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Wow, cool write up. Any more courses like this being offered in the future?
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There are classes you can take in FL from some good people. As far as Tactical Response specifically, I don't know if they have any other planned for Florida right at this time. I think some of us are going to do what we can to get them back here though!
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+1 on Neeglik's AAR, and a big +1 for Tactical Response's Rob Edwards!
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why do ya gotta roll your eyes when u talk of the AK.....lol....I love how u say LEO types, thats means wanna be cop in my book......I have been to these before, they are full of good info and u usually have fun al long as the gung ho types keep quiet, there is almost always a big fat guy ( like me ) and some tactical comando joe....great pics, glad it was a good time
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"why do ya gotta roll your eyes when u talk of the AK.....lol....I love how u say LEO types, thats means wanna be cop in my book"
I was just giving the AK guy a hard time. It's just in fun. He rocked with the AK and it made me want to get mine out and practice more with it. LEO-types just means that there are a lot of LEO's out there of differing variety...local, state, fed, patrol, detective, etc. By no means did I mean wannabe. I think variety in a training class is great as long as everyone is competent and safe. If the class make up is right, you can learn from both the instructors and your classmates. |
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If that sort of thing makes you nervous, you wouldn't want to be a part of the training. The photo is of a threat assessment taking place after firing upon the target. Every class member did the threat assessment after firing to check 360 degrees after every repetition and then performed a tactical reload. Some shooters were more proficient than others as you could see some performing the assessment while others were still shooting their target. Some participants were just faster than others completing the drills.
Besides, there was nothing unsafe about it whatsoever, as all of the handguns were held in the Suhl position during the assessment drill. If you will observe, the support hand is under and behind the gun hand, the muzzle is pointed directly down towards the ground not sweeping the legs or feet, and the shooter's finger is outside the trigger guard held on the slide, not the triggerguard. |
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+1 to what Burney said. Watch the videos I posted. This is one of the first things we're shown to do, and we were expected to do it for the next four days. No way to do good combat training without moving about with a hot weapon. Train the way you fight.
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Observer,
What specifically makes you nervous about that picture ? The shooter was within arms reach of a veteran instructor and SWAT officer who is GTG as far as range safety. His muzzle is pointed down and his finger is off the trigger. What I like about this is it's an action shot, not staged. I have shot with this shooter, he is one of the fastest , most accurate pistol shooters I know and I never pause for a second o nthe lien with him. I would actually rather stand on the line beside him and have done so on many occasion. He is performing the Drill safely and as instructed to do so by the instructor. I know your nervousness is not a personal attack against the shooter, you don't know him and he doesn't know you so I'm assuming it's towards the technique. If you consider yourself an experienced shooter and that made picture made you nervous, you need to look harder at your skillset . This is not novice stuff, it's medium to highspeed stuff, well executed. Definitelty no room to fuck up. If you are a relatively new shooter, or relatively inexperienced (unlike the shooter in the Pic) then this is something you should aspire to. If you are just generally nervous by nature. PM me your name, I''' make sure I stay off any class rosters with your on it... Joke |
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Looks like you guys had a great time.
I really need to get my candy ass to a good class. Its been way to long since my last class and I really do not know who is teaching these days. Can anyone recommend a good upcoming pistol/rifle class? |
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Florida doesn't seem to get a ton of classes. Firms come here, but they don't seem to come as often as other places. If you don't mind going as far as Atlanta, that is a city that appears to stay quite busy.
Also, most firms will come to you if you can provide them a range and 10 or so paying students. The following are a few groups that I have trained with or want to, and I know that they come to Atlanta, or closer: Tactical Response Personal Defense Training Adler and Associates (Dedicated Professionals) Trident Concepts Options for Personal Security EAG Tactical Roger's Shooting School |
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I dont think observers comments about nurvous were directed towards that shooter, just he might have , like me have been to these shoots where, THE WANNA BE & ( COMMANDO JOE ) doesnt have excellent muzzel control...and that pic it looks af if the instructor is walking the line, what about the others shooters at the end of the line who are also going to turn, he can't reach out and grab everybody....I knowwhat u are saying, some people dont like to shoot in these classes unless they are comfortable with the other in the class
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Rentprop....I assure you there was no Wannabes or Commando Joes in these classes. Everyone performed to the standard demanded or was gone.Both classes were small. 6 in the pistol and 7 in the carbine, no room to hide on a big line . The instructor was well able to keep control of the firing line if needed. However these were experienced shooters who knew what they were doing and policed themselves very well. I am not aware of any safety issues from the Pistol class nor did I witness any safety violations at the Carbine class.
I know most of these guys, Muzzle control, trigger finger gerneral firearm admin not an issue. in all liklihood if you are going to shoots where the wannabes and comandos are causing issues then we don't travel in the same shooting circles. the only folks who seem to have issues with guys that travel in the groups I associate with are ones who do not like to run hot ranges, which is something we absolutely always do at these classes. Lastly, This particular Group, Tactical Response offers a 100% no questions asked Money Back guarantee, if at the end of the course you do not feel you got your moneys worth, they will refund you. So next time the opportunity presents itself, I would respectfully suggest you and observer take a course and opine from a position of known fact as opposed to your judgment of a group based apparently on how they look in a picture and a collection of poor experiences you have had with crappy shooters who dress similarly You have nothing to lose. |
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Like I said it looks like a fun day, I enjoy shooting practical rifle matches and have looked into defensive pistol if I ever get the time so people training and walking around with hot weapons doesn't bother me. However what makes me nervous about the photo is that there's a line of people to his right that are going to be in the potential path of his barrel as he spins to engage the target. You're right that I don't know the guy from Adam and I have no idea of what his skill level is so it's certainly nothing personal but it appears that he's drawing from concealment, facing 180 degrees from the target, then spinning to engage the target. Seems to me like a lot of opportunities for an AD/ND but again I don't know the particulars. Granted I say this as someone who has had a shooter (who I knew and trusted) behind me ND as he decocked a pistol so yeah maybe I've got a different perspective on it. Damn don't take this shit personal, I'm certainly not 'high speed' and never claimed to be so if it the class works for you then I'm glad you had a good time (seriously). Anyday out shooting in the woods beats a day when you're not. |
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Does that clear it up? The shooter had already engaged the target as instructed and was performing the threat assessment drill as the other shooters were completing the shooting portion of the drill. The photos are chronological and the first pic of the series in question shows the shooter with pistol in hand "punching out" at the target, none of the other students have cleared the holster as yet. The second pic reveals brass flying and active shooting taking place. The third picture shows the assessment almost fully completed while the other shooters on the line are about to finish shooting or are about to perform the assessment themselves. If you watch the video posted, you can see the shooter immediately go to the Suhl position after the instructor halts firing, and hear the pistol decock, and then the threat assessment. This is the threat assessment technique I have seen and been taught at two different shooting schools. I really like the syllabus and course of instruction that Tactical Response offers. I will be attending their classes again. |
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I understand that you could assume a lot of things from just one picture. Just to echo what Burney said. The scan is done after the shoot to check for more targets. We always brought our weapons to the target and only the target. Again, if you watch the videos, this might be a little more clear.
Sorry to hear your friend had a ND right by you. I've had a ND occur in one of the classes I was in. It's scary; however, it could happen to anybody. Cooked off rounds and ND's are something that you have to be prepared for even if you take all the appropriate steps. Shit can and does happen, but again, this is part of high intensity training. Do your best to follow the basic safety rules, hopefully no one will get hurt. |
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Observer, I understand and have a much better idea of wheere you are coming from.
This guys muzzle was never anywhere it should not have been. One would need to be laying at his feet to have a chance of being covered by the muzzle and then I suspect he would see you and probably move to avoid you. An ND can be a confidence wrecker and I see it shook your confidence in the safety of the line. Remember this is a crawl, walk, jog, run type of thing..if at any point in time you become a little uncomfortable with where you are or feel you are getting a little too loose, drop back a bit and go back to the basics. Anyone of us here would gladly spend some time even with red guns if that made you more comfortable doing some drills that may help with gun handling confidence. Again we have no idea of your skillset and we are by no means masters, however I consider us solid shooters, most days. And would always be happy If I could help another shooter , god knows I have been given a pointer or two . Bottom line is you cannot grow or improva at anything unless you push your comfort zon, even just a little. If you don't do this you stagnate. however If you do it too much it is dangerous. Knowing your abilities and having a feel for how much shit can be thrown at you at one time will let you know where you fit in that window. Boom : How have you been Dude ? i lost Valdez number Did he survive Katrina , tell him I said hello. You need to check out the thread from Dedicated Professionals the Pistol Operator Class. Russ Adler is GTG Nigel |
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