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Link Posted: 3/19/2022 11:16:50 PM EDT
[#1]
Thanks!
Link Posted: 3/19/2022 11:54:24 PM EDT
[#2]
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Originally Posted By von_landstuhl:
Thanks!
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No problem, friend. I'm all for keeping my brothers and sisters out of jail. I've heard some other misinformation about vehicle carry after constitutional carry goes into effect ("you still won't be allowed to carry a concealed handgun in a motor vehicle without a CHL"), I'll explain more if you want.
Link Posted: 3/20/2022 11:30:11 AM EDT
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By CherokeeGunslinger:

No problem, friend. I'm all for keeping my brothers and sisters out of jail. I've heard some other misinformation about vehicle carry after constitutional carry goes into effect ("you still won't be allowed to carry a concealed handgun in a motor vehicle without a CHL"), I'll explain more if you want.
View Quote



So you can CC without a CHL, but the minute you get in your car you are breaking the law?  They need to remedy that, it's absurd.
Link Posted: 3/20/2022 12:02:39 PM EDT
[#4]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Et2ss:



So you can CC without a CHL, but the minute you get in your car you are breaking the law?  They need to remedy that, it's absurd.
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Originally Posted By Et2ss:
Originally Posted By CherokeeGunslinger:

No problem, friend. I'm all for keeping my brothers and sisters out of jail. I've heard some other misinformation about vehicle carry after constitutional carry goes into effect ("you still won't be allowed to carry a concealed handgun in a motor vehicle without a CHL"), I'll explain more if you want.



So you can CC without a CHL, but the minute you get in your car you are breaking the law?  They need to remedy that, it's absurd.


No. The same abilities are granted to non-permit holders as permit holders. So carrying a handgun in a car is fine once this goes into effect. I think the other poster was trying to give an example of misinformation that is being spread.
Link Posted: 3/20/2022 2:04:16 PM EDT
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By vaughn4380:


No. The same abilities are granted to non-permit holders as permit holders. So carrying a handgun in a car is fine once this goes into effect. I think the other poster was trying to give an example of misinformation that is being spread.
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Originally Posted By vaughn4380:
Originally Posted By Et2ss:
Originally Posted By CherokeeGunslinger:

No problem, friend. I'm all for keeping my brothers and sisters out of jail. I've heard some other misinformation about vehicle carry after constitutional carry goes into effect ("you still won't be allowed to carry a concealed handgun in a motor vehicle without a CHL"), I'll explain more if you want.



So you can CC without a CHL, but the minute you get in your car you are breaking the law?  They need to remedy that, it's absurd.


No. The same abilities are granted to non-permit holders as permit holders. So carrying a handgun in a car is fine once this goes into effect. I think the other poster was trying to give an example of misinformation that is being spread.

Thanks. I'm gonna post some lengthy-ass response I typed out before to explain the legalese behind this misconception.
Link Posted: 3/20/2022 2:36:41 PM EDT
[#6]
Link Posted: 3/20/2022 7:10:38 PM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ZW17:


Gunslinger did a poor job at typing that out.

It even had me confused for a second.
View Quote

Don't worry, I'll post a more in-depth explanation that makes more sense.
Link Posted: 3/20/2022 7:12:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: CherokeeGunslinger] [#8]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Et2ss:



So you can CC without a CHL, but the minute you get in your car you are breaking the law?  They need to remedy that, it's absurd.
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Originally Posted By Et2ss:



So you can CC without a CHL, but the minute you get in your car you are breaking the law?  They need to remedy that, it's absurd.

Alright, I'm going to quote a post that I made on another gun forum to explain this misconception. I also did a Youtube video on it, but reading the rules, it might not be allowed to link it because I only just registered yesterday.

Please bear with the length, you have to go into absurd detail when talking about legal things.
This is going to be quite a long post, but when it's got to do with law, you can't summarize. Just please, bear with me and have some patience, and I promise you'll leave this thread with useful knowledge. "Here goes."

I've heard a bit of misinformation going around about Ohio's constitutional carry law that was signed into law by Governor DeWine on Monday. By "a bit of misinformation," I'm meaning one specific gripe that people seem to have with this law.

Some people in the gun community have been spreading this idea that the new law will not allow you to carry a loaded handgun in a motor vehicle without a CHL, and that if you choose to carry a concealed handgun without a CHL under the provisions of the bill, you'll have to unload and case it in the same way as if you were an open-carrier without a CHL. This is simply not true.

The law that was enacted implements the constitutional carry provisions through adding a new section to the Ohio Revised Code, that being Section 2923.111. https://codes.ohio.gov/ohio-revised-code/section-2923.111

Let's quote the part where it talks about qualifying adults.
(2) "Qualifying adult" means a person who is all of the following:

(a) Twenty-one years of age or older;

(b) Not legally prohibited from possessing or receiving a firearm under 18 U.S.C. 922(g)(1) to (9) or under section 2923.13 of the Revised Code or any other Revised Code provision;

(c) Satisfies all of the criteria listed in divisions (D)(1)(a) to (j), (m), (p), (q), and (s) of section 2923.125 of the Revised Code.

This language is what provides the basis for who this bill applies to. In this case, 21-year olds who are eligible to obtain a CHL.

Let's quote the part where it actually conveys the ability to carry a concealed handgun upon the aforementioned "qualifying adult."
(B) Notwithstanding any other Revised Code section to the contrary:

(1) A person who is a qualifying adult shall not be required to obtain a concealed handgun license in order to carry in this state, under authority of division (B)(2) of this section, a concealed handgun that is not a restricted firearm.

This language is what provides the right to carry a concealed handgun to a "qualifying adult."

"But CherokeeGunslinger, that still doesn't mean you can carry a concealed handgun in a motor vehicle without a CHL!" Let's get to that part, brother. Here's the part of the statute where it discusses what you can do as a non-CHL holder versus a CHL holder.
(2) Regardless of whether the person has been issued a concealed handgun license, subject to the limitations specified in divisions (B)(3) and (C)(2) of this section, a person who is a qualifying adult may carry a concealed handgun that is not a restricted firearm anywhere in this state in which a person who has been issued a concealed handgun license may carry a concealed handgun.

(3) The right of a person who is a qualifying adult to carry a concealed handgun that is not a restricted firearm that is granted under divisions (B)(1) and (2) of this section is the same right as is granted to a person who has been issued a concealed handgun license, and a qualifying adult who is granted the right is subject to the same restrictions as apply to a person who has been issued a concealed handgun license.

This language here, which states that a non-CHL holder has the exact same right as a CHL holder to carry a concealed handgun, is expanded upon in the following language. This is a particularly long quote, so please bear with me, we have to trudge through all this in its absurd length.
(C)(1) For purposes of any provision of section 1547.69, 2923.12, or 2923.124 to 2923.1213 of the Revised Code, or of any other section of the Revised Code, that refers to a concealed handgun license or a concealed handgun licensee, except when the context clearly indicates otherwise, all of the following apply:

(a) A person who is a qualifying adult and is carrying or has, concealed on the person's person or ready at hand, a handgun that is not a restricted firearm shall be deemed to have been issued a valid concealed handgun license.

(b) If the provision refers to a person having been issued a concealed handgun license or having been issued a concealed handgun license that is valid at a particular point in time, the provision shall be construed as automatically including a person who is a qualifying adult and who is carrying or has, concealed on the person's person or ready at hand, a handgun that is not a restricted firearm, as if the person had been issued a concealed handgun license or had been issued a concealed handgun license that is valid at the particular point in time.

(c) If the provision in specified circumstances requires a concealed handgun licensee to engage in specified conduct, or prohibits a concealed handgun licensee from engaging in specified conduct, the provision shall be construed as applying in the same circumstances to a person who is a qualifying adult in the same manner as if the person was a concealed handgun licensee.

(d) If the application of the provision to a person depends on whether the person is or is not a concealed handgun licensee, the provision shall be applied to a person who is a qualifying adult in the same manner as if the person was a concealed handgun licensee.

(e) If the provision pertains to the imposition of a penalty or sanction for specified conduct and the penalty or sanction applicable to a person who engages in the conduct depends on whether the person is or is not a concealed handgun licensee, the provision shall be applied to a person who is a qualifying adult in the same manner as if the person was a concealed handgun licensee.

This language specifically makes it so that anywhere the Ohio Revised Code talks about concealed handgun licenses and concealed handgun licensees, it will also apply to "qualifying adults."

O.R.C. Section 2923.12 (carrying concealed weapons) was never amended to insert any constitutional carry legislation, similar to O.R.C. Section 2923.16 (improperly handling firearms in a motor vehicle). If a non-CHL holder has no right to carry a concealed handgun in a motor vehicle because 2923.16 wasn't amended to add any constitutional carry language, then a non-CHL holder has no right to carry a concealed handgun at all under the new law. However, that's not the case, non-CHL holders will be able to carry a concealed handgun, including in motor vehicles, when the new law goes into effect on June 13th.

So, next time someone who is ignorant of what the new law says, tries to tell you this hogwash about how "you still won't be able to carry a pistol in a car," you can direct them here. If they decide not to read because of the sheer length, thry shouldn't be talking about this new law.

Have a good one, brothers and sisters.
Link Posted: 3/20/2022 7:37:32 PM EDT
[#9]
If all that is correct, thanks for posting.
I thought is was now (90 days)  the same for "qualifying adults" permit or not.
Have to be a part time lawyer to buy or carry a gun. Then there's  NFA.
Link Posted: 3/21/2022 11:12:46 PM EDT
[#10]
Link Posted: 3/22/2022 1:08:06 AM EDT
[#11]
...recommend everyone check out the article:


Answers to Common Questions about Ohio’s New Permitless Carry Law

Does this change how I carry in my vehicle?
No. You will be able to carry a concealed handgun in your car with or without a CHL. You do not have to unload. You do not have to make the handgun visible. You can have loaded handguns and magazines on your person or stored anywhere in your vehicle.
View Quote


Can I carry in a bar, courthouse, church, etc.?
Per federal law, you will still need a CHL to carry in a school zone in your vehicle. If you leave your vehicle, your handgun must be secured and locked in your vehicle. Otherwise, nothing changes about where you can or cannot carry a concealed handgun. Areas that are currently no-carry zones will remain no-carry zones. Property owners will still be able to post no-gun signs.
View Quote


Can non-residents carry concealed without a license?
Yes. While the rules for carrying a concealed handgun remain the same with or without a license, there will be no residency requirement when this law goes into effect. Someone who is otherwise a “qualifying” adult may carry with or without a license whether they reside in Ohio or another state.
View Quote
Link Posted: 3/22/2022 5:43:52 AM EDT
[#12]
Link Posted: 3/22/2022 7:46:58 AM EDT
[#13]
The original news release said you had to be an Ohio resident for 45 days, so that was wrong? I thought that seemed kind of dumb.

I wonder if IN new CC law allows for non residents?
Link Posted: 3/22/2022 9:25:31 AM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AR_Dale:
The original news release said you had to be an Ohio resident for 45 days, so that was wrong? I thought that seemed kind of dumb.

I wonder if IN new CC law allows for non residents?
View Quote


I remember that too as a condition of "qualifying adult", but if you look at the orc linked above that language isn't present.

I'm not sure if that was a previous version or the bill from the other side or just adlib journalism, but it doesn't appear to be part of the final bill.
Link Posted: 3/22/2022 11:15:50 AM EDT
[Last Edit: vaughn4380] [#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By WileyCoyote:

Can I carry in a bar, courthouse, church, etc.?
Per federal law, you will still need a CHL to carry in a school zone in your vehicle. If you leave your vehicle, your handgun must be secured and locked in your vehicle. Otherwise, nothing changes about where you can or cannot carry a concealed handgun. Areas that are currently no-carry zones will remain no-carry zones. Property owners will still be able to post no-gun signs.

View Quote


Well that makes the new law less appealing to anyone with school age children. At least getting the license is not too much of a hassle.
Link Posted: 3/22/2022 1:26:18 PM EDT
[#16]
Regarding the poll, yes I will renew my Ohio CHL.  I am already in the system and I like the reciprocity to carry in other states.
Link Posted: 3/22/2022 3:58:47 PM EDT
[#17]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Yojimbo:
Regarding the poll, yes I will renew my Ohio CHL.  I am already in the system and I like the reciprocity to carry in other states.
View Quote
This for me as well.  
Link Posted: 3/22/2022 9:52:04 PM EDT
[#18]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By shotar:
What I can't emphasize enough, particularly for those who live in border counties, is that PA will still require a chl. Do not cross borders into states that require a license without one. The argument that Ohio does not require a license will not go over well with PSP.
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I do work in PA about one weekend  a month or so. It is the sole reason I still filed for my CCW even with this passing.

Indiana  passed constitutional  carry last night so those in that area should be ok
Link Posted: 3/23/2022 4:34:33 PM EDT
[#19]
I have good friends and family from here to Fla, so I'm definitely keeping mine.
Link Posted: 3/25/2022 10:32:55 AM EDT
[#20]
I'm keeping it for the reciprocity, and no NICS call
Link Posted: 3/25/2022 4:42:40 PM EDT
[#21]
Link Posted: 3/25/2022 5:10:49 PM EDT
[#22]
I wish I could find similar for IN on the residency issue. Thanks for posting.
Link Posted: 3/25/2022 6:14:03 PM EDT
[#23]
Does anyone have a feel for how LEOs will address large format pistols?

I can't see the flying donuts being cool with a 14" AR with a brace on the seat.
Link Posted: 3/26/2022 1:40:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: RareBear] [#24]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By safe1:
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I am under the impression that the answer to question 7 applies to folks without a CHL.   CHL holders can have long guns and loaded magazines anywhere in a vehicle with the only restriction being no loaded magazine in a long gun.
Link Posted: 3/26/2022 12:04:10 PM EDT
[#25]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By RareBear:


I am under the impression that the answer to question 7 applies to folks without a CHL.   CHL holders can have long guns and loaded magazines anywhere in a vehicle with the only restriction being no loaded magazine in a long gun.
View Quote



Are you sure? I have never seen anything that substantiates that. People keep saying it, but never show a cite.
Link Posted: 3/26/2022 2:57:22 PM EDT
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Ohio:
Does anyone have a feel for how LEOs will address large format pistols?

I can't see the flying donuts being cool with a 14" AR with a brace on the seat.
View Quote


Is ether a pistol or not. Sounds like a pistol to me.
Link Posted: 3/26/2022 3:19:00 PM EDT
[#27]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Ohio:



Are you sure? I have never seen anything that substantiates that. People keep saying it, but never show a cite.
View Quote


Cites are given in the article.

https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/hb495-definition-unloaded-gun-now-fixed-all-ohioans-no-guns-signs-come-down-statehouse
Link Posted: 3/26/2022 3:20:42 PM EDT
[#28]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Ohio:
Does anyone have a feel for how LEOs will address large format pistols?

I can't see the flying donuts being cool with a 14" AR with a brace on the seat.
View Quote


They might not be cool with it, but nothing has changed other than the CHL being needed.
Link Posted: 3/26/2022 3:36:29 PM EDT
[#29]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History



Thanks, that helps.
Link Posted: 3/26/2022 6:29:49 PM EDT
[#30]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AR_Dale:


Is ether a pistol or not. Sounds like a pistol to me.
View Quote


While that’s true, that assumes that the LEO knows the difference between an SBR and a pistol w a brace, and I can assure you that is not the case for many LEOs. It’s why I go over it when I teach firearm laws in the Academy.
Link Posted: 3/26/2022 8:16:23 PM EDT
[#31]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By LonChaney:


While that’s true, that assumes that the LEO knows the difference between an SBR and a pistol w a brace, and I can assure you that is not the case for many LEOs. It’s why I go over it when I teach firearm laws in the Academy.
View Quote


Not much I can do about LEO that don't know the law. I know to not argue with them, they can look dumb in court.
Link Posted: 4/3/2022 6:38:14 AM EDT
[#32]
It's supposed to start in June for Ohio but the Cuyahoga County Prosecutor decided to start it now in Cuyahoga County.
Link Posted: 4/3/2022 7:38:42 AM EDT
[#33]
Link Posted: 4/4/2022 8:15:49 AM EDT
[#34]
It's Cuyahoga County anyway, they no bill murder charges.
Link Posted: 4/4/2022 8:36:49 AM EDT
[#35]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By shotar:

It is difficult if not impossible to prosecute a crime, that is no longer a crime when the case would actually get to court.

I'm not saying I wouldn't do my job, but once the legislation is passed and signed by the governor,  we'll there you are.
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I always get the feeling like I'm in a dead feeling City, when in dayton. It's like Detroit 25 years ago. Just a smaller version.
Link Posted: 4/4/2022 10:38:06 AM EDT
[#36]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Leisure_Shoot:
I always get the feeling like I'm in a dead feeling City, when in dayton. It's like Detroit 25 years ago. Just a smaller version.
View Quote


I though all cities were like that.
I live 30 min from Dayton, never go there other than pass through on highway.
Salem mall got so bad all the stores left so now the people that made it trash go to Dayton mall. I don't go to malls.
Walmart near Salem mall had so much theft they closed and built new store several miles north in Clayton.
Link Posted: 4/4/2022 1:57:30 PM EDT
[#37]
Link Posted: 4/4/2022 4:59:49 PM EDT
[#38]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
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Link Posted: 4/6/2022 12:32:31 AM EDT
[#39]
Link Posted: 4/6/2022 6:38:34 AM EDT
[#40]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History


that article doesn't mention that when buying a gun and filling out a 4473, they don't need to do the nics check.
Link Posted: 4/6/2022 8:34:52 AM EDT
[#41]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Chowser:
that article doesn't mention that when buying a gun and filling out a 4473, they don't need to do the nics check.
View Quote


Coworker gets a hold every time, it would help him.
For me, filling out the form is the part I want to skip.
Link Posted: 4/6/2022 8:55:23 AM EDT
[#42]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Chowser:
that article doesn't mention that when buying a gun and filling out a 4473, they don't need to do the nics check.
View Quote


The gun shop can still require it, though. Vance’s in Hebron had me do one on my last purchase.
Link Posted: 4/6/2022 10:03:33 AM EDT
[#43]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By AR_Dale:


Coworker gets a hold every time, it would help him.
For me, filling out the form is the part I want to skip.
View Quote


I haven't found a shop that has allowed me to use my CHL instead of the form. When I asked, they said their legal team advised them not to, because that transfers the liability from NCIC to the FFL holder.
Link Posted: 4/6/2022 11:39:49 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 549] [#44]
IME, it's only been the big box/chain stores that still require the check. The smaller family owned stores I frequent haven't.

Cabela's requires the NICS check, however they still wouldn't sell to me one time at all because the address on my CHL doesn't perfectly match the correct address on my DL. It was noticed when I laid my CHL on the counter in the hopes that it would bypass the NICS.

Despite the fact that they don't use the CHL in lieu of the check, the mismatch of info apparently made me a suspicious character and the manager said he couldn't sell to me at all. Wouldn't even run the NICS check to verify I was gtg.

I made the issuing county aware of this, but they said it wasn't a big deal and that they weren't going to issue me a corrected CHL because of it. Just told me to correct it when I renewed.
Link Posted: 4/6/2022 11:49:47 AM EDT
[#45]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By tweiss3:


I haven't found a shop that has allowed me to use my CHL instead of the form. When I asked, they said their legal team advised them not to, because that transfers the liability from NCIC to the FFL holder.
View Quote


This places asks every time before giving out the 4473.  https://jjgunsupply.com/  Brookville, OH
You are required to fill out a 4473 when picking up an NFA item. They don't call those because not required. Most places call those in.
Imagine waiting a year for a stamp then getting a hold on a not required background check.

Unless it's a steal of a deal I will never buy another firearm from a corp box store. I buy everything from JJ Gun unless they can't get it, then I buy online and send to them for transfer. Aim is ok but since moving not as convenient for store visits.
Link Posted: 4/6/2022 2:11:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: WileyCoyote] [#46]
...all things woke, turn to s***!



Sheriff McGuffey: Signing of concealed carry bill 'not well thought out' for high population areas

McGuffey said that poor decision making happens and those who are carrying a weapon can make bad decisions that can cause tremendous ramifications.

"People in the general public may not understand how poorly most people shoot. That's why I have been a vocal opponent of this bill, and tried to educate the public on what this means for our community," McGuffey said. "I have many, many years of firearm training and I am usually at 90% accuracy. In a high-stress situation, my accuracy or that of any trained officer will go down by about 40%. This is something that needs to be considered when we allow untrained and unlicensed individuals to walk the streets of Hamilton County with concealed weapons."
View Quote


guys, did you know she's "90%" accurate shooter?....

Link Posted: 4/6/2022 2:20:54 PM EDT
[#47]
Link Posted: 4/6/2022 8:42:11 PM EDT
[#48]
...beware of "i support the second amendment, but...." ranges...




Akron-area police, firearms instructors react to Ohio's new 'constitutional carry' gun law

Adam Kusicki, who manages Range 42 in Norton, said that although he supports gun rights, he noted the Second Amendment also mentions a "well-regulated militia."

Kusicki, who served as an Army military policeman with a tour in Afghanistan, now offers private training in firearms proficiency and tactics.

"I believe everyone should have the right to bear arms, but we're removing the 'well-regulated' part when we're doing this so-called constitutional carry," he said.
View Quote
Link Posted: 4/6/2022 9:13:43 PM EDT
[#49]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By WileyCoyote:
...beware of "i support the second amendment, but...." ranges...




Akron-area police, firearms instructors react to Ohio's new 'constitutional carry' gun law

View Quote
Of course. There goes most of their gravy CCW training class money.
Link Posted: 4/7/2022 7:23:51 AM EDT
[#50]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By WileyCoyote:
...beware of "i support the second amendment, but...." ranges...




Akron-area police, firearms instructors react to Ohio's new 'constitutional carry' gun law

View Quote


I was going to post that. I don't think well regulated means what he thinks it means or he is trying to twist the meaning.
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