral Health Survey, 2002)

-- One out of seven guns in Washington State is stored unlocked.
(Belo Marketing Solutions, 2002)

Washington CeaseFire is a nonprofit advocacy organization dedicated
to reducing gun violence in Washington State through education and
legislative action. Founded in 1983, CeaseFire has grown to more than
3,500 members throughout the State.




so using there same ''facts"
1/3 of gun deaths in King CO occur outside the home (public places?)

77 percent of homes in Washington are unarmed (victims in waiting)

6 out of seven guns are safely stored locked up in WA state, that other gun is either improperly stored or not needed to be to be locked up for whatever reason (owner home w/ gun and no kids??)
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 9:09:35 PM EDT
Excellent point about reversing their facts and figures, might want to check your math though, your point was too good to have it mis-stated.
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 9:53:23 PM EDT
....only time will tell.....
Link Posted: 3/26/2006 11:54:25 PM EDT
Violence begins between someone's ears, and the choice of weapon, or none at all, does not matter after a decision to harm someone is made.

More people are kiled by vehicles than by guns. Ban and destroy those death machines, every last one of them! (that's called sarcasm, folks)
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 1:00:57 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/27/2006 1:03:52 AM EDT by SKSGuy]
Same shit...different day. It gets old listening to these people.

The thing is they are appealing to a lot of young impressionable people, especially in city settings. People that typically don't have a lot of common sense and that are not lacking in self-induldgence.

When I was in high school all I really heard was that guns were evil. And anybody that was pro-gun was "a gun nut" or a "psycho". Contrary to what older, wiser people say when I chat with them...I don't ever recall my teachers professing guns = evil.

My personal belief is that it starts in the home. If you teach your kids gun safety, common sense, and respect for others the people attempting to take away our rights would be a tiny, less significant thorn in the ass.

-Rob
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 3:36:54 AM EDT
Guess I better get ready to turn my guns in for some Wal Mart gift cards!!

Link Posted: 3/27/2006 7:48:49 AM EDT
This mindless drivel has been said for years....

And it continues to sound so stupid.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 8:26:21 AM EDT

Originally Posted By KA3B:
By the time the next legislative session rolls around this will be old news.



+1

I hate to view anything of this tragic crime as a silver lining, but the timing could not have been more fortuitous in our effort to protect our rights.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 8:32:24 AM EDT
Maybe we can start a "gun watch." I've seen a website that has been (or at least was) monitoring an "evil" AR-15 with bayonet attached since the AWB ended in 2004, making sure it didn't make any moves to attack people. Maybe we could do the same thing.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 8:43:48 AM EDT

Originally Posted By dar48:
Maybe we can start a "gun watch." I've seen a website that has been (or at least was) monitoring an "evil" AR-15 with bayonet attached since the AWB ended in 2004, making sure it didn't make any moves to attack people. Maybe we could do the same thing.



www.assaultweaponwatch.com/
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 8:53:50 AM EDT

Originally Posted By elokoman:
Excellent point about reversing their facts and figures, might want to check your math though, your point was too good to have it mis-stated.



ummmm...duh...blonde moment, thats what I get for trying to quickly log on a work.

but hey.... its statistics/polls...not like the anti gun groups don't skew the numbers to suit them


Link Posted: 3/27/2006 8:57:52 AM EDT
ummmm...duh...blonde moment, thats what I get for trying to quickly log on at work.

fixed
....damn I can't seem to get anything right!
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 9:04:51 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/27/2006 9:06:24 AM EDT by PCR-00]
My favorite "Facts" from ceasefire....

http://www.washingtonceasefire.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=13&Itemid=28



In the United States, an average of 9 children die per day of firearm related deaths.



SO, 9 * 365 = 3285 people under the age of 18 die per year in the US.


Between 1997 and 2001, 287 youth under the age of 19 died as a result of firearms



SO. 2001 - 1997 = 4 years

287/4 = 71.75 average people under the age of 19 died per year in the US.




WHICH IS IT? 71.75 or 3285 ?
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 9:12:44 AM EDT

Originally Posted By PCR-00:
My favorite "Facts" from ceasefire....

http://www.washingtonceasefire.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=13&Itemid=28



In the United States, an average of 9 children die per day of firearm related deaths.



SO, 9 * 365 = 3285 people under the age of 18 die per year in the US.


Between 1997 and 2001, 287 youth under the age of 19 died as a result of firearms



SO. 2001 - 1997 = 4 years

287/4 = 71.75 average people under the age of 19 died per year in the US.




WHICH IS IT? 71.75 or 3285 ?



106
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 9:23:34 AM EDT

Originally Posted By PCR-00:
My favorite "Facts" from ceasefire....

http://www.washingtonceasefire.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=13&Itemid=28



In the United States, an average of 9 children die per day of firearm related deaths.



SO, 9 * 365 = 3285 people under the age of 18 die per year in the US.


Between 1997 and 2001, 287 youth under the age of 19 died as a result of firearms



SO. 2001 - 1997 = 4 years

287/4 = 71.75 average people under the age of 19 died per year in the US.




WHICH IS IT? 71.75 or 3285 ?



If you can wait I'll get you the accurate numbers after I get home from work and have access to my reference data.

Link Posted: 3/27/2006 9:29:17 AM EDT
Annother good one:



Every 7.5 hours a child or teen was killed in a firearm-related accident or suicide in 2000.



24/7.5 = 3.2 per day
3.2*365 = 1168


So the new number per year is 1168
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 9:34:03 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 9:36:34 AM EDT
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 11:39:18 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Boomer:

Originally Posted By KA3B:
By the time the next legislative session rolls around this will be old news.



+1

I hate to view anything of this tragic crime as a silver lining, but the timing could not have been more fortuitous in our effort to protect our rights.



I agree, but I dont see this as a tragic crime...

I see it as more oxygen for the rest of us...

Sorry, But I guess the Asshole part of me is not to upset about a bunch of young adults paying the price for doing illegal drugs, and someone flipping out. Im more upset that the spin is on the firearms, and not the illegal activity that caused it.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 11:41:02 AM EDT

Originally Posted By PCR-00:
My favorite "Facts" from ceasefire....

http://www.washingtonceasefire.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=13&Itemid=28



In the United States, an average of 9 children die per day of firearm related deaths.



SO, 9 * 365 = 3285 people under the age of 18 die per year in the US.


Between 1997 and 2001, 287 youth under the age of 19 died as a result of firearms



SO. 2001 - 1997 = 4 years

287/4 = 71.75 average people under the age of 19 died per year in the US.




WHICH IS IT? 71.75 or 3285 ?



You're using Assault-Math. You need to just "feel" the numbers...

And 9 kids/day vs 3.2 kids/day is explained by 3 of them getting back in line again, 2 or them rose from the dead and 1 was just lying really still.

Link Posted: 3/27/2006 11:59:42 AM EDT

Originally Posted By mordecai:

You're using Assault-Math. You need to just "feel" the numbers...





Link Posted: 3/27/2006 12:14:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/27/2006 12:20:59 PM EDT by BIGDUKESIX]
Some more bullshit from our favorite gun control group. Is ceasefire going by the poll that was at 80% against gunshow bans before they yanked the poll?


Deborah Wang; KUOW
December 13, 2005

Gun control advocates released a poll Monday saying that the majority of Washington state residents favor more restrictions on the sale of guns at gun shows. They say the poll lends support to legislation that would require background checks for all gun show transactions.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 12:21:57 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BIGDUKESIX:
Some more bullshit from our favorite gun control group. Is ceasefire going by the poll that was at 80% against gunshow bans before they yanked the poll.


Deborah Wang; KUOW
December 13, 2005

Gun control advocates released a poll Monday saying that the majority of Washington state residents favor more restrictions on the sale of guns at gun shows. They say the poll lends support to legislation that would require background checks for all gun show transactions.



I know 10 Doctors...and I can tell you that 9 out of 10 of them actually think that chewing trident in between meals actually kills kittens.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 12:30:37 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BIGDUKESIX:
Some more bullshit from our favorite gun control group. Is ceasefire going by the poll that was at 80% against gunshow bans before they yanked the poll?


Deborah Wang; KUOW
December 13, 2005

Gun control advocates released a poll Monday saying that the majority of Washington state residents favor more restrictions on the sale of guns at gun shows. They say the poll lends support to legislation that would require background checks for all gun show transactions.




Link Posted: 3/27/2006 12:36:32 PM EDT

Originally Posted By BIGDUKESIX:
Some more bullshit from our favorite gun control group. Is ceasefire going by the poll that was at 80% against gunshow bans before they yanked the poll?


Deborah Wang; KUOW
December 13, 2005

Gun control advocates released a poll Monday saying that the majority of Washington state residents favor more restrictions on the sale of guns at gun shows. They say the poll lends support to legislation that would require background checks for all gun show transactions.



You can contact her at debwang@kuow.org to ask where she got the information.*

*from: www.kuow.org/staff_deb_wang.asp
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 2:29:00 PM EDT
Some comments from Ken"pizza face" Schram

Ken Schram Commentary: Guns DO Kill People

March 27, 2006

By Ken Schram




SEATTLE - A lunatic in Seattle slaughters six people at a house party.

A guy in the Midwest shoots and kills a teenager for walking across his lawn.

A minister's wife down South blows the back of her husband's head off while he's sleeping.

And yet gun fanatics are outraged that people like me think that too many guns, in the hands of too many people, has created a national crisis.

300,000 kids' charm bracelets are being pulled from stores because one 4-year old died after swallowing a piece of the jewelry.

Yet even though there are more than 11,000 people a year murdered by guns here in the U.S., more guns are more easily available then ever before.

Spineless, cowardly politicians remain intimidated by the pro-gun lobby even though 75% of the people in this country don't even own a gun.

Death is tucked away in too many bedside tables.

Death is left to descend on house parties, school hallways and shopping malls because groups like the NRA have sold a bumper-sticker mentality as being a literal interpretation of the 2nd Amendment.

Bottom line: Guns DO kill people.

And it's time to stop it.

Tomorrow, some ideas on how to do that.

Want to share your thoughts with Ken Schram? You can e-mail him at kenschram@komo4news.com

And be sure to catch Ken Schram and John Carlson on their new radio show, "THE COMMENTATORS." Airing Monday through Friday, from 10 till noon on KOMO 1000, Ken and John will be delving into news of the day offering their own particular brand of insight and perspective - with a healthy dose of irreverence and humor thrown in for good measure.


Email This Story | Printer-friendly Version
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 3:55:59 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/27/2006 4:05:27 PM EDT by Phil_in_Seattle]

Originally Posted By PCR-00:
My favorite "Facts" from ceasefire....

http://www.washingtonceasefire.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=13&Itemid=28



In the United States, an average of 9 children die per day of firearm related deaths.



SO, 9 * 365 = 3285 people under the age of 18 die per year in the US.


Between 1997 and 2001, 287 youth under the age of 19 died as a result of firearms



SO. 2001 - 1997 = 4 years

287/4 = 71.75 average people under the age of 19 died per year in the US.




WHICH IS IT? 71.75 or 3285 ?



On the 9 children per day claim, if we specify that children are ages 17 to >1 and you use the years 1990 through 2003 the average (not adjusting for leap years) number of deaths for all intents (homicide, unintentional, suicide, legal intervention, undetermined) is 6.38454 if you use the age range of 18 to >1 it changes to 8.96908.

For the same age groups but using the years 1997 through 2001 the results change to 4.935890411
and 7.127123288.

The last year which data is currently available for is 2003 the numbers for that year would be 3.6 and 5.528767123.

In fact In fact except for a small upturn in 2002 (10 more deaths total, from 1433 to 1443, than in the prior year of 2001 in the >1 through 17 age range) the average per day numbers of both age ranges have consistently decreased every year since 1994.


Between 1997 and 2001, 287 youth under the age of 19 died as a result of firearms


I'm going to go with this claim as referring to Washington State only, but the total for 1997 through 2001 for ages >1 through 18 is 214. for ages >1 through 19 it's 298.

All the above data is collected from the CDC.

We all knew that they cherry picked their data anyway.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 4:21:39 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Phil_in_Seattle:

Originally Posted By BIGDUKESIX:
Some more bullshit from our favorite gun control group. Is ceasefire going by the poll that was at 80% against gunshow bans before they yanked the poll?


Deborah Wang; KUOW
December 13, 2005

Gun control advocates released a poll Monday saying that the majority of Washington state residents favor more restrictions on the sale of guns at gun shows. They say the poll lends support to legislation that would require background checks for all gun show transactions.




pic5.picturetrail.com/VOL77/858902/2210487/121666769.jpg





Did you send this to here and ask how she got that info from that pole?
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 4:50:45 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/27/2006 4:54:51 PM EDT by MOGWAR]
I'm so sick of people saying that our founding fathers could not have foreseen the modern gun, they sure as hell were more likely to have imagined a semi auto rifle than cell phones and the internet but I never hear the same argument used to curtail free speech.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 4:56:12 PM EDT

Originally Posted By Cboyer:

Originally Posted By Phil_in_Seattle:

Originally Posted By BIGDUKESIX:
Some more bullshit from our favorite gun control group. Is ceasefire going by the poll that was at 80% against gunshow bans before they yanked the poll?


Deborah Wang; KUOW
December 13, 2005

Gun control advocates released a poll Monday saying that the majority of Washington state residents favor more restrictions on the sale of guns at gun shows. They say the poll lends support to legislation that would require background checks for all gun show transactions.




pic5.picturetrail.com/VOL77/858902/2210487/121666769.jpg





Did you send this to here and ask how she got that info from that pole?



Ceasefire didn't run their gunshow poll online, however the PI did and the results were 180 degrees out from Ceasefires poll, which didn't even ask directly about gunshows.

Link Posted: 3/27/2006 4:56:25 PM EDT

Originally Posted By MOGWAR:
I'm so sick of people saying that our founding fathers could not have foreseen the modern gun, they sure as hell were more likely to have imagined a semi auto rifle than cell phones and the internet but I never hear the same argument used to curtail free speech.



I'm sure that someone will someday.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 4:57:37 PM EDT
I see, Thanks Phil.
Link Posted: 3/27/2006 5:00:55 PM EDT
Its always interesting to see the outrage at the number of people shot and killed every year. Yet at the same time there is little outrage at the number of people killed by drunk drivers or little done about it. Drive drunk, pay a fine, lose your license, do it again. Drive drunk on a suspended license, pay a fine, maybe spend a few days in jail. Continue to drive drunk on a suspended license, pay a fine, spend a few more days in jail this time. How is that being shot isn't even one of the ten leading casues of death in the country but it gets 99% of the attention.
Link Posted: 3/28/2006 12:09:55 AM EDT
And KIRO 7 running the ominous headline tonight at 11:00;

"suspect owned an AR-15 too (while showing his on a table, with a loaded up 3x30 Redimag, which they claim was in his truck with the AR-15, a baseball bat, and a machete), Settle Police say he COULD have killed hundreds".....

Did anybody else see this tonight? Tell me how are we ever going to get a fair shake going up against that? And since when has COULD ever meant jack, and how is a hypothetical able to make the news? And I call BS on the allegation it was in his truck. No way is a sick ass guy bent on killing a house full of people going to pass up a portable ninety rounds in an AR, to reach over it and get a .12ga shotgun.

I would like to see the evidence sheet to see where the AR was recovered because I can't get over that one. On many levels.
Link Posted: 3/28/2006 12:20:50 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Cyclic240B:
I would like to see the evidence sheet to see where the AR was recovered because I can't get over that one. On many levels.



For what it is worth the Bushmaster was registered to him for at least ten years according to the reporter.

Link Posted: 3/28/2006 3:25:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/28/2006 3:25:58 AM EDT by Gibby]


Nicole Brodeur

Taking aim at current gun laws
By Nicole Brodeur

Seattle Times staff columnist



Related

Nicole Brodeur's columns via RSS

Even before the shock subsided, The Blame Game began.

It was the rave scene that killed those poor kids Saturday on Capitol Hill. It was the city's weak All Ages Dance Ordinance. It was the weed they smoked, the beer they drank, the music that drained their heads of reason. It was the parents who didn't keep track. Stop.

What killed those people was a 28-year-old man named Kyle Huff, who took advantage of American gun laws and packed his pickup with an arsenal of weapons that no person should ever want or need: An assault rifle. A handgun. A shotgun. A machete. Hundreds of rounds of ammunition.

"There's plenty for everyone," Huff said as he started shooting, according to witness statements to police.

We all want to know why Huff opened fire on a houseful of innocents. But what confounds me is why anyone should have such weapons, and so many.

Huff used a pistol-grip shotgun and a .40-caliber semiautomatic Ruger.

He used them six years ago to blast a moose sculpture in his hometown of Whitefish, Mont. Police seized the guns, then returned them to Huff — their rightful owner. And why not? He had committed no felonies. And no one could have known then what would happen years later in a house in Seattle.

On Saturday, Police Chief Gil Kerlikowske walked through that house before the bodies were removed. Afterward, he called Huff's shotgun "not for hunting purposes, but for hunting people."

It was a wretched moment: Less than 24 hours earlier, Kerlikowske and Mayor Greg Nickels were honored by Washington CeaseFire for "their work to end gun violence in Washington state."

"It doesn't feel for naught," Kerlikowske said Monday. "Reasonable, common-sense gun laws are going to be an issue for a while.




"Looking at those bodies put it in perspective as to why I speak on this issue. That progress has slipped away in the last few years, and we're all trying to bring it back to a level of sanity."

John Rosenthal has a plan. Last year, the Boston real-estate manager founded the American Hunters & Shooters Association (www.huntersandshooters.org), a nonprofit seeking "common sense gun-safety measures."

Rosenthal wants to represent the millions of American gun owners who act responsibly and expect the government to do the same, like restricting access to military-style weapons, and requiring training and permits, and tightening rules for gun-show sales.

I told him about the guns Huff used.

"People are asking where these guns are coming from, and I think the question is, 'Where aren't they coming from?' " Rosenthal said. "National gun policy has been to allow unrestricted access to all firearms, including assault weapons, which had been banned until last September."

Why would someone want to buy an assault rifle?

"Because they can."

Kyle Huff owned an arsenal. And then he killed six people.

Because in America, he could.

Nicole Brodeur's column appears Sunday, Tuesday and Thursday. Reach her at 206-464-2334 or nbrodeur@seattletimes.com. They were just kids.



It's only a matter of time now.
Link Posted: 3/28/2006 6:27:35 AM EDT
Rosenthal is a tool. His "pro-gun" organization is nothing but another Brady bunch outlet.
Link Posted: 3/28/2006 11:42:24 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 3/28/2006 11:49:41 AM EDT by Kaliburz]
....if an idividual is determined to commit a violent crime..... they will do it.... a gun mearly makes it easier for them then trying to use a sword or hammer or ax...... take away the gun, they will find something else....

....just like going to Seattle.... faster in a car then trying to ride a horse....(but then again, why would I want to go to Seattle...)


Originally Posted By XD_Fan:
Its always interesting to see the outrage at the number of people shot and killed every year. Yet at the same time there is little outrage at the number of people killed by drunk drivers or little done about it. Drive drunk, pay a fine, lose your license, do it again. Drive drunk on a suspended license, pay a fine, maybe spend a few days in jail. Continue to drive drunk on a suspended license, pay a fine, spend a few more days in jail this time. How is that being shot isn't even one of the ten leading casues of death in the country but it gets 99% of the attention.



Because they want to disarm the people. Doing it all at once won't work. They'll take it little by little, one gun at a time. The "sporting use" is hog wash. Next thing you know, we'll be back to owning muzzle loaders ......... And they'll probably make it so that they're not the same caliber too.
Link Posted: 3/29/2006 9:56:19 PM EDT
Still waiting for the elitist media types to need a weapon to defend themselves. then it'll go uncovered. (then again a fair bunch of them probably carry and don't publicize it) They want the guns in the hands of The Law and not us mindless bunch of criminal would be BOOBS. What is that rifle the SWAT teams use anyway? Oh thats right, the rest of us are just would be criminal BOOBS that only care about ourselves and doing harm to others...(Sarcasm at its best.)
Link Posted: 3/29/2006 10:26:13 PM EDT

Originally Posted By EOP:
What is that rifle the SWAT teams use anyway? Oh thats right, the rest of us are just would be criminal BOOBS that only care about ourselves and doing harm to others...(Sarcasm at its best.)



Link Posted: 3/30/2006 7:13:28 AM EDT

Originally Posted By PCR-00:
The Tacoma Mall incident didn't do anything to even come CLOSE to closing the "Gunshow Loophole".....It would seem that one or two people try to get these laws passed, and every year, they find out that there are WAY more people interested in them not passing.....

Lets keep it this way. and work on keeping the nutjobs in prison or California.



Agreed on keeping it this way but consider who the one or two people are. All you guys who were at the SB hearing on the gun show "loophole" bill last year remember where they sat: In the front of the public space with the other uniforms, and up on the rostrum next to their leader Senator Adam Kline. We got -lucky- there IMO (and thanks to a buncha folks from this forum for showing up), Luke Esser stuck up for us and Marylin Rassmussen backed down in her support, thanks in part to the large number from our side sittingin the audience. But I don't think we should chalk it up to anything other then luck because the support for stopping "terrorists gun bazarrs" amongst those senators was strong.
And the thing about all this palather from ceasefire is that it helps them build their base. Sure, this is to far from the election to have the impact they would like, but they are fundraising and recruiting volunteers and ... at the grassroots level less of that is happening on our side, I think. I expect we'll continue to see the gunshow "loophole" bills dropped in the hopper every year, like a drumbeat. We gotta be there when that happens. clawista 92 (bias: I like gun shows so much, I'm a director at one)
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 7:41:25 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Clawista92: I expect we'll continue to see the gunshow "loophole" bills dropped in the hopper every year, like a drumbeat.



During the exective session where the Judiciary Committee voted down SB 5343 Kline said "I think I know where the votes are and I understand that this bill may not pass but it's got to come up every year, and we've got to be faced with this every year, until we have a little sense"
Link Posted: 3/30/2006 7:48:06 AM EDT

Originally Posted By Cyclic240B:
And KIRO 7 running the ominous headline tonight at 11:00;

"suspect owned an AR-15 too (while showing his on a table, with a loaded up 3x30 Redimag, which they claim was in his truck with the AR-15, a baseball bat, and a machete), Seattle Police say he COULD have killed hundreds".....

What are police being paid or if he could have killed humdreds?

Did anybody else see this tonight? Tell me how are we ever going to get a fair shake going up against that? And since when has COULD ever meant jack, and how is a hypothetical able to make the news? And I call BS on the allegation it was in his truck. No way is a sick ass guy bent on killing a house full of people going to pass up a portable ninety rounds in an AR, to reach over it and get a .12ga shotgun.

I would like to see the evidence sheet to see where the AR was recovered because I can't get over that one. On many levels.

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