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1/25/2018 7:38:29 AM
Posted: 12/22/2005 6:17:41 PM EST
I want to start this post with 2 facts---1)I am a satellite instructor(independent contractor) at bills and 2)I receive absolutley no compensation for posting this. I just wanted to let people know that(as it's been explained to me) some first tier, nationally recognized firearms instructors are coming to town to teach some courses. I'll admit it--i lurk on many firearms; sites reading the posts and soaking up the info without contributing a whole lot, but in my defense I am an investment banker and what place do I have telling swat team members and military personnel their business. I read their posts and I am jealous that they have access to equipment and training deemed unnecessary, too advanced or dangerous for us mere civilians. I really enjoy my training from Len at bills and can't wait to start training with Sully @ DE(thanks to mcnielsen--they should pay him for all of the "free positive press" he gives them). I guess my point is that it is that Bills is providing us with an opportunity to get exposure to nationally recognized instructors and we should take advantage of that. Chuck Taylor is coming in April to teach rifle, shotgun and handgun courses. As a person that carries a gun I see these classes as an investment in my life and security. The Ayoob class that bills hosted was very beneficial. If Bills can show some succes with these courses, who know who can be teaching a course there next, Pat Rogers, Jeff Gonzalez, Ken Hackathorne, or Larry Vickers--as far as I know none of these people are scheduled to teach a course at bills, but wouldn't it be cool if they did come to town and offer classes to civilians. Yes, you can get cheaper training, and yes there are local instructors that are on par with the big national guys, but it could be really cool to see who would come to bills next if we support Len's efforts now. I know this post is kind of preachy so I'll get off my soapbox--please, don't light me on fire.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 4:21:04 AM EST
I'm all signed up and ready to go. Looking forward to learning from another teacher. Any idea what the load-out is going to be?

No fire, just Jager shots.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 4:46:43 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/23/2005 4:49:14 AM EST by VA-gunnut]
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 6:04:54 AM EST
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 6:23:44 AM EST
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 8:44:19 PM EST
John Farnam is a nationally recognized and published firearms instructor. He is also a friend of Len's at Bills. I just spent 4.5 hours at Bills today taking a basic tactical carbine class. there was instruction on basic proper use of a carbine(ar-15) followed up by at least 2 hours of full auto shooting(half of the guns were Len's personal guns). What a great afternoon for $25 dollars. At least on the surface there seems to be an us (bills) against them(DE) mentality. The point of my post(maybe not clear enough) is that each of us has our own training regimen, whether it be bills(Len) or DE(Sully), or a combo of each(mcneilsen, one of the few people on this earth that i would trust behind me with a hot weapon). We can all use outside sources to teach us more and round out our understanding of various weapons and their uses. I have repeatedly stated that I can't wait to start taking Sully's classes(mcneilsen has me sold on the belief that there are no absolute right answers, just different perspectives and that if I am not exposed to as many as possible I am short changing myself). Fedgunner asked if there is schedule for future instructors. I'll answer that--no I don't believe that there is a future schedule. If these classes, Farnam and Taylor, don't work out(by that I mean low attendence) I don't think that Bills(Len) will take the risks (professional and personal) to book other instructors. That is what I was trying to convey--let's take a risk and step outside our personal boxes and be exposed to something new or different. We may not agree with the entire course, but we all should take something home with us that makes us better or more aware. I moved out here from CA. I couldn;t take 2/3s of my guns back home if i was forced to move back. I am very grateful to be living in area with so many different options. Let's support what Len is doing and make the Twin Cities a destination location for these instructors. If these classes are succesful who knows who might come to teach us. Once again, I am stepping off of my soap box, so please be gentle and use a liberal amount of militec.
Link Posted: 12/23/2005 10:36:30 PM EST
Just out couriousty, why would you want Larry Vickers, are you planning on some serious 1911 builds????
Link Posted: 12/24/2005 4:02:50 AM EST

Originally Posted By biga_mn:
Fedgunner asked if there is schedule for future instructors.


That was VA-Gunnut, about 3 posts up.
Link Posted: 12/24/2005 4:39:49 AM EST
Link Posted: 12/24/2005 7:11:00 AM EST
Great post biga_mn!
Though readers need to realize even with proper training whether it be from Len at Bills or Sully at DE, which (I believe) is essential for competency with a firearm you are going to use or carry. But this is only one aspect, it's what and how you practce that reinforces what you have been told and taught. Like you posted earlier with Cooper and Taylor coming to the Twin Cities market you'd have to be a fool not to attend and get some excellent training from nationally recognized instructors. Just think maybe the training we recieve could save our or someone we care abouts life or at the very least enhance or knowledge base and shooting proficency.
If we invest into ourselves we invest into the most important person.
Lets all empower ourselves for 2006 to better trained and better prepared.
I too look forward to taking classes at DE with Sully, though I am not going to pass on the opportunity to train with Cooper or Taylor.

Link Posted: 12/24/2005 10:15:53 AM EST
Unfortunately I can't make Farnams class because of prior commitments, but I do have Taylor's dates pencilled in my calendar. I let Len know that I will definitely be attending that class.

As for DE, I am going to make it to at least a couple courses with Sully this year. Not sure which classes those will be yet, but at this point it doesn't matter that much. I'll be evaluating his teaching style more than the content the first class or two. From what I've heard from the people here and other places, DE is top notch, and I'm sure I won't be disappointed.

Link Posted: 12/24/2005 7:26:51 PM EST
What is he charging?
Link Posted: 12/25/2005 4:30:35 AM EST
Might want to take a gander at BGS Training Page

Originally Posted By Claidhmore:
What is he charging?

John Farnum has taugth classes up in Fergus Falls, Duluth, and out in Valley City, ND. In the past there was college instructor that was lining classes up in the past!
Link Posted: 12/25/2005 6:30:12 AM EST
At $250 a day, I cant afford it.
Link Posted: 12/25/2005 7:01:13 PM EST
Not to butt in on you Mn boy's, but I got bored and snuck on over for a peak (and theirs nothing you can do about it..)

I had the pleasure of Shooting In a Pat Roger's course two years Ago and Greg "Sully" Sullivan from DE was one of the Students. Now I had heard about Greg and was Impressed that he was taking Pat's class (Tells me that he want's to learn from everybody and increase his knowledge).

That right their told me I need to take one of his classes. and this year I took Carbine 1 & 2 from him. It was a great class with a lot of great shooters and I learned some great stuff. If I lived up their I would be taking all his classes. You are getting some serious training for the Money compared to some other courses. If You get a chance to take one of Sully's classes, I would Highly recommend them.

Now that's not to say that others are not worthy either. But Greg is on the top of My "A" List
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