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Posted: 10/14/2004 7:05:10 PM EST
Anyone remember the hostage situation on April 14th of this year in Indianapolis that was terminated with a police action shooting on 135 in Greenwood right in front of Elmore's Gun Shop?

I met the hostage today at the range.

He was shooting a few lanes down from we three. I was instructing one of the people I was with, and he got interested in what we were doing (shooting suppressed boltguns). We got to chatting, and he mentioned that he had just started shooting again after a 25 year hiatus, and was looking forward to getting some more practice. I asked him why he took it up again after all that time, and he asked if I remembered a hostage situation that occurred on the above date....

He was (in his words) completely oblivious to the world. He didn't see any need to pay attention to his surroundings, and in general was just going on about his daily activities with no thought that someone out there might want to do him harm.

That changed on April 14, 2004.

He came home from work, and when he got out of his car in the driveway, he suddenly noticed the black kid who had just pulled in to his driveway behind him. The victim walked back to the van to ask if the kid needed directions or something, and was met with a pistol in his face. The asshole forced him into his house and told him that he was going to kill him. He forced the victim around the house collecting money and valuables, and finally made him lie down on his bed face down, and put the gun to his head. The asshole then said, "I'm gonna kill you now."

The victim replied, "The Lord is waiting for me. You do what you have to do."

The asshole paused, then said, "You got any more money, motherfucker?" The vic replied, "No, but I do have $3000 in the bank. We can go get it."

The asshole pulled him up by the hair and forced him outside to his (the assailant's) van. The victim broke free and ran as soon as the asshole moved around the van to get into the driver's side. He ran bent over, as he is middle aged, overweight, and plagued with lupus, and figured that if he bent over, taking a bullet in the buttocks was better than one in the back or head.

The asshole pursued for about 20 feet, then ran back to his van and drove off. The vic's neighbors saw this, and called the police.

The police chased the prick and finally caught up to him in Greenwood, about 10 miles down the road. They fired up his van, unfortunately not killing him, and captured him on the spot.

This poor bastard has had an eye-opener like you would not believe.

I'm not normally given to believing range bullshit, but I believe this guy..for two reasons - 1) I saw his face as he was telling the story and 2) he described the van perfectly, and I was there less than 4 minutes after the shooting took place.



Complacency kills. Inattention kills. Thinking "It's paranoid to be looking around all the time" kills. Thinking "I OWN guns...but you guys who carry them 24/7 are nuts" is fucking stupid as hell.


Link Posted: 10/14/2004 7:20:35 PM EST
I've always said........I'd rather have a gun and not need it than to need a gun and not have it.

Anything else is stupidity.
Link Posted: 10/15/2004 7:33:49 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/15/2004 9:53:37 AM EST by Zoub]
I know a guy in a wheelchair who went through a similar situation. He was basically tortured and shot to pieces, hence the reason he is in a wheelchair and missing fingers etc...

Some dudes walk in to his business and get the jump on him. Begin to ask him where the safe and money is. Each time they shoot him again. He won't talk because his business is connected to his home and his wife and Daughters are in the house. These guys are not wearing face masks so he figures they do not plan to leave

The whole time he had a revolver tucked in his pants but had no chance to draw it. They finish with him, and 3 of the guys start to leave. Prick#1 with the gun decides to finish him off. Puts his gun to the vitims head, "CLICK, CLICK." Victim pulls his revolver shoots P1 in the ass and kills him. Others die a few weeks later in a shootout with IPD after robbing a liquor store. I seem to recall they killed the owner. I think it was in 2002.

FYI the guy in the wheelchair had one of he best outlooks on life I HAVE EVE SEEN. He also smiles when he tells you he killed that SOB and the others died too.
Link Posted: 10/15/2004 7:50:36 AM EST

Originally Posted By QuietShootr:
Anyone remember the hostage situation on April 14th of this year in Indianapolis that was terminated with a police action shooting on 135 in Greenwood right in front of Elmore's Gun Shop?

I met the hostage today at the range.

He was shooting a few lanes down from we three. I was instructing one of the people I was with, and he got interested in what we were doing (shooting suppressed boltguns). We got to chatting, and he mentioned that he had just started shooting again after a 25 year hiatus, and was looking forward to getting some more practice. I asked him why he took it up again after all that time, and he asked if I remembered a hostage situation that occurred on the above date....

He was (in his words) completely oblivious to the world. He didn't see any need to pay attention to his surroundings, and in general was just going on about his daily activities with no thought that someone out there might want to do him harm.

That changed on April 14, 2004.

He came home from work, and when he got out of his car in the driveway, he suddenly noticed the black kid who had just pulled in to his driveway behind him. The victim walked back to the van to ask if the kid needed directions or something, and was met with a pistol in his face. The asshole forced him into his house and told him that he was going to kill him. He forced the victim around the house collecting money and valuables, and finally made him lie down on his bed face down, and put the gun to his head. The asshole then said, "I'm gonna kill you now."

The victim replied, "The Lord is waiting for me. You do what you have to do."

The asshole paused, then said, "You got any more money, motherfucker?" The vic replied, "No, but I do have $3000 in the bank. We can go get it."

The asshole pulled him up by the hair and forced him outside to his (the assailant's) van. The victim broke free and ran as soon as the asshole moved around the van to get into the driver's side. He ran bent over, as he is middle aged, overweight, and plagued with lupus, and figured that if he bent over, taking a bullet in the buttocks was better than one in the back or head.

The asshole pursued for about 20 feet, then ran back to his van and drove off. The vic's neighbors saw this, and called the police.

The police chased the prick and finally caught up to him in Greenwood, about 10 miles down the road. They fired up his van, unfortunately not killing him, and captured him on the spot.

This poor bastard has had an eye-opener like you would not believe.

I'm not normally given to believing range bullshit, but I believe this guy..for two reasons - 1) I saw his face as he was telling the story and 2) he described the van perfectly, and I was there less than 4 minutes after the shooting took place.



Complacency kills. Inattention kills. Thinking "It's paranoid to be looking around all the time" kills. Thinking "I OWN guns...but you guys who carry them 24/7 are nuts" is fucking stupid as hell.





At least he has a second chance to make a first impression. He won't let it happen again I'm sure.
Link Posted: 10/15/2004 7:54:36 AM EST
[Last Edit: 10/15/2004 7:55:59 AM EST by livefreeordieNH]

Originally Posted By QuietShootr:

Complacency kills. Inattention kills. Thinking "It's paranoid to be looking around all the time" kills. Thinking "I OWN guns...but you guys who carry them 24/7 are nuts" is fucking stupid as hell.





good points.

ETA: sorry i'm not from IN, just happened to see this in Active Topics.
Link Posted: 10/15/2004 8:39:55 AM EST
So this guy is now interested in carrying for protection? Man, that's the bad way to learn that lesson.
Link Posted: 10/15/2004 10:34:06 AM EST
I have an uncle in a wheel chair back in MD.. He lives in a high crime area and has been screwed with on several different occasions.. He went out and bought a 1911 that he keeps covered with the blanket that he keeps on his legs..


Link Posted: 10/16/2004 1:15:08 PM EST
Glad to hear that the guy has a chance to make sure something like that doesn't happen ever again. My wife and I are always watching movies where some perp breaks into a home and terrorizes the occupants. When a scene like that unfolds, I always tell my wife, "See, if they had only had a firearm, that wouldn't be happening to them right now." The first person who illegally enters my home will be in for a rude 12-gauge awakening.
Link Posted: 10/16/2004 6:38:24 PM EST
You don't always get second chances, nice to hear when someone does.
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 3:26:20 AM EST
I love the ADT Alarm commercials where some bad guy is breaking into the house and everyone huddles around the phone waiting for the alarm service to call 911 to send a car to their house to save them. 911 is government-sponsored dial-a-prayer. I'd like to see the commercial where the alarm goes off, the homeowner grabs their gun, and they defend themselves instead of waiting like sheep and hoping the wolves run away at the loud noise.
Link Posted: 10/17/2004 4:02:01 PM EST
One of the main reasons I chose to learn to defend myself with firearms and to carry all the time was a severe back injury that left me a semi-invalid for close to ten years. I went from being a competitive powerlifter to being a bedridden and it made me realize how vulnerable I was, even when I was mobile enough for short periods of time to go out and about.

I'm very glad I was inspired before I had a "wakeup call."

Link Posted: 10/30/2004 8:09:20 PM EST
I woke up in 1982 when I was robbed by a heroin addict in broad daylight in San Diego, CA. I was a young mom with a baby in my arms and a 3 year old wandering around in traffic while I tried to keep my composure as that pusbag piece of human waste pointed his gun at my baby's head. From that point on I became a gun-totin mama! Now ALL of my children know how to handle a gun and protect themselves! Sadly, sometimes it takes a horrible thing like that to make people wake-up! That is why we need to do everything we can to protect our rights!

Oh! and Fuck all those bastard drug addicts/alcoholics who blame their "disease" for all the hell they put honest citizens through! I'm so tired of hearing about how it's not their fault. They didn't know what they were doing, cause they were too high! Whaaaa!!!hat
I guarantee the next dirtbag who pulls a gun on this gun-totin grandma will get a big surprise between the eyes! He won't have to worry about his "disease" anymore!
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